New York Mets 2015 Season Thread

[NJDevs4978]

No Matt Harvey for mandatory workouts at Citi Field today. Sandy says his excuse was traffic. Sure...right. The most high profile player on the team again making headlines. Again being an unnecessary distraction and headache

He's in bed with a supermodel.

According to Francesa, even David is really hot under the collar about this one...yikes, just when Harvey had finally put his last self imposed distraction behind him. Edited October 6, 2015 by NJDevs4978

['7']

According to Francesa, even David is really hot under the collar about this one...yikes, just when Harvey had finally put his last self imposed distraction behind him.

 

And as much as he rubs me the wrong way, Francesa does have legit back-channel lines of communication to the Mets. When he reports these grumblings, they're generally true.

 

Do we really need this now? Traffic BS. I want to know what really happened.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Yeah, RBI Kryptonite is really one to be getting ticked about his teammates. Not that I'm saying Harvey shouldn't have made sure he got there one way or another.

[NJDevs4978]

Colorado Rockies 1976, on 06 Oct 2015 - 3:30 PM, said:

Yeah, RBI Kryptonite is really one to be getting ticked about his teammates. Not that I'm saying Harvey shouldn't have made sure he got there one way or another.

 

Why doesn't David have a right to be ticked off?  Say what you want ON the field but there's a bit of a difference between that and this - he would never embarrass the organization off the field like this or big-time his teammates.  Heck if you ran this as a blind item people would have guessed Harvey in a nanosecond, well the ones that didn't get their sports confused and guess Geno Smith anyway

 

And btw Terry debunked the traffic issue:

 

Adam Rubin ‏@AdamRubinESPN 10m10 minutes ago

Workout was noon-2 PM. Terry Collins told me Matt Harvey said: ‘I was doing some stuff, looked up and it’s 1 o’clock and said, ‘Oh s---.'"

So basically this is Geno Smith without the timezone issues

[MadDog2020]

Why doesn't David have a right to be ticked off? Say what you want ON the field but there's a bit of a difference between that and this - he would never embarrass the organization off the field like this or big-time his teammates. Heck if you ran this as a blind item people would have guessed Harvey in a nanosecond, well the ones that didn't get their sports confused and guess Geno Smith anyway

And btw Terry debunked the traffic issue:

Adam Rubin ‏@AdamRubinESPN 10m10 minutes ago

Workout was noon-2 PM. Terry Collins told me Matt Harvey said: ‘I was doing some stuff, looked up and it’s 1 o’clock and said, ‘Oh s---.'"

So basically this is Geno Smith without the timezone issues

'I was banging out this chick, looked up and said 'holy sh!t it's 1:00? That's alright, lemme finish up here and I'll head to the ballpark'. Or something like that. [emoji14]

['7']

Harvey was probably in traffic...to go to the Yankee game

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Why doesn't David have a right to be ticked off?  Say what you want ON the field but there's a bit of a difference between that and this - he would never embarrass the organization off the field like this or big-time his teammates.  Heck if you ran this as a blind item people would have guessed Harvey in a nanosecond, well the ones that didn't get their sports confused and guess Geno Smith anyway

 

And btw Terry debunked the traffic issue:

 

Adam Rubin ‏@AdamRubinESPN 10m10 minutes ago

Workout was noon-2 PM. Terry Collins told me Matt Harvey said: ‘I was doing some stuff, looked up and it’s 1 o’clock and said, ‘Oh s---.'"

So basically this is Geno Smith without the timezone issues

 

I'm of the belief that when you've kind of been carried (and predictably didn't step up at all when the guys who carried you slumped a bit), you should probably lay low a little bit.  Harvey is not right here obviously, but it wouldn't surprise me if a part of him was thinking "Right pal, why don't you drive in a fvcking run when we really need it once in a while, Mr. Paycheck."  Like I've always said, in spite of the still-quite-good career numbers (built on the 2005-08 foundation), Wright has been just as much of a face of futility as anyone else in recent years...the guy now has a rep as a guy who never gets it done in big moments for a reason. 

