New York Mets 2016 Season Thread

['7']

Almost time to DL Harvey. He's really not capable of pitching at this level right now

The offense has been a hideous car wreck too last 15 games or so are gruesome. Duda needs to get going, Walker hasn't done the job as well

Murph's success with David Wright almost totally incapable of playing and us needing a 3b is really angering me.

Edited May 20, 2016 by '7'

[NJDevs4978]

2 hours ago, '7' said:

Almost time to DL Harvey. He's really not capable of pitching at this level right now

The offense has been a hideous car wreck too last 15 games or so are gruesome. Duda needs to get going, Walker hasn't done the job as well

Murph's success with David Wright almost totally incapable of playing and us needing a 3b is really angering me.

At least they have a semi-viable alternative in Walker should David suddenly have to retire after this season.

As far as Harvey...yep it's just a matter of when he goes on the DL at this point and for what, basically he's the Severino for us - if there's no reason to put him on the DL they'll invent one.  Not like they're going to option him to the minors but boy would the tabloids love THAT.

Edited May 20, 2016 by NJDevs4978

['7']

Rubin just tweeted they will look at skipping Harvey his next turn. It may just be fatigue from the inning last year, dead arm type of phase. Shutting him down for a month may do him a lot of good (providing there is no structural damage in their)

This team is coming apart. Granderson...a dropoff was expected but this is a bit too steep for us to manage. Wright fell off a cliff faster then any of us could imagine. Duda's back is bugging him more than I think they're letting on. d'Arnaud is too weak to play the sport....wouldn't shock me if he gets rotator cuff surgery and is shut down for the season soon.

A lot went right last year, and this is the year where everything is going wrong, It's looking like an 82-80 type of year, injury riddled and everybody not named Cespedes taking steps back

Dilson has to be here. This team isn't hitting, but Herrera is murdering the ball in Vegas.

[NJDevs4978]

3 minutes ago, '7' said:

Rubin just tweeted they will look at skipping Harvey his next turn. It may just be fatigue from the inning last year, dead arm type of phase. Shutting him down for a month may do him a lot of good (providing there is no structural damage in their)

This team is coming apart. Granderson...a dropoff was expected but this is a bit too steep for us to manage. Wright fell off a cliff faster then any of us could imagine. Duda's back is bugging him more than I think they're letting on. d'Arnaud is too weak to play the sport....wouldn't shock me if he gets rotator cuff surgery and is shut down for the season soon.

A lot went right last year, and this is the year where everything is going wrong, It's looking like an 82-80 type of year, injury riddled and everybody not named Cespedes taking steps back

Dilson has to be here. This team isn't hitting, but Herrera is murdering the ball in Vegas.

In regards to that maybe that's why they're mysteriously trying to get deAza time at first base.  Which makes no sense otherwise.

The sad part is you're not wrong about anything...the Mets had some question marks coming into the season anyway but even the some of the sure things have now become serious question marks.  Unfortunately the only way Herrera gets here is if Wright goes on the DL too, which may happen soon enough anyway.

Edited May 20, 2016 by NJDevs4978

['7']

2 minutes ago, NJDevs4978 said:

In regards to that maybe that's why they're mysteriously trying to get deAza time at first base.  Which makes no sense otherwise.

The sad part is you're not wrong about anything...the Mets had some question marks coming into the season anyway but even the some of the sure things have now become serious question marks.

And De Aza has been such a disaster. I mean this guy had been a borderline legit starter...and AT WORSE should be a good backup, if not a very good backup. But he's freaking John Mayberry here. And I loved the signing.

Edited May 20, 2016 by '7'

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

I can't go full-panic just yet...the team is right about on pace for the 90 wins or so I predicted...but yeah, there were concerns coming in, and right now the team is showing us all why there were. 

