Derlique Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 The operative words being "in hindsight". That's totally asinine considering these guys weren't even picked two years ago. I believe Larsson has played more games than anyone else in his draft class. Landeskog and RNH may be close though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 Couturier is going to be a Selke-level forward who drives play a ridiculous amount. RNH - he'll be a PP wizard, but it remains unclear if he will drive play, plus his goal scoring numbers weren't great in junior either - I'd be concerned about that long term. 31 goals in his draft year is not a whole lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted April 9, 2013 Author Share Posted April 9, 2013 That's totally asinine considering these guys weren't even picked two years ago. I believe Larsson has played more games than anyone else in his draft class. Landeskog and RNH may be close though Courturier has played more games on what is arguably a deeper team. And the other players I've mentioned, especially Hamilton that plays at the same position, do not have the regular f-ups that Larsson seems to have every game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derlique Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 Courturier has played more games on what is arguably a deeper team. And the other players I've mentioned, especially Hamilton that plays at the same position, do not have the regular f-ups that Larsson seems to have every game. Perhaps, but Hamilton plays with Chara and Brodin plays with Suter. I love Andy Greene, but he is nowhere near as good as these guys. It's easier to hide a forward on the fourth line than hide a dman, Daniel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 Courturier has played more games on what is arguably a deeper team. And the other players I've mentioned, especially Hamilton that plays at the same position, do not have the regular f-ups that Larsson seems to have every game. The Flyers aren't a deeper team at forward than NJ is at defense. I'm sure you're watching all Hamilton's games like you are Larsson's. BTW, Hamilton's territorial stats have come to earth since the beginning of the year - I think he like a lot of guys who were playing hockey elsewhere this year got a little bump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted April 9, 2013 Author Share Posted April 9, 2013 RNH is also only 19. He'll fill out. If he doesn't, I can see credence in your argument, but just on the massive potential, I'd take him. If you'd honestly take Zibanejad or Couturier over him, you're insane I think. If you're scared of the shoulder injuries, that's your prerogative, but I'd take the chance. They probably should've sent him back down to Red Deer last year to fill out and not get beat up, but that's hindsight now. RNH does not have "massive" potential. Hell, he didn't even make the Canadian world junior team during his draft year. That isn't necessarily an indiciation of his future potential, but he was far from being a can't miss kind of talent on draft day like Tavares, or even Yakupov. Absent a healthy dose of steroids, he won't fill out all that much more. If you've seen him in person like I have, you'd think he was the type of guy who got wedgies in high school. RNH is not and probably will not be a bust. At worst, he'll be seen as an unspectactular, but adequate number 1 pick in a draft that didn't have that any future superstars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils731 Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 Since we're talking that past draft, I'm still flabbergasted at Couturier's free fall. Defensively responsible, big body, not a bad skater, and huge juniors numbers across 2 seasons. One of my Islander fan friends said the Islanders took Strome because they were worried Couturier would give them a player too similar in style to Tavares.....Oh no, too many Tavares type players on my team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derlique Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 Since we're talking that past draft, I'm still flabbergasted at Couturier's free fall. Defensively responsible, big body, not a bad skater, and huge juniors numbers across 2 seasons. One of my Islander fan friends said the Islanders took Strome because they were worried Couturier would give them a player too similar in style to Tavares.....Oh no, too many Tavares type players on my team. I can't believe the Islanders, Sens and Jets passed on this guy. I was so pissed when I realized the Flyers would either get Couturier or Hamilton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1Guy3Cups Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 The best about Larson is people were talking like he was some Scott Stevens remake... Why because he is on the bigger side?? Sometimes the kid looks like a deer in headlights.. But lets compare him to our captain.. Captain Salvador Hook.. Oh wait he sucks... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nessus Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 I can't believe the Islanders, Sens and Jets passed on this guy. I was so pissed when I realized the Flyers would either get Couturier or Hamilton Yeah couldn't believe he fell that low. Although, Zibanejad is turning out to be a great pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MantaRay Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 In a few years I am going to look back at this post and laugh. This sound almost exactly the complaints about Nieds his first few seasons. Defensemen take more time to develop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DH26 Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 (edited) RNH does not have "massive" potential. Hell, he didn't even make the Canadian world junior team during his draft year. That isn't necessarily an indiciation of his future potential, but he was far from being a can't miss kind of talent on draft day like Tavares, or even Yakupov. Absent a healthy dose of steroids, he won't fill out all that much more. If you've seen him in person like I have, you'd think he was the type of guy who got wedgies in high school. RNH is not and probably will not be a bust. At worst, he'll be seen as an unspectactular, but adequate number 1 pick in a draft that didn't have that any future superstars. RNH was the clearcut #1 that year. There was no debate about him going #1 by January IIRC. He's a shrimp now, you think he won't become normal human size? Crosby filled out after his first year and there's no reason the smaller for his frame RNH won't either. He's not like 5'7" or something. He may not ever learn to play defense esp on that eternally cruddy Oilers team, but to say he wasn't in the same league as Yakupov is asinine and 100% making stuff up. If he stays the size he is now, you're right, but don't act like nobody's ever gained weight and he's such a shrimp there's no way for him not to. He's not exactly 35 and on the downside here It's not like the Oilers couldn't find anyone and just settled on RNH. Hell they probably would've been better taking Larsson since they needed a defenseman or Couturier in hindsight since he better fits their needs now but he was the clear cut #1 that year. Edited April 9, 2013 by DH26 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted April 9, 2013 Author Share Posted April 9, 2013 RNH was the clearcut #1 that year. There was no debate about him going #1 by January IIRC. He's a shrimp now, you think he won't become normal human size? Crosby filled out after his first year and there's no reason the smaller for his frame RNH won't either. He's not like 5'7" or something. He may not ever learn to play defense esp on that eternally cruddy Oilers team, but to say he wasn't in the same league as Yakupov is asinine and 100% making stuff up. If he stays the size he is now, you're right, but don't act like nobody's ever gained weight and he's such a shrimp there's no way for him not to. He's not exactly 35 and on the downside here It's not like the Oilers couldn't find anyone and just settled on RNH. Hell they probably would've been better taking Larsson since they needed a defenseman or Couturier in hindsight since he better fits their needs now but he was the clear cut #1 that year. If the Oilers could do it all over again, I bet they would take Landeskog. I recall it was a little later than January before RNH was the generally thought of as the Number 1 prospect. For a while it was actually Courturier. So far as the "experts" predictions, they were all over the map. Some had Larsson number 1 up until the day of the draft, and I think a few might have even had Huberdeau going number 1. Yakupov was number 1 in virtually everyone's mock, except for a few that thought that the Oilers would draft a defenseman out of need. The point isn't so much to say that the experts always know what they're talking about. It's just that there was no one in the draft that was a can't miss superstar, which is what you're always hoping for with a number 1 pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muevelos Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 If we were lower I wish we woulda took dumba. Both defense and offense. A leader and a hard hiter like Stevens which is something we need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLL765 Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 (edited) The best about Larson is people were talking like he was some Scott Stevens remake... Why because he is on the bigger side?? Sometimes the kid looks like a deer in headlights.. But lets compare him to our captain.. Captain Salvador Hook.. Oh wait he sucks... They did? I don't remember that at all. I remember hearing, Lidstrom like 1000 times, not like Stevens though. He was said to be not much of a hitter, defends with stick well, excellent passer and decently mobile with a good sized frame. Edited April 9, 2013 by ATLL765 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 They did? I don't remember that at all. I remember hearing, Lidstrom like 1000 times, not like Stevens though. He was said to be not much of a hitter, defends with stick well, excellent passer and decently mobile with a good sized frame. I think he was referring to the amount of people calling Larsson soft for not making big hits. Seriously, this thread has become hilarious with some of the posts. It's like some expected him to be the most versatile, HOF defender just because we took him 4th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepperkorn Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 The best about Larson is people were talking like he was some Scott Stevens remake... Why because he is on the bigger side?? Sometimes the kid looks like a deer in headlights.. But lets compare him to our captain.. Captain Salvador Hook.. Oh wait he sucks... No one said that. At least i read that no where. Just the Lidstrom comparison. what's his face -- the fat kid...Phaneuf, he was compared to Stevens. every thred is just inventing somethign to talk about. It's almost like off season except we have fresh hockey material - just not fresh or new Devils material. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DH26 Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 They did? I don't remember that at all. I remember hearing, Lidstrom like 1000 times, not like Stevens though. He was said to be not much of a hitter, defends with stick well, excellent passer and decently mobile with a good sized frame. I remember TSN said his best comp was Sami Salo I had a LOLgasm when I saw that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil Dan 56 Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 Tough crowd around here these days. Labeling a 2nd year player a bust because he hasn't lit the world on fire at 20 years old? Wow. It takes years for these guys to develop. Also there seems to be a weird thing on this board where people assume every player not in NJ plays perfectly every game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamtheprodigy Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Tough crowd around here these days. Labeling a 2nd year player a bust because he hasn't lit the world on fire at 20 years old? Wow. It takes years for these guys to develop. Also there seems to be a weird thing on this board where people assume every player not in NJ plays perfectly every game. If you don't see them play, it's safe to assume that they are amazing and probably exactly the kind of player the Devils need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepperkorn Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Let's talk about Salvador! Seriously i think I'll watch his little video blurbs to see what insight I glean. I miss Scott Stevens something awful. I knew I would... but I hoped it'd work out. I dont miss his hits at all. There was so much more. It was the way he just saw everything. and he could forecast the play seamlessly to the other guys. You know - it's no wonder Rafalski loved Jeopardy. He loved remembering things and he knew how to read Stevens. I dont know how to teach that. I'm trying to think about it. I have a zillion dopey acting exercises and trust crap -- but that's just not hockey. It's that unspoken communication. I can do it I can read it... I have no clue how to teach it. It's art. I'm sorry but it is. I think maybe I should watch old Lidstrom tape too... just to see how he hears and communicates - aside from being stand-alone perfect. Stevens captured the team perfection - he wasn't a stand-alone guy. That's what I like. You dont need that on a team but the Devils organization thinks that way - parts of a whole and stuff - listening communicating trusting. They have a particular style of winning. When the style doesn't click -- blah... and as I suspected he doesn't have a handle on teaching that quite yet. He's pretty relentless so he will I have no doubt. I can't guess what he's up to now. It's very possible that he's got a mixed hand - sometimes a little heavy but then he'll pull back because he's not sure - then maybe it gets confusing. Part of me says I want him to play a scrimmage with these guys so they get it in something closer to a gameline setting -- but --- Rafalski proved you can understand it completely and not recreate it. --- so how do you teach it? and I just KNOW Scott gets a huge part I dont about manipulating the skills a guy does have... ok... so is this enough? Have I killed the thread or do I need to start sharing fantasies I have about Stevens as coach... my day dream about talking to him over a tavern table.. I WILL go there if you all don't let this stupid thread die... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muevelos Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Lets not get hasty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DH26 Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Tough crowd around here these days. Labeling a 2nd year player a bust because he hasn't lit the world on fire at 20 years old? Wow. It takes years for these guys to develop. Also there seems to be a weird thing on this board where people assume every player not in NJ plays perfectly every game. based on people like Pierre McGuire and other people who value big tough Canadians over "soft" Euros, there are probably some people who wish we took Hamilton when it would've been asinine at the time. I'm sure if Larsson had Zdeno Chara next to him he'd be doing ok too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted April 10, 2013 Author Share Posted April 10, 2013 Tough crowd around here these days. Labeling a 2nd year player a bust because he hasn't lit the world on fire at 20 years old? Wow. It takes years for these guys to develop. Also there seems to be a weird thing on this board where people assume every player not in NJ plays perfectly every game. based on people like Pierre McGuire and other people who value big tough Canadians over "soft" Euros, there are probably some people who wish we took Hamilton when it would've been asinine at the time. I'm sure if Larsson had Zdeno Chara next to him he'd be doing ok too Funny because McGuire absolutely gushed over Larsson at the draft and during the NBC broadcasts. I think you have Don Cherry in mind. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DH26 Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Funny because McGuire absolutely gushed over Larsson at the draft and during the NBC broadcasts. I think you have Don Cherry in mind. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD I mean McGuire this year when NBC has the Bruins games. I dunno if you've seen him then, but I think he'd propose to Dougie if he possibly could. He might Larsson just as much I dunno but I know for a fact he loves his Dougie and I'm sure Cherry does too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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