MadDog2020 Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 The Columbus Blue Jackets have signed forward Vaclav Prospal to a one-year, $1.75 million contract Good. Let him take his whiny douche act out west. I can't stand Prospal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayday Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 No update on us trading rolston? ONE MORE YEAR! Hopefully he can put up 20g, 20a and be a solid PK and shooter on the PP. The way the lines are shaping up Parise/Zajac and Kovalchuk/Jofeson its looking good to have a responsible 3rd line that can also be a offensive threat with Elias feeding Rolston. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SterioDesign Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 its Єklund (2.3% accurate) bullsh!t but its slow here these days so wtv "also, I am hearing a trade is about tom go down with NJ and San Jose..."mid-level" but I haven't been able to get any more yet.." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil Dan 56 Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 its Єklund (2.3% accurate) bullsh!t but its slow here these days so wtv "also, I am hearing a trade is about tom go down with NJ and San Jose..."mid-level" but I haven't been able to get any more yet.." Well, Єklund (2.3% accurate) saying it means one thing is for sure. We won't be trading with San Jose. That narrows it down! I hope he says that we won't be trading Rolston soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 its Єklund (2.3% accurate) bullsh!t but its slow here these days so wtv "also, I am hearing a trade is about tom go down with NJ and San Jose..."mid-level" but I haven't been able to get any more yet.." i don't see how a deal between these two would work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bibby89 Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 YES! Finally its that Clarkson for Ferriero trade he mentioned a few weeks back...about time! I knew Єklund (2.3% accurate) never makes stuff up. Oh wait...forget it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insanity_gallops Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 YES! Finally its that Clarkson for Ferriero trade he mentioned a few weeks back...about time! I knew Єklund (2.3% accurate) never makes stuff up. Oh wait...forget it. Shows how unoriginal the trade idea is...pretty sure Tri talked about Clarkson to SJ, and I speculated it'd be for Ferriero. But then again, our sources aren't really sources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bibby89 Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 LOL Theyre probably right the same amount of the time though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormJosh Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 i don't see how a deal between these two would work. Jay Leach is very nervous right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insanity_gallops Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Jay Leach is very nervous right now. Hah, that's the one trade I've ever actually predicted...Leach back from the Sharks. Lou didn't want to lose him the first time around; he might actually be in the "almost untouchable" category with the Devils' organization now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharifijanov2099 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 its Єklund (2.3% accurate) bullsh!t but its slow here these days so wtv "also, I am hearing a trade is about tom go down with NJ and San Jose..."mid-level" but I haven't been able to get any more yet.." Well, I think some kind of NJ trade has to break soon. The arbitration hearing is starting to close in on us, and any cap relief we can get via trade will likely play into our financial flexibility in the Parise contract offers. NJ has a glut of defensemen who are either current NHLers or predicted NHLers this season: Volchenkov Tallinder White Greene Salvador Fayne Larsson Taormina ------------ Urbom Corrente Fraser By my thinking, only 8 of the above 11 guys can be on our opening night roster (maybe only 7, depending on how big a roster NJ wishes to ice--but in the past, we have often gone with 13 forwards, 8 D, 2 goalies). For my money, I'd say Corrente and Fraser provide almost no value, except a big dumb physical presence that isn't really necessary in the mix of other personalities. Sure, NJ could do something crazy like trade White (but they won't) and it might mean Corrente then has a job. Or if Salvador is never declared ready to play, maybe another guy is kept around, but it will be near impossible to trade someone like Salvador (given his injury). As you see, it's crowded. Mark Fayne, IMO, pretty much played his way onto the team, and it would be a mistake to knock him off the top 6. If NJ keeps Urbom around, it will probably only in a part time role, 7th D. Taormina has to get back in there in a top 6. Anyway, maybe much of this is speculation as we will