[devsin4]

TheMazz, on 29 July 2010 - 10:10 PM, said:

While am too young to remember and while this is true I just don't picture the Devils being "the Devils" if the had drafted Kidd instead and the Flames picked Marty first.

Credit the scouts and LL for picking Marty over Kidd, and that was HUGE!! But Scott Stevens added a more credibility and personality to the team.. set the tone, and lead by example, I wish he took a more active role in coaching these days, cause these guys could really use a good kick in the pants!! But you're right Mazz.I don't think we'de have 3 cups without Marty between the pipes. That's what makes this poll so good!!!

This post has been edited by devsin4: 29 July 2010 - 11:21 PM

[Devils Pride 26]

Stevens and its not close, imo. Brodeur without Stevens:

03-04, 1st round loss to Philly
05-06, 2nd round loss to Carolina
06-07, 2nd round loss to Ottawa
07-08, 1st round loss to NYR
08-09, 1st round loss to Carolina
09-10, 1st round loss to Philly

Disgusting

[grcenter47]

Devils Pride 26, on 30 July 2010 - 12:07 AM, said:

Stevens and its not close, imo. Brodeur without Stevens:

03-04, 1st round loss to Philly
05-06, 2nd round loss to Carolina
06-07, 2nd round loss to Ottawa
07-08, 1st round loss to NYR
08-09, 1st round loss to Carolina
09-10, 1st round loss to Philly

Disgusting

nice stats

[Devils Pride 26]

grcenter47, on 30 July 2010 - 12:13 AM, said:

nice stats

as in, stats that make you wanna drink til you puke? yeah, ill go with that

[grcenter47]

Devils Pride 26, on 30 July 2010 - 12:14 AM, said:

as in, stats that make you wanna drink til you puke? yeah, ill go with that

haha.. its nice to see people backing up their points with actual facts and statistics

[devsin4]

Devils Pride 26, on 29 July 2010 - 11:07 PM, said:

Stevens and its not close, imo. Brodeur without Stevens:

03-04, 1st round loss to Philly
05-06, 2nd round loss to Carolina
06-07, 2nd round loss to Ottawa
07-08, 1st round loss to NYR
08-09, 1st round loss to Carolina
09-10, 1st round loss to Philly

Disgusting

Man That is piss poor when you think about it, The ones against NYR (Avery shadow dancing Marty while P. Martin stood there with a dopey look on his face) and 09-10 Philly (Zach getting nearly decapitated by Pronger and no payback) REALLY gets under my skin--Lack of balls!! Dorothy Hamil could've put up a better fight.
Basically this team sucks without Stevens, as soon as he retired, the team turned into pussies.

[devilsfan26]

Devils Pride 26, on 30 July 2010 - 12:07 AM, said:

Stevens and its not close, imo. Brodeur without Stevens:

03-04, 1st round loss to Philly
05-06, 2nd round loss to Carolina
06-07, 2nd round loss to Ottawa
07-08, 1st round loss to NYR
08-09, 1st round loss to Carolina
09-10, 1st round loss to Philly

Disgusting

It's too close for me to decide so I'm not arguing that Brodeur is more valuable than Stevens, but if you're gonna make that argument, check out Stevens without Brodeur:

82-83, 1st round loss to NYI
83-84, 2nd round loss to NYI
84-85, 1st round loss to NYI
85-86, 2nd round loss to NYR
86-87, 1st round loss to NYI
87-88, 2nd round loss to NJ
88-89, 1st round loss to Philly
89-90, 3rd round loss to Boston (sweep)
90-91, 2nd round loss to Minnesota
91-92, 1st round loss to NYR
92-93, 1st round loss to Pittsburgh

Not much better.

[grcenter47]

devilsfan26, on 30 July 2010 - 01:26 AM, said:

It's too close for me to decide so I'm not arguing that Brodeur is more valuable than Stevens, but if you're gonna make that argument, check out Stevens without Brodeur:

82-83, 1st round loss to NYI
83-84, 2nd round loss to NYI
84-85, 1st round loss to NYI
85-86, 2nd round loss to NYR
86-87, 1st round loss to NYI
87-88, 2nd round loss to NJ
88-89, 1st round loss to Philly
89-90, 3rd round loss to Boston (sweep)
90-91, 2nd round loss to Minnesota
91-92, 1st round loss to NYR
92-93, 1st round loss to Pittsburgh

Not much better.

i love your jersey collection especially the golden gophers jersey and the parise north dakota jersey

This post has been edited by grcenter47: 30 July 2010 - 12:42 AM

[Pepperkorn]

njdevilz4, on 29 July 2010 - 09:09 PM, said:

My first instinct is to say Stevens. He set the tone for the team. When he was out of the lineup there was (and still is) a huge hole that could not be filled. Marty went down 2 seasons ago and we kept winning, but in no way shape or form can you discount what he has done for this franchise. Stevens set the tone in the playoffs, but Marty stole so many games for us. Both are legends. I think Marty's longevity will give him the biggest overall impact.

Honestly - not sarcastic -- what games did Marty steal? I don't recall a one. He makes great saves and keeps the team in it - but he never saved the teams bacon in a flashy Roy way that I can recall. I'd honestly love to see/read about the highlights.

[SC Devs Fan]

When I saw the topic, there are only 2 people I thought of ... Lou or McMullen, and an argument can be made for either.

