Report: Devils GM Shero high on Penguins AHL head coach

[fsu1852]

Source: http://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/761960

[Marshall]

Hockey East connection so it's essentially a done deal.

[devilsrule33]

If Shero has interviewed Stevens and Oates, and is high on someone else...I'm okay with that. 

 

However, considering the Penguins can't be very high on Johnston, hard to see them letting Hynes go.

[NJDfan1711]

Heh, this is exactly what I said in the 'realistic coaching options' thread.  Wouldn't mind seeing this at all!

[Pepperkorn]

Is everyone so obtuse that they don't see Stevens and Oates don't want to be the coach here?  We were watching  Butch and Sundance -- with Oates in the Katherine Ross  role 

 

Seriously - that's why this board sucks now.  You guys - you don't see things. 

[NewarkDevil5]

Is everyone so obtuse that they don't see Stevens and Oates don't want to be the coach here?  We were watching  Butch and Sundance -- with Oates in the Katherine Ross  role 

 

Seriously - that's why this board sucks now.  You guys - you don't see things. 

 

Part of why this board isn't as good as in years past is we don't have guys like Bobby Holik with his penchant for awesomely terribly quotes to the media to pick apart. For better or for worse, we used to have some characters to talk about. Now we're left with nothing but good soldiers. Even Jamie Langenbrunner was good for some interesting lines every once in a while.

Edited May 11, 2015 by NewarkDevil5

[Pepperkorn]

True enough but the guys I'm thinking of HATED that kind of talk.  And they'd get the wrong information from it like they do today with the few bits we have.  Probably why they hate it so much -- they suck at comprehending intangibles. They lack creative thinking.

 

Theses guys who were anti-Lou are not from Jersey even.  Why not go root for Ottawa instead?  Or Montreal?  Why did you bad-mouthing a team you've adopted that has nothing to do with you?  Because you liked the style.... so when that style is dull to you go back from where you came from, you know?  Why drum out what got you here and change things to just another sh!t Ottawa Montreal Leafs team?

 

It took a decade but these crappers got what they wanted.  It's "their" team now.  It's just garbage - like any other team in the NHL with some good years some bad.  I don't see a tradition being carried on from here.  I really don't.  I'm sure I'm just being negative - but it's McHockey. Homogenized. Commercialized.  There will be nothing to make NJ stand out from the crowd now.  They'll be inconsistent running by whim of the NHL demi-gods -- not by hockey. 

[NewarkDevil5]

True enough but the guys I'm thinking of HATED that kind of talk.  And they'd get the wrong information from it like they do today with the few bits we have.  Probably why they hate it so much -- they suck at comprehending intangibles. They lack creative thinking.

 

Theses guys who were anti-Lou are not from Jersey even.  Why not go root for Ottawa instead?  Or Montreal?  Why did you bad-mouthing a team you've adopted that has nothing to do with you?  Because you liked the style.... so when that style is dull to you go back from where you came from, you know?  Why drum out what got you here and change things to just another sh!t Ottawa Montreal Leafs team?

 

It took a decade but these crappers got what they wanted.  It's "their" team now.  It's just garbage - like any other team in the NHL with some good years some bad.  I don't see a tradition being carried on from here.  I really don't.  I'm sure I'm just being negative - but it's McHockey. Homogenized. Commercialized.  There will be nothing to make NJ stand out from the crowd now.  They'll be inconsistent running by whim of the NHL demi-gods -- not by hockey. 

 

Question is how do you continue the kind of tradition you're talking about? The kind that was built on the shoulder of guys like Stevens, Niedermayer, Daneyko, MacLean, Lemieux etc. That kind of character isn't being bred today and honestly it didn't start off being that kind of character when they got here either. They leaned very heavily on the Montreal Canadiens organization to bring that attitude here. It took a Lemaire and a Robinson to turn a firebrand Stevens into the ice cold leader he became and to keep Niedermayer from turning into Paul Coffey. It took a Jacques Caron to turn Brodeur from just another Quebec goalie to a guy who could change the way the position is played. Once those guys were molded correctly they were able to put young guys like Arnott and Elias onto the straight and narrow path.