have to see who does what in camp, but NJ knows it can't keep everyone around. I still think a realistic trade package will be Clarkson + Urbom. Clarkson is a guy who can definitely add an element to a contender (such as SJ) in a 3rd line role, and Urbom is a decent prospect who might have some appeal. SJ has 9 or 10 forwards on their cap who are definitely on the team (Thornton, Marleau, Havlat, Pavelski, Clowe, Handzus, Mitchell, Couture, McGinn, Ferriero). But there is some room there, I think, for a banger like Clarkson. SJ's defense is pretty stacked for at least 5 deep, but a guy like Urbom might be worked in there, if SJ were so inclined. Sharks have about 6-7 mill in cap space, I believe. They could definitely absorb Clarkson to fill out their roster. For NJ, trading Clarkson+Urbom gives us more wiggle room financially for Parise, and it also ships off a prospect who may not have room on this team for at least 1-2 seasons from now (assuming that Larsson, Taormina, and Fayne are ahead of him on that chart). Maybe that package could fetch a 2nd round pick. Obviously, I don't want a player coming back. If this were to happen, we still have 8 defensemen on the NHL roster (including Salvador) which is fine in terms of depth. Which leaves Corrente+Fraser who can go for a bag of pucks. If Salvdor doesn't play, keep Corrente or Fraser. If he does, trade both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 (edited) I don't think the Devils will be making any salary reducing trades. I can't see a scenario where Bryce Salvador makes the team. He wasn't particularly good in 2009-10, he sat out a year, and his salary is prohibitively high. NJ won't be trading away anyone to clear out room for him. Rather than construct a depth chart, it's more important to consider who is waiver-eligible and who isn't. Fraser and Corrente would be eligible for waivers, Taormina, Urbom, and Larsson are not. That doesn't put Fraser or Corrente above those 3 guys, but it does mean that it could have an impact on the decisions made. Re: Urbom being squeezed out - no way. Urbom isn't even 21. His contract hasn't started yet. I would expect at least a 1st round pick for Clarkson + Urbom. Put it this way, where do you think Urbom gets drafted if we could re-do the 2009 draft? Whoever gets Urbom gets 7 years of a cost-controlled player who is probably close to NHL ready. That's massively valuable, and the Devils are not in the position where they can start dealing away D depth. Nor do I think they can afford to deal away RW depth unless they are getting an RW back. Edited July 25, 2011 by Triumph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinn01 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 (edited) Salvador will be a forever AHL player at this point. He was a strong player before but with that type of injury and the specifics that he suffered, he will not be the same. Itll come down to this: Volchenkov Fayne Tallinder Larsson White Greene Taormina Tallinder will be paired with Larsson, Taormina with White, Volchenkov with Greene. I'd be happy with those lines. While Fayne is a strong d-man I dont really see him getting a spot over anyone else, besides Taormina if at all. Edited July 25, 2011 by Quinn01 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharifijanov2099 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I don't think the Devils will be making any salary reducing trades. I can't see a scenario where Bryce Salvador makes the team. He wasn't particularly good in 2009-10, he sat out a year, and his salary is prohibitively high. NJ won't be trading away anyone to clear out room for him. Rather than construct a depth chart, it's more important to consider who is waiver-eligible and who isn't. Fraser and Corrente would be eligible for waivers, Taormina, Urbom, and Larsson are not. That doesn't put Fraser or Corrente above those 3 guys, but it does mean that it could have an impact on the decisions made. Re: Urbom being squeezed out - no way. Urbom isn't even 21. His contract hasn't started yet. I would expect at least a 1st round pick for Clarkson + Urbom. Put it this way, where do you think Urbom gets drafted if we could re-do the 2009 draft? Whoever gets Urbom gets 7 years of a cost-controlled player who is probably close to NHL ready. That's massively valuable, and the Devils are not in the position where they can start dealing away D depth. Nor do I think they can afford to deal away RW depth unless they are getting an RW back. Well, the scenario where Salvador makes the team is: he is medically ready. Why is that an impossible scenario? Sure, he wasn't great his last season, and hasn't played in a year, but what do you think will happen? You think if he's ready to return he'll just keep quiet for the good of the team and pretend to be injured? Yes, he collects money, but it's better for him and his agent if he plays, which could mean he creates future value for his services too. Sitting out another year, if healthy, is pointless for the player. Re: RW concerns... there is a point, and you've made it several times, but at the end of the day, do you really think Lou sits around saying "Well, we could dump 2+ million on a guy who isn't gonna be in our top 6... but... he's right-handed, so, better not..."