Jump to content

David Conte Out


Derlique
 Share

Recommended Posts

There's only one place Brodeur could be a 'good' GM and that's in New Jersey.  Unless he does a total 180 with the media (or miracles his way into having a dominant team right away + consistently makes good moves), fans in other cities, and quite possibly his players, will tire of his combination of truth telling and excuse making.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you Dave. It's almost a certainty this team would not have been as successful for as long as it was without his input and his decisions.

It's a shame that his recent record, which is nowhere near as bad as people seem to make out , is being used to tarnish an incredible legacy.

One of the best.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There's only one place Brodeur could be a 'good' GM and that's in New Jersey.  Unless he does a total 180 with the media (or miracles his way into having a dominant team right away + consistently makes good moves), fans in other cities, and quite possibly his players, will tire of his combination of truth telling and excuse making.

 

Everyone hates Lou because of his secrecy, then people complain about truth-telling.  Everyone wants an explanation, then call it excuse making.  It's all opinion and personal preference.  I preferred the radio silence.  It let us talk more and it let us avoid other teams to beat us to the punch.

 

Brodeur can still be a great GM because it's first and foremost about team construction.  Where has anyone learned about Brodeur's team construction skills?  Shero has been far too truthful and excuse making for my taste already.  Doesn't mean that he can't be a good GM.

 

I really dislike these arguments now because it doesn't seem like either side can see the other's perspective.  Was Lou on the outs?  Of course, he's 72 or whatever and had bad teams the last two years.  Did changes need to be made?  Of course, we were the 6th worst team in the league.  But on the other side:  should we throw the baby out with the bath water?  Of course not, we had a winning organization and getting rid of the guys (Stevens, Brodeur) that learned before them (Lou, Conte, Lemaire, etc) wholesale isn't the right answer.  Are we building something or tearing things down?  It's pretty obvious that the last bits of the team are being torn away rather than building on what little we have left.

 

I'm torn.  On one hand, I can tell that we need to make some changes but I don't like that these owners took it upon themselves to tear down everything.  Right now, we have the most cap space possible even with Clowe, Ruutu and Zubrus, and signed scrubs rather than anyone of note.  Moore is our biggest signing and he couldn't even get qualified for his RFA contract.  Youth isn't a universal good.  I have a feeling that Shero is doing the "they gave me time so I'll use it" but he's using it by taking the first half of his contract to stockpile "assets" and hoping the second half of his contract to actually try.  He still has a chance to make an NHL team, but so far, he still has an AHL team and I'm still holding out hope that he actually can do something productive today.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yup, gotta give the man props.

 

Was arguably as big a reason of our success as Lou. Brodeur, Elias, Guerin, Shanahan, Rolston, Niedermayer, Sykora, Brylin,Parise, Zajac, Pandolfo were all great finds. Not to mention the UDFA like Madden, Rafalski, Greene and Clarkson that worked out real well.

 

It's tough to draft well when you dont have a lot of firsts and when you do, it's late. Congrats on a great career.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hadn't realized how long the whole scouting staff had been here.  I'm pretty sure they're all going to be gone along with David.  I do think the Devils need people more experienced with the game as it's become after 2005 - not that the changes to hockey have been that large, but the big ones I see are that 1 on 1 skill isn't a very big deal and obviously that physical toughness/goons are falling out of favor.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hadn't realized how long the whole scouting staff had been here.  I'm pretty sure they're all going to be gone along with David.  I do think the Devils need people more experienced with the game as it's become after 2005 - not that the changes to hockey have been that large, but the big ones I see are that 1 on 1 skill isn't a very big deal and obviously that physical toughness/goons are falling out of favor.

 

 

 

Absolute right, Harris is cleaning house after Lou's recent failures. And why shouldn't? Lou delivered, 4 out of 5 misses for making the playoffs. Lou knew there was problems when Stevens quit yet he kept DeBoer, his escape goat. Lou constantly said rebuild was not necessary because if he said anything else it would reflect on him. Lou will leave after this season if not sooner. Harris is being generous keeping Lou as President.

 

Thank you Mr. Harris

Edited by BostonNala370
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On what planet was McMullen not a bullheaded owner?

 

Probably didn't use the write phrasing, but NHL owners that are hands on, and get involved with team personnel and decisions do not have a history of doing well. 

 

Whether Harris is this active going forward is up to question, but according to BostonNalala he is our savior.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Probably didn't use the write phrasing, but NHL owners that are hands on, and get involved with team personnel and decisions do not have a history of doing well. 

 

I don't know why you think our owners are doing anything out of the norm. GMs, scouts, coaches, etc., get fired every year across half the league. 

 

If anything, the Devils keeping their core management together is outside of the norm, and now we're just joining society.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The ghost of George Steinbrenner, one of Lou's close friends, begs to differ.

 

You don't know much about the Yankees.

 

The Yankees became a dynasty when Big Stein was banned from baseball. The core 4 never occurs if he is around. And the Yankees post 2001 decline, if you want to call it that, was largely the result of him. Sheffield over Vlad, is just one instance I can think of.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Probably didn't use the write phrasing, but NHL owners that are hands on, and get involved with team personnel and decisions do not have a history of doing well. 

 

Whether Harris is this active going forward is up to question, but according to BostonNalala he is our savior.

 

Oh you mean like the time when JVB went above Lou's head and signed Kovy to a 17-year and then later to a 15-year contract that cost us a fine, a 3rd round pick, and a 1st rounder that our new owners salvaged into a 30th overall pick?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You don't know much about the Yankees.

