30 replies to this topic

[Darwindog]

And now... my rant which I know you will all ignore or skim through

I understand the NHLPA’s stance – basically the majority of the members are working under apparently incompetent management. I’ve ALWAYS believed that. That’s why despite making boatloads of money there were serious morale issues on most teams. I don’t think this is about the money for the players at all. Most are pretty miserable in this shoddy league which seems to be all about infighting between owners.

So, how is this CBA going to change anything aside from remove the potential for a player to make a nice sum of money? What improves the situation for the players? What are they getting in return for these concession? Well they have a four year out… it’s going to take time to improve things no matter how you slice it. There is no way to guarentee change -- if there is then the players should work on how not just catagorically shout that the onus is on the league. That's not a group with a solution -- that's not a group working to negotiate even remotely.

Anyhow- the NHLPA has not articulated that fear clearly enough. This is Goodenow’s failing – he’s sending out a stupid pig-headed message which sadly is based on a very difficult and very valid point. Bettman has been very clear cut, never made it personal to the players always took accountability. The guy does NOT have any obligation to say “THIS IS NOT FAIR” and yet he all but has. His message is clear – This is the best we’ve got for you guys- come back with better and we’ll work with you. A salary roll back is NOT better we ALL know that. Goodenow HAS to come back with better – he’s got to get rid of all the animosity and lay out his issues. The NHLPA HAS to find a way to publicly acknowledge the players responsibility to revenue generation while delineating itself from the poor management that abounds in the league.

Goodenow’s waiting 5 fecking years to think this through just blows my mind. He’s COASTED. He’s done NOTHING!!! How ANYONE can say Bettman is inferior to Goodenow is beyond me! Goodenow had ALL THIS TIME to come up with different ways players can participate in the betterment of the league and he did NOTHING. His whole plan appears to have been “the league will cave just like they did last time” He is SO far over his head it’s not even amusing. He should have been training his player board he should have made sure he had SMART ARTICULATE people in there. I have seen NO…ZERO… NADA proactive thinking from Goodenow and the NHLPA. And given the extraordinary circumstances we have here he should have been doing this… he could start OUT with the that’s not our responsibility card but HAD to have the plan to work this situation to the unions advantage. I mean WOW has he screwed the pooch on this one.

Edited by Darwindog, 03 February 2005 - 12:46 PM.

[Derek21]

When are you people going to realize that what was offered was just for show? The NHL had no intention of playing this season. If they did, they would have tried making an offer a lot sooner than this last ditch effort just to make themselves look good.

They want a CAP. If they wanted one so badly, why couldn't they make it a little higher and have it address all 30 NHL markets instead of half? Because they aren't interested in satisfying everyone.

And if you fans really believe a hard cap would be beneficial to the Devils as they are currently constructed, you really need to do some thinking.


The linkage they offered was garbage as well. These owners don't even trust each other. But they're supposed to be taken off the hook for how they ran their franchises? I don't think so.


In the end, both sides come out losers in this mess. They'll most likely never recover.

It was always about greed.


As for myself, it's going to be hard to comeback as a fan. This league is an embarrassment.


Until a new commissioner and new PA representative come in, it's hard to take them seriously.

I hope both rot in Hell.

[Triumph]

Whoops. Wouldn't want to have you all read two uninteresting rants.

Edited by Triumph, 03 February 2005 - 04:16 PM.

[Triumph]

Right, it was all about greed - those greedy owners, how dare they want to not lose money.

The NHL made its offer in hopes that the NHLPA would negotiate - on their terms. The NHLPA had no intention of doing so. They have naively and stubbornly continued to insist that the owners are lying, they're all making money, and they're looking to screw the union. The NHLPA has constantly displayed an attitude of smug disapproval. They are getting what they deserve by missing out on their biggest paychecks.

A hard cap would absolutely be beneficial to the Devils. Now that this season is over, the Devils have 25 million in contracts evaporating. This means they're under the cap. The New England Patriots haven't done so bad with a cap, have they? Lou has been handcuffed by the most recent CBA; even though his franchise won 3 Stanley Cups under it, I cannot imagine that total profits were greater than $100 million, and the Devils have been suffering heavy losses over the past few seasons. The only benefit to the CBA as it was then was the ability to make deadline deals to boost the club. The Devils won't have that, but neither will any other team, so it evens out.

