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2nd group mulling NHL in Hamilton, Ont.


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#1 nyrsuck26

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Posted 09 May 2009 - 08:48 PM

http://sports.espn.g...tory?id=4154780

Will they beat the Coyotes?

Edited by nyrsuck26, 09 May 2009 - 08:55 PM.

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#2 Don

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Posted 09 May 2009 - 10:45 PM

Put them both in Hamilton. They will draw more fans than they currently are.
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#3 DEV1LDR1VER

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 12:19 AM

Bettman is hell bent on keeping the over-expanded NHL failing teams in bad hockey markets.
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#4 DevilNurn

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 12:30 AM

Hey they made the playoffs one year!!

:P
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#5 maxpower

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 01:20 AM

Bettman is hell bent on keeping the over-expanded NHL failing teams in bad hockey markets.



Bettman isn't hell bent on anything, if the owners didn't agree with him, this wouldn't be happening. There's only so many middling Canadian markets you can put teams in or the mid-late 90's will repeat itself. Unless you want these teams on border shuttles depending on how exchange is working out. In a pro USD exchange environment, the Coyotes crappy gate looks like $700-800K Canadian a night.
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#6 Revan

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 04:36 AM

LOL, I happen to know (too much of a word probably) a guy who roots for two teams: the Thrashers and (now that he's moved to Arizona) the Coyotes. Gotta feel bad for him. :P
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#7 UliHiemer

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 05:01 AM

I've been to quite a few games in Glendale and - after the Devils - the Coyotes are my favorite team. However, hockey in the desert at 85 degrees in December just doesn't feel quite right. No wonder not too many people care about hockey down there. The same can be said for a place like Tampa Bay. On the other hand, many years ago I've been to Quebec to watch the Nordiques play Buffalo, Boston and Montreal. Boy, that was a hockey town. Everybody was talking hockey, it was cold and hockey just seemed like a natural there. To me, the NHL has never been the same after Quebec and Winnipeg moved and the NHL expanded into markets, that are just not right for hockey. Yes, I would be sad if the Coyotes left, but on the other hand, this would probably be the right decision for hockey.
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#8 Triumph

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 11:09 AM

Bettman isn't hell bent on anything, if the owners didn't agree with him, this wouldn't be happening. There's only so many middling Canadian markets you can put teams in or the mid-late 90's will repeat itself. Unless you want these teams on border shuttles depending on how exchange is working out. In a pro USD exchange environment, the Coyotes crappy gate looks like $700-800K Canadian a night.


seriously. i think hamilton can support a team, but it's the only canadian market i would put an nhl team in that doesn't already have one. i was reading on another board where people thought kitchener-waterloo could get a team - i mean, are these people nuts?
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#9 HellOnICE

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 11:36 AM

seriously. i think hamilton can support a team, but it's the only canadian market i would put an nhl team in that doesn't already have one. i was reading on another board where people thought kitchener-waterloo could get a team - i mean, are these people nuts?


I feel the same way Tri. It seems Hamilton is the only place I'd put a team too. The market is big enough, seemingly to sustain a team. I won't worrya bout the Leafs, they've had like 90 year head start...I'd worry a little bit about Buffalo...but if that many people are taken away from Buffalo then OY. But, if NJ/NYR/PHI can work...then I don't see why a stronger market for hockey wouldn't.

If it's about NHL US tv ratings, which it partly is...I can't see that many people aring in Phoenix anyway.
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#10 SS-SS

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 12:53 PM

Bettman is hell bent on keeping the over-expanded NHL failing teams in bad hockey markets.



+1
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#11 nyrsuck26

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 01:19 PM

seriously. i think hamilton can support a team, but it's the only canadian market i would put an nhl team in that doesn't already have one. i was reading on another board where people thought kitchener-waterloo could get a team - i mean, are these people nuts?

