GDT: Game 21 - Devils @ Pitt 7PM, MSG+

[Steven M.]

7 hours ago, njd3b1ink said:

Yeah Hynes is the real deal. Not sure how anyone can deny that with what he's done with the roster last season and so far this season. 

Better yet: beyond me how anyone can determine that he ISN'T the real deal after one season with that absolute garbo roster last year (which he got every last ounce out of) and only a quarter of this season gone by. Not to mention as previously stated, the roster still has plenty of holes... it's still a rebuild after all.

You can't really say for certain whether he is going to get us to the Cup or whether he is not very good at this stage. You have to be patient and give things time to develop, not be idiots like management in Florida. What a short sighted move it was to can their coach already.

[EdgeControl]

hynes is trading defense for offense now. gotta take the bad with the good... so far Im happy with the results..  although that last sec goal hurt..

[DevsMan84]

12 hours ago, Triumph said:

Haha, okay.   Hynes changed things around massively this summer and has this team playing a game much more suited to their talents.  This team still has gigantic holes on it.  And yet they're 10-6-5 and in a playoff spot right now.  

I guess you guys should get used to complaining about Hynes because I think he will be around for a while.

I think he will be around for a while.  He will be around for at least through next year when the Devils struggle to get to the playoffs.  They will probably keep him when they make the playoffs but be one and done.  However, I have a feeling he will not be our coach when we become serious cup contenders a few years down the line.

I will gladly eat my words if he is still our coach the next time this team wins the cup, but I do not think that will happen.

[Triumph]

41 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

I think he will be around for a while.  He will be around for at least through next year when the Devils struggle to get to the playoffs.  They will probably keep him when they make the playoffs but be one and done.  However, I have a feeling he will not be our coach when we become serious cup contenders a few years down the line.

I will gladly eat my words if he is still our coach the next time this team wins the cup, but I do not think that will happen.

Haha okay.  You do realize that the Devils aren't ordained to win the Cup in the next ten years, right?  I'll be surprised if he's the Devils coach the next time they win the Stanley Cup too, because winning Stanley Cups is really hard and for any given coach to do it is even more difficult.

[DevsMan84]

14 minutes ago, Triumph said:

Haha okay.  You do realize that the Devils aren't ordained to win the Cup in the next ten years, right?  I'll be surprised if he's the Devils coach the next time they win the Stanley Cup too, because winning Stanley Cups is really hard and for any given coach to do it is even more difficult.

I know they are not ordained, but this coach won't take us to the next level either.  He is good for this current crop of kids and that's about it.  That's why I said we will never win anything of significance with him, which it looks like you agree with me.

[Triumph]

55 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

I know they are not ordained, but this coach won't take us to the next level either.  He is good for this current crop of kids and that's about it.  That's why I said we will never win anything of significance with him, which it looks like you agree with me.

lol, no.  I don't agree at all.  You should try to figure out better when someone agrees with you.  

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

On ‎11‎/‎26‎/‎2016 at 10:18 PM, DevsMan84 said:

Morons in our fanbase got their wish with JJ being scratched and this is what happens.

Hynes seems nice and all, but hard to think of him as a coach that will get this team to win big down the line when he makes decisions like putting zajac in the shootout over other available options.

He's about 1 1/4 years into his NHL coaching tenure...sure, you can have disasters that become very obvious disasters very quickly (John MacLean), but Hynes has squeezed more points out of his teams than what should have been expected since he's gotten the job.  I'm with Has in that I don't think Hynes had that many way more enticing options available in the shootout, really...if anything, who was expecting KK to stop Malkin and Crosby?  It was kind of a surprise that Zajac's attempt wound up having as much meaning as it did. 

Anyway, I think Hynes has done a solid job, considering what he's had to work with...the Devils have definitely gotten some good fortune over his tenure, as far as results go, but on the other side, losing Cam for so many games last season and losing Hall this season have hurt...you can make the argument that both players often miss games, so maybe that should be expected.  But I don't think it's fair to make any declarations about what kind of a coach he will be long-term this early.  And Tri nailed it when he said that this is a team full of holes (and I'll add that it's not well-equipped to lose too many bodies to injury).  10-6-5 feels like an overachieve to me.   

