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Patriots using camera to steal signs?


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#21 NJDevs4978

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Posted 11 September 2007 - 04:20 PM

Nice, apparently this is the FOURTH different time the Pats have either been accused of or caught using a camera to spy.

http://www.bostonher...ticleid=1030707

In one of the instances (the GB game) the only reason the Packers didn't report it was because they felt it was in bad taste considering they lost by such a wide margin, while the Bills only strongly suspected it. I don't know why Detroit didn't report it :P

Edited by Hasan4978, 11 September 2007 - 04:23 PM.

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#22 UnderDogX

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Posted 11 September 2007 - 05:01 PM

well Goodell thinks it's a big deal apparently...on ESPN.com they are saying severe actions are going to be taken...possibly the loss of several draft picks...although it's not like they need them at the moment....
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#23 Derek21

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Posted 11 September 2007 - 06:03 PM

Having Brady throw a 30-yard pass up top to Moss up 17 with two and a half minutes to go I'd call running it up. He'd have had a lot to answer for if Moss had gotten injured or Brady had somehow twisted an ankle. Even Peyton Manning can't score that many points that quick.

Not to mention throwing a challenge flag to try to get a half-yard on the goalline - on FIRST DOWN no less - was excessive. What was the point of that exactly?



That's pretty bush league. The Jets should remember that when they face them again in December if they're still in it.

I think this cheating thing is pathetic. But you see it a lot with baseball where teams steal signs. Anything to gain an edge.

Doesn't make it right.
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#24 Don

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Posted 11 September 2007 - 07:05 PM

Doesn't make it right.


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#25 devilsfan26

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Posted 11 September 2007 - 11:46 PM

Were you using a camera to do so? :P

This is verbatim, a post I made on another board:

[Stealing signs is one thing, if you're careless and the other team can decipher your signals then tough noogies. But using cameras to do so is outright spying and against the written rules of the NFL (which granted haven't been enforced to this point).]

Exactly.
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#26 LOTCB

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 10:08 AM

I love the Patriots apologists in this thread...I cannot imagine if those same apologists who think no matter what Billa-cheat does, he walks on water, if the New York Ranger$ were ever accused of this, what would their reaction be?

This surely is a dark day for most of the E$PN crew, as they adore the Pat$

Edited by LOTCB, 12 September 2007 - 10:11 AM.

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#27 Jerrydevil

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 10:19 AM

I love the Patriots apologists in this thread...I cannot imagine if those same apologists who think no matter what Billa-cheat does, he walks on water, if the New York Ranger$ were ever accused of this, what would their reaction be?

This surely is a dark day for most of the E$PN crew, as they adore the Pat$


What thread are you reading? Not many Pats apologists here.

Throw the book at him. I'd love to see the Jets get something out of this, like a draft pick, but if that's not feasible because other teams have been victimized, then how about a nice bite out of the Pats salary cap for the next two years?
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#28 LOTCB

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 12:27 PM

Found this on the Bills site I post on:

Belicheck had a press conference, listen to this, BB refused to talk about the scandal about cheating etc and here was his response:

Bill Belichek: "Does anyone want to talk about the upcoming game?"
Reporter: "Is it going to be harder to score on San Diego without knowing their defensive signals?"

Bill's response: Blank stare!!!!

Priceless!!!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Edited by LOTCB, 12 September 2007 - 12:27 PM.

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#29 South Jersey Devs Fan

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 12:29 PM

I think Beli-chick should be suspended and draft picks taken. Whatever it is I hope it is fierce...

Edited by South Jersey Devs Fan, 12 September 2007 - 12:30 PM.

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#30 thefiestygoat

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 12:53 PM

Found this on the Bills site I post on:

Belicheck had a press conference, listen to this, BB refused to talk about the scandal about cheating etc and here was his response:

Bill Belichek: "Does anyone want to talk about the upcoming game?"
Reporter: "Is it going to be harder to score on San Diego without knowing their defensive signals?"

