What's happened to Severson and Merrill?

[Chimaira_Devil_#9]

I haven't been able to watch nearly the quantity of games that I have previously this year. So just wondering why people think Severson and Merrill have regressed so much? 

Is it Hynes coaching style? We're they never that good in the first place? Is this a long term thing?

[Jerzey]

I don't think it's Hynes' style. They're trying to get Severson to be more involved offensively. I'm hoping with him it's just a sophomore slump but I'm nervous that we just overrated him because of his incredible start to his career (and his juniors). 

As for Merrill I honestly don't know. I think our expectations were just too high.

[Chuck the Duck]

I think you have to separate the 2 a bit.  Severson is still very young and will take more time to develop.  He has all the tools to be a top 4 defenseman in this league and I think he will end up being that when all is said and done. 

Merrill on the other hand is not consistent enough yet and is a bit older than Severson.  There's still time for him, but I think we did overrate him a bit and now it looks like he's going to top out as a 5-6.  I had high hopes for him coming off his rookie season, but he hasn't progressed since then which is concerning.  He shows flashes of being a very good defenseman, but he doesn't do it on a nightly basis which is necessary for coaches to trust you in the NHL.   

[Crisis]

There is still time.  Just from reading the post CR1976 made in the Devs Ducks GDT thread, it took Andy Greene almost 4 seasons to start showing some consistency in his play.  On top of that, this is also everyone's first season under the new Hynes brand of hockey and who are the vets on D showing these guys the ropes?  Just Greene?  Add Zidlicky last season.  

I'll stay optimistic for another season or two.

[RizzMB30]

I agree. They've both obviously taken a step back this season. I don't think they're being mishandled or anything like that. They both need to work hard to get out of the doghouse. Severson's skills are obviously there and I still believe he is something special. For Merril, I'm just not sure, he was a PP quarterback while at Michigan and it just doesn't seem that those skills have translated to the NHL. The question with Merril is do you move him or do you give him a chance to be a bottom 4 guy. I think with the talent in our D pipeline, we can afford to move him, but we should be patient to see if we can get a 2nd or 3rd rounder for him. Very likely he will not garner that value.

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[Devil Dan 56]

I think Severson just needs time. Larsson had the same question marks before he turned the corner. Merrill I'm not sure of but hey... You need bottom pairing guys too, right?

[Devils731]

I'm still generally happy with Severson's play.  He still shows the ability to read plays before they happen and to respond accordingly. My guess is Severson is being benched more for off ice habits than on ice. 

[RizzMB30]

30 minutes ago, Devils731 said:

I'm still generally happy with Severson's play.  He still shows the ability to read plays before they happen and to respond accordingly. My guess is Severson is being benched more for off ice habits than on ice. 

Hmm, that's an interesting point.  It very well could be.  Maybe he was late to practice or the last the d-men to get there on time and we're just not hearing about it.  I'd like to hear more of what you're possibly speculating.  

Maybe he doesn't work hard enough to Hynes' liking in practice.  

[DJ Eco]

4 hours ago, RizzMB30 said:

Hmm, that's an interesting point.  It very well could be.  Maybe he was late to practice or the last the d-men to get there on time and we're just not hearing about it.  I'd like to hear more of what you're possibly speculating.  

Maybe he doesn't work hard enough to Hynes' liking in practice.  

If this is the case, I'm glad we don't know about it. I'd rather those things be kept in the locker room. It's never a good look once a coach is railing on a player about something like that to the media.

[mfitz804]

Severson has not lived up to expectations based on what he did last year.

Merrill just sucks. 

Edited March 16, 2016 by mfitz804

[SterioDesign]

i think everyone just overrated them way too much

[Chimaira_Devil_#9]

14 hours ago, Devils731 said:

I'm still generally happy with Severson's play.  He still shows the ability to read plays before they happen and to respond accordingly. My guess is Severson is being benched more for off ice habits than on ice. 

Any reason you think that he has off ice issues 731? Or is it just intuition? 

When he first made the team I remember thinking he seemed like a real pro.  

I was hoping  with Severson it was just Adam Larsson syndrome, and he just needs time. 

Thinking Merrill is past that point now but you occasionally see moments where you know he has the tools. I don't like the idea of giving up on him yet.

[Devils731]

3 hours ago, Chimaira_Devil_#9 said:

Any reason you think that he has off ice issues 731? Or is it just intuition? 

When he first made the team I remember thinking he seemed like a real pro.  

I was hoping  with Severson it was just Adam Larsson syndrome, and he just needs time. 

Thinking Merrill is past that point now but you occasionally see moments where you know he has the tools. I don't like the idea of giving up on him yet.

