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Vegas on the verge


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Bat  country.    

If their mascot is not a walking slot machine with a jersey on, I will be pissed.  #SlottieForMascot2017

Too bad there's already a team called the Kings.[emoji14]

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2 hours ago, thecoffeecake said:

How long until the first official suggestion from media that they relocate? I give it 5 years until they're another Arizona.

I think the big difference is that their arena has a perfect location instead of out in a former cotton field 45 minute west of the city.  I think Vegas will be a huge success.

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NHL seem to be doing their best to make sure this team will be successful right out of the gate. Obviously that is the key thing for the franchise. They'll be able to get good defense and goaltending + fairly balanced and deep forwards but without the really high end guys. 

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The coyotes used to play in downtown Phoenix. The stars play in a prime location in Dallas. Both of those cities and their metros are bigger than Vegas'. How is Vegas going to be different? Because they're going to flip a magic switch and be engaged with Vegas' business community? If it was that simple, no city would have problems getting people to the games. Vegas will benefit from a longer stay in the novelty phase, but at the end of the day, it's going to be another non traditional transient market that draws bigger crowds of Bruins and kings fans than anything else. I'd rather see Quebec city bring the cap down and have a team in a real hockey town than have to deal with this gimmick. The NHL turns more into the NFL every year.

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7 minutes ago, thecoffeecake said:

The coyotes used to play in downtown Phoenix. The stars play in a prime location in Dallas. Both of those cities and their metros are bigger than Vegas'. How is Vegas going to be different? Because they're going to flip a magic switch and be engaged with Vegas' business community? If it was that simple, no city would have problems getting people to the games. Vegas will benefit from a longer stay in the novelty phase, but at the end of the day, it's going to be another non traditional transient market that draws bigger crowds of Bruins and kings fans than anything else. I'd rather see Quebec city bring the cap down and have a team in a real hockey town than have to deal with this gimmick. The NHL turns more into the NFL every year.

Both the Coyotes and Stars play in crowded sports markets, in that both of their markets have teams for all four major sports.  For the next couple of years at least, a Vegas NHL team will be the only game in town when it comes to pro sports teams.  Even if the Raiders move there, football doesn't cut out a hockey attendance like baseball and basketball do. 

The Vegas ECHL team also gets an average attendance of like 5,000, which indicates that there is some interest in pro hockey there. 

The last thing that will help is the NHL's plan to make the team not terrible from the start.

So count me as one of the people who thinks it's not a crazy idea. 

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38 minutes ago, thecoffeecake said:

The coyotes used to play in downtown Phoenix. The stars play in a prime location in Dallas. Both of those cities and their metros are bigger than Vegas'. How is Vegas going to be different? Because they're going to flip a magic switch and be engaged with Vegas' business community? If it was that simple, no city would have problems getting people to the games. Vegas will benefit from a longer stay in the novelty phase, but at the end of the day, it's going to be another non traditional transient market that draws bigger crowds of Bruins and kings fans than anything else. I'd rather see Quebec city bring the cap down and have a team in a real hockey town than have to deal with this gimmick. The NHL turns more into the NFL every year.

The Coyotes played in a crap arena in downtown Phoenix.  They also have been awful - they've won 2 playoff series in 19 years in Phoenix.  Now that's not saying there should be a team in the Phoenix area, but the franchise relocated way outside the population center and has been terrible.  Florida has the same story.

The Stars were middle of the pack in attendance the last two years; I don't see the problem.  

Anyway, it's already pointed out that Vegas doesn't have a pro team yet, and that even if the NFL moves there, it won't siphon a ton of people off.  I think the team will do just fine for the first few years - after that, it's like just about every other market in the United States besides maybe New York and Philadelphia - win and people show up, lose and they don't.  As it should be.

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The NHL is a regional sport played in a national league.  

 

That's my conclusion after being a fan for 30+ years, and reading all of the discussions for & against.  One can ignore that conclusion at their wallet's peril. 

It is very difficult to sustain crowds/tv viewers unless the team is winning, and this fact is worse in non-traditional (ie not cold region) markets.

 

The NFL Raiders would do well since there's just 8 games + exhibition, and they're all on the weekend.   

41 NHL games ? Good Luck !

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5 hours ago, Triumph said:

The Coyotes played in a crap arena in downtown Phoenix.  They also have been awful - they've won 2 playoff series in 19 years in Phoenix.  Now that's not saying there should be a team in the Phoenix area, but the franchise relocated way outside the population center and has been terrible.  Florida has the same story.