 

Right now you're seeing the modern Devils equivalent of the 1985 Devils. Obviously they're not as bad as that because they've got goaltending and a modicum of defensive talent, but they're back at square one in some ways and perhaps that's not a bad thing. It's very difficult to have a seamless transition. If David Hale had panned out to what Lou thought he'd be then maybe we'd be talking differently now, but guys like him and Kadeykin not panning out when we needed to transition the defense in the early 00s is what we're paying for now. It forced the team to really concentrate heavily on drafting defensemen which caused a huge delay in the forward talent pipeline.

[BostonNala370]

Question is how do you continue the kind of tradition you're talking about? The kind that was built on the shoulder of guys like Stevens, Niedermayer, Daneyko, MacLean, Lemieux etc. That kind of character isn't being bred today and honestly it didn't start off being that kind of character when they got here either. They leaned very heavily on the Montreal Canadiens organization to bring that attitude here. It took a Lemaire and a Robinson to turn a firebrand Stevens into the ice cold leader he became and to keep Niedermayer from turning into Paul Coffey. It took a Jacques Caron to turn Brodeur from just another Quebec goalie to a guy who could change the way the position is played. Once those guys were molded correctly they were able to put young guys like Arnott and Elias onto the straight and narrow path.

 

Right now you're seeing the modern Devils equivalent of the 1985 Devils. Obviously they're not as bad as that because they've got goaltending and a modicum of defensive talent, but they're back at square one in some ways and perhaps that's not a bad thing. It's very difficult to have a seamless transition. If David Hale had panned out to what Lou thought he'd be then maybe we'd be talking differently now, but guys like him and Kadeykin not panning out when we needed to transition the defense in the early 00s is what we're paying for now. It forced the team to really concentrate heavily on drafting defensemen which caused a huge delay in the forward talent pipeline.

 

Good post. Spot on

[themightyall]

Question is how do you continue the kind of tradition you're talking about? The kind that was built on the shoulder of guys like Stevens, Niedermayer, Daneyko, MacLean, Lemieux etc. That kind of character isn't being bred today and honestly it didn't start off being that kind of character when they got here either. They leaned very heavily on the Montreal Canadiens organization to bring that attitude here. It took a Lemaire and a Robinson to turn a firebrand Stevens into the ice cold leader he became and to keep Niedermayer from turning into Paul Coffey. It took a Jacques Caron to turn Brodeur from just another Quebec goalie to a guy who could change the way the position is played. Once those guys were molded correctly they were able to put young guys like Arnott and Elias onto the straight and narrow path.

 

Right now you're seeing the modern Devils equivalent of the 1985 Devils. Obviously they're not as bad as that because they've got goaltending and a modicum of defensive talent, but they're back at square one in some ways and perhaps that's not a bad thing. It's very difficult to have a seamless transition. If David Hale had panned out to what Lou thought he'd be then maybe we'd be talking differently now, but guys like him and Kadeykin not panning out when we needed to transition the defense in the early 00s is what we're paying for now. It forced the team to really concentrate heavily on drafting defensemen which caused a huge delay in the forward talent pipeline.

 

One way we could continue the tradition is carry on the guys that built and continued it.  Lemaire, etc is gone but kicking Stevens and Brodeur (http://fireandice.northjersey.com/fire-ice-1.174987/after-gm-change-martin-brodeur-not-expecting-to-return-to-devils-for-a-few-years-1.1331807) out the door isn't going to continue it.  You said it yourself, the guys that came in didn't have that character, it had to be built by Lemaire.  Bringing in people like Brodeur, they'd be expected to pass off the torch.  Now what are we building?  A group of players that are playing for a goal or points bonus.

