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Derek21

A noticeable difference

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If the topic at hand in this thread about Lou and his stubborn ways, is he really being a broken record?

 

If the topic was something that either didn't have to do with Lou or was very remotely Lou-related and SD just did his shtick, then I would agree with you.  However, I think SD's comments are apt in this case and I don't think he is being a broken record.

 

Thanks for being able to see this. Folks here just can't stand it anymore so i really can't say anything without them freaking out. I do understand the situation but it doesn't change anything to the facts. I'm not bashing the guy im just saying things like it is. Im bringing good points but all i get is the "broken record" thing.

 

I'm actually mind blown that it's not more obvious to most people here. I'm not smarter than everyone here, I can't see the future, i never worked in the NHL. But common sense is telling me that if you always go all out and stick to it... it's gonna bite you in the ass eventually. And that's the mentality that killed this team. 

 

and for the love of god guys work with me here, i am NOT trying to troll. I'm putting out these very fair facts out there trying to get a point across so don't jump on me.

 

An "all out" attitude brought all of these "short term fix" decisions:

- not giving up the 29th pick

- not looking into flipping assets if we can't retain a player before the deadline, just blindly going in thinking about the playoffs.

- signing vets to patch hole and make sure to get the job done.

- not giving enough chance to kids cause you're in win mode.

- Trading for Schneider

 

So the results of this is... you get an aging team, with holes to patch all the time. You don't develop your youngsters as much as you should. You lose free agents cause they are put in a situation where they can choose to leave and you can't do anything about it (were not the team who lost the most talent for nothing... Pavelski, Nieds, Gomez, Gionta, Fayne, Clarkson etc etc walked cause Lou let them. I may be a broken record about this... but anyone making excuses for Lou and this approach is in denial. It proved to be flaw based on our track record of talent loss. Then you have to overpay for free agent on the market and thats not better.

 

and not getting extra picks for those return mixed with very bad drafting (that was also never looked into) + moooostly sticking to go for average all around guys that does everything right. Well you get what we have now i guess. Of course drafting is not an easy thing and you never know. He did go out of his way a few times for guys like Tedenby and all. Certainly didnt pan out. But something should have been done at some point seeing we couldnt develop or draft good forward. Our track record is horrifying for forwards.

 

And like you mention, he was denying that the team needed to be faster, younger and needed a rebuild. again its showing how he was not willing to take a step back for the future. I'm not saying im right on everything here, but everything is pointing in the same direction. So even if im wrong about 1 or 2 things... it doesn't change much. 

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Devils are getting the bounces and have great goaltending, Leafs are not and have had poor goaltending.  Let me know where these two teams are after the season's half-over.  I think the Leafs will still be under the Devils but I don't think these two teams are far apart.

 

I don't buy the whole "bounces" thing. We had 5 posts last game. We've been outshooting or at least keeping close with shots on goal each game in a way we haven't seen in years. And as good of a job as he's been doing, Schneider hasn't had to "steal" too many games. His stats are not as dominant as they were most of last season. Our penalty kill isn't even that great. Nothing, outside of Zajac's goals and unreal shooting percentage on the PP, really looks like a fluke. But dare I say it: we're doing just enough, and sometimes considerably more, in all areas of the ice to win every game. And every loss has been CLOSE. 

 

I'm not gonna say we're contenders, or that we're even destined to make the playoffs, but there's not much flukey about this past month and I think they deserve more credit than saying they're getting the bounces.

Edited by DJ Eco

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i guess to put things in perspective... at the end of the day players wants to win, make good money and be happy.

 

depending on the situation one might sacrifice one aspect to get another one. There's plenty of example out there.

 

You see players taking less money to play on a good team. You see players taking more money to play on a worst team with no chance at winning. You see players signing where they probably won't win but they will have top 6 minutes and be more important. You see players asking to be traded eventhough they make good money and that the team is winning, they just don't get along with the coach and they wan't to get out. You see guys willing to take less money just go play home cause it was their dream. etc etc You see jerks who only wants to be traded to NY cause it's NY. it's all about balancing things out. 

 

I mean for a long time NJ was a good destination. We were a winning team, always contenders. So i'm sure then the strict rules we're not that much of a big deal for players cause they were winning. But the more and more the team wasn't doing great, the leverage is going away.

 

It's like any job, if i'd have a job that guarantees that i'm gonna keep that job until retirement. Super well paid. Solid business with deep pockets and the long term plan is established, always trying to get bigger and bigger. Sure if there's strict rules you kind of get over it and even if the big boss is a jerk, you just do your thing and be happy.

 

But if you work at a job that the business is shaky, average paycheck, the owners are old and you have no clue what's gonna happen when they leave, the whole staff is old people that you don't really want to hang out with. Then you're gonna be annoyed that it's so strict but you don't get anything positive out of it and obviously if you have an opportunity to jump ship you'll do it. This is kind of what this team was becoming. No wonder all we could sign was guys with something to prove lol

 

But then you can have a job who doesnt pay well but you're surrounded with bunch of young guys working on a long term plan with promises that your role with grow and grow through the years and you feel free and have fun and are allowed to have fun. You're gonna stick to that job.