The Stars were middle of the pack in attendance the last two years; I don't see the problem.  

Anyway, it's already pointed out that Vegas doesn't have a pro team yet, and that even if the NFL moves there, it won't siphon a ton of people off.  I think the team will do just fine for the first few years - after that, it's like just about every other market in the United States besides maybe New York and Philadelphia - win and people show up, lose and they don't.  As it should be.

Dallas had one good year attendance wise, and they were the best team in the west and play downtown in one of the biggest markets in hockey. Historically, when they're not a top end team, Dallas draws awful crowds. I definitely see a problem.

NHL Vegas will not be the only show in town. Sure, Dallas and Phoenix compete with 3 or 4 other major pro sports teams, but in terms of access to other entertainment, Vegas is second to none. There are plenty of places to spend entertainment dollars in Vegas that other markets don't contend with.

Dallas (4) and Phoenix (12) are 2 of the biggest metros in the country; Las Vegas is 32.

You can make all the excuses you want for teams in other non-traditional markets, but sticking a team in a shrinking (that's right; Vegas is losing people) transient town in the Sun Belt is a recipe for disaster. All the bells and whistles in the world aren't going to build a real fan base for this team. The NHL wants to be the first to crack the market, and they're NHL ready. If there is an NFL, MLB, and NBA team already in Vegas, the NHL doesn't look twice at it.

Edited by thecoffeecake
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19 minutes ago, thecoffeecake said:

 

NHL Vegas will not be the only show in town. Sure, Dallas and Phoenix compete with 3 or 4 other major pro sports teams, but in terms of access to other entertainment, Vegas is second to none. There are plenty of places to spend entertainment dollars in Vegas that other markets don't contend with.

 

The locals aren't the ones who are spending their dollars to see Celine Dion. That's the tourists. And the ability to see your team while going to Vegas will still make them a pretty good draw. The problem is going to be that there will be a ton of games where the visitors have a sizable crowd on their side.

I can assure you that as long as the scheduling works, I will see the Devils play in Vegas as often as I can.

 

a big key will be how they price tickets. if you can get in for $25, you'll absolutely get the college kids that are out there and the locals.

Edited by sundstrom
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I'm very much on the fence about Vegas, but there is something to be said for growing the game in non-traditional markets. Say what you want, but do you think Auston Matthews ever starts playing hockey without the Coyotes in town? Or Seth Jones without the Avalanche? I doubt that very much. You're not making any new hockey fans if you drop a team in Quebec City, you have the potential to create another 10,000 fans for arguments sake if you drop a team in Las Vegas.

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1 hour ago, thecoffeecake said:

Dallas had one good year attendance wise, and they were the best team in the west and play downtown in one of the biggest markets in hockey. Historically, when they're not a top end team, Dallas draws awful crowds. I definitely see a problem.

NHL Vegas will not be the only show in town. Sure, Dallas and Phoenix compete with 3 or 4 other major pro sports teams, but in terms of access to other entertainment, Vegas is second to none. There are plenty of places to spend entertainment dollars in Vegas that other markets don't contend with.

Dallas (4) and Phoenix (12) are 2 of the biggest metros in the country; Las Vegas is 32.

You can make all the excuses you want for teams in other non-traditional markets, but sticking a team in a shrinking (that's right; Vegas is losing people) transient town in the Sun Belt is a recipe for disaster. All the bells and whistles in the world aren't going to build a real fan base for this team. The NHL wants to be the first to crack the market, and they're NHL ready. If there is an NFL, MLB, and NBA team already in Vegas, the NHL doesn't look twice at it.

Vegas has a ton of other entertainment options but guess what?  They're always there, and they've always been there.   A professional sport is something new.   And this time they're doing it right - it's a privately-financed arena set near the downtown, not some government-financed thing out in Henderson where few will go or care.

What's going to build a fan base for this team is that it's something that's theirs.  Vegas hasn't had a sports team that's been interesting since the days of Jerry Tarkanian.  

If the NFL also goes it will hurt, but I think Vegas will do okay, as long as the team isn't a disaster.  

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1 hour ago, Triumph said:

Vegas has a ton of other entertainment options but guess what?  They're always there, and they've always been there.   A professional sport is something new.   And this time they're doing it right - it's a privately-financed arena set near the downtown, not some government-financed thing out in Henderson where few will go or care.

What's going to build a fan base for this team is that it's something that's theirs.  Vegas hasn't had a sports team that's been interesting since the days of Jerry Tarkanian.  