[ThreeCups]

Pepperkorn, on 30 July 2010 - 08:31 AM, said:

Honestly - not sarcastic -- what games did Marty steal? I don't recall a one. He makes great saves and keeps the team in it - but he never saved the teams bacon in a flashy Roy way that I can recall. I'd honestly love to see/read about the highlights.

He played out of his mind for the majority of the 2000 SCF vs Dallas...even in the Game 5 devastating loss....perhaps one of his best series

[njdevilz4]

Pepperkorn, on 30 July 2010 - 08:31 AM, said:

Honestly - not sarcastic -- what games did Marty steal? I don't recall a one. He makes great saves and keeps the team in it - but he never saved the teams bacon in a flashy Roy way that I can recall. I'd honestly love to see/read about the highlights.

Whithout his great saves we don't win a lot of games. Maybe steal isn't the right word, but I think you know what I mean.

[Pepperkorn]

TheMazz, on 29 July 2010 - 10:35 PM, said:

Also, I too think a goalie is the most important piece within a hockey team.

I think the position is a corner stone - but it's also isolated from the rest of the team. You can have a perfect goalie and a sh!t team in front of him. So he racks up Vezinas but doesn't actually affect the team psyche as a whole. On the other hand you can have a sh!t goalie and still have the team in front of him come through.

A goalie's job is to NOT have too much influence on a team. You build a team around a goalie because he provides consistency. If Gretzky was out of the line up the Oilers suffered - If Stevens was out of the line up Marty had to pick it up. If Marty was out of the lineup Stevens might be blocking that many more shots.

It's a symbiotic relationship. Marty has a great mindset - that he is just like any other member of the team. He doesn't buy into the Goalie is a different fish theory - and that's what elevates him above most goalies. But he cannot lead on ice - he cannot lead by example he's too far removed from play. He cannot be offensive minded. Defense can be defensive and offensive - he can see the whole ice from all angles - block shots, clear zones of pucks and people. If Marty was a defenseman he would not bring to the team what Stevens does. If Stevens were a goalie - well he coudln't be ... he's too hot, too hands on. The reason Stevens has more of a total impact on the team is because of the way he sees the game and can somehow articulate that to the entrie team. A goalie cannot SHOULD NOT do that. It's achoice a career choice Marty made -- given his personality his greatest influence is between the pipes. it's limited but he's the most complete there. Stevens - because it's a part of his being to influence and manipulate ... it's his JOB to have the most impact.

Marty not having the greatest impact is part of his job, mentally speaking. It would be damaging to the team if he attempted to have as great an impact as Stevens.

I also think that one could argue the trapezoid rule neutered Marty. He has always been as offensive minded as a goalie can be. His plaing the puck was a kin to Stevens blocking shots. imagine if Dmen were no longer allowed to block shots don't get me started.

This post has been edited by Pepperkorn: 30 July 2010 - 07:48 AM

[ThreeCups]

This debate could go on forever...I can't pick, they went together like peanut butter & jelly...haha

[Pepperkorn]

SC Devs Fan, on 30 July 2010 - 08:37 AM, said:

When I saw the topic, there are only 2 people I thought of ... Lou or McMullen, and an argument can be made for either.

Yeah -- I thought Lou as well - for me hands down. McMullen - if had been able to replace Lou with someone with that same vision -- hard to judge when you get it right the first time out!

[Pepperkorn]

I'm just saying - if marty had his way and defence played the way HE wants them too... fail! Stevens HAD his way. He HAD CONTROL OF THE TEAM. Marty has control of the pipes - and I just get the sense it irked him when big fat Stevens got in there. never go tthe sense Stevens cared one bit if Marty played the puck. Stevens gave Marty the freedom to be Marty -- Marty wanted to tweek Stevens play into something else based on all his stupid comments --- and THAT makes Marty an idiot who THANK GOD does not have the biggest impact on the team.

I'm sure it's all my own fiction -- but Crasher even says Marty's got his head up his ass once he steps into the whole game philosophy.

Stevens controlled the whole game thus MUST have the greatest impact. Just a case of on ice circumstance.


(and this is the way I convince everyone to vote for Marty just to tell me to go fvck my all knwoing self )

This post has been edited by Pepperkorn: 30 July 2010 - 07:57 AM

[DevsMan84]

How is this not obviously Stevens? The team has not accomplished really anything since he retired back in 04. Brodeur is a great goalie, but he was not the reason why we won so many cups. It was our defense and it started with Stevens first and then with support from Niedermayer, Rafalski, etc... down the road.

[Pepperkorn]

ThreeCups, on 30 July 2010 - 08:49 AM, said:

This debate could go on forever...I can't pick, they went together like peanut butter & jelly...haha

You voted for Marty though right?

[Pepperkorn]

ThreeCups, on 30 July 2010 - 08:38 AM, said:

He played out of his mind for the majority of the 2000 SCF vs Dallas...even in the Game 5 devastating loss....perhaps one of his best series

Hmeh -- and Stevens won the COnn Smythe... got anything else? Anything specific? That game changing save?

[ThreeCups]

Pepperkorn, on 30 July 2010 - 09:05 AM, said:

You voted for Marty though right?

I did not vote, because I can't. They are equally as important. I do not think we would have success without either one...we needed both