Some are criticizing Cory...if one chooses to go strictly by save%, November has been brutal for him (.892); that being said, how many truly bad months has he had since coming here?  Sometimes really good players just go through really bad stretches, and this guy has had to deal with a lot of crap in front of him as Devil...he's stolen his fair share of points (and been a hard-luck loser in a number of others).  I'm willing to give him a pass for this month...even terrific players can go through an extended funk.  I'm not worried about him.  But it goes without saying that he needs to pull out of this slump, because the Devils are a team that needs top-level goaltending most nights.  This team CAN challenge for a playoff berth, but not unless most of the team is playing near the top of their individual games. 

It will also be nice when the Devils FINALLY get past this part of their schedule.  17 road games out of 23 games total is brutal...that's the stretch that started on 11/3, and the Devils have managed to go a respectable 6-4-3 so far.  If they finish it up 11-9-3 or something like that...can we really get on them that much?  If someone had told you that Hall and Cam would each miss a chunk of games, and Cory would turn in a shaky November, would you have thought that flirting with 25 points or so in those 23 games was really possible?    

[mfitz804]

2 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

He's about 1 1/4 years into his NHL coaching tenure...sure, you can have disasters that become very obvious disasters very quickly (John MacLean), but Hynes has squeezed more points out of his teams than what should have been expected since he's gotten the job.  I'm with Has in that I don't think Hynes had that many way more enticing options available in the shootout, really...if anything, who was expecting KK to stop Malkin and Crosby?  It was kind of a surprise that Zajac's attempt wound up having as much meaning as it did. 

 

Did anyone else catch Dano throwing it to Johnny Mac during the last game, kind of like "You were a coach, what do you think"?  J Mac looked pissed that he brought it up. 

[Jimmy Leeds]

Maybe someone said this but Crosby's goal to tie the game reminded me of Henrique's in '12

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

1 minute ago, mfitz804 said:

Did anyone else catch Dano throwing it to Johnny Mac during the last game, kind of like "You were a coach, what do you think"?  J Mac looked pissed that he brought it up. 

Missed that during a pee break.  That has to bring back brutally painful memories for Johnny Mac...you wait all that time to become a head coach, work your way up, and then it's SUCH a disaster that there's pretty much no way that you'll ever get another shot.  I really felt for him...I loved the guy as a player.  I remember when he was on the air not long before he was traded to San Jose, when he was on in pre-game and announced that he had asked Lou for a trade (mostly because he didn't like his new role).  Really bummed me out at the time. 

[DevsMan84]

2 hours ago, Triumph said:

lol, no.  I don't agree at all.  You should try to figure out better when someone agrees with you.  

"I'll be surprised if he's the Devils coach the next time they win the Stanley Cup too"

Your words and while we have different views on how it will end up there, but it seems like we agree he will not be the coach if and when the Devils win another cup.

Also, next time before talking down to me Sheldon Cooper, if you think I am twisting words just remember I have only learned from the best after reading some of your responses over the years.

[DevsMan84]

2 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

He's about 1 1/4 years into his NHL coaching tenure...sure, you can have disasters that become very obvious disasters very quickly (John MacLean), but Hynes has squeezed more points out of his teams than what should have been expected since he's gotten the job.  I'm with Has in that I don't think Hynes had that many way more enticing options available in the shootout, really...if anything, who was expecting KK to stop Malkin and Crosby?  It was kind of a surprise that Zajac's attempt wound up having as much meaning as it did. 

Anyway, I think Hynes has done a solid job, considering what he's had to work with...the Devils have definitely gotten some good fortune over his tenure, as far as results go, but on the other side, losing Cam for so many games last season and losing Hall this season have hurt...you can make the argument that both players often miss games, so maybe that should be expected.  But I don't think it's fair to make any declarations about what kind of a coach he will be long-term this early.  And Tri nailed it when he said that this is a team full of holes (and I'll add that it's not well-equipped to lose too many bodies to injury).  10-6-5 feels like an overachieve to me.   

Some are criticizing Cory...if one chooses to go strictly by save%, November has been brutal for him (.892); that being said, how many truly bad months has he had since coming here?  Sometimes really good players just go through really bad stretches, and this guy has had to deal with a lot of crap in front of him as Devil...he's stolen his fair share of points (and been a hard-luck loser in a number of others).  I'm willing to give him a pass for this month...even terrific players can go through an extended funk.  I'm not worried about him.  But it goes without saying that he needs to pull out of this slump, because the Devils are a team that needs top-level goaltending most nights.  This team CAN challenge for a playoff berth, but not unless most of the team is playing near the top of their individual games. 

