116 replies to this topic

[Amberite]

I worry about the team going forward. Right now, the Devils cannot think that Brodeur can play more than 40 games next year. They absolutely must get a guy who can fill that other time. When it comes time for Brodeur to retire, then Devils fans will remember the good times, but it's tough to remember those times when he's playing as poorly as he is.

If Brodeur keeps playing this way, it would be catastrophic to play him 40 games next season. He's going to need to swallow his pride and become a backup, or simply hang them up. I have the utmost respect for Brodeur and he's the main reason this franchise has been so successful, but that doesn't mean I should turn a blind eye while he lets games slip away from us.

[SoobyDoo]

If Brodeur keeps playing this way, it would be catastrophic to play him 40 games next season. He's going to need to swallow his pride and become a backup, or simply hang them up. I have the utmost respect for Brodeur and he's the main reason this franchise has been so successful, but that doesn't mean I should turn a blind eye while he lets games slip away from us.

You guys crack me up. Marty has been a significant reason why this franchise has won 3 cups, and why we've made 13 straight playoff appearances. Let's also remember how Marty passed up better money to remain in Jersey at a time his value was highest. To disrespect him in the manner in which so many of you are, is disgusting. Marty is having an off year, but he is hardly the reason why this team is in the toilet. I will never be convinced that part of our problem was the protracted Kovy contract situation. Bettman really screwed us in that it was difficult to properly plan for the season without knowing whether he'd be here or not. But that's not all, we have several players who seem to have no heart. Larry Brooks' article this past Sunday was spot on. Langenbrunner has been the same since his falling out with Lemaire last year. Moving him should have been Lou's first move when the season ended. I can go on and on, but you all see the same team I do, and you see the same garbage as me. Just don't pin this on Marty. He has no help out there.

[Marv4Life]

When the likes of a 41-year old Brian Roloson and a few no-name goalies are constantly outplaying you, something's gotta give.

Up the anty for that Tukka Rask proposal.

[CarpathianForest]

You guys crack me up. Marty has been a significant reason why this franchise has won 3 cups, and why we've made 13 straight playoff appearances. Let's also remember how Marty passed up better money to remain in Jersey at a time his value was highest. To disrespect him in the manner in which so many of you are, is disgusting. Marty is having an off year, but he is hardly the reason why this team is in the toilet. I will never be convinced that part of our problem was the protracted Kovy contract situation. Bettman really screwed us in that it was difficult to properly plan for the season without knowing whether he'd be here or not. But that's not all, we have several players who seem to have no heart. Larry Brooks' article this past Sunday was spot on. Langenbrunner has been the same since his falling out with Lemaire last year. Moving him should have been Lou's first move when the season ended. I can go on and on, but you all see the same team I do, and you see the same garbage as me. Just don't pin this on Marty. He has no help out there.

Yes, we should just resign Marty to a lifetime contract because of past success.

No one is disrespecting Marty, we know what he has provided for this team. However, there is a time when you need to realize that your days are behind you and it's better to be put out to pasture.

[Sickman]

CR76, nice effort but it's futile, especially here. I don't know when it became cool to bash the guy but there is a nice group of fans who love to downplay his contributions to the game and what he has done for this team. Let's break down all of his stats and show show how smart I am. Let's devalue the consistency and dedication to your craft required to play 1100 games in one of the most challenging positions in all of sports. A goalie only being as good as the team in front of him? Shocker! Ryan Miller would surely have us fighting for the division lead right now. Whatever the case, trying to knock him down a peg has been such a hobby for some (his own fans and experts) throughout his entire career. Now the feast begins at the lowest point of his professional career.

