Devils Trade Deadline Thread

[Triumph]

Absolutely not, thats ridiculous to assume that this is what i meant. But Clarkson and Fayne are prime examples. You don't won't agree of course. But we had no business in the playoffs in the last 2 seasons either close or not. We've lost too much and our group was aging, Lou had to start making steps back then to restock and he gambled all in and we've lost assets in their primes.

 

Mark Fayne was worth a 4th round pick.  Get over it.

 

One of the things that just never crosses your mind is how it looks to the locker room when you trade Clarkson.  You are selling out every single one of those players.  That team was right there in 8th place when the deadline rolled around - if they deal Clarkson, who was probably leading the team in goals at the time, it's a give up.  How's that going to look to Zajac who just signed an 8 year contract?  How's it look to Elias who is an unrestricted free agent?  Andy Greene's UFA in a year - does he want to stick around for this?  Zidlicky's UFA - he want to hang around for a team that gives up?

[SterioDesign]

Mark Fayne was worth a 4th round pick.  Get over it.

 

One of the things that just never crosses your mind is how it looks to the locker room when you trade Clarkson.  You are selling out every single one of those players.  That team was right there in 8th place when the deadline rolled around - if they deal Clarkson, who was probably leading the team in goals at the time, it's a give up.  How's that going to look to Zajac who just signed an 8 year contract?  How's it look to Elias who is an unrestricted free agent?  Andy Greene's UFA in a year - does he want to stick around for this?  Zidlicky's UFA - he want to hang around for a team that gives up?

 

Haha dude you're wearing blinders so fvcking thick. 

 

You think only in NJ this is happening? It's a business and the playoffs knows that. If Lou tries to sign a guy long term and it's not going anywhere, he had to trade him. But of course it never got to that point cause he never even start contract talks with him. Even Elias himself said it was frustrating that Lou was doing things that way. So there you go, Elias who's a no BS guy said he's not supporting that sh!t from Lou.

 

Even if he was just a 4th (which you don't know that) that's a 4th and i'd take it, we have NOTHING. Was it worth to keep him? a guy who's been jerked around and benched all season for Salvador and A-Train? Why keep a guy like that around? We have NOTHING to trade and we need picks, and here Triumph everytime a guys goes for nothing "Who cares? He was not gonna bring back much" EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. Well ALL those times together that's quite a lot of assets that we're not getting and we really have to bet on anything we can get.

 

You do realize you said it was "no big deal" when Zach left. When Kovy left. When Clarkson left. When every single guy who left. Always the same robotic answer from you. Well guess what. When all those guys were here we made it to the finals and once they all left we never made the playoffs. But yeah, you don't seem to understand the accumulation here. 

Edited February 17, 2015 by SterioDesign

[Neb00rs]

i like the sarcasm but it's not about that at all. It's about Lou being delusional thinking he has a contending team. Nothing more than that.

 

And him believing that has to change the way he does business. And that's hurting.

 

even if that rumour isnt true. We've seen other quotes, we saw him claiming it himself too. We ALL know that Lou clearly think he's in the run and could make a run even though its clear his team has no chance. Anyone denying this is out of it. And Lou being this delusional explains a lot about the way he approached certain situations (and failed) 

 

It's like if you're stuck in snow with your car... if you believe you can get out just by having the pedal to the floor and not let it go. Well lol i think we all know you're just making it worst haha instead of going slow and shoveling a bit and turning the wheels and going slowly forward then slowly backward until you can get it out. You'll never get out lol  this is quite similar.

 

It's like MD2020 says, for some reason you choose to take everything a GM says word for word as exactly what he means, and such is even sillier with Lou Lamoriello (not that Lou has really said anything to demonstrate delusion).

 

I'll ask you again, and once more this isn't a trick question, what kind of credit do you give Lou for this team's 2012 run?

[Devil Dan 56]

Haha dude you're wearing blinders so fvcking thick.