 

But I will absolutely give you that David has never ever EVER been an embarrassment off the field, and always represented the Mets well as a person.  That's not even debatable. 

Harvey was probably in traffic...to go to the Yankee game

 

Good one...that made me chuckle.

Edited October 6, 2015 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[NJDevs4978]

'7', on 06 Oct 2015 - 4:14 PM, said:

Harvey was probably in traffic...to go to the Yankee game

 

Believe me I had a thought in this vein too. 

 

Of course Jon Heyman (aka Boras's mouthpiece) has been taking up for him on Twitter.  Jon, fifty other guys had to get to Citi, only one was late - and the traffic excuse was already debunked by his own manager.  Lay low on this one, whether it's coming from you or Bora$.

Edited October 6, 2015 by NJDevs4978

['7']

Cubs-Pirates tonight. Have to say I will be rooting for Pittsburgh as I think (god willing) if the Mets get that far down the line Chicago would be a nightmare opponent, plus I wouldn't want to run into that "It's finally our year!" buzzsaw. Overall I think we could hang with the Pirates better than the Cubs...if it even gets to that point.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

I hate to say it, but both of those teams are clearly better than the Mets.  Dodgers and Mets are very much the #4 and #5 teams in the NL playoffs, and I think the Mets are the definite #5.  Just hope the Mets can pull some upsets off (and as we well know, sometimes a team can get hot in the playoff and do just that), because they'll be the underdog against every team they face. 

Edited October 7, 2015 by Colorado Rockies 1976

['7']

He's allowed 4 earned runs since July. How the hell did Jake Arrieta get this good this fast?

[capo]

I just put this game on before the benches cleared... theres been so many swings and misses is a wonder if the ball is a solid entity.

Like Ronnie said... Arrieta should have just taken his dumb ass down to 1st base. Watson should have hit between the numbers and not on the ass.

[thecoffeecake]

Man, as good as Keuchel was, of course Arrieta is that much better. I think the Cubs are looking at the same thing the Dodgers are; strong through the first two starters, and maybe not too great beyond that. The Mets' chances are going to lie in their rotational depth. Split in LA, they've got a good shot at clinching in game 4. Lose both in LA, they probably aren't going back for game 5.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

I just put this game on before the benches cleared... theres been so many swings and misses is a wonder if the ball is a solid entity.

Like Ronnie said... Arrieta should have just taken his dumb ass down to 1st base. Watson should have hit between the numbers and not on the ass.

 

Really hoping hitters start re-learning to do the little things again (making contact, situational hitting, drawing walks, etc).  Today's hitters are making the pitchers' jobs so easy these days.  I never thought I'd say Curtis Granderson would be a good example, but the 2015 version of him found a way to do a lot of things pretty well even though he doesn't really hit for average (and remains strikeout-prone):  26 HR, 33 2B, 91 BB, .364 OB%, .457 SLG.  This version of Curtis is worth his contract.  He really had a very good year.

Edited October 8, 2015 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[capo]

Really hoping hitters start re-learning to do the little things again (making contact, situational hitting, drawing walks, etc). Today's hitters are making the pitchers' jobs so easy these days. I never thought I'd say Curtis Granderson would be a good example, but the 2015 version of him found a way to do a lot of things pretty well even though he doesn't really hit for average (and remains strikeout-prone): 26 HR, 33 2B, 91 BB, .364 OB%, .457 SLG. This version of Curtis is worth his contract. He really had a very good year.

Only not for a leadoff batter. Granted the Mets don't have a leadoff guy and SA never addressed that desperate need...

[NJDevs4978]

Only not for a leadoff batter. Granted the Mets don't have a leadoff guy and SA never addressed that desperate need...

 

Granderson may not fit the 'traditional' mold of a leadoff hitter because he doesn't have speed and bunt his way on base a la the Reyes of old, but really he did the two main things you ask leadoff guys to do - take pitches and get on base.  And he still produced a middle-of-the order HR total.  

Edited October 8, 2015 by NJDevs4978

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Only not for a leadoff batter. Granted the Mets don't have a leadoff guy and SA never addressed that desperate need...