[Triumph]

Question is how do you continue the kind of tradition you're talking about? The kind that was built on the shoulder of guys like Stevens, Niedermayer, Daneyko, MacLean, Lemieux etc. That kind of character isn't being bred today and honestly it didn't start off being that kind of character when they got here either. They leaned very heavily on the Montreal Canadiens organization to bring that attitude here. It took a Lemaire and a Robinson to turn a firebrand Stevens into the ice cold leader he became and to keep Niedermayer from turning into Paul Coffey. It took a Jacques Caron to turn Brodeur from just another Quebec goalie to a guy who could change the way the position is played. Once those guys were molded correctly they were able to put young guys like Arnott and Elias onto the straight and narrow path.

 

Right now you're seeing the modern Devils equivalent of the 1985 Devils. Obviously they're not as bad as that because they've got goaltending and a modicum of defensive talent, but they're back at square one in some ways and perhaps that's not a bad thing. It's very difficult to have a seamless transition. If David Hale had panned out to what Lou thought he'd be then maybe we'd be talking differently now, but guys like him and Kadeykin not panning out when we needed to transition the defense in the early 00s is what we're paying for now. It forced the team to really concentrate heavily on drafting defensemen which caused a huge delay in the forward talent pipeline.

 

Tradition is naturally ossifying and can be ultimately blinding - it hides harsh truths ('we've always done it this way, this way has worked in the past, therefore this way is good'), and produces sycophancy.  Lou brought in Adam Oates and had Scott Stevens here as assistant coach.  Between them the 3 of them have been involved in more winning hockey games than probably any staff in the NHL.  What did they produce as a coaching staff?  Only the worst team the Devils have iced in almost 30 years.  When adherence to a certain standard is deemed more important than what kind of results that standard is producing, it's got to go.

 

The Devils seem to have gotten very lucky with defensive D in the 90s and assumed they had the ability to pick out guys with 0 offensive ability who were going to succeed in the NHL - they lost that ability post-Colin White and have not regained it.

Edited May 13, 2015 by Triumph

[redruM]

True enough but the guys I'm thinking of HATED that kind of talk.  And they'd get the wrong information from it like they do today with the few bits we have.  Probably why they hate it so much -- they suck at comprehending intangibles. They lack creative thinking.

 

Theses guys who were anti-Lou are not from Jersey even.  Why not go root for Ottawa instead?  Or Montreal?  Why did you bad-mouthing a team you've adopted that has nothing to do with you?  Because you liked the style.... so when that style is dull to you go back from where you came from, you know?  Why drum out what got you here and change things to just another sh!t Ottawa Montreal Leafs team?

 

It took a decade but these crappers got what they wanted.  It's "their" team now.  It's just garbage - like any other team in the NHL with some good years some bad.  I don't see a tradition being carried on from here.  I really don't.  I'm sure I'm just being negative - but it's McHockey. Homogenized. Commercialized.  There will be nothing to make NJ stand out from the crowd now.  They'll be inconsistent running by whim of the NHL demi-gods -- not by hockey. 

I completely disagree, I'm a jersey guy, I've follwed this team from day 1, and I've been as vocal as as most about the NHL having passed LL by.  Part of keeping the tradition going is being able to successfully move on from those that lead you.  LL has not been able to rebuild this team since Stevens & Neids moved on.  and clearly with the revolving door coaches he has not done a good job there...  LL had a great run, and ownership needs to find the GM for the next 30 years, and lets hope the GM position does not become a revovling door.  If you trust LL so much then you should trust that he can pick the GM for the next 30 yrs.

[themightyall]

Tradition is naturally ossifying and can be ultimately blinding - it hides harsh truths ('we've always done it this way, this way has worked in the past, therefore this way is good'), and produces sycophancy.  Lou brought in Adam Oates and had Scott Stevens here as assistant coach.  Between them the 3 of them have been involved in more winning hockey games than probably any staff in the NHL.  What did they produce as a coaching staff?  Only the worst team the Devils have iced in almost 30 years.  When adherence to a certain standard is deemed more important than what kind of results that standard is producing, it's got to go.

 

The Devils seem to have gotten very lucky with defensive D in the 90s and assumed they had the ability to pick out guys with 0 offensive ability who were going to succeed in the NHL - they lost that ability post-Colin White and have not regained it.

