Gomer is leading the team in points so to me he is 1st line material. Our new first line is creating magic and are learning where everyone is. Hell just watch the Flyers OT goal by Little G over and over again, no doubt that was an ALine goal. Look at Elias' numbers since being put on this line. He went from like 7 points to 14 in a matter of games. This line is for real.
Could Newy Be On The Way Out?
Started by sundstrom, Dec 04 2002 11:15 PM
55 replies to this topic
#21
NJayDevil
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 12:18 PM
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"They are the loudest and most loyal students in the country. They call this place Happy Valley?
That's an understatement tonight. This is definitely the best place on Earth. I have seen Paternoville,
I have seen these students...there is nothing like this in the country."
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#22
Derek21
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 02:28 PM
Most of the Devil nucleus is young.
Gomez-Elias-Gionta are all 26 and under and can fly.
Friesen is playing with Nieuwendyk and Stevenson but can they keep up with him?
Pandolfo-Madden-Langenbrunner are all in their late 20's and mesh well together. They can also skate very fast for a checking line. This is what makes them so tough to play against.
Berglund and Brylin are very shifty skaters and McKenzie doesn't do bad for an enforcer.
Maybe they should trade Nieuwendyk. Berglund can certainly play with Friesen and Brylin. IMO, that wouldn't be a bad 2nd line. They all have great speed and can keep up with each other.
You can then put McKenzie and Stevenson on a 4th line with another center. Maybe who they get in return for Newy.
Gomez-Elias-Gionta are all 26 and under and can fly.
Friesen is playing with Nieuwendyk and Stevenson but can they keep up with him?
Pandolfo-Madden-Langenbrunner are all in their late 20's and mesh well together. They can also skate very fast for a checking line. This is what makes them so tough to play against.
Berglund and Brylin are very shifty skaters and McKenzie doesn't do bad for an enforcer.
Maybe they should trade Nieuwendyk. Berglund can certainly play with Friesen and Brylin. IMO, that wouldn't be a bad 2nd line. They all have great speed and can keep up with each other.
You can then put McKenzie and Stevenson on a 4th line with another center. Maybe who they get in return for Newy.
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#23
Triumph
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 02:45 PM
Good idea Derek, let's replace a 500 goal scorer with a 3 goal scorer. That ought to boost the Devils scoring ability.
There is no reason to deal Nieuwendyk. Unless people want the Devils to lose in the first round, then I'd agree, go ahead, deal him.
There is no reason to deal Nieuwendyk. Unless people want the Devils to lose in the first round, then I'd agree, go ahead, deal him.
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#24
Derek21
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 02:57 PM
Tri, I get to watch games. He isn't fitting in that well. I don't care if the guy has 500 goals. That means crap when he can't put the puck in the ocean and is holding back his linemates.
Berglund shouldn't be on their 4th line and neither should Brylin. If you put them together with Friesen, that might be a dangerous line.
Is it snowing by you also?
Berglund shouldn't be on their 4th line and neither should Brylin. If you put them together with Friesen, that might be a dangerous line.
Is it snowing by you also?
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#25
Triumph
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 03:05 PM
Derek, you can't believe what you just said, can you?
"I don't care if the guy has 500 goals, if he can't put the puck in the ocean..." .. well, if Nieuwendyk were a career 3 goal scorer, maybe I'd agree with you. The fact is, he's a 500 goal scorer, so I expect him to pop out of that slump. He's proven he can score.
Nieuwendyk is holding back his linemates? I guess those 5 points in 5 games are what we expect out of Turner Stevenson? And Friesen's recent surge has had nothing to do with Nieuwendyk? That line was very effective against the Red Wings and Predators and got the game winner against the Blues.
Joey N has been getting more assists lately, and it's only a matter of time before he starts scoring. Tossing him away for a 4th line center and a prospect would be silly.
Brylin shouldn't be on the 4th line, but neither should he be the second line center either.
Trusting in rookies with no 2nd line experience to step up is a big mistake. The Devils tried it last year and it backfired. If Nieuwendyk were going to be dealt, Berglund should have been getting 2nd line ice time for at least 20 games to prove that he's capable of playing on a 2nd line.
And yes, it did snow.. about four inches.
"I don't care if the guy has 500 goals, if he can't put the puck in the ocean..." .. well, if Nieuwendyk were a career 3 goal scorer, maybe I'd agree with you. The fact is, he's a 500 goal scorer, so I expect him to pop out of that slump. He's proven he can score.
Nieuwendyk is holding back his linemates? I guess those 5 points in 5 games are what we expect out of Turner Stevenson? And Friesen's recent surge has had nothing to do with Nieuwendyk? That line was very effective against the Red Wings and Predators and got the game winner against the Blues.
Joey N has been getting more assists lately, and it's only a matter of time before he starts scoring. Tossing him away for a 4th line center and a prospect would be silly.
Brylin shouldn't be on the 4th line, but neither should he be the second line center either.