We saw the latest example of how upper-echelon pitching can make the Met offense look completely overmatched.  Though I know Duda will forever get to keep playing with impunity, as he has yet to be held accountable for anything in his Met career, he continues to prove what everyone should know about him by now:  that he's a loser who fattens up on mediocre-to-bad pitching, but quickly gets exposed against good arms and has no business being asked to do anything significant for a contending team.  It's enough with him.  He is what he is, and it's never going to change.   

And at some point, Sandy has to break out of his robo-sabermetric way of thinking and realize that loading up on "power" guys who are all very strikeout prone (because sabes guys don't think Ks are a big deal) is not the way to go...sure, a lineup like that will bully up on lesser pitching staffs and in bandbox ballparks and will go on occasional runs, but we see what happens against good staffs (one-two-three strikes yer out...one-two-three strikes yer out...one-two-three strikes yer out).  32 more Ks against the Nats, and just seven BB drawn.  Even if Sandy can't find players who are killer OB% guys, I'll happily settle for some guys who aren't CONSTANTLY swinging and missing.  You know how many sac flies the Mets have?  THREE!  All but two other NL teams are in double-digits at this point in the season.  Gee Sandy, you think maybe there's something to be said for guys who actually make some fvcking CONTACT?!  Who actually hit for something resembling a batting average...because your teams often can't seem to hit .240, and the same stiffs (here's looking at you, Eric Campbell) seem to keep getting to hang around season after season. 

Anyway, I don't think this team will fall short of 90 wins unless another starting pitcher Harveys his way into a bad season, and right now I don't see it.  Hopefully Sandy finds a way to bring in a bat...I'm all for giving Herrera a shot up here if it gets Wright out of the lineup, but I think people have to not assume that Walker going to third will automatically pay dividends...we have no idea how he'll fare being asked to field 3B everyday. 

11 hours ago, '7' said:

Almost time to DL Harvey. He's really not capable of pitching at this level right now

The offense has been a hideous car wreck too last 15 games or so are gruesome. Duda needs to get going, Walker hasn't done the job as well

Murph's success with David Wright almost totally incapable of playing and us needing a 3b is really angering me.

I get the bolded, but the fact is that you can't really be angry about it.  For starters, if Murph is back here, he's the second baseman...Wright would've gotten just as much opportunity to do what he's done so far...we knew it could definitely go this way, as far as Wright looking like a shell of himself, but he was going to get a lot of games regardless of whether or not a solid option for 3rd existed from within...his contract alone ensured that.  For another, if Murph takes the QO, then Cespedes almost certainly isn't back, meaning you'd have a CF platoon of Lagares and De Aza, which is a pretty scary thought.  Then you'd still have to find a trade partner for Niese, who I don't think the Mets wanted back for 2016 and were willing to move no matter what, meaning they probably would've gotten less back for him (and though he's been up-and-down, Walker has played a solid second base and offensively is about where you'd expect him to be, even with his OB% down at the moment...the problem is he's being measured against Murph's insane Nats sample, and I'm sorry, NO ONE thought Murph would get off to a .397/.429/.636 slash.  If anyone thought that, he gets signed a lot quicker and for considerably more money and term than he got.).  The team needed to get Niese off the team for every reason you could think of (salary, not having a place in rotation for him, etc) and Niese isn't so appealing that a lot of great trade options were going to be available, and under the circumstances Sandy did a good job to bring in a solid vet who's done a pretty good job being Neil Walker, but unfortunately can't be 2016-through-mid May Daniel Murphy.  Yeah, it blows that Murph played well against the Mets in his first series against them.  Argh on that.

Edited May 20, 2016 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

26 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

 

Can never figure out how to get rid of accidental quote boxes.

Anyway, from the Post's Mike Vaccaro (who I've always liked...one of the few writers that I do):

And look, while we’re at it, let’s identify one of the 800-pound elephants in the room: Harvey no longer remotely resembles the lithe, elite athlete he was in 2013. The Mets did him no favors re-broadcasting a Mets-Yankees game from ’13 on SNY on Monday night’s off-night; all you need is a glimpse of what Harvey looked like then, and what he looks like now, to see a stark difference.