 

How poetic.  Tradition also leads to a group of individuals playing beyond the collective sum.  I think that's the biggest difference I see with me and others.  There are plenty of teams with good players.  But the teams that win are the ones with a stronger dedication to a system, character and tradition.  The players the Devils have now aren't good enough.  That doesn't mean you throw out everything just because they need to get better players.  It wasn't tradition's fault that the Devils aren't winning, it's the players.  That is Lou's fault but there's more to a GM than just throwing jerseys to players.  I'm not trying to say that Lou needed to stay and I'm not saying that status quo is the answer, but throwing out what made the Devils better than comparable teams is wrong.

 

That is probably what boils everything done for me.  Get better forwards and everything else is in place.  If that means that Lou had to step down to get better forwards, so be it.  But this is not looking like they are only changing players, they're becoming nothing special.

[Jerzey]

Exactly what traditions are we talking about here anyway?

 

Traditionally we have been a tough team to play against. But you're only as good as the players on your team. 

 

Our traditions are things like no beards, no numbers above 35, Rangers suck chant/whistle (which admittedly was stolen), and no 3rd jerseys. 

 

I just don't see what traditions are lost all of a sudden without Lou as GM. 

 

And I may not live in NJ now but I grew up there (first 22 years of my life) and you couldn't find a more die hard fan when I was there.

Edited May 13, 2015 by Jerzey Devil

[Triumph]

How poetic.  Tradition also leads to a group of individuals playing beyond the collective sum.  I think that's the biggest difference I see with me and others.  There are plenty of teams with good players.  But the teams that win are the ones with a stronger dedication to a system, character and tradition.  The players the Devils have now aren't good enough.  That doesn't mean you throw out everything just because they need to get better players.  It wasn't tradition's fault that the Devils aren't winning, it's the players.  That is Lou's fault but there's more to a GM than just throwing jerseys to players.  I'm not trying to say that Lou needed to stay and I'm not saying that status quo is the answer, but throwing out what made the Devils better than comparable teams is wrong.

 

That is probably what boils everything done for me.  Get better forwards and everything else is in place.  If that means that Lou had to step down to get better forwards, so be it.  But this is not looking like they are only changing players, they're becoming nothing special.

 

The teams that win are the ones with a stronger dedication to tradition?   The teams that win are the ones with better players.  I think tradition has some place, but not at the expense of players.  We see lots of different teams win from year to year.  They can't all have this amazing tradition.

 

Lou still runs the organization, by the way.  He just doesn't make the final decisions on players or coaches.  If his answer to the Devils' scoring issues was legitimately that the Devils need 2 top six forwards and his plan was to go out this off-season and get those, a removal was justified.

[themightyall]

Couple of points: 

 

I did say better players are needed.  You think that the Wild players are a better team than the Blues?  You need good players but to beat other teams with good players you need what Lou brought.

 

Lou did bring a tough team to play against, good or bad players.  Recent years they have been bad and that is why we are out of the playoffs but if you think that no beards and a Rangers suck chant (which is a fan thing, not a team thing) creates the culture then I just don't know how to respond to you.  Sure no beards are a byproduct of the culture Lou created but let's not have the tail wag the dog or anything.

 

In regards to the 2 forwards away, what do you expect Lou to say in February or whenever he said it, "Yeah, we suck.  We won't make the playoffs for a while."  What does that say about the team you are running?  You might as well be Buffalo at that point.  Losing is not acceptable.  You guys seem to think it is if it's building towards something.  Signing a 30+ year old forward isn't stopping them from drafting their player or developing the players they have (for the most part) but it is admitting defeat without trying.  YOU HAVE TO TRY!  Maybe you want to watch lazy prospects that were given important roles they didn't earn and no one there to push them but I don't.  What's so wrong with waiting for Josefson to make you bump him to a scoring line?  I've seen on this board someone talk about how great Loktionov when he couldn't even make it on 3 NHL teams and isn't in NA anymore.  A lot of you would want those guys as centering our scoring lines.