? I doubt it. Having depth at any single position is important, but what results has Clarkson been getting that he's so valuable positionally so as to negate all trades that don't bring a RW back? I think you might be harping a little bit much on this particular argument. Re: 2-way/1-way, well, maybe then there is a point to be made that Fraser/Corrente could easily be slotted into the AHL rather than being traded. Maybe that does make more sense for our overall depth, injury occurrences, etc. Still, if Salvador is pronounced healthy, that's 9 potential D (excluding Corrente/Fraser). -Volchenkov -Tallinder -White -Greene -Salvador -Fayne -Larsson -Taormina -Urbom Hell, even if Salvador doesn't play, that's a total of 8 guys, which may be too much depending on how much money is given to Parise. NJ may only have room for 7 D. I dunno, I think in the least, like I said previously, we have so many bodies back there, I think someone gets traded (at least 1 D). Maybe Urbom has too much potential to be that guy. I'm not sure. But I'm guessing someone is moved out from the above-listed 9 guys, whether Salvador is healthy or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Pride 26 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Stuff Urbom in the minors, have him battle and earn White's spot in camp 2012. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 (edited) Well, the scenario where Salvador makes the team is: he is medically ready. Why is that an impossible scenario? Sure, he wasn't great his last season, and hasn't played in a year, but what do you think will happen? You think if he's ready to return he'll just keep quiet for the good of the team and pretend to be injured? Yes, he collects money, but it's better for him and his agent if he plays, which could mean he creates future value for his services too. Sitting out another year, if healthy, is pointless for the player. Salvador's career is over, whether or not anyone told him, I'm not sure. He'll cost 2.9 million on the cap when there are clearly several players who might be able to do his job for 1/4th of that. The Devils don't have the cap room for him, healthy or not. And it's not worth trading any of the forwards to make room for him, because they're all better values at this point than he is. God, I hated that contract. Re: RW concerns... there is a point, and you've made it several times, but at the end of the day, do you really think Lou sits around saying "Well, we could dump 2+ million on a guy who isn't gonna be in our top 6... but... he's right-handed, so, better not..."? I doubt it. Having depth at any single position is important, but what results has Clarkson been getting that he's so valuable positionally so as to negate all trades that don't bring a RW back? I think you might be harping a little bit much on this particular argument. Were the Devils ever going to put David Clarkson in their top 6? Like, was that a thing that was discussed? I don't think so. The Devils don't have any depth at RW WITH Clarkson. The depth chart is now: Zubrus Tedenby Clarkson Palmieri Zharkov? Janssen Anderson Sislo Janne Ojanen I mean, it's a sad state of affairs. Palmieri's not at all guaranteed to be an NHL quality player, so if you're trading Clarkson, you are relying on Palmieri to do that job. And if anyone gets hurt, it means AHL lifers or AHL rookies coming up. Will Clarkson play in the top 6? Probably not, but he'll likely be the 3rd line RW. Re: 2-way/1-way, well, maybe then there is a point to be made that Fraser/Corrente could easily be slotted into the AHL rather than being traded. Maybe that does make more sense for our overall depth, injury occurrences, etc. Still, if Salvador is pronounced healthy, that's 9 potential D (excluding Corrente/Fraser). -Volchenkov -Tallinder -White -Greene -Salvador -Fayne -Larsson -Taormina -Urbom Hell, even if Salvador doesn't play, that's a total of 8 guys, which may be too much depending on how much money is given to Parise. NJ may only have room for 7 D. I dunno, I think in the least, like I said previously, we have so many bodies back there, I think someone gets traded (at least 1 D). Maybe Urbom has too much potential to be that guy. I'm not sure. But I'm guessing someone is moved out from the above-listed 9 guys, whether Salvador is healthy or not. I mentioned nothing at all about 1 way or 2 way contracts, because that has very little to do with waivers. Again, Salvador isn't going to be on this team, so your position is already tenuous here. The Devils have at least another year to start making decisions on D prospects. Some will have good years, and some will have not so good