Trusting in rookies with no 2nd line experience to step up is a big mistake. The Devils tried it last year and it backfired. If Nieuwendyk were going to be dealt, Berglund should have been getting 2nd line ice time for at least 20 games to prove that he's capable of playing on a 2nd line.
And yes, it did snow.. about four inches.
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#26
Derek21
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 03:14 PM
There's one thing wrong with your statement on rookies.
It's been proven before that you can win with rookies.
Was it my imagination that the Devils won in 2000 with four rookies on their roster?
Scott Gomez was pretty good. So was that John Madden character. He didn't look out of place against Dallas. Neither was Colin White. Neither did that other rookie Brian Rafalski do too badly for such inexperience.
Sometimes, inexperience doesn't matter. If the player has confidence and fits in well with their team, they can succeed in the most pressure packed situations. The 2000 Devils were definitive proof of that.
I can give other examples if you like.
As for Newy, I never said he stunk. If he is to remain a Devil, he needs to start burying some chances.
It's been proven before that you can win with rookies.
Was it my imagination that the Devils won in 2000 with four rookies on their roster?
Scott Gomez was pretty good. So was that John Madden character. He didn't look out of place against Dallas. Neither was Colin White. Neither did that other rookie Brian Rafalski do too badly for such inexperience.
Sometimes, inexperience doesn't matter. If the player has confidence and fits in well with their team, they can succeed in the most pressure packed situations. The 2000 Devils were definitive proof of that.
I can give other examples if you like.
As for Newy, I never said he stunk. If he is to remain a Devil, he needs to start burying some chances.
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#27
Triumph
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 03:22 PM
The difference between 2000 and now is that the Devils had the proper structure in place for Gomez to succeed. When it was clear that Gomez needed guys better than Pederson and Oliwa to play with, Lou went out and got Claude Lemieux. When Lemieux started to falter down the stretch, Lou went out and got #89. He had the assets to do so.
Now he doesn't. Friesen and Brylin, while being decent players, are not super talented. Berglund would be expected to carry that line, not be a passenger on it. Brylin, no matter how much I like him, won't be better than a 20 goal scorer. Friesen looks like he might be capable of 25 goals, but even if Berglund gets 20 that's not an exceptional 2nd line. Add in the rather unexceptional 1st line, and the Devils offense stinks.
Nieuwendyk can play with Stevenson and Friesen.
Now he doesn't. Friesen and Brylin, while being decent players, are not super talented. Berglund would be expected to carry that line, not be a passenger on it. Brylin, no matter how much I like him, won't be better than a 20 goal scorer. Friesen looks like he might be capable of 25 goals, but even if Berglund gets 20 that's not an exceptional 2nd line. Add in the rather unexceptional 1st line, and the Devils offense stinks.
Nieuwendyk can play with Stevenson and Friesen.
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#28
insanity_gallops
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 03:28 PM
The Sykora deal was a bad one? Are you nuts? Can someone post the point totals and +/- of Friessen and Tevo please?
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#29
sundstrom
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 04:33 PM
i never called for newy to be traded for a 4th liner. i wanted to deal him and danton for a two solid players returning.
and don't say that tanguay would never be moved for joe. tanguay is being offered all over the place. he was offered up for mclaren and the b's turned it down. i don't think its a great fit b/c we'd be down a center again. and joe does have value to us as well. his playoff performance is worth noting. his ability to win faceoffs is key. but if he's part of a package that brings us something solid back, i wouldn't mind him being dealt.
and don't say that tanguay would never be moved for joe. tanguay is being offered all over the place. he was offered up for mclaren and the b's turned it down. i don't think its a great fit b/c we'd be down a center again. and joe does have value to us as well. his playoff performance is worth noting. his ability to win faceoffs is key. but if he's part of a package that brings us something solid back, i wouldn't mind him being dealt.
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#30
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 04:46 PM
Derek called for Nieuwendyk to be dealt for a 4th liner and a prospect.
Tanguay would never be moved for Joe.
Tanguay stinks. I don't care how many Game 7 goals he scores, he's small, and he's a 60-65 point player. We already have a better Tanguay and his name is Gomez. Won't score as many goals, but will be a better passer.
If you think Boston rejected Tanguay for McLaren, you must have a very high opinion of McLaren or a low opinion of Tanguay. Tanguay for McLaren would be a steal for the Bruins, unless they aren't looking for a forward.
Unless Nieuwendyk brings back a scoring, physical forward, forget about dealing him. And even then, dealing to plug a weakness while creating a weakness is shortsighted. But getting yet another small forward who isn't a particularly good scorer to add to our collection would be a bad move.
Tanguay would never be moved for Joe.
Tanguay stinks. I don't care how many Game 7 goals he scores, he's small, and he's a 60-65 point player. We already have a better Tanguay and his name is Gomez. Won't score as many goals, but will be a better passer.
If you think Boston rejected Tanguay for McLaren, you must have a very high opinion of McLaren or a low opinion of Tanguay. Tanguay for McLaren would be a steal for the Bruins, unless they aren't looking for a forward.