 

Lastly, trotting Lou around as a figure head is hardly something at which to point.  He might as well be stuffed and left out in front of the Rock.  Maybe Shero and the owners continue the (or a similar) culture, but no one has said or shown me anything that makes me think so.  That interview from TG and the 76ers just show me the owners find losing acceptable.

[NewarkDevil5]

Tradition is naturally ossifying and can be ultimately blinding - it hides harsh truths ('we've always done it this way, this way has worked in the past, therefore this way is good'), and produces sycophancy.  Lou brought in Adam Oates and had Scott Stevens here as assistant coach.  Between them the 3 of them have been involved in more winning hockey games than probably any staff in the NHL.  What did they produce as a coaching staff?  Only the worst team the Devils have iced in almost 30 years.  When adherence to a certain standard is deemed more important than what kind of results that standard is producing, it's got to go.

 

The Devils seem to have gotten very lucky with defensive D in the 90s and assumed they had the ability to pick out guys with 0 offensive ability who were going to succeed in the NHL - they lost that ability post-Colin White and have not regained it.

 

There is always a delicate balance between keeping the traditions of prior teams and bringing in the new ideas that are necessary to keep pace with the direction the league is heading. Part of what I'm saying is best exemplified by the descent of the Islanders into an abysmal abyss of irrelevance starting in the early 90s and only starting to break free of it in the last year or two. They had a tradition based on guys like Bill Torrey who, while immensely successful at drafting offensive players, also made certain that the team had both an effective commitment to the defensive side (through players like Potvin and coaches like Al Arbour) as well as instilling an expectation of success and winning. He was unable to maintain that tradition as the league began changing its character and goaltending. He was fired while attempting to rebuild and the ensuing sh!tshow destroyed every tradition he'd built. The Islanders became a team that could turn any player they got sour. That is what I hope to avoid over here. Yes, we've got a stronger goaltending and defensive base than the Isles did in the early 90s, but then again the Islanders still had better scoring talent then than we do now and goaltending was only just then starting to take on the importance in those days that it is now. The parallels are not exact and I'm sure it will be easy enough to pick it apart, but the point that I'm trying to make is that there had been a culture of winning on the Island throughout the 80s that died in the early 90s. I hope that doesn't happen here as well.

Edited May 13, 2015 by NewarkDevil5

[DJ Eco]

We have no idea what kind of mold Brodeur would follow if given the Devils' front office job. For all we know, Ray Shero may be more "Lou-like" than Brodeur would as GM or ass't GM. That's just it, we just don't know, because Brodeur doesn't have any experience on the job. We're a team who can't afford to bring someone on to learn the ropes on the job. Other teams can and we'll benefit from that in the long run if/when Marty learns the ropes and comes back in 5-10 years. We tried with John Maclean and failed. We've sort of tried with Stevens and while he may be a great ass't coach, he's not a head coach, so we failed.

 

That's why it's dangerous to just label this move as "throwing our tradition away". You don't keep tradition for tradition's sake. And for all we know, we could've brought on Brodeur in a front office position and have him change everything we know about Devils hockey.

[Jerzey]

Couple of points: 

 

I did say better players are needed.  You think that the Wild players are a better team than the Blues?  You need good players but to beat other teams with good players you need what Lou brought.

 

Lou did bring a tough team to play against, good or bad players.  Recent years they have been bad and that is why we are out of the playoffs but if you think that no beards and a Rangers suck chant (which is a fan thing, not a team thing) creates the culture then I just don't know how to respond to you.  Sure no beards are a byproduct of the culture Lou created but let's not have the tail wag the dog or anything.