years, and those decisions will become much easier after they get more information. Edited July 25, 2011 by Triumph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharifijanov2099 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Salvador's career is over, whether or not anyone told him, I'm not sure. He'll cost 2.9 million on the cap when there are clearly several players who might be able to do his job for 1/4th of that. The Devils don't have the cap room for him, healthy or not. And it's not worth trading any of the forwards to make room for him, because they're all better values at this point than he is. God, I hated that contract. Were the Devils ever going to put David Clarkson in their top 6? Like, was that a thing that was discussed? I don't think so. The Devils don't have any depth at RW WITH Clarkson. The depth chart is now: Zubrus Tedenby Clarkson Palmieri Zharkov? Janssen Anderson Sislo Janne Ojanen I mean, it's a sad state of affairs. Palmieri's not at all guaranteed to be an NHL quality player, so if you're trading Clarkson, you are relying on Palmieri to do that job. And if anyone gets hurt, it means AHL lifers or AHL rookies coming up. Will Clarkson play in the top 6? Probably not, but he'll likely be the 3rd line RW. I mentioned nothing at all about 1 way or 2 way contracts, because that has very little to do with waivers. Again, Salvador isn't going to be on this team, so your position is already tenuous here. The Devils have at least another year to start making decisions on D prospects. Some will have good years, and some will have not so good years, and those decisions will become much easier after they get more information. OK, Salvador's career is over. No one has stated that anywhere publicly. So your argument is what... that he will be stashed in the minors if he is somehow healthy enough to play? I'm just trying to understand you on this one. So far, I don't know how this point is a certainty, or what makes you so sure about it. If Salvador gets healthy, and NJ doesn't have the room for him, some team might be willing to gamble 1.45 mill on him (half salary) on waivers, if NJ does send him to the AHL. Is that a gamble NJ can make? Clarkson, summer 2009, Lamoriello said they'd like to get Clarkson into the top 6. I don't have the article, but it was a quote from Lou, I believe posted on Fire & Ice. So yeah, I believe they didn't have intentions of signing a guy to a 2.667 cap hit that they foresaw playing on the 3rd or 4th line. I just don't believe that the "NHLer" argument is enough to keep a guy around, regardless of position. Yes, Clarkson is an NHL player and isn't a huge defensive liability. And he's a RW. To me, that's not enough to keep a guy on the team. If that's the only criteria, we can trade Clarkson and sign some RW UFA for under a mill. Sjostrom or someone, anyone--if being an NHLer is all that it takes. And we'd save 2 million. In terms of RW depth, listing out our org's RW chart is fine, but it says nothing for who is actually on the NHL team come day 1 of the season, and they don't just do it by positions. Kovalchuk-Zajac-Parise was a line for a small while, no RWs. Didn't work out really, but there is no rule that says anywhere a natural LW can't shift to RW. NJ loves using players in an ambidextrous manner. So just a guess: Kovalchuk-Zajac-Zubrus Parise-Josefeson-Tedenby Rolston-Elias-Clarkson/Palmieri Janssen/Boulton-Steckel/Pelley-Zharkov You really think it matters if Janssen plays LW or RW? Or if Rolston plays LW or RW? Palmieri may not be a proven player, or Zharkov, or Tedenby, but Clarkson's value is a "proven" guy is pretty minimal to me. Trade him, and let Palmieri play on the top 3 lines with Zubrus and Teddy (whatever combos work out best and are most balanced as the season moves along). I'd much rather give development time to Tedenby and Palmieri than waste it on Clarkson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 (edited) OK, Salvador's career is over. No one has stated that anywhere publicly. So your argument is what... that he will be stashed in the minors if he is somehow healthy enough to play? I'm just trying to understand you on this one. So far, I don't know how this point is a certainty, or what makes you so sure about it. If Salvador gets healthy, and NJ doesn't have the room for him, some team might be willing to gamble 1.45 mill on him (half salary) on waivers, if NJ does send him to the AHL. Is that a gamble NJ can make? Salvador wouldn't be subject to re-entry waivers (where the original team and new team split his salary) unless the Devils called him back up. What makes me so sure is the Devils' salary cap position. Right now, NJ is at 5.4M in cap space, and that's counting Salvador. But that roster has 23 guys, so let's say 5.9M. Do you think Parise is going to be paid less than 5.9M? Clarkson, summer 2009, Lamoriello said they'd like to get Clarkson into the top 6. I don't have the article, but it was a