You think only in NJ this is happening? It's a business and the playoffs knows that. If Lou tries to sign a guy long term and it's not going anywhere, he had to trade him. But of course it never got to that point cause he never even start contract talks with him. Even Elias himself said it was frustrating that Lou was doing things that way. So there you go, Elias who's a no BS guy said he's not supporting that sh!t from Lou.

Even if he was just a 4th (which you don't know that) that's a 4th and i'd take it, we have NOTHING. Was it worth to keep him? a guy who's been jerked around and benched all season for Salvador and A-Train? Why keep a guy like that around? We have NOTHING to trade and we need picks, and here Triumph everytime a guys goes for nothing "Who cares? He was not gonna bring back much" EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. Well ALL those times together that's quite a lot of assets that we're not getting and we really have to bet on anything we can get.

You do realize you said it was "no big deal" when Zach left. When Kovy left. When Clarkson left. When every single guy who left. Always the same robotic answer from you. Well guess what. When all those guys were here we made it to the finals and once they all left we never made the playoffs. But yeah, you don't seem to understand the accumulation here.

Yeah. Id rather have Fayne and Clarkson and a possible shot at the playoffs than some low level picks. You highly overvalue the market.

[Triumph]

Haha dude you're wearing blinders so fvcking thick. 

 

You think only in NJ this is happening? It's a business and the playoffs knows that. If Lou tries to sign a guy long term and it's not going anywhere, he had to trade him. But of course it never got to that point cause he never even start contract talks with him. Even Elias himself said it was frustrating that Lou was doing things that way. So there you go, Elias who's a no BS guy said he's not supporting that sh!t from Lou.

 

Even if he was just a 4th (which you don't know that) that's a 4th and i'd take it, we have NOTHING. Was it worth to keep him? a guy who's been jerked around and benched all season for Salvador and A-Train? Why keep a guy like that around? We have NOTHING to trade and we need picks, and here Triumph everytime a guys goes for nothing "Who cares? He was not gonna bring back much" EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. Well ALL those times together that's quite a lot of assets that we're not getting and we really have to bet on anything we can get.

 

You do realize you said it was "no big deal" when Zach left. When Kovy left. When Clarkson left. When every single guy who left. Always the same robotic answer from you. Well guess what. When all those guys were here we made it to the finals and once they all left we never made the playoffs. But yeah, you don't seem to understand the accumulation here. 

 

Last post on this:

 

Where would the Devils be right now if they had traded Parise in 2011, Kovalchuk ever, and Clarkson in 2012?  They'd probably be here.  Where they are right now.  They'd have some more guys who might be NHL ready, maybe, coming up, so they'd be in a better position for the future, one would hope.  They wouldn't have that run in 2012 without Parise, that's almost a certainty, as he was an extremely valuable player both during the season and in the playoffs as well.  But they'd be better off in 2015-16 than they will be in our current reality, that I will grant.  Or again, I'd hope they would be.

 

Now let's ask the other question - where would the Devils be if they still had all 3 of these guys - forget that, let's even leave out Clarkson, as he immediately turned to garbage - where are the Devils with Parise and Kovalchuk?  They don't have Schneider, probably.  They probably don't have Brodeur either.  Quite probable they don't have Jagr.  It doesn't really matter who they have and don't have - I don't think that team is particularly good either.  Maybe they're a playoff fringe team?  Maybe they're a few points out of the playoffs?  Either way, that team isn't that hot either - it probably doesn't have elite goaltending, it's got the same problems at center that this team does, and it has the other issue, that besides Henrique and Josefson, every other forward on the team is getting worse, and that includes Parise and Kovalchuk.  That team's also going nowhere fast, even with Severson coming up, it's not going to offset everything else going on up front.