Bill's response: Blank stare!!!!

Priceless!!!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

That is great! I hope to see the video of that pop up online somewhere.
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#31 Jerrydevil

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 01:27 PM

Bill Belichek: "Does anyone want to talk about the upcoming game?"
Reporter: "Is it going to be harder to score on San Diego without knowing their defensive signals?"

Bill's response: Blank stare!!!!


Bravo!
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#32 insanity_gallops

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 06:10 PM

Hey, I'm the first to admit that, given the results of the investigation, the Patriots cheated.

My whole point in the beginning of this thread was that everybody immediately assumed the Pats were stealing signals because of a rumor. So yes, I was skeptical until further evidence surfaced. 'n now, the Patriots deserve to be punished for it.
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#33 TravisZajac

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 06:27 PM

Hey, I'm the first to admit that, given the results of the investigation, the Patriots cheated.

My whole point in the beginning of this thread was that everybody immediately assumed the Pats were stealing signals because of a rumor. So yes, I was skeptical until further evidence surfaced. 'n now, the Patriots deserve to be punished for it.


Ex-Steelers coachs have been suspecting this out of Belichik since he was a HC with the Clevelend Browns...But they haven't had enough proof to prove it.


Hey guys..Just imagine..We don't know how many times they have been using this, an exemple..They used on the Packers, a weak team in the NFC.Imagine, its a weak team.Imagine for all the teams they have been playing , who are way better teams than the Packers.



Remember back in 2004-2005, The Steelers won 34-20 vs the Pats during October(in Pittsburgh) Then, in the AFC Championship, the Defense was weak vs the Pats Offense(When they allowed like..5yards rushing, and intercepted Brady 2times ect , during the Regular season)..



Ehhhh.....The reputation of B.B and Tom Brady are getting a huge hit.
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#34 insanity_gallops

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 07:01 PM

Remember back in 2004-2005, The Steelers won 34-20 vs the Pats during October(in Pittsburgh) Then, in the AFC Championship, the Defense was weak vs the Pats Offense(When they allowed like..5yards rushing, and intercepted Brady 2times ect , during the Regular season)..


See, this is what gets me - how people immediately assume that sign stealing is the only reason the Pats have won big games. TZ, there's no way that the Patriots simply outplayed the Steelers in that game, just like the Steelers outplayed them earlier in the season?
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#35 Derek21

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 07:35 PM

I love the Patriots apologists in this thread...I cannot imagine if those same apologists who think no matter what Billa-cheat does, he walks on water, if the New York Ranger$ were ever accused of this, what would their reaction be?

This surely is a dark day for most of the E$PN crew, as they adore the Pat$



LMAO...but every smart team and its players are trying to gain a competitive edge. So I guess it just doesn't come as much of a shock that this happened. It's probably been going on for years. Now the NFL wants to get serious about it. So they'll punish the Pats and make them an example.
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#36 TravisZajac

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 08:16 PM

See, this is what gets me - how people immediately assume that sign stealing is the only reason the Pats have won big games. TZ, there's no way that the Patriots simply outplayed the Steelers in that game, just like the Steelers outplayed them earlier in the season?




I never said it was the reason "WHY THE PATS WON THE GAME"


I just said, it was questionnable to see, One team dominating the other, then in the playoffs, Pats outplays the Steelers.




You can fault on the poor Offense contribution also, (Big Ben 2ints, Crucial one's...)Cowher mishandled of the game(He decided to go with a FG in the 4rth Quarter instead of a TD...)


Sigh..As a Steeler fan, this game was a huge upset to me.I remember following them all season-long, The Big three, Staley-Bettis-Parker....Polamalu was dominating, it seemed like this was OUR YEAR.But yet, the Patriots cut off once again(2001...Afc...)After that game, I just hated so much the Pats..Hated them to death.

But I became more mature(At that time I was like... 13years old?).(An other thing ...I think 99.99% of the Steelers fans hates the Patriots, No kidding.)