No one can deny that Marty has lost some speed and that the reflexes are not as sharp as they once were. But there were signs of this happening years ago. It comes along with age no matter who you are or how good you are. What I don't understand is why are so many convinced that he has lost EVERYTHING in the span of a summer? I still contend that this team is a burial ground for any goalie you throw in there but in saying that it's obviously not an excuse for every goal that he gives up. He's struggling, especially right now, but this seems like more of a mental issue at this point. I know it seems like forever ago, but after a tough start, Marty got his game in gear earlier this year and was actually playing pretty well prior to hurting his elbow in the Chicago game. He was by far one of the better players on this team at that time (although that may not be saying much). He was keeping them in games. He was still able to do it.

Imo, I think he has just lost complete confidence in his game and he can't get it back. But really, who can blame him?. He's getting older. He's been injured. The team in front of him is mistake prone and they absolutely can not score. There have been some terrible turnovers in front of him these last couple of games but that's not an excuse. He's really struggled these past two games, that much is obvious. But what you have seen these last couple of games is not a true barometer of his current capabilities. No way in hell a goalie playing at his current level manages to secure 3 shutouts on an awful team like NJ. He's no longer the Marty of old but he's not as bad as he has recently shown.

What has me worried more then anything is that I don't know HOW he can regain his confidence on this team. They're really limiting the shots against right now but they still mange to make such glaring and stupid mistakes all over the ice. Now add in the fact that the offense is basically non-existent, well it's a difficult task to ask someone to get their sh!t in order when everything is in total chaos around them. This can be said for many of the players on this team actually. Again, it's not an excuse for him, but as a goalie it's only you in that crease. Now think about playing that position while you're struggling and knowing that you have no room for error. It's not easy.

If Marty were the only one on this team that looked absolutely fried, then yeah, plan the burial. But this TEAM is in the toilet mentally. He's not the only one. They're bad and their season is lost. Say what you will about them only caring about money and what not, no one wants to be considered a laughingstock and this is exactly what this team has become this year. The losing starts to weigh on you, we even feel it as fans. Imagine being in that locker room? They're damaged.

[CarpathianForest]

eh, nevermind.

Edited by CarpathianForest, 27 December 2010 - 11:55 AM.

[Triumph]

It's not too tough to remember if you were a fan during the old days and look back on the goaltender situation pre-Marty, and recall when the Devils were a middling .500-or-so team struggling to make the playoffs. You admitted in previous posts that you didn't start following the team until '96, so clearly you don't have this perspective. But those who don't or can't remember the old days only need to take a gander at many other teams' goalie issues (hello Flyers?) while Marty played to realize that they saw something pretty damned special...a guy who not only played all of his games with one team, but who played them at or near peak performance for almost all of that time. Yeah, everything associated with the Devils is pretty hard to take right now, as they're just about unwatchable, and Marty is as much a factor in the Devils' poor play as anyone, but I don't think that means respect for an all-time great who was actually proud to wear a Devils jersey gets thrown right out the window.

don't play the young fan card at me. i will care about the past when brodeur retires, then i will celebrate his entire catalog. until then, he's signed for another year, which is an implicit promise to remain being good at hockey, and he's been terrible this year. everyone else has been bad too, but he's been just as bad. the flyers' goaltending issues over the last decade and a half are highly overstated - they make for a comfortable narrative, but they are not entirely why the flyers have yet to win a stanley cup.

[SoobyDoo]

"Yes, we should just resign Marty to a lifetime contract because of past success.

No one is disrespecting Marty, we know what he has provided for this team. However, there is a time when you need to realize that your days are behind you and it's better to be put out to pasture."


Nobody suggested that Marty is going to be re-signed. In fact, I'm not sure MARTY is even looking for another contract. I just don't understand the lack of respect people are showing this hall of famer. I ask you, would getting rid of Marty make this team better?

[CarpathianForest]

"Yes, we should just resign Marty to a lifetime contract because of past success.

No one is disrespecting Marty, we know what he has provided for this team. However, there is a time when you need to realize that your days are behind you and it's better to be put out to pasture."


Nobody suggested that Marty is going to be re-signed. In fact, I'm not sure MARTY is even looking for another contract. I just don't understand the lack of respect people are showing this hall of famer. I ask you, would getting rid of Marty make this team better?