 

So no, I don't think that Lou made mistakes going for it.  I don't think you either have to be a Cup contender or selling pieces off if they don't want to sign a contract in February.  Sometimes you just have to go for it.  If the Devils make it into the playoffs last season (not an impossibility at all) and Schneider plays as he has been for the last month in last year's playoffs, that team can win a round or two or three, they weren't horrible, and they wouldn't have to deal with the goddamned shootout in the playoffs.

 

I did understate how much losing Parise would hurt the franchise and it did hurt it greatly (though Jagr was a suitable simulacrum last year).  But again the thing that you don't seem to ever acknowledge is that free agent forwards are going to get worse.  Kovalchuk isn't the player he was when we got him in 2010.  He's not the top scorer on his KHL team.  David Clarkson is a 4th line player now.  Having or not having these guys isn't the problem with the team - it's everyone else.  Everyone else has gotten worse and no one has come up to replace them.  That's not significantly altered by these trades you always talk about, either.  

[devilsrule33]

Last post on this:

 

Where would the Devils be right now if they had traded Parise in 2011, Kovalchuk ever, and Clarkson in 2012?  They'd probably be here.  Where they are right now.  They'd have some more guys who might be NHL ready, maybe, coming up, so they'd be in a better position for the future, one would hope.  They wouldn't have that run in 2012 without Parise, that's almost a certainty, as he was an extremely valuable player both during the season and in the playoffs as well.  But they'd be better off in 2015-16 than they will be in our current reality, that I will grant.  Or again, I'd hope they would be.

 

Now let's ask the other question - where would the Devils be if they still had all 3 of these guys - forget that, let's even leave out Clarkson, as he immediately turned to garbage - where are the Devils with Parise and Kovalchuk?  They don't have Schneider, probably.  They probably don't have Brodeur either.  Quite probable they don't have Jagr.  It doesn't really matter who they have and don't have - I don't think that team is particularly good either.  Maybe they're a playoff fringe team?  Maybe they're a few points out of the playoffs?  Either way, that team isn't that hot either - it probably doesn't have elite goaltending, it's got the same problems at center that this team does, and it has the other issue, that besides Henrique and Josefson, every other forward on the team is getting worse, and that includes Parise and Kovalchuk.  That team's also going nowhere fast, even with Severson coming up, it's not going to offset everything else going on up front.

 

So no, I don't think that Lou made mistakes going for it.  I don't think you either have to be a Cup contender or selling pieces off if they don't want to sign a contract in February.  Sometimes you just have to go for it.  If the Devils make it into the playoffs last season (not an impossibility at all) and Schneider plays as he has been for the last month in last year's playoffs, that team can win a round or two or three, they weren't horrible, and they wouldn't have to deal with the goddamned shootout in the playoffs.

 

I did understate how much losing Parise would hurt the franchise and it did hurt it greatly (though Jagr was a suitable simulacrum last year).  But again the thing that you don't seem to ever acknowledge is that free agent forwards are going to get worse.  Kovalchuk isn't the player he was when we got him in 2010.  He's not the top scorer on his KHL team.  David Clarkson is a 4th line player now.  Having or not having these guys isn't the problem with the team - it's everyone else.  Everyone else has gotten worse and no one has come up to replace them.  That's not significantly altered by these trades you always talk about, either.  

 

Man...I can tell you've never played sports by this post. Just by all the statistics you used in this long post. I see the number 2012 and 2015 in there somewhere. Too much math. Not enough intangibles and I'd understand it better if you incorporated either a girlfriend or ex-girlfriend into this post.

[DJ Eco]

One of the things that just never crosses your mind is how it looks to the locker room when you trade Clarkson.  You are selling out every single one of those players.  That team was right there in 8th place when the deadline rolled around - if they deal Clarkson, who was probably leading the team in goals at the time, it's a give up.  How's that going to look to Zajac who just signed an 8 year contract?  How's it look to Elias who is an unrestricted free agent?  Andy Greene's UFA in a year - does he want to stick around for this?  Zidlicky's UFA - he want to hang around for a team that gives up?