“He’s 27 years old,” one member of the organization mused recently. “He’s a professional athlete, who makes his living — and wants to make $200 million — by being an athlete. Does he look like an elite professional athlete to you?”

http://nypost.com/2016/05/20/matt-harvey-learning-how-the-other-half-lives-amid-struggles/

Yeah, I think we've all kind of noticed that he looks a bit doughy...just seems like no one in the media wanted to bring it up. 

Edited May 20, 2016 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[NJDevs4978]

I have no love lost for Harvey and though I don't believe in booing my own players if I was at Citi last night, he would have heard it from me.  I admit for personal reasons...I wouldn't boo deGrom or Thor if they were pitching to a 6 ERA and took the beating of their lives.  I haven't booed the corpse of David Wright and really I hope it never comes to that.  But Harvey being the jack*** he is kind of deserves no sympathy from Met fans.

And the Post or whomever can write about what shape he's in and maybe him liking the nightlife too much is a factor...maybe the innings are a factor...but deep down I can't help but wonder if Harvey shuts the door in the 9th inning of Game 5 are we having this conversation?  For a guy that fancies himself as Derek Jeter, Joe Namath or Mark Messier, that was his moment to feel like he was in the pantheon of that greatness - home crowd going nuts, demanding the ball and he was gonna shut the door and show he was the baddest man on the planet...until that didn't happen.  Maybe having that moment blow up on him affected him more than any of us thought.

Edited May 20, 2016 by NJDevs4978

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

I don't know Has.  I tend to think it's something else with Harvey...that he's never really struggled before and doesn't know how to battle through it.  deGrom seems to have much more fight in him that way.  We've been over it a bunch of times, but yeah, just due to a lot of things that have happened with Harvey over the past 18 months or so, he's not going to get much of a pass from Met fans...and I agree, I think if that deGrom or Syndergaard were in a similar position, Met fans would've shown a lot more patience and not let loose with the boos.  I think the Met faithful very much want to see Harvey recover and pitch well...but I also think he's somewhat now permanently on their sh!t list, for the following perceptions (fairly or unfairly...definitely somewhere in between):

1) He's more into the off-the-field perks and the celebrity aspect of his life than being the very best he can be.

2) It's all about Matt...always has been.

3) He's just biding his time in the blue and orange until he can bolt as a free agent...possibly to the team he grew up rooting for (the Yankees).

4) He doesn't seem to be in the same physical shape he was earlier in his career.

5) His agent is annoying meddlesome d*ck who doesn't know when to shut up.

Only Harvey knows what his deal is, as far as not getting it done last season goes.  If what you suggest is at all true, that the 2015 WS is still affecting him in 2016, then that would really show what some have suspected about Harvey...that he's a lot better pretending to be tough than actually being tough. 

Edited May 20, 2016 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[NJDevs4978]

And right on cue...

Adam Rubin ‏@AdamRubinESPN  50s50 seconds ago

Terry Collins tells reporters at Citi Field that Matt Harvey wants to pitch and will face the Nationals on turn... http://es.pn/1TsmJQF 

[NJDevs4978]

13 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

I don't know Has.  I tend to think it's something else with Harvey...that he's never really struggled before and doesn't know how to battle through it.  deGrom seems to have much more fight in him that way.  We've been over it a bunch of times, but yeah, just due to a lot of things that have happened with Harvey over the past 18 months or so, he's not going to get much of a pass from Met fans...and I agree, I think if that deGrom or Syndergaard were in a similar position, Met fans would've shown a lot more patience and not let loose with the boos.  I think the Met faithful very much want to see Harvey recover and pitch well...but I also think he's somewhat now permanently on their sh!t list, for the following perceptions (fairly or unfairly...definitely somewhere in between):

1) He's more into the off-the-field perks and the celebrity aspect of his life than being the very best he can be.

2) It's all about Matt...always has been.

3) He's just biding his time in the blue and orange until he can bolt as a free agent...possibly to the team he grew up rooting for (the Yankees).