There's no lack of respect. Would you rather have a Marty that is known as being the all time winningest goaltender, one of the greats, 3 time cup winners or have Marty be known for all those things with the caveat that he stayed past his sell by date. Say what you want about Patrick Roy but at least he knew when to hang them up.
And with the way things are would getting rid of Marty make this team any worse? Like I've said before this isn't the New Jersey Martys this is the New Jersey Devils and you do what's best for the team. Lou said he's not getting rid of Marty so there is probably not going to be a trade for him. I'd prefer to see Marty go out on top and this ain't the way to do it. He's slow and it appears that his injuries are getting the best of him. It would be terrible to see him retire as an old broken down player. Why would you want to disrespect him like that? Just for some imaginary loyalty you have to the guy's past successes?

[Amberite]

You guys crack me up. Marty has been a significant reason why this franchise has won 3 cups, and why we've made 13 straight playoff appearances. Let's also remember how Marty passed up better money to remain in Jersey at a time his value was highest. To disrespect him in the manner in which so many of you are, is disgusting. Marty is having an off year, but he is hardly the reason why this team is in the toilet. I will never be convinced that part of our problem was the protracted Kovy contract situation. Bettman really screwed us in that it was difficult to properly plan for the season without knowing whether he'd be here or not. But that's not all, we have several players who seem to have no heart. Larry Brooks' article this past Sunday was spot on. Langenbrunner has been the same since his falling out with Lemaire last year. Moving him should have been Lou's first move when the season ended. I can go on and on, but you all see the same team I do, and you see the same garbage as me. Just don't pin this on Marty. He has no help out there.

We crack you up huh? News flash: hockey is a business. Loyalties are important, and Brodeur will be talked about in NJ for the next 20 years, but when a player's time comes, it comes. I don't care how much he's done for us (and it's been a LOT) - the fact is, he's been abysmal this year, and if it continues, it means it's time for him to retire or become a backup. What is so hard to understand about this? It's the same with any other player in the NHL. Teams don't keep on players for the sake of nostalgia, especially not when they play a position which is absolutely essential for team success.

[Quinn01]

We crack you up huh? News flash: hockey is a business. Loyalties are important, and Brodeur will be talked about in NJ for the next 20 years, but when a player's time comes, it comes. I don't care how much he's done for us (and it's been a LOT) - the fact is, he's been abysmal this year, and if it continues, it means it's time for him to retire or become a backup. What is so hard to understand about this? It's the same with any other player in the NHL. Teams don't keep on players for the sake of nostalgia, especially not when they play a position which is absolutely essential for team success.

+1

Langenbrunner and White have done alot for our franchise in the past but they arent what they used to be. Amberite, you wouldnt happen to be one of those people saying you want them out of NJ are you? If so, whats the difference between what White did and Marty? They both were great and contributed alot to the team in the past, but that doesnt mean their down hill of skill needs to be over looked. The main goal of this sport/team is to win and if you arent helping that cause get out of the way. Fact is: Ever since the beginning of his injury, he is not what he used to be and consistently has been getting worse. Its time for him to take a bow and take a step back out of the light.

Edited by Quinn01, 27 December 2010 - 12:41 PM.

[CarpathianForest]

I still think we can lend/lease Marty like St. Louis did in 06-07 with Tkachuk. You could get a decent conditional return by sending Marty to Montreal for the playoffs.
Maybe Triumph or Daniel can chime in on the stats on this but I think one of the best things Marty can do for this club is retire. That opens up the cap.

[DaneykoIsGod]

Langenbrunner and White have done alot for our franchise in the past but they arent what they used to be. Amberite, you wouldnt happen to be one of those people saying you want them out of NJ are you? If so, whats the difference between what White did and Marty? They both were great and contributed alot to the team in the past, but that doesnt mean their down hill of skill needs to be over looked.

White's been one of our best players this year.