Unless Nieuwendyk brings back a scoring, physical forward, forget about dealing him. And even then, dealing to plug a weakness while creating a weakness is shortsighted. But getting yet another small forward who isn't a particularly good scorer to add to our collection would be a bad move.
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#31
CaptainScotty
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 06:13 PM
Maybe we should resign this season, trade danton and Nieuwendyk for some prospects and a pick.
Everyone knows the cupboard is half empty, looks like this team needs a rebuilding year. Better suck it up and make the best of it.
I really hate to think like this too, but in my heart I know the Devs dont have the cup in them this year. Especially with Elias lost without his scoring touch, our first line center playing the fourth line, and our other wings waiting for someone else to pick up the slack.
Everyone knows the cupboard is half empty, looks like this team needs a rebuilding year. Better suck it up and make the best of it.
I really hate to think like this too, but in my heart I know the Devs dont have the cup in them this year. Especially with Elias lost without his scoring touch, our first line center playing the fourth line, and our other wings waiting for someone else to pick up the slack.
GO Big Red!!!
#32
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 06:36 PM
It definitely looks like the Devils are not cut out for the Cup. 1st in the division, probably the 2nd best team so far in the East other than Boston.. let's throw in the towel now.
The problem is that Devils fans have an all or nothing mentality regarding the playoffs because that's how the Devils have been. They haven't lost in the ECF for 9 years. They haven't lost in the 2nd round in 6 years. It's been either first round or last round.
The Devils need to win a round or two to remain financially viable. I, too, doubt that this team has it in them right now to win a Cup, or the assets to trade for it, but they have the ability to win in the playoffs.
The problem is that Devils fans have an all or nothing mentality regarding the playoffs because that's how the Devils have been. They haven't lost in the ECF for 9 years. They haven't lost in the 2nd round in 6 years. It's been either first round or last round.
The Devils need to win a round or two to remain financially viable. I, too, doubt that this team has it in them right now to win a Cup, or the assets to trade for it, but they have the ability to win in the playoffs.
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#33
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 06:46 PM
Wanted: power forward.
Solution: GET CARTER.
Solution: GET CARTER.
#34
DevilMinder
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 08:22 PM
Is Carter(anson?) On the market?
#35
insanity_gallops
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Posted 05 December 2002 - 10:16 PM
Is Carter(anson?) On the market?
I doubt it. I'd be surprised if Edmonton was looking to shop him.
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#36
zenchic
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Posted 06 December 2002 - 12:00 AM
Man o' man I hate hearing/seeing that Joey's having troubles up there for ya'll 
He's one he** of a faceoff man..and yes, I know ya'll need him to score..but Jaimie's scoring more than he's ever scored..doesn't that help take up *some* of the slack ?
I mean..Joe's *still* winning a high percentage of his faceoffs, yes? Come'on ya'll..give him a little bit longer...or..
Send he and Jaimie HOME!
Seriously, Joey's gonna come through..just hang in there with him a little longer!
He's one he** of a faceoff man..and yes, I know ya'll need him to score..but Jaimie's scoring more than he's ever scored..doesn't that help take up *some* of the slack ?
I mean..Joe's *still* winning a high percentage of his faceoffs, yes? Come'on ya'll..give him a little bit longer...or..
Send he and Jaimie HOME!
Seriously, Joey's gonna come through..just hang in there with him a little longer!
#37
poisler
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Posted 06 December 2002 - 09:38 AM
As I remember it, the Devils lost in the first round last year WITH Nieuwendyk. Yeah I know he was sick... but still, he did nothing for us in the playoffs and he's done nothing in a Devs uniform.There is no reason to deal Nieuwendyk. Unless people want the Devils to lose in the first round, then I'd agree, go ahead, deal him.
zenchic, I hope your right. But it's really frustrating watching this guy play right now. He actually makes me sick
. I have the feeling you'll get Nieuwy back in the off-season when he signs with the stars as a UFA.
#38
eddieslobbo
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Posted 06 December 2002 - 09:39 AM
GetReal: GET REAL. Either you are a very new Devils fan or just don't pay attention. How could you say that Gomez is not a first line player? There isn't a team in the league that wouldn't take him and put him with their biggest gun. Elias needs to snap out of it, and that's all there is. He was a scorer before the A line, and he'll have to be one post A line. Triumph makes good sense here - give it time, we're leading the division, for Pete's sake. I am distressed about Nieuwendyk too, but he's got to come around, he hasn't looked horrible by any stretch.
#39
Jerrydevil
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Posted 06 December 2002 - 12:15 PM
I tend to agree with Eddie and Triumph. I'm disappointed in Nieuwendyk so far, but I think the reward will be greater if we hang onto Joe and wait till he heats up. I could be wrong, but trading a guy like Nieuwendyk could rock that locker room negatively. Anyone consider that?
Nevertheless, we need a lot more production from Joe.
Nevertheless, we need a lot more production from Joe.
#40
insanity_gallops
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Posted 06 December 2002 - 12:59 PM
GetReal: GET REAL. Either you are a very new Devils fan or just don't pay attention.
Woooo! Line of the day!
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