 

The Yankees became a dynasty when Big Stein was banned from baseball. The core 4 never occurs if he is around. And the Yankees post 2001 decline, if you want to call it that, was largely the result of him. Sheffield over Vlad, is just one instance I can think of.

 

Your use of hyperbole is terrific.  A meddling owner is an owner who gets involved in the day to day operations of the franchise.  That's not what's going on here at all.  Harris and Blitzer have said it - their job is to hire the people who run the franchise both from the business and hockey ends, and they feel that they've done that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Your use of hyperbole is terrific.  A meddling owner is an owner who gets involved in the day to day operations of the franchise.  That's not what's going on here at all.  Harris and Blitzer have said it - their job is to hire the people who run the franchise both from the business and hockey ends, and they feel that they've done that.

 

I'm happy you appreciate it.

 

Serious question, would you have hired Shero, and do you think he was Lou's hand picked successor?

I never saw him as someone who respects the Penguin organization, and I find it surprising he didn't pluck someone from the Kings or Sharks organization, as  Wilson and Dean are two Lou acolytes.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm happy you appreciate it.

 

Serious question, would you have hired Shero, and do you think he was Lou's hand picked successor?

I never saw him as someone who respects the Penguin organization, and I find it surprising he didn't pluck someone from the Kings or Sharks organization, as  Wilson and Dean are two Lou acolytes.  

 

Personally, I don't think I'd have hired Shero, but the reasoning for his hiring is clear. Shero has been in the league a while, both as an asst GM and as a head GM and knows his way around it. I don't think I would've gone for a neophyte GM (i.e. Marty) regardless of whomever's attachment to the organization. I like the fact that we brought in a GM from outside the organization without any ties to the franchise whatsoever. This team needs a new vision going forward. Lou is 70 something and Conte is up there as well. Neither were going to be in their positions for much longer anyway and its perfectly understandable that a new GM would make changes like this as he takes over. Good GMs don't grow on trees in this league and reaching into the basket and giving someone without a track record a chance wasn't the prudent move IMO right now. I also find it hard to sit here and vilify Shero a couple of months into his tenure, especially when I've agreed with literally every single move he's made so far, from not diving headfirst into the UFA pool or making a dumb trade (yet). Its going to take time to fix the team, just as its going to take time to judge Shero for his job and Lou on his decision.

 

At the very least I'm glad we didn't hire a Dave Nonis or JFJ lol.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm happy you appreciate it.

 

Serious question, would you have hired Shero, and do you think he was Lou's hand picked successor?

I never saw him as someone who respects the Penguin organization, and I find it surprising he didn't pluck someone from the Kings or Sharks organization, as  Wilson and Dean are two Lou acolytes.  

 

Would I have hired Shero?  No.  Do I think he was Lou's hand-picked successor?  Absolutely.  First off, the two men clearly have tons of respect for one another - there's that very weird story of Shero and Lombardi disagreeing on something and saying 'Let's call Lou, he'll decide' and they did and he did and they won't say what it was about (I suspect it's about Aladdin supposedly saying 'Good teenagers take off their clothes', but that's me).  Shero's a US guy and Lou's a US guy.  How many ex-GMs were there sitting around who the Devils could hire?  As I said before this happened, one of the issues the Devils were going to be facing is that they had no real AGMs and seemingly had no plan for what would happen if Lou were fired or stepped aside.  So hiring a guy who had been an AGM to be the GM of the Devils, under Lou, would've been a really, really difficult hire.  They got a guy who's been a GM and who had taken over for a guy who had been there forever and who had won Stanley Cups, so at least he knows that part of the job.  Like Lou, Shero's biggest problem was goaltending, and that's not going to be an issue here for several years.  Do I think Shero is some great innovator?  No, and that's probably going to be an issue, because the Devils are starting from so far behind the 8 ball that it's going to take some real wizardry to get them anywhere near the top in 5-6 years.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Would I have hired Shero? No. Do I think he was Lou's hand-picked successor? Absolutely. First off, the two men clearly have tons of respect for one another - there's that very weird story of Shero and Lombardi disagreeing on something and saying 'Let's call Lou, he'll decide' and they did and he did and they won't say what it was about (I suspect it's about Aladdin supposedly saying 'Good teenagers take off their clothes', but that's me). Shero's a US guy and Lou's a US guy. How many ex-GMs were there sitting around who the Devils could hire? As I said before this happened, one of the issues the Devils were going to be facing is that they had no real AGMs and seemingly had no plan for what would happen if Lou were fired or stepped aside. So hiring a guy who had been an AGM to be the GM of the Devils, under Lou, would've been a really, really difficult hire. They got a guy who's been a GM and who had taken over for a guy who had been there forever and who had won Stanley Cups, so at least he knows that part of the job. Like Lou, Shero's biggest problem was goaltending, and that's not going to be an issue here for several years. Do I think Shero is some great innovator? No, and that's probably going to be an issue, because the Devils are starting from so far behind the 8 ball that it's going to take some real wizardry to get them anywhere near the top in 5-6 years.

I'll say this for Shero, he did make some pretty bold and good trades in Pittsburgh, the Staal and Hossa trades being the ones that come to mind. The problem here is that unless we have a flukey season where the Devils are in the playoff picture at the deadline, he can't trade first round picks, and doesn't have any coveted veterans that other teams would be willing to part with a first round pick or a good prospect for.

I'll also add that while its a year away and most of them should end up with long term deals before July 1, there is an amazing group of players in the last year of their deals, and there won't be many teams that will have the cap space that the Devils have and without having to worry about setting aside huge bucks for players about to finish their ELCs or bridge contracts. He tried to land Parise in Pittsburgh and made a shrewd UFA singing with Martin.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.