A luxury tax, on the other hand, would be the worst thing for the Devils. They do not have the money to go over a luxury tax threshold. Most of their rivals do. This would put them at a severe disadvantage. Toronto, New York, and Philadelphia could spend into the stratosphere if they so desired. Major League Baseball and its luxury tax is a joke.

PK's post on this subject is dead on - Goodenow and the PA saw this coming for years and did nothing about it. They have not made one serious offer yet. They have gone to play in Europe and minor leagues here in the US, showing their solidarity by skipping town and taking jobs from other players. The union, even leaders like Daniel Alfredsson, has taken the attitude of "Call me when it's over", thinking that the owners will simply cave. They have absolutely failed to recognize the magnitude of the situation.

[Pepperkorn]

Gee whiz Derek that post read more like you just want us all to shut the f*ck up while you extoll your feelings and views free as you please and completely discount ours as not fully comprehending the situation.

I said a lot in my posts and none of it had to do with there being a season but I don't see any sign you even paid any attention to it.

Just for my own lesson in articulation what did you interpret my post to mean? I'm always looking ot improve.

[redruM]

Who cares whether it is fair.

The owners are owners and it is their game and their league and tehir teams. The players a workers.

Supply and demand determines what happens and teh players, if they want to play in the NHL, have to take what the owners offer or not.

Otherwise they can play in a different league that will pay them more.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

EXACTLY So if the owners offer $9 mil per yr then why should the commish stop them!!!

Its the Owners who make the offers not the players... and even if the players counter and the owner agrees then we have to assume that the owner is being fiscally responsible right???

If not then the owner should not make the offer and negotiate w/ another player.

[redruM]

I really donot care who is to blame they both are... they both suck and ingeneral they DONOT CARE aboutt he fans...

Its a friggin joke that ahole slike us are here praying and trying to keep the candle lit for a seaosn while they are all out vacationing or doing stars tours of europe or just playing elsewhere...

i'm furstrated this probably didn;t even make sense!!!

[HellOnICE]

But rum lets say the 5 teams who can spend these 9 million bucks a year do it on all the players they can within their budget. Then there are 25 other teams who cant do that. The hightest of all the offers is 4 million for this player. You don't think for one second the PA will have the owners in court for collusion saying "look see, the 25 teams are cooperating against us and won't pay"

[Z-Man]

Hey Red, let me give you an example of your flawed thinking.

30 different people want to bid on E-bay for a signed Brodeur jersey. However, the 5 people with the most money drive up the bidding to $1,000. Because of that, everyone else selling similar jerseys won't sell their jerseys unless the bidding reaches $1,000. So you're going to blame the other 25 people who couldn't afford to bid on the first jersey for driving up the price?

Don't blame the owners like they are one group, and can't control their spending. Teams like Edmonton trade away good players before their contracts expire because they can't meet the market price that a select few of the other owners have set by overspending.

[AddictedToHockey]

The proposal was fair to the players, but the owners were still not being fair to the fans. The $32-42 million range is far too high -- we need a range of something like $20-30 million in order to get ticket prices down, and that's what's needed.

The fact that the NHLPA rejected this totally disgusts me. The owners' next offer had better be lower than this one -- maybe then the NHLPA would get their head out of their backsides.....???

[Derek21]

$20 - 30 million Nature? Are you nuts? Man, I was going to make this other big post but why bother.


The bottom line is this season has come to the sad conclusion many thought it would.


Whenever they do return, I hope there's a new commissioner and a new PA representative. I hope that there is a cap but one that's fair to all 30 participants. I hope there's a marketing plan attached to trying to restore credibility. I hope they put in the right rule changes and not ones that turn the sport into a three-ring circus. I hope that whatever cap the league winds up with, ticket prices are reduced by 20 percent rewarding the fans for their patience. And if the owners can't do that, then there's something wrong.


Until then, see ya all in Off Topic.