 

In regards to the 2 forwards away, what do you expect Lou to say in February or whenever he said it, "Yeah, we suck.  We won't make the playoffs for a while."  What does that say about the team you are running?  You might as well be Buffalo at that point.  Losing is not acceptable.  You guys seem to think it is if it's building towards something.  Signing a 30+ year old forward isn't stopping them from drafting their player or developing the players they have (for the most part) but it is admitting defeat without trying.  YOU HAVE TO TRY!  Maybe you want to watch lazy prospects that were given important roles they didn't earn and no one there to push them but I don't.  What's so wrong with waiting for Josefson to make you bump him to a scoring line?  I've seen on this board someone talk about how great Loktionov when he couldn't even make it on 3 NHL teams and isn't in NA anymore.  A lot of you would want those guys as centering our scoring lines.

 

Lastly, trotting Lou around as a figure head is hardly something at which to point.  He might as well be stuffed and left out in front of the Rock.  Maybe Shero and the owners continue the (or a similar) culture, but no one has said or shown me anything that makes me think so.  That interview from TG and the 76ers just show me the owners find losing acceptable.

 

Again, the only tradition or culture the Devils have had over the years is being a defensive team that's tough to play against. For a while The Trap was mostly our culture. None of that has been a part of our culture for the past few years anyway.

 

Players come and go. GM's, coaches, commentators...they all come and go. For the most part, we've all only known Lou as GM of this team. Let's consider Lou's time as GM of the Devils an era. The Lamorillo era. Now it's time for the franchise to enter a new era. 

 

What traditions does today's Yankees team carry from past teams over the years? Tradition and culture are things that change over the course of a franchises history.

Edited May 13, 2015 by Jerzey Devil

[DJ Eco]

Look no further than the Flyers for a team that's stuck on"tradition"... The "tradition" of being a physical and bruiser of an organization. Ron Hextall as GM, Craig Berube as their coach, Zac Rinaldo has been a roster regular for a few years. The "Broad Street Bullies" title continues to follow them, the fans still love it and the players get traded to Philly and begin to embody it, it's cult-like.

 

 

And yet it's a losing tradition. It won them some Cups decades ago, but it's a page they need to turn before they can set themselves up to win another one. But fans will fight you tooth and nail that the "bullies" persona is what the Flyers need to continue to be successful.

Edited May 13, 2015 by DJ Eco

[NewarkDevil5]

Look no further than the Flyers for a team that's stuck on"tradition"... The "tradition" of being a physical and bruiser of an organization. Ron Hextall as GM, Craig Berube as their coach, Zac Rinaldo has been a roster regular for a few years. The "Broad Street Bullies" title continues to follow them, the fans still love it and the players get traded to Philly and begin to embody it, it's cult-like.

 

 

And yet it's a losing tradition. It won them some Cups decades ago, but it's a page they need to turn before they can set themselves up to win another one. But fans will fight you tooth and nail that the "bullies" persona is what the Flyers need to continue to be successful.

 

I see what you're saying, but I consider that more of an identity than a tradition. Perhaps you're right though because the Edmonton Oilers have a similarly persistent identity of being a team of fast-skating, no-defense, offensive only team that has persisted since the 80s but hasn't served them at all well since then.

[themightyall]

Again, the only tradition or culture the Devils have had over the years is being a defensive team that's tough to play against. For a while The Trap was mostly our culture. None of that has been a part of our culture for the past few years anyway.

 

Players come and go. GM's, coaches, commentators...they all come and go. For the most part, we've all only known Lou as GM of this team. Let's consider Lou's time as GM of the Devils an era. The Lamorillo era. Now it's time for the franchise to enter a new era. 

 

What traditions does today's Yankees team carry from past teams over the years? Tradition and culture are things that change over the course of a franchises history.

 

The trap is a coaching structure, not a culture.  Would you say you had a runny nose if you had the flu?  The culture is an overall lifestyle that manifests in many ways.  I'd say putting team before person, professionalism, respect, discipline and hard work are all a part of the culture Lou cultivated.  These were manifested when things were going well in players signing lower than market contracts, not airing dirty laundry out to the public, wearing suits and being clean shaven, playing the system that the coach designed, not having high numbers, etc.  And those manifestations have changed with the times because of Lou.  Everyone says he is so rigid but we didn't always play the trap, we didn't only have lower numbers and we didn't always have slow, stay at home D (albeit that is just within a couple of years).  But the culture didn't change.  Sure every team would say that is their culture but not everyone buys in.  A symptom that the culture is dwindling is consciously not improving your team and putting winning not at the forefront with the expectation that the team will win more further down the road.