Why wouldn't Winnipeg or Quebec City be able to support a team? There are cities with less population (and less of a percentage of hockey fans) that do have an NHL team.
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#12 DEV1LDR1VER

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 01:36 PM

Why wouldn't Winnipeg or Quebec City be able to support a team? There are cities with less population (and less of a percentage of hockey fans) that do have an NHL team.


Especially now with a cap in place they could support a team. All contracts are in US $. Back when the US dollar was so much stonger than the CA dollar coupled with no cap it was much tougher for Canadian teams.
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#13 Triumph

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 01:41 PM

Why wouldn't Winnipeg or Quebec City be able to support a team? There are cities with less population (and less of a percentage of hockey fans) that do have an NHL team.


no there aren't. and even if there are, the canadian exchange rate is at .8. this means that a canadian team has to pay 10 dollars where american teams have to pay 8, that's a large impediment. but yeah please tell me what markets are smaller than quebec or winnipeg, because there aren't any.
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#14 Triumph

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 01:44 PM

Especially now with a cap in place they could support a team. All contracts are in US $. Back when the US dollar was so much stonger than the CA dollar coupled with no cap it was much tougher for Canadian teams.


huh? as far as i know, the canadian clubs do not get matching dollars from the league; they used to. a contract would be signed for $2 million cdn, but it would be paid out as $2 million US, with the league making up the difference. that's not the case anymore, as far as i can tell.
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#15 HellOnICE

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 02:23 PM

no there aren't. and even if there are, the canadian exchange rate is at .8. this means that a canadian team has to pay 10 dollars where american teams have to pay 8, that's a large impediment. but yeah please tell me what markets are smaller than quebec or winnipeg, because there aren't any.


Even cities like Raleigh and Columbus are bigger than WPG. Sunrise, FL is small...but if you count the greater Ft. Lauderdale area, it's quite huge.
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#16 nyrsuck26

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 02:33 PM

no there aren't. and even if there are, the canadian exchange rate is at .8. this means that a canadian team has to pay 10 dollars where american teams have to pay 8, that's a large impediment. but yeah please tell me what markets are smaller than quebec or winnipeg, because there aren't any.

You'll have to forgive me because according to statshockey.net you're right by the population of the metroplitan areas. I was looking at another site that only gave the population of the actual cities.

However, I still hold my arguement that the percentage of hockey fans in Winnipeg, Quebec, etc. is greater than that of Florida (just the Panthers not the whole state), Atlanta, Phoenix, Carolina, Nashville, etc. for example.
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#17 Triumph

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 02:33 PM

the thing about winnipeg is that it doesn't have any suburbs. it's a city of 633,451, with its metropolitan area having 694,668 people. in the US, cities of 600,000 have metro areas well over a million people.
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#18 Devils731

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 02:40 PM

You'll have to forgive me because according to statshockey.net you're right by the population of the metroplitan areas. I was looking at another site that only gave the population of the actual cities.

However, I still hold my arguement that the percentage of hockey fans in Winnipeg, Quebec, etc. is greater than that of Florida (just the Panthers not the whole state), Atlanta, Phoenix, Carolina, Nashville, etc. for example.


Population only tells part of the story too. Disposable income is an important item as well. I don't have any numbers but it's another thing to factor in when you're looking at locations.

Another thing to look at is cannabilization. How much do these areas already spend on hockey vs how much more can they vs how much do other teams lose by having a team in that location.
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#19 nyrsuck26

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 07:41 PM

Mayor says Hamilton only working with Balsillie

"We've had discussions with others, we're going to leave it at that, but the primary person we're dealing with right now and that we hope to put together an arrangement with for Copps Coliseum is Mr. Balsillie," said [Mayor] Eisenberger

Something tell's me that those discussions have gone farther than he's letting on...
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#20 thelastonealive

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Posted 10 May 2009 - 07:45 PM

Wyshynski mentioned in one of his blog posts that wind up in the News Feed section, and I have to agree with him: Bettman's not against a second team in the Toronto area, he's against moving a team there, when an alternative would have the NHL collecting massive expansion fees instead.
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