The general tone about how Severson just has to be better and do the things to be better.  I don't see a lack of effort on the ice and I don't see his on ice play warranting the repeated scratchings so I think it has to be something other than just game day performance  

Here is an early on article where Severson is bagged for lack of practice effort.

http://fireandice.northjersey.com/mobile/fire-ice-1.174987/severson-pays-price-as-hynes-makes-point-to-devils-about-soft-stick-fouls-1.1415669

I think we know Severson has tons of confidence in himself and maybe Hynes feels Severson needs to work harder on non game days to be the best he can be  

It is all speculation on my part but it's just my guess  

 

[RizzMB30]

17 hours ago, DJ Eco said:

If this is the case, I'm glad we don't know about it. I'd rather those things be kept in the locker room. It's never a good look once a coach is railing on a player about something like that to the media.

I completely agree with the bolded.  One thing we don't always appreciate, no matter our lust for information.  

16 hours ago, mfitz804 said:

Severson has not lived up to expectations based on what he did last year.

Merrill just sucks. 

Merrill might suck, but you/we don't know for a fact that he's done.  If the point about playing time still stands, Merril has been getting playing time over Severson is some cases this year.  I expect Severson to bounce back based on what we know about sophomore slumps.  Merril on the other hand might need some time too ala Larsson.  I won't disagree that Merril is on a short leash next season and might go the way of Gelinas.  

[Jerzey]

Have to wonder if Shero drafts a defender. According to Pens fans he loved drafting PMD's and since Severson is still a question mark at this point I wonder if Shero takes that into consideration. According to what a few on here have said I think there should be a couple of good forwards around where we should be picking so I'm hoping they do that (Jost or Gauthier).

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

15 hours ago, SterioDesign said:

i think everyone just overrated them way too much

I'd say more optimism based on some good early signs, as opposed to outright overrating.  But it's been rough going for them ever since. Greene and Larsson took a while to figure it out, so hopefully that's the case here.  If Gelinas, Merrill, AND Severson all stagnate...man is that going to suck.  

[MantaRay]

It takes a few years for young defensemen to adjust to the NHL level.   They will both be fine in time.

I honestly think our blueline will be the bedrock of the franchise in the next few years.

 

 

 

[lucifer91]

1 hour ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

I'd say more optimism based on some good early signs, as opposed to outright overrating.  But it's been rough going for them ever since. Greene and Larsson took a while to figure it out, so hopefully that's the case here.  If Gelinas, Merrill, AND Severson all stagnate...man is that going to suck.  

Am I missing something?

Edited March 17, 2016 by lucifer91

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

I lumped Gelinas in because he was part of the "new hope".  One out of three is already gone. 

[Daniel]

I'm not ready to give up on Merrill yet.  He's still young, and not that far removed from the AHL and the NCAA where his point totals -- yes, I know it's superficial -- are all in that range which suggest some who will turn into a quality NHL defenseman.  It's one thing if the coaches or people who know the nuts and bolts better than I do see flaws that can't be fixed.  Barring that though, I'd rather take the risk of not getting anything out of him, rather than selling low in the near term (i.e. getting a third round pick for him). 

[SterioDesign]

7 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

I'd say more optimism based on some good early signs, as opposed to outright overrating.  But it's been rough going for them ever since. Greene and Larsson took a while to figure it out, so hopefully that's the case here.  If Gelinas, Merrill, AND Severson all stagnate...man is that going to suck.  

ah well yeah. After what ive seen Severson do in his first season i know he'll be good. he's clearly adjusting or something here.

[Mike Brown]

Merrill was never that good.  Not sure why he's loved so much.

Severson is just a consistency issue.  He'll be fine imo.

[mfitz804]

33 minutes ago, Mike Brown said:

Merrill was never that good.  Not sure why he's loved so much.

This. 

[RizzMB30]

Merrill was never that good.  Not sure why he's loved so much.

Severson is just a consistency issue.  He'll be fine imo.

He was considered stronger than Gelinas defensively and could actually start a breakout. He's obviously regressed. Peter DeBoer says hi. If you remember, DeBoer used Merrill a lot. He was around 21 mins per game last year. He also gets stuck playing on the right side due to having Moore, Gelinas, greene,and schlemko being left handed defensemen. On top of that, he's still 164 games into his career. If you'd like to make the argument that he's a completely developed player, we can discuss that, but I've seen this board scapegoat defenseman after defenseman and they turn out okay. Greene, Larsson weren't always popular or playing all the time in the beginning of their careers.

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[RizzMB30]

Tonight in the Minnesota game, Merrill was okay, and chipped in a secondary assist, which easily could have been a primary. Yes, two very poor penalties that were converted on make it look worse, but it's not like Merrill isn't being held accountable for poor play. On top of that, Merrill shouldn't be blamed for PK going cold.

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