Though, you can question each game they played.We don't know when it started,(Since Belichik was a Head Coach of the Browns, Since some Steelers coachs suspected at that time, Belichick to seal Signs illegaly..)


We don't really know.



http://sports.aol.co...for-years/#cont



When the news broke that the Patriots were being investigated for illegally using a video camera to record their opponent's defensive signals, there didn't seem to be a whole lot of surprise around the league. In fact, several Steelers coaches told the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette that Belichick has been doing it for years, going back to his time in Cleveland.

Steelers coaches, who asked not to be identified, have suspected for a long time that the Patriots used such a device to gain an illegal advantage, although they did not file a complaint with the league.
One assistant said the Steelers changed their defensive signals whenever they played against New England because of their suspicions.

Steelers head coach Mike Tomlin was one of the few coaches to go on the record with his concerns about the Patriots, saying in his Tuesday press conference that "where there is smoke, there's fire." Apparently Belichick and his team's tweaking of the rules has been an open secret, but no one seems to have stepped forward to accuse them because it was extremely difficult to obtain hard evidence--until the Jets confiscated the Patriots camera.


"A lot has been said about the New England guys and New England family, if you will," Tomlin said. "You focus on the variables that you can control; the men that you work with, your preparation; your performance, at least I do. I don't worry about those things."
Of course, if Belichick was cheating with the Browns, it shows that there are limits to how much of an advantage teams can get from stealing signals--he was 36-44 as the Browns coach before being fired.



http://www.post-gaze...id=steelers.xml

Steelers coaches, who asked not to be identified, have suspected for a long time that the Patriots used such a device to gain an illegal advantage, although they did not file a complaint with the league.

One assistant said the Steelers changed their defensive signals whenever they played against New England because of their suspicions.



Steelers president Art Rooney II said he did not want to comment on the Patriots' situation.


Dick Hoak, a former longtime Steelers assistant coach, said the Steelers once received a video from another team by mistake in their exchange with them. The video focused on an opposing coach using hand signals along the sideline. Hoak could not remember the team, but said the Steelers did not file a complaint.

Edited by TravisZajac, 12 September 2007 - 08:22 PM.

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#37 Don

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 08:28 PM

BTW - how do you actually stop this from happening? Okay, the Patriots had guys with video cameras that were pointed at the opposition sidelines. That you can deal with. But you can put a spy camera in a helmet and have someone nonchalantly point it at the opposition coach.
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#38 TravisZajac

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Posted 12 September 2007 - 09:13 PM

BTW - how do you actually stop this from happening? Okay, the Patriots had guys with video cameras that were pointed at the opposition sidelines. That you can deal with. But you can put a spy camera in a helmet and have someone nonchalantly point it at the opposition coach.




Oh well..I'm sure for what'll happen to the Pats, I don't think so any teams will try, or maybe of course, will try.




I seriously hope not...But good point Don.I hope mister Goodell, makes sure there'll be no more cheating of sying the opposite Coach signals.
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#39 LOTCB

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Posted 13 September 2007 - 11:50 AM

Random thought: Bill was the DC of the Giant$ in SB 25...hmmmmmmmmm :uni: :o
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#40 Devils731

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Posted 13 September 2007 - 12:17 PM

Oh well..I'm sure for what'll happen to the Pats, I don't think so any teams will try, or maybe of course, will try.
I seriously hope not...But good point Don.I hope mister Goodell, makes sure there'll be no more cheating of sying the opposite Coach signals.


Boomer, on 660 AM in the morning, was saying every team does this, they just don't violate the rule of having someone on the field with a camera doing it. There is a reason everyone covers their mouths when they call in plays because teams have guys with binoculars at different spots trying to catch what they're saying. The NFL, from what Boomer said, banned people from doing it at field level so coaches could know they weren't trying to be caught from that height and only had to worry about the people above. Of course the only reason they had to worry about people above is because people started trying to steal signals from above and teams still try to do it whenever they can.
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