[hit the post]

Marty definitely won't be a backup. Also, there is no goalie on the planet that could lead THIS team as is to a Cup....

Wasn't talking about this year...thinking more the future....and he wouldn't be a backup because ?

You seem to pick what you want from others posts then start bashing....Again....NOT SAYING ITS ALL MARTY...but he's not helping things one bit...Others have posted...look whats he's done for the team,the fan's....its called doing his fvcking job...which he's not doing very well now.....can't keep playing him as a reward for his play 7 years ago.

[Quinn01]

White's been one of our best players this year.

Well thats like saying hes the smartest kid with down syndrome.

[CarpathianForest]

I think it would be cool for Marty to be sent to Montreal, it's also a fesbile option for both clubs. We perhaps could get a decent d man in return plus some conditional picks. Alex Auld is Price's backup and Montreal is going to want more assurance of playoff success in case Price falls apart. Marty and Price share some games in the regular season, perhaps gets a couple of starts in the playoffs and brings the cup to his hometown for the first time in 18 seasons. He comes back here next season and retires on a high note. What's wrong with that?

[hit the post]

I think it would be cool for Marty to be sent to Montreal, it's also a fesbile option for both clubs. We perhaps could get a decent d man in return plus some conditional picks. Alex Auld is Price's backup and Montreal is going to want more assurance of playoff success in case Price falls apart. Marty and Price share some games in the regular season, perhaps gets a couple of starts in the playoffs and brings the cup to his hometown for the first time in 18 seasons. He comes back here next season and retires on a high note. What's wrong with that?

Not a thing...its smart business.....but the Marty strokers would give it a thumbs down....Would he be the backup,because according some here..he won't be a backup....they must have talked about it over coffee or something.....I say do it...its good business.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

don't play the young fan card at me.

You ARE a young fan...maybe not in age, but in the number of years you've been watching the team. This isn't the only occasion you've shown that...you took an almost forensic approach some time back as to how important the '87-'88 playoff run was to the franchise's history, basically saying it really wasn't that big a deal. If you weren't there and didn't experience that whole run (which really started with an incredible and improbable late-season surge just to have a chance to get in), then you might think that. But for those of us who DID experience it, it really did help to put the Devils on the map, and the first victory didn't even happen on the ice...with that OT victory against the Blackhawks, the Devils took the 4th Patrick Divison seed away from the Rangers. Then they beat the Isles in the first round. Suddenly the hockey locals who'd been following the Rangers and Islanders for years had to stop treating us like this goofy lil' harmless oddity that was cute because they played in NJ and their backyards. Suddenly the Devils were relevant. And the significance of all of that would be lost on you.

i will care about the past when brodeur retires, then i will celebrate his entire catalog.

As well you should.

until then, he's signed for another year, which is an implicit promise to remain being good at hockey, and he's been terrible this year.

It's an implicit hope on the part of the Devils that he would remain being good, and an implicit promise on Brodeur's part that he would at least TRY to remain good (which I think he has). But everyone from LL on down had to know that there was a chance that Marty might not be the same player by the end of this last contract as he was at the beginning...even Marty in Beyond the Crease admitted as much. How can anyone accurately predict what a 38-year-old player is going to be, no matter what his pedigree and track record? And even the very best (which Marty will down as one of 'em) have slumps and down periods...you make it sound like because he's signed and because he's supposed to remain good he's not ever allowed to slump, even on a team full of slumping/underperforming players.

everyone else has been bad too, but he's been just as bad. the flyers' goaltending issues over the last decade and a half are highly overstated - they make for a comfortable narrative, but they are not entirely why the flyers have yet to win a stanley cup.

Goalies are not the one and only reason why the Flyers haven't won a Cup since 1975, but the ones they did have sure didn't help.

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976, 27 December 2010 - 01:40 PM.

