12374 replies to this topic

[lilgriffey84]

That's what I thought too, that a new deal could be created to avoid the arbitration...in fact the rule I posted seems to suggest it. But I agree with you, that since I haven't heard any sportswriters mention the clause I posted it doesn't apply for some reason.

I think pride is a factor basically the nhl is putting its foot down on the devils when they had the oppurtunity to do it with the other contracts. Also how can you allow the stanley cup champions blackhawks and the Phailures who were the runner up get there contracts passed. This is an uneven playing field in my mind. if the hawks and phailures along with numerous other clubs were allowed to make the same deals who is the nhl to say that the devils cant

[maxpower]

it's not really the same contract though. the Devils had a chance to put the same contract out there, but they dragged it out 2 years longer for some unknown reason.

this is basically a combination of all of these whacky deals stretched out to maximum length.

[lilgriffey84]

it's not really the same contract though. the Devils had a chance to put the same contract out there, but they dragged it out 2 years longer for some unknown reason.

this is basically a combination of all of these whacky deals stretched out to maximum length.

kovy wants to play until he is 44

[HOLLYWOOD]

Well, since the planet knows the entire details of the Devils/Kovy contract... Now this from Helen Elliott of the LA Times

I still say this is all the greatest publicity stunt in NHL history. The media is running with it full speed.

http://www.latimes.c...0,4820847.story

Kings would be interested in resuming pursuit of Ilya Kovalchuk

The Kings could again try to sign the forward if his 17-year, $102-million contract with New Jersey is invalidated on the grounds that it circumvents the league's salary cap.

[HOLLYWOOD]

LA Kings looking to make a deal. Montreal Gazette reports...

http://www.montrealg...7473/story.html


Making a deal with the Devils

The Devils acquired Kovalchuk in a mid-season trade with the Atlanta Thrashers last season and along with the Los Angeles Kings have courted him since free agency began July 1. Kings general manager Dean Lombardi told the team's website his club would still be interested in signing Kovalchuk if the deal with the Devils falls through.

[BlueSkirt]

All is well. The NHL simply fired a salvo across the bow of the GMs fully knowing they will not win in arbitration. On the longshot the NHL does win, the contract would be tweaked such that the NHL could not reject it again.
I have full confidence that #17 will be here for quite some time.

[RolandNJD]

All is well. The NHL simply fired a salvo across the bow of the GMs fully knowing they will not win in arbitration. On the longshot the NHL does win, the contract would be tweaked such that the NHL could not reject it again.
I have full confidence that #17 will be here for quite some time.

Here's hoping.

I thought maybe this was a blessing... I mean talk to us in 10 years and we might not even want any part of Kovalchuk. But I'm all for it now, and I don't understand why the NHL would take it out on New Jersey, and not start at the Hossa contract.

[dejaentendu2101]

LA Kings looking to make a deal. Montreal Gazette reports...

http://www.montrealg...7473/story.html


Making a deal with the Devils

Oh no.

[mrthemike]

fvckin Kings....

[jagknife]

I'm confident he returns even if the contract gets voided in arbitration. His comments tuesday at the press conference alone locked him in here. If he goes elsewhere at this point, it would create not only a fan backlash, but it would be a PR nightmare for him for the rest of his career. Every game, every mistake, every detail of his play would come into question and he would also could be looked upon as a fraud for saying so many things that made him seem dedicated to one team, and then for him to turn around and bolt just because the original contract was rejected by some fat midget who cant see over the steering wheel of his own car.

[Amberite]

Dean Lombardi is the biggest GM in the league. He doesn't know when to shut his mouth. I wouldn't take too much stock in them saying that they would be interested in Kovy again. Of course they're interested - Kovy abandoned them, Gagne signed in with Tampa, and he has droves of fans outside his office with pitchforks. I'm also interested in winning Mega Millions this Friday.

Edited by Amberite, 22 July 2010 - 07:53 AM.

[Pepperkorn]

Great article

Nhl may have picked the wrong fight

Yeah makes you think -- will the NHL reject any Islanders contract for circumventing the floor?

I'm confident he returns even if the contract gets voided in arbitration. His comments tuesday at the press conference alone locked him in here. If he goes elsewhere at this point, it would create not only a fan backlash, but it would be a PR nightmare for him for the rest of his career. Every game, every mistake, every detail of his play would come into question and he would also could be looked upon as a fraud for saying so many things that made him seem dedicated to one team, and then for him to turn around and bolt just because the original contract was rejected by some fat midget who cant see over the steering wheel of his own car.

Yeah - until the next moron comes along -- next off-season probably. Only Devils fans will feel that way long term.

Edited by Pepperkorn, 22 July 2010 - 07:56 AM.

[Pepperkorn]

That's what I thought too, that a new deal could be created to avoid the arbitration...in fact the rule I posted seems to suggest it. But I agree with you, that since I haven't heard any sportswriters mention the clause I posted it doesn't apply for some reason.

If I were representing the Devils organization, I wouldn't even think of suggesting a new deal to Kovalchuk. It's his job to come back and say - Look, can we re-structure this thing and see what happens?

Even if I'd want to give the NHL the big fvck you and fight to the death, it's all about what Kovalchuk wants, not the organization, THAT is what good faith negotiating is about. The whole claim is that the Devils were NOT negotiating in good faith. They were though - it's always been in Kovalchuk's court. That's one of the reason I like that he is on record as saying he wanted 17 years because it's his number - his dad died on the 17th. It has genuine significance to him. Even if it's a line it was HIS call not the organizations therefore NOT a bad-faith request on NJ's part.


Basically bottom line: If the Devils look to do anything other than follow Kovalchuk's lead it's proof positive of bad faith negotiation - if not before the rejection then it most certainly would be after the fact, And that is NOT the Devils way.