 

You are way WAY off-base here.  You're not putting Granderson's numbers in the proper contexts at all.

 

For one, this isn't the early 2000s anymore...offensive numbers are down from that era, for obvious reasons.  Granderson's .364 OB% ranked 15th in the NL, and some of the guys who rank ahead of him are studs like Harper and Goldschmidt who clearly get pitched around because pitchers don't want any part of them.  Granderson's 91 walks were good for 6th in the NL, as were his 98 runs scored.  And as we saw, not only was he getting on base at a very good clip, but he provided power as well...terrific power for the leadoff spot.  He was 17th in the NL with his .821 OB+SLG. 

 

I've been critical of both Curtis and his contract at times, but the guy was asked to fill a role that didn't seem to be like the right fit initially, and he did a terrific job at it....I was hoping for "can live with him" numbers, and he far exceeded that.  I would happily take Grandy's 2015 numbers out of the leadoff spot over the next two remaining years of his deal.  You want to see bad leadoff numbers, see what happens if Lagares ever has to hit there.   

Edited October 9, 2015 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Granderson may not fit the 'traditional' mold of a leadoff hitter because he doesn't have speed and bunt his way on base a la the Reyes of old, but really he did the two main things you ask leadoff guys to do - take pitches and get on base.  And he still produced a middle-of-the order HR total.  

 

Speaking of Reyes, man, who would we rather have right now?  Reyes looks pretty damned close to finished...and being paid top dollar to boot.  His 2015 season was just awful.

[capo]

I'd like to how many times he scored after getting walked or hitting a single?

[NJDevs4978]

Speaking of Reyes, man, who would we rather have right now?  Reyes looks pretty damned close to finished...and being paid top dollar to boot.  His 2015 season was just awful.

 

The funny thing is Reyes was always thought of and treated like the prototype leadoff hitter cause he could run and steal bases (and I still kind of miss that Reyes, flaws and all) but his ONLY season with an OBP higher than Grandy's this year was the year he won the batting title.

I'd like to how many times he scored after getting walked or hitting a single?

 

Well Granderson scored 98 runs this year which isn't exactly terrible, especially considering the crap in the Mets' lineup for the first half of the season

[capo]

I'm not saying he had a bad season. He earned his money for sure... I'm saying he's not a leadoff hitter. Even if he's the best the a Mets have. The Mets lost a ton of games this year because they couldn't manufacturer runs. This is going to be their problem in the playoffs as well. Granderson does ver well at getting on but how good is he at manufacturing runs after reaching 1st base?

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Again, Granderson scored 98 runs. Exactly five players scored more in the NL. No, Granderson doesn't possess ALL of the skills you'd like to see out of a leadoff hitter, but clearly his lack of speed/base-stealing prowess didn't hurt him much. Show me an NL leadoff hitter in 2015 who had a drastically better year. Also remember "manufacturing ability" hardly falls solely on the baserunner. Is it his fault that a lot of Met hitters are strikeout-prone? That RBI Kryptonite and Duda often don't get it done in memorable moments? Look at it another way: you rarely see Granderson screw up on the basepaths...considering how much Murph sucks at it, there's something to be said for merely being a solid baserunner.

I know you're not saying Grandy had a bad year (no one can), but finding a guy who can do very last thing a top leadoff hitter is supposed to do is very difficult. 2015 Granderson gets on base at a very good rate and gets his fair share of extra base hits, including a nice number of dingers (his 26 ties him for 14th in the NL). You're really nitpicking on this one capo. Just accept the Grandy may not check every box in "great leadoff hitter assets" column, but he did almost everything well in 2015.

Edited October 9, 2015 by Colorado Rockies 1976

['7']

If anybody remember now, when Granderson first came here we looked legitimately finishes as a ballplayer. Absolutely no pitch recognition, and it looked like he was longing for his short porch. Guy seemed a hair away from retiring...the fact that he's reinvented himself as a legit leadoff hitting at this stage of his career is remarkable.