 

This right here^

 

And I'm not one of the guys who always disagrees with SD, but yeah, there are some common sense reasons you can't just blow up a team like that when you're in that position.

[ilzz89]

Devils need to sign couple of guys from overseas with speed and who have a scoring touch. Due to NHL free agency being bah this year. Couple of SKA players might be available (Kovy's teamates) 

I think you are familiar with Victor Tikhonov (ex coyote) 

but Artemi Panarin is the new Rafalski, a late bloomer. he's been getting better every year, never drafted only 23, and is becoming hell of a player. I hope Devs overseas scouts are gonna give this guy a good look. 

 

http://www.nhltraderumors.me/2015/02/viktor-tikhonov-and-artemy-panarin-move.html

[devilsrule33]

Steve Pellegrini: Sir, we are getting a ton of calls on Zidlicky, Ryder, Bernier, and especially Jagr. Teams really want him. Some of these offers are very impressive.

 

Lou: I'm not ready yet to concede the season, the team is ready to make a push.

 

Steve: But sir, the Devils are already mathematically eliminated.

 

Lou: Steve, when you have time, you use it.

 

Steve: But Mr. Lamoriello, it's 2.58, the deadline is in two minutes.

 

Lou: I said, when you have time, you use it.

 

Steve: 1 minute, now. I have a deal with the Lightning in place. All I have to do is call the league offices.

 

Lou: Hang up the phone, Steve. That's enough for now

 

Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger  6m6 minutes ago

Devils still believe they're in the playoff hunt, so Jagr trade discussions very temporarily on hold. Still trade bait. @NHLonNBCSports

Edited February 19, 2015 by devilsrule33

[Neb00rs]

The reason I don't buy into the "Lou is still playing for it" hype is because I see no reason to believe that Lou is going to wait too long and somehow not be able to trade Jagr, or make our best deal for him. Does anyone here actually believe that Jagr will still be here after the deadline? C'mon now. 

 

There is also part of me that is annoyed at Lou for the ways he goes about things, it gets to everyone sometimes, but then there is the part of me that thinks it's pretty cool to know that the last motherfvcker on planet earth who is going to give up on the Devils is our GM. That's a real dude right there.

Edited February 19, 2015 by Neb00rs

[Triumph]

I mean, it's Dreger, who is willing to carry anyone's water.  If the Devils put it out there that they are thinking of keeping Jagr, maybe they get some higher offers. 

[devilsrule33]

The reason I don't buy into the "Lou is still playing for it" hype is because I see no reason to believe that Lou is going to wait too long and somehow not be able to trade Jagr, or make our best deal for him. Does anyone here actually believe that Jagr will still be here after the deadline? C'mon now. 

 

No one thinks that. It's just a funny report. Jagr will be traded, and Lou is probably in no rush to trade him or discuss deals yet. That's perfectly fine.

[Neb00rs]

What will be really funny, is when we are all completely wrong and it does end up being too late and when they ask Lou about it, he just responds "oops."

[NJDevs4978]

Maybe that's why Jagr's been so disinterested, he's trying to tank so he can get out of town

[William D'Aquila]

It is a Louluison

[Neb00rs]

It is a Louluison

 

Hockey spandex?

[redruM]

How can LL think this team is still int he playoff race? 

 

Man is he out of touch

[NJDfan1711]

How can LL think this team is still int he playoff race? 

 

Man is he out of touch

Several reasons, actually.  But to me it's a combination of four main things:

 

1- Being out of touch

2- Not wanting to face the facts of the current state of affairs of the team

3- Being a passionate and hungry GM who always wants to win and never say die

4- Looking at the current schedule for us, and the last place team in the playoffs

 

 

To touch on #4, you'll see why there's still a small chance of optimism, albeit many things have to also go right for it to even remotely look like we have a shot, mainly all of the other teams in front of us losing as well...BUT.... the Bruins next 4 games are @St Louis, very easily a loss, @Chicago, very easily another loss, home against Vancouver (could be another loss considering how we'll Van is playing lately), and then on the road against us (for arguments sake let's just say we win).  That's 4 losses in a row which is unlikely, but Boston has been sucking a ton lately and doesn't seem to want to get into the playoffs. 