Edited by Pepperkorn, 22 July 2010 - 08:05 AM.

[NewarkDevil5]

If I were representing the Devils organization, I wouldn't even think of suggesting a new deal to Kovalchuk. It's his job to come back and say - Look, can we re-structure this thing and see what happens?

Even if I'd want to give the NHL the big fvck you and fight to the death, it's all about what Kovalchuk wants, not the organization, THAT is what good faith negotiating is about. The whole claim is that the Devils were NOT negotiating in good faith. They were though - it's always been in Kovalchuk's court. That's one of the reason I like that he is on record as saying he wanted 17 years because it's his number - his dad died on the 17th. It has genuine significance to him. Even if it's a line it was HIS call not the organizations therefore NOT a bad-faith request on NJ's part.


Basically bottom line: If the Devils look to do anything other than follow Kovalchuk's lead it's proof positive of bad faith negotiation - if not before the rejection then it most certainly would be after the fact, And that is NOT the Devils way.

I agree with this completely. Well said, PK.

[Pepperkorn]

I also really feel for the journalists out there ... or sports writer - its a tough job if you're a Devils fan. Lou cannot say certain things. These guys have to get out the message in competitive time or risk not being listened to. and sometimes they get the intent wrong. Lou cannot spell out his intent because that's far too specific. He has to paint with broad strokes and he's got to find the journalist who knows the Ineffable System well enough to translate the message. I had the feel of it yesterdays but it was all too much. It was too much because I didn't get the hidden message from Lou's insinuations before the contract was rejected. Lou was unclear in fact - but he had it in his head what he was getting at... dope. I suspect that was over thinking to the point of missing that middle step - that they had a heads up the contract might be rejected but didn't take much stock in it because it's a standard message that goes out to all teams that must cross some line NHL has set out but hasn't communicated - because they can't because it's illegal in the CBA basically instigating collusion.

Yes yes -- all the pieces are just falling perfectly into place for me. I'm massively pissed I didn't get this right off the bat - we could have helped TG get the message straight. PuckDaddy could have spun it all out correctly from the start. But I ... I dont know if even I can get it all out properly now - what's so clear -- generally though, once I get it, the whole world has too so.... now it's re-spinning, rewinding and putting it all back the way Lou intended... (of course I knwo it's just the way I see things but I love to think I see them the Devils way )

TRAUMA!

Edited by Pepperkorn, 22 July 2010 - 08:26 AM.

[Triumph]

If I were representing the Devils organization, I wouldn't even think of suggesting a new deal to Kovalchuk. It's his job to come back and say - Look, can we re-structure this thing and see what happens?

Even if I'd want to give the NHL the big fvck you and fight to the death, it's all about what Kovalchuk wants, not the organization, THAT is what good faith negotiating is about. The whole claim is that the Devils were NOT negotiating in good faith. They were though - it's always been in Kovalchuk's court. That's one of the reason I like that he is on record as saying he wanted 17 years because it's his number - his dad died on the 17th. It has genuine significance to him. Even if it's a line it was HIS call not the organizations therefore NOT a bad-faith request on NJ's part.


Basically bottom line: If the Devils look to do anything other than follow Kovalchuk's lead it's proof positive of bad faith negotiation - if not before the rejection then it most certainly would be after the fact, And that is NOT the Devils way.

i didn't think of it like this, but you're absolutely right. it has to be kind of terrifying for lou and company to be in such a position, but their move should be no move at all.

[cubanjd305]

When do the 120 hours to file grievance start from? Tuesday night or when the NHL announced it??

[njdevil26]

This puts a ton of pressure on Kovalchuk.

If it turns out the way I'm thinking it will... having the press conference knowing the contract was going to get rejected was GENIUS.

Now it's up to Kovy to live by his word. He said he wanted to be here and he said it's not about the money.

So he's got two options. He can either go to Lou and say "We can change this deal and make it acceptable to the leauge." Or he can agree to fight the hell out of his contract to make sure it's accepted by the arbitrator.

Lou's done a great job so far.

[thelastonealive]

Well, at least it's not boring. Hell, it's almost like not having an offseason at all! This ridiculousness has made summer WAY more tolerable than usual. In a weird painful sorta way.

[DaneykoIsGod]

If I were representing the Devils organization, I wouldn't even think of suggesting a new deal to Kovalchuk. It's his job to come back and say - Look, can we re-structure this thing and see what happens?

Even if I'd want to give the NHL the big fvck you and fight to the death, it's all about what Kovalchuk wants, not the organization, THAT is what good faith negotiating is about. The whole claim is that the Devils were NOT negotiating in good faith. They were though - it's always been in Kovalchuk's court. That's one of the reason I like that he is on record as saying he wanted 17 years because it's his number - his dad died on the 17th. It has genuine significance to him. Even if it's a line it was HIS call not the organizations therefore NOT a bad-faith request on NJ's part.


Basically bottom line: If the Devils look to do anything other than follow Kovalchuk's lead it's proof positive of bad faith negotiation - if not before the rejection then it most certainly would be after the fact, And that is NOT the Devils way.

+1

Er ... I mean

We're all so used to the concept that Lou is always in control, but in a process like this, how much is the GM really the one in control? How much does the player and agent dictate? Is it really such a stretch to say Kovalchuk was the one insisting on 17 years (for all the reasons 17 is important to him) and $102M ($1M more than the Thrashers offered)? Is it really unfathomable that Kovy/Grossman put those numbers on the table and Vanderbeek told Lou to make it work, and Lou used the framework of previously approved contracts to construct something that technically abided by the CBA even though it made him roll his eyes?

I don't know ... I feel like this scenario, however unlikely it may be, fits Lou's quotes from the other day better than any other conspiracy theory floating around.