 

Look no further than the Flyers for a team that's stuck on"tradition"... The "tradition" of being a physical and bruiser of an organization. Ron Hextall as GM, Craig Berube as their coach, Zac Rinaldo has been a roster regular for a few years. The "Broad Street Bullies" title continues to follow them, the fans still love it and the players get traded to Philly and begin to embody it, it's cult-like.

 

 

And yet it's a losing tradition. It won them some Cups decades ago, but it's a page they need to turn before they can set themselves up to win another one. But fans will fight you tooth and nail that the "bullies" persona is what the Flyers need to continue to be successful.

 

The Flyers is an interesting case.  I think that tradition comes from Snider rather than Hextall and Berube but it is a tradition that hasn't won because it's never fostered discipline.  Sure they won twice because of gooning it up but the Flyers have always had very talented rosters but have never had the discipline in their culture to beat other talented teams with that discipline.

[Triumph]

There is always a delicate balance between keeping the traditions of prior teams and bringing in the new ideas that are necessary to keep pace with the direction the league is heading. Part of what I'm saying is best exemplified by the descent of the Islanders into an abysmal abyss of irrelevance starting in the early 90s and only starting to break free of it in the last year or two. They had a tradition based on guys like Bill Torrey who, while immensely successful at drafting offensive players, also made certain that the team had both an effective commitment to the defensive side (through players like Potvin and coaches like Al Arbour) as well as instilling an expectation of success and winning. He was unable to maintain that tradition as the league began changing its character and goaltending. He was fired while attempting to rebuild and the ensuing sh!tshow destroyed every tradition he'd built. The Islanders became a team that could turn any player they got sour. That is what I hope to avoid over here. Yes, we've got a stronger goaltending and defensive base than the Isles did in the early 90s, but then again the Islanders still had better scoring talent then than we do now and goaltending was only just then starting to take on the importance in those days that it is now. The parallels are not exact and I'm sure it will be easy enough to pick it apart, but the point that I'm trying to make is that there had been a culture of winning on the Island throughout the 80s that died in the early 90s. I hope that doesn't happen here as well.

 

The reason the Islanders went into the toilet is because Mike Milbury took over and immediately made terrible trades and decisions, and he lasted through multiple owners, somehow.  That would not happen on the Harris/Blitzer watch - these guys are too shrewd to let someone tear apart the organization like Milbury did.  Regardless, it's about the players.  Have a strong organization, absolutely, but you can't do that without good players.  Coaching can only do so much.

[DJ Eco]

The Flyers is an interesting case.  I think that tradition comes from Snider rather than Hextall and Berube

 

Absolutely. Hextall and Berube are just continuations of the kind of that perceived tradition/identity they keep trying to forcefeed their teams year-in and year-out. They were never going to get someone entirely from outside the organization to be the next GM. It was always going to be a Philly veteran.

 

Having said that, and watched Philly all this time, I don't want us to make that same mistake, just for the sake of doing it (just for the sake of hiring a Brodeur or Stevens in an elevated capacity/position). Where we're at now, some fresh eyes from outside the organization may be what we need to turn things around.

 

And the good news is that Lou's still here, so don't be fooled, there will be some mentorship between Lou and Shero that will go on until he fully steps down and that too is a good thing.

[NewarkDevil5]

The reason the Islanders went into the toilet is because Mike Milbury took over and immediately made terrible trades and decisions, and he lasted through multiple owners, somehow.  That would not happen on the Harris/Blitzer watch - these guys are too shrewd to let someone tear apart the organization like Milbury did.  Regardless, it's about the players.  Have a strong organization, absolutely, but you can't do that without good players.  Coaching can only do so much.

 

There were 2 GM's between Torrey and Milbury and the Islanders were already headed for the toilet by the time he got there.