 

In contrast, our next FIVE games are as follows:  Home against Van (tough, but we will probably see their backup since they are on the road tonight against the Rags in a back to back game [yes we all know, like last year, we made backups look like Gods, but still] ), home against Carolina which is very winnable, home against Arizona again very winnable, home against Calgary...tough but winnable, and then home against the Bruins, also tough but would be huuuuge.  

 

Again, very unlikely?  Yeah.  And that's not even the hardest part -- we'd need teams like PHI/OTT/CMB/FLA to lose some games in between the next week or two as well, but, in terms of just looking at that last playoff spot and considering our remaining schedule against theirs, it's EXTREMELY favorable.  You couldn't really ask for better matchups than those.  We all knew this was coming too based on how unbalanced the first half of the season was for us with all of the road games we had, back to backs, and hard teams / west coast teams.

[mrthemike]

Lou you fvcking maniac...

 

http://www.sportsclubstats.com/NHL/Eastern/Metropolitan/NewJersey.html

Edited February 19, 2015 by mrthemike

[Devilsfan118]

In contrast, our next FIVE games are as follows:  Home against Van (tough, but we will probably see their backup since they are on the road tonight against the Rags in a back to back game [yes we all know, like last year, we made backups look like Gods, but still] ), home against Carolina which is very winnable, home against Arizona again very winnable, home against Calgary...tough but winnable, and then home against the Bruins, also tough but would be huuuuge.  

 

Again, very unlikely?  Yeah.  And that's not even the hardest part -- we'd need teams like PHI/OTT/CMB/FLA to lose some games in between the next week or two as well, but, in terms of just looking at that last playoff spot and considering our remaining schedule against theirs, it's EXTREMELY favorable.  You couldn't really ask for better matchups than those.  We all knew this was coming too based on how unbalanced the first half of the season was for us with all of the road games we had, back to backs, and hard teams / west coast teams.

 

I respect what you're saying, but "very unlikely" doesn't even cut it.  "Very unlikely" in my mind might mean a 20-30% chance of making the playoffs.  In that situation, you could say things have to fall just right and maybe, just maybe, the Devils could pull it off if the stars align perfectly.

 

Per mrthemike's post above, the Devils have a 0.2% chance to make the playoffs.  That's as good as mathematically eliminated - I don't care what other teams do or what schedules look like.  There is no way the Devils are going to make the playoffs.  You know, I know it, everyone here knows it.  The only question at this point is whether Lou has accepted it - I think he has, there's no way he's that clueless.  I just don't think acknowledging it is in his best interests at the moment.

 

I'm pretty confident Lou's actions as the deadline approaches will indicate he doesn't believe this is a playoff team.

[redruM]

My main concern is that LL truly beleives that the longer he waits the more he will get, but in reality theese teams might find other option with other teams and then LL gets nothing ...

[HellOnICE]

I'd like to believe Lou knows how to work the market at this point. GMs will call him for parts - he'll take his time. I'm fine with that. Hell, teams are starting to lose D and other players it seems like - might drive up demand too. 

[NJDevs4978]

I'd like to believe Lou knows how to work the market at this point. GMs will call him for parts - he'll take his time. I'm fine with that. Hell, teams are starting to lose D and other players it seems like - might drive up demand too.

But what if we lose the players we're trying to trade in the meantime lol

[HellOnICE]

True, but that's the risk everyone makes.

[NJDevs4978]

True, but that's the risk everyone makes.

It's a little more pronounced when you're talking about 43 and 38-year old players. Granted they have stayed on the ice for the most part throughout their time here but...