4) He doesn't seem to be in the same physical shape he was earlier in his career.

5) His agent is annoying meddlesome d*ck who doesn't know when to shut up.

Only Harvey knows what his deal is, as far as not getting it done last season goes.  If what you suggest is at all true, that the 2015 WS is still affecting him in 2016, then that would really show what some have suspected about Harvey...that he's a lot better pretending to be tough than actually being tough. 

I think everything's a factor or potential factor really.  I can't dismiss anything.  Game 5 of the World Series, the innings limits, everything you said...all of it could be an issue or maybe it's just mechanical bs.  But it's not just that Harvey failed in the ninth inning of Game 5, it's that he failed after publicly pulling his tough guy routine demanding the ball from Terry and with the crowd roaring for him.  That was gonna be his big 'I'm a star among stars' moment but turned into the emperor has no clothes moment.

Edited May 20, 2016 by NJDevs4978

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

19 minutes ago, NJDevs4978 said:

And right on cue...

Adam Rubin ‏@AdamRubinESPN  50s50 seconds ago

Terry Collins tells reporters at Citi Field that Matt Harvey wants to pitch and will face the Nationals on turn... http://es.pn/1TsmJQF 

Hey Terry...YOU are the manager...YOU can say NO!  You have that power. 

The one and only thing I'll say in Matt's defense in that he definitely hasn't gotten much help from his fielders.  His FIP is 3.66 and his xFIP is 3.88...to be expected, in that guys who give up a lot of home runs and a lot of walks are the ones who see their FIPs dinged (by dinged, meaning that their FIPs and xFIPs will be greater than their ERAs).  Harvey's HR and BB rates are still pretty good and not far out of line with previous seasons.  And his strand rate is pretty low (62.2%), and his BABIP is high (.385).  A pure sabes guy will tell you that some of that stuff is not sustainably bad, and that some positive regression is pretty much inevitable, no matter how bad Harvey looks.  I agree in that I don't think he'll continue to be as bad as he's been in his last two starts.

But though I do look at FIPs and xFIPS and think they definitely have importance, the problem with both of these numbers is that they don't really account for how "hittable" some guys are, and right now Harvey is simply getting hit hard...it's clearly not phenomenally rotten luck or defense that's doing him in, as his FIP and xFIP strongly suggest.  Much of his struggles fall on him. 

Edited May 20, 2016 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Yikes, already down 2-0.  Hope these guys find some fight in themselves.  

[NJDevs4978]

Big-time effort from Matz, Reed and Familia and huge HR from Conforto.  Hopefully this somehow gets them out of their malaise but with a rainout possible tomorrow it might not carry over.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Same ol' crap with the offense...HR or bust...bust at least they made a productive out for a change. 

Yeah, just another terrific start by Matz.  Just completely slammed the door shut and gave the Mets the chance to come back. 

Happy for Conforto...hope that gets him going.  All in all though, for a 23-year-old kid in his first full season in the majors, his offensive numbers overall are solid.  Big question is his fielding...we're starting to see some warts there. 

[Devils Pride 26]

Can't stand Harvey, but like that he wants the ball again. I think he's a big wuss, but hey the easy thing would be to shut it down for a bit. 

[NJDevs4978]

19 minutes ago, Devils Pride 26 said:

Can't stand Harvey, but like that he wants the ball again. I think he's a big wuss, but hey the easy thing would be to shut it down for a bit. 

That's fine but like CR said at SOME point Terry's gotta step in and say no this is what's going to happen.  You would have thought he would have learned a lesson about always deferring to Harvey last October but I could at least understand it then cause he was pitching well.  But sometimes you gotta put your foot down if you're management, especially when he's not pitching well.  Of course they could also be scared of Bora$ too, you know he's capable of being a major pita if the Mets do something with Harvey he doesn't like.