If the NFL also goes it will hurt, but I think Vegas will do okay, as long as the team isn't a disaster.  

Vegas Casinos will carry the team for a very long time... I presume the Las Vegas marketing sales packages won't target Nevadans, but the other 49 states. all of Canada and Europeans on those Hockey/Casino/Entertainment packages. Maybe the Asian marketing will pickup by advertising hockey Fights and their lust for gambling... on hockey too.

I'll wait to watch for the controversy over Las Vegas casinos owning the entire lower bowl, half the upper bowl, and all the suites, while the locals have their choice of nose bleed seats. Well, it's a business expense, so party on I presume, especially after the club paying that $500 million entrance fee.

 

Just hope the team doesn't embed LED tivoli lighting into their uniforms, lol

 

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4 hours ago, sundstrom said:

The locals aren't the ones who are spending their dollars to see Celine Dion. That's the tourists. And the ability to see your team while going to Vegas will still make them a pretty good draw. The problem is going to be that there will be a ton of games where the visitors have a sizable crowd on their side.

I can assure you that as long as the scheduling works, I will see the Devils play in Vegas as often as I can.

 

a big key will be how they price tickets. if you can get in for $25, you'll absolutely get the college kids that are out there and the locals.

What exactly makes you think locals aren't spending their entertainment dollars on things tourists do in Vegas? They do, I promise. I grew up not far from Atlantic City, and I've spent a lot of entertainment dollars there on all kinds of things.

Why do we want a market in the NHL whose success is reliant on away crowds? Why don't we want to be building another real hockey city with a real fan base?

 

3 hours ago, CommonDreads said:

I'm very much on the fence about Vegas, but there is something to be said for growing the game in non-traditional markets. Say what you want, but do you think Auston Matthews ever starts playing hockey without the Coyotes in town? Or Seth Jones without the Avalanche? I doubt that very much. You're not making any new hockey fans if you drop a team in Quebec City, you have the potential to create another 10,000 fans for arguments sake if you drop a team in Las Vegas.

I honestly don't care about pandering to people in a non traditional market to make new fans. I'd rather the NHL be represented by genuine hockey cities first, and worry about expanding hockey's footprint later. Teams 31 and 32 are going to grow league revenue (at least in the short term) regardless of whether or not the fans consuming the product are new to the sport.

3 hours ago, Triumph said:

Vegas has a ton of other entertainment options but guess what?  They're always there, and they've always been there.   A professional sport is something new.   And this time they're doing it right - it's a privately-financed arena set near the downtown, not some government-financed thing out in Henderson where few will go or care.

What's going to build a fan base for this team is that it's something that's theirs.  Vegas hasn't had a sports team that's been interesting since the days of Jerry Tarkanian.  

If the NFL also goes it will hurt, but I think Vegas will do okay, as long as the team isn't a disaster.  

You've successfully described novelty, thanks. That's what I said was going to propel this team for the first handful of years. Vegas just isn't big enough to justify this kind of gamble in my opinion. I think it crashes and burns as quick as any non traditional market experiment has.

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16 minutes ago, Satans Hockey said:

Reports coming out now that this is basically confirmed. I've been wanting to go to Vegas but might as well wait until the Devils play out there now. I'm excited about it. 

Same - I'm definitely going to make the trip out.

Convincing people to come with me is going to be the challenge.

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2 hours ago, Devilsfan118 said:

Same - I'm definitely going to make the trip out.

Convincing people to come with me is going to be the challenge.

Make it vacation and here's the info on the arena, events, and hockey seat pricing (what's left):

http://www.t-mobilearena.com/premium-seating

http://www.t-mobilearena.com/

https://www.vegaswantshockey.com/BuyTickets

Edited by HOLLYWOOD
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I would have rather seen Quebec get a team, but a big sheet of ice in the desert will definitely be an attraction.

Will they be called the Las Vegas Aces I wonder? A black and red jersey with a spade on the front? 

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Reports coming out now that this is basically confirmed. I've been wanting to go to Vegas but might as well wait until the Devils play out there now. I'm excited about it. 

Same - I'm definitely going to make the trip out.

Convincing people to come with me is going to be the challenge.

Do I sense an NJDevs board trip to Vegas? [emoji3][emoji106]

I would have rather seen Quebec get a team, but a big sheet of ice in the desert will definitely be an attraction.

Will they be called the Las Vegas Aces I wonder? A black and red jersey with a spade on the front? 

I heard it was gonna be the Las Vegas Black Knights....

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