quote from Lou, I believe posted on Fire & Ice. So yeah, I believe they didn't have intentions of signing a guy to a 2.667 cap hit that they foresaw playing on the 3rd or 4th line. The deal was signed in Summer 2010, and I still don't see when that would be said or thought of. He was behind Langenbrunner and Zubrus at that point. I just don't believe that the "NHLer" argument is enough to keep a guy around, regardless of position. Yes, Clarkson is an NHL player and isn't a huge defensive liability. And he's a RW. To me, that's not enough to keep a guy on the team. If that's the only criteria, we can trade Clarkson and sign some RW UFA for under a mill. Sjostrom or someone, anyone--if being an NHLer is all that it takes. And we'd save 2 million. Like it or not, Clarkson led the team in 5 on 5 shots last season. And there are no good RWs left, besides Nikolai Zherdev, the UFA list is a mystery zone. I think Clarkson could get 30 points with a 3rd line role. In terms of RW depth, listing out our org's RW chart is fine, but it says nothing for who is actually on the NHL team come day 1 of the season, and they don't just do it by positions.Kovalchuk-Zajac-Parise was a line for a small while, no RWs. Didn't work out really, but there is no rule that says anywhere a natural LW can't shift to RW. NJ loves using players in an ambidextrous manner. You really think it matters if Janssen plays LW or RW? Or if Rolston plays LW or RW? Palmieri may not be a proven player, or Zharkov, or Tedenby, but Clarkson's value is a "proven" guy is pretty minimal to me. Yes, I think it does matter. Rolston has been terrible as a right wing. Some guys can switch from wing to wing easily. Others cannot. Rolston being on the right wing gives him less time to shoot the puck, which for him is bad news. He was a right wing earlier in his career, but he's lost a good bit of speed, and I think this is now a bad fit for him. Janssen, good god, he's already bad enough, let's not make him switch positions. He, too, needs all the time he can get to handle the puck. Trade him, and let Palmieri play on the top 3 lines with Zubrus and Teddy (whatever combos work out best and are most balanced as the season moves along). I'd much rather give development time to Tedenby and Palmieri than waste it on Clarkson. As I said, I am not convinced that Palmieri is an NHL player. And this is ignoring the issues with the depth that the Devils have. If New Jersey is going to deal anyone, it's going to be Rolston, imo, but I don't see where they can deal him. Edited July 25, 2011 by Triumph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilsfan118 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 So let's hope there's some sort of deal this week...arbitration is right around the corner... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SterioDesign Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 So let's hope there's some sort of deal this week...arbitration is right around the corner... yeah damn... 9 days left... the worst thing is that... to me i really think that if Lou can only sign him to a one year deal that we lose him in the summer about 90% sure... i mean... if he couldnt get him long term now... why would he change his mind next season when he knows he could test the market? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil Dan 56 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 yeah damn... 9 days left... the worst thing is that... to me i really think that if Lou can only sign him to a one year deal that we lose him in the summer about 90% sure... i mean... if he couldnt get him long term now... why would he change his mind next season when he knows he could test the market? The only good thing about him being UFA next year is that we have a big chunk of money coming off the cap, meaning we can match nearly any offer. Of course, I'd much rather just have him locked up for 7-8 years this week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sundstrom Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Janne Ojanen thank you. i needed that today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDog2020 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 So let's hope there's some sort of deal this week...arbitration is right around the corner... If he signs long term, there won't be a deal until August 1 or 2. Anyone who knows the way Lou rolls knows this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinn01 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Site was down for me for about a half hour, I was convinced there was Parise news. Poopie. Thats what I was thinking. Wow there must be something good going on for the site to crash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevsMan84 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 You guys don't see the thread about parise re-signing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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