Edited by SterioDesign

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I don't buy the whole "bounces" thing. We had 5 posts last game. We've been outshooting or at least keeping close with shots on goal each game in a way we haven't seen in years. And as good of a job as he's been doing, Schneider hasn't had to "steal" too many games. His stats are not as dominant as they were most of last season. Our penalty kill isn't even that great. Nothing, outside of Zajac's goals and unreal shooting percentage on the PP, really looks like a fluke. But dare I say it: we're doing just enough, and sometimes considerably more, in all areas of the ice to win every game. And every loss has been CLOSE. 

 

I'm not gonna say we're contenders, or that we're even destined to make the playoffs, but there's not much flukey about this past month and I think they deserve more credit than saying they're getting the bounces.

 

In a way we haven't seen in years?  We saw it in 2013-14.

 

Either way, NJ is clearly getting the bounces - just look at the OT record, the Devils are 5-0-1 in games decided after regulation.  They're 3-5-0 in games decided in regulation.  Their top players are all on pace for either their best season or their best season in years.  The team is playing well, but they still shouldn't be winning this much.

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I've always said that it's tough to criticize management because it's been their entire life to make these kinds of decisions for 10, 20, 30+ years. If we see something, they see it. I know it isn't a great mentality to have, because if everyone saw it that way, where's the public pressure on teams to succeed? But with DeBoer not playing the young guys enough and Lou giving every open roster spot to over the hill vets, I was starting to wonder what the hell was going on. When Lou would say things like "we're 2 top 6 forwards away". Yea, that's a third of your top 6. Add two true top 6 forwards to any team and chances are you've got a playoff team. But top 6 forwards don't grow on trees. It almost seems like he was referring to Zach and Kovy, almost trying to deflect criticisms. "Well I put a good team together, what am I supposed to do now? If only we had a few top 6 guys".

We don't really know what was going on behind the scenes then or now. It's easy to say restrictive rules made it an unhappy place to be, but with what we knew, were the rules really that big of a problem for guys that they weren't loose and having a good time on the ice? I wouldn't love if I couldn't have a beard, but I'm not sure it'd make me unhappy. Is Henrique that into social media that he comes to the rink with a different glow than he used to? I doubt it. However, we don't know what other rules they might have had for players. Maybe they had stricter than normal curfews on the road, more severe off ice activities restrictions on players, players weren't allowed to go to certain places if they wanted to go out the night before an off day, who knows.

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In a way we haven't seen in years? We saw it in 2013-14.

Either way, NJ is clearly getting the bounces - just look at the OT record, the Devils are 5-0-1 in games decided after regulation. They're 3-5-0 in games decided in regulation. Their top players are all on pace for either their best season or their best season in years. The team is playing well, but they still shouldn't be winning this much.

Will be interesting to see how they do when they aren't playing great teams:

WSH, CHI, SJ, NYR, NSH, VAN and NYIx2. Not to mention they have Chicago, STL and Pitt coming up this week. The schedule is brutal right now

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I don't know. I see the back and forth about Lou but what's different this year is expectation are low for the first time in a while and we have a much younger team that had us looking to the future. If the team ends up over NHL 500 you have to applaud them. As a Mets fan I have seen the argument over what GM actually contributed more to a winning season and it's a fools errand. Every GM inherits a team and personal and it's what they do with it, I think Shero's MO was that he wasn't the one that actually built the Pittsburg teams, who gives a crud. Bottom line is the Devils have gotten off to a hot start, if they are able to withstand a full year and make the playoffs I will be amazed, if only because my expectations were for a terrible year.

 

I plan on enjoying the ride and consider myself to be in fan heaven after a surprise Mets run so the Devils giving me this as well is just Christmas.

Edited by newarkdev01

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I don't know. I see the back and forth about Lou but what's different this year is expectation are low for the first time in a while and we have a much younger team that had us looking to the future. If the team ends up over NHL 500 you have to applaud them. As a Mets fan I have seen the argument over what GM actually contributed more to a winning season and it's a fools errand. Every GM inherits a team and personal and it's what they do with it, I think Shero's MO was that he wasn't the one that actually built the Pittsburg teams, who gives a crud. Bottom line is the Devils have gotten off to a hot start, if they are able to withstand a full year and make the playoffs I will be amazed, if only because my expectations were for a terrible year.

 

I plan on enjoying the ride and consider myself to be in fan heaven after a surprise Mets run so the Devils giving me this as well is just Christmas.

 

 

That's true. But what i'll give credit to Shero for in Pittsburgh is that he made all the "right moves" it didn't pan out sure. All you can do as a GM is give the coach the tools to be successful. He did that very well and managed the team really well. The players didn't get it done, that's not really on him.

 

Shero may or may not be a success here but at the very least he showed that he's willing to make the right move for the team at the right time.

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