Edited May 21, 2016 by NJDevs4978

[Devils Pride 26]

7 minutes ago, NJDevs4978 said:

That's fine but like CR said at SOME point Terry's gotta step in and say no this is what's going to happen.  You would have thought he would have learned a lesson about always deferring to Harvey last October but I could at least understand it then cause he was pitching well.  But sometimes you gotta put your foot down if you're management, especially when he's not pitching well.  Of course they could also be scared of Bora$ too, you know he's capable of being a major pita if the Mets do something with Harvey he doesn't like.

I don't disagree with anything you're saying. One of the few things Collins has going for him is his reputation as a players manager. Always sides with his players to a fault. Players seem to acknowledge and respond well, though. I can't expect him to change his stripes. But giving Harvey the benefit of the doubt, especially when he's asking for the rock, I have no problems with. If (when) he spits the bit against the Nats I'm sure further action will be taken 

[NJDevs4978]

Well if deGrom's going to pitch like this too then the Mets can forget about catching the Nats, they probably won't even be able to squeeze out the second wild card.

[NJDevs4978]

Thank god for other teams having hideous relievers...Blazek should have been taken out just for walking Plawecki.  Jesus Terry REALLY wanted David to find a way to come through giving him the green light on 3-0 though

Or David really wanted David to find a way to come through since he admitted he wasn't looking for a sign lol

Edited May 21, 2016 by NJDevs4978

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

All things considered, all that matters is that they've won a couple of games.  

Good for Wright...one thing about baseball is that even guys who seem hopeless most of the time occasionally have a moment.  Even Wright's had a few between the strikeout barrages.  

Not that this is breaking news, but the division is going to come down to how the Mets and Nats fare head-to-head.  Nats haven't been lighting it up...after that 10-2 start, they're only 16-15 since.  Not saying they'll go .500 from here on out, but I don't think they're going to run away with this thing at all.  

Edited May 22, 2016 by Colorado Rockies 1976

['7']

Well, no style points but the Mets took care of business sweeping a bad Brewers team. They still can't get the O going at all, and this lineup is pretty much Conforto/Cespedes. Granderson is looking more and more like the modern day Rob Deer...is 30 HR 50 rbi .195 really that far fetched from him? 

Duda may have a disc issue and the Mets are very concerned. If it is in fact that then...I don't know he may very well be done for the season if he goes ahead and has surgery. I doubt we'll see d'Arnaud again.

Dilaon has to be up here, and I realize we don't quite have a place for him but we can't waste hitters right now in AAA. Sure would be nice if Walker could man 3rd and Dilson 2nd for stretches. I'm sure Wright will see the 15 day at some point this summer as well...

no complaints with the pen, and Thor pitched like an ace today

['7']

 

if Duda is out long term one guy I would look at is Mark Reynolds from Colorado, however they would first need to fall out of things themselves. Get back Kelly Johnson as well(and/or Uribe) Reynolds and Johnson can both play 1st and 3rd, Urbe can PH and play 3b.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

I'm definitely not heartbroken about Duda possibly being out of the lineup for a long time...might sound crazy, as you could do a lot worse at first than his at-a-glance stats (and it could very well go that way), but I feel like the Mets were going to have to be forced to start looking at other options for first base...the problem is that Duda had just enough power and (until this season) drew just enough BB that he was never going to be benched...especially since the Mets didn't have any obvious candidates to challenge him. 

Obviously, some of his numbers look pretty good.  OB+SLG of .830 and .838 the past two seasons.  And I do think his numbers would've improved this season.  But I also think he would've been about as crappy overall in a 2016 postseason as he was last postseason, and I think he's just too vulnerable against better arms.  It just feels like it's time to move on from him...the guy doesn't seem like a winner and never really did. 

All that being said, I have no idea where the Mets go for a replacement.  I don't kid myself...as much as I think Duda was very flawed and at times maddeningly so, it's going to be hard to find someone to match his production of 2014-15.  If anything, maybe they find someone who will be more consistent. 

Campbell or Wright playing first for the next several weeks is a pretty frightening prospect for sure. 

Edited May 23, 2016 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Herrera suddenly ice cold in AAA...just 1-for-his-last-17.