 

Yea he has a noodle arm, yea lefties annihilate him, but I would never in my wildest dreams think Granderson would have a 5.1 war year for us. That's insane

 

Anyway...tonights the night (just don't get no hit ok!) everyone is brimming with anticipation. 9:45 will feel like Chrismas morning.

 

I think our only chance is pretty much matching zeros and getting Kershaws pitch count up.

[capo]

Your leadoff guy has to be a guy that can steal you a run. Particularly in the playoffs. How many times were the Mets shut out this year? What was Grandersons obp in those games? Most likely on par with his season.... we need to find a way to make that run to win the game. This series can see the Mets lose 1-0 in 3 of 4 games. That's a problem and it's not on Granderson it's on SA.

The Mets need some speed. It plays to their ballpark to be a speedy team.

Edited October 9, 2015 by capo

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Your leadoff guy has to be a guy that can steal you a run. Particularly in the playoffs. How many times were the Mets shut out this year? What was Grandersons obp in those games? Most likely on par with his season.... we need to find a way to make that run to win the game. This series can see the Mets lose 1-0 in 3 of 4 games. That's a problem and it's not on Granderson it's on SA.

The Mets need some speed. It plays to their ballpark to be a speedy team.

 

The bolded:  he does?  Since when?  Lots of teams find ways to win without that kind of leadoff hitter.  Tell me where that guy was and what Sandy should have done to get him. 

 

This sounds much like the Devil fan who blasts the captain (whomever he may be) for not making some incredible inspiration speech that wills his seemingly sleepwalking teammates to some unbelievable come-from-behind victory. 

 

How many "Rickey Henderson"-types do you think are out there in 2015?  The stolen base is not that big of a deal anymore...exactly seven players in the AL and NL combined stole 30 bases or more.  I'm sorry, with most "base stealers" stealing a base roughly every five or six games, it's just not that vital a weapon.  The top four base-stealers in the NL this season played for teams that ultimately didn't make the playoffs.  And though Grandy isn't fast, it's not like he's a pure singles hitter...33 2B hits is pretty good, and he even hit two triples.   

 

You need your leadoff hitter to GET ON BASE.  First and foremost.  Give the guys who hit after him a chance to drive him home.  Curtis did that this season.  As we all know, Eric Young's problem was that he couldn't steal first.  You make it sound like it's all on the leadoff hitter to steal a run.  Like I've said, those drive-their-opponents-batty-from-the-basepaths speedster guys aren't falling from the sky.  When you have a guy who's doing the job (and Curtis did), it's on other guys to move him along, drive him in, and not strike out so damned much.   

 

Let's face it, if the Mets lose this series and lose 1-0 or 2-1 in three out of four games (and Kershaw and Greinke can make a LOT of lineups look bad), it won't be just because Granderson couldn't steal a run.  I think it will be because both Wright and Duda can be pitched to and gotten out pretty easily by above-average pitching, and because lots of guys throughout the Mets' lineup didn't come through with key hits.  There will be blame to go around.  They're not losing this series because their leadoff hitter drew a walk, but couldn't steal second and third.  And remember that pretty much every team these days has some kind of flaw, or multiple flaws. 

 

Also keep in mind that I don't think this team was really planning on making the playoffs this season (probably why Sandy didn't seem to try terribly hard to address the team's weaknesses last offseason).  A LOT of things broke right: 

 

1) deGrom and Harvey remained healthy all year, and neither regressed.  Harvey didn't experience any real setbacks from TJS.

2) Syndergaard came up and was able to approximate what the Mets would've missed from Wheeler...there was no "get beat up for a season" learning curve for him.

3) Colon provided innings and usually gave his team a chance to win most starts...he never got old overnight.

4) Granderson did a terrific job in the leadoff spot.

5) Conforto proved he could stick in the majors.

6) Cespedes was far more productive than could ever be expected.

7) Familia took the closer's job and ran with it. 

8) The Nationals sucked and completely failed to take advantage of a schedule that gave them every chance to get back in the race, and never built up that insurmountable lead that might've had Sandy saying "Wait 'till next year."   

Edited October 9, 2015 by Colorado Rockies 1976