[Triumph]

You ARE a young fan...maybe not in age, but in the number of years you've been watching the team. This isn't the only occasion you've shown that...you took an almost forensic approach some time back as to how important the '87-'88 playoff run was to the franchise's history, basically saying it really wasn't that big a deal. If you weren't there and didn't experience that whole run (which really started with an incredible and improbable late-season surge just to have a chance to get in), then you might think that. But for those of us who DID experience it, it really did help to put the Devils on the map, and the first victory didn't even happen on the ice...with that OT victory against the Blackhawks, the Devils took the 4th Patrick Divison seed away from the Rangers. Then they beat the Isles in the first round. Suddenly the hockey locals who'd been following the Rangers and Islanders for years had to stop treating us like this goofy lil' harmless oddity that was cute because they played in NJ and their backyards. Suddenly the Devils were relevant. And the significance of all of that would be lost on you.

i don't remember saying this at all, but i'll take your word for it. i'm sure there are fans that rank the 88 run as their favorite even after 3 stanley cups and that's completely fine. who knows what the discussion was where i said this, but i do tend to resent older fans getting up on their ever-growing horses to discuss the history of this team.

It's an implicit hope on the part of the Devils that he would remain being good, and an implicit promise on Brodeur's part that he would at least TRY to remain good (which I think he has). But everyone from LL on down had to know that there was a chance that Marty might not be the same player by the end of this last contract as he was at the beginning...even Marty in Beyond the Crease admitted as much. How can anyone accurately predict what a 38-year-old player is going to be, no matter what his pedigree and track record? And even the very best (which Marty will down as one of 'em) have slumps and down periods...you make it sound like because he's signed and because he's supposed to remain good he's not ever allowed to slump, even on a team full of slumping/underperforming players.

my issue is that i know brodeur will not retire, and the devils will likely not get him any help next year, and he'll torpedo whatever chance the devils have next season. is it probably unfair to hold future events against brodeur right now? sure. but you can't hide a bad goaltender. right now he is playing at a backup level, and i think i am being generous. he is going to put the franchise in a really difficult spot this coming off-season. we have seen it with great athletes time and time again, they don't know when to quit.

Goalies are not the one and only reason why the Flyers haven't won a Cup since 1975, but the ones they did have sure didn't help.

what also didn't help is scoring 1 goal in each of the ECF Game 7s they lost. that never helps. they scored 3 goals in 3 games against NJ when they blew that 3-1 lead.

[DevilinLA]

You ARE a young fan...maybe not in age, but in the number of years you've been watching the team. This isn't the only occasion you've shown that...you took an almost forensic approach some time back as to how important the '87-'88 playoff run was to the franchise's history, basically saying it really wasn't that big a deal. If you weren't there and didn't experience that whole run (which really started with an incredible and improbable late-season surge just to have a chance to get in), then you might think that. But for those of us who DID experience it, it really did help to put the Devils on the map, and the first victory didn't even happen on the ice...with that OT victory against the Blackhawks, the Devils took the 4th Patrick Divison seed away from the Rangers. Then they beat the Isles in the first round. Suddenly the hockey locals who'd been following the Rangers and Islanders for years had to stop treating us like this goofy lil' harmless oddity that was cute because they played in NJ and their backyards. Suddenly the Devils were relevant. And the significance of all of that would be lost on you.



As well you should.



It's an implicit hope on the part of the Devils that he would remain being good, and an implicit promise on Brodeur's part that he would at least TRY to remain good (which I think he has). But everyone from LL on down had to know that there was a chance that Marty might not be the same player by the end of this last contract as he was at the beginning...even Marty in Beyond the Crease admitted as much. How can anyone accurately predict what a 38-year-old player is going to be, no matter what his pedigree and track record? And even the very best (which Marty will down as one of 'em) have slumps and down periods...you make it sound like because he's signed and because he's supposed to remain good he's not ever allowed to slump, even on a team full of slumping/underperforming players.



Goalies are not the one and only reason why the Flyers haven't won a Cup since 1975, but the ones they did have sure didn't help.

You mean there are hockey experiences that cannot be quantified via statistics and calculations? Pshh....