It will also be nice when the Devils FINALLY get past this part of their schedule.  17 road games out of 23 games total is brutal...that's the stretch that started on 11/3, and the Devils have managed to go a respectable 6-4-3 so far.  If they finish it up 11-9-3 or something like that...can we really get on them that much?  If someone had told you that Hall and Cam would each miss a chunk of games, and Cory would turn in a shaky November, would you have thought that flirting with 25 points or so in those 23 games was really possible?    

I responded earlier saying that I think Greene, Severson, Auvitu and Palmieri probably would have been better than stone hands Zajac (and this is coming from a guy who likes Zajac).

Hynes has done a good job so far IMO and completely aware that the team as-is will not win anything simply because we are in the midst of a rebuild.  With that said, while I agree with the team so far overachieving, I still do not have that feeling Hynes will take them to the next level.  He is a coach that seems to be good with kids and getting them into good habits, but down the road with some of the decisions he has made over these past 100 or so games as coach unless he changes a few things he will have a tough time taking them to the next level.  I could end up with my foot in my mouth in a few years down the line, but am I not allowed to have some worries and opinions about the long-term future of the team?  I am not exactly out here saying Hynes sucks ass and should be fired ASAP.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Just now, DevsMan84 said:

I responded earlier saying that I think Greene, Severson, Auvitu and Palmieri probably would have been better than stone hands Zajac (and this is coming from a guy who likes Zajac).

Hynes has done a good job so far IMO and completely aware that the team as-is will not win anything simply because we are in the midst of a rebuild.  With that said, while I agree with the team so far overachieving, I still do not have that feeling Hynes will take them to the next level.  He is a coach that seems to be good with kids and getting them into good habits, but down the road with some of the decisions he has made over these past 100 or so games as coach unless he changes a few things he will have a tough time taking them to the next level.  I could end up with my foot in my mouth in a few years down the line, but am I not allowed to have some worries and opinions about the long-term future of the team?  I am not exactly out here saying Hynes sucks ass and should be fired ASAP.

Not sure if those four would be that much better than Zajac.  After Pap Smear and JJ, it feels pretty crapshoot-ish with this group.

I'm more saying that it's probably too early to worry about what kind of coach Hynes will be long-term, or even to look for tendencies.  He's learning too...much like the team, he's a work-in-progress.  If nothing else, the past few seasons have taught me to be patient with this bunch.  It's still ragged at times, but at least it looks like things are headed the right way.   

[Triumph]

22 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

"I'll be surprised if he's the Devils coach the next time they win the Stanley Cup too"

Your words and while we have different views on how it will end up there, but it seems like we agree he will not be the coach if and when the Devils win another cup.

Also, next time before talking down to me Sheldon Cooper, if you think I am twisting words just remember I have only learned from the best after reading some of your responses over the years.

Because your logic is awful.  I concluded he won't be the coach when the Devils win the Cup because winning the Cup is really unlikely for anyone to do, much less the coach of this particular organization - an organization that is on the right track but is nowhere near a Stanley Cup at present.  You concluded he won't be here for a Devils Cup because he is 'not the right coach' for reasons you've ginned up after seeing the guy coach for 100 games, 82 of which were with an awful team that was somehow dragged to 11th worst in the NHL.  That the problem will be him and not the fact that the Devils are still staring down a large talent deficit which no coach is likely to breach.  An enormous percentage of coaches get fired before winning Stanley Cups with a particular team.  Don't try a slippery slope argument where 'the next level' is now defined as 'winning a Stanley Cup'.  If this team wins a playoff round in the next 3 years I'll take that as a win considering where they started out in April 2015.

I will always talk down to anyone who tries the rhetorical trick you just did.  If you sincerely believed we were in agreement, you do not know how to read and decipher an argument - you have nearly 10,000 posts here, so it'd be strange if you couldn't follow the logic.

[DevsMan84]

1 minute ago, Triumph said:

Because your logic is awful.  I concluded he won't be the coach when the Devils win the Cup because winning the Cup is really unlikely for anyone to do, much less the coach of this particular organization - an organization that is on the right track but is nowhere near a Stanley Cup at present.  You concluded he won't be here for a Devils Cup because he is 'not the right coach' for reasons you've ginned up after seeing the guy coach for 100 games, 82 of which were with an awful team that was somehow dragged to 11th worst in the NHL.  That the problem will be him and not the fact that the Devils are still staring down a large talent deficit which no coach is likely to breach.  An enormous percentage of coaches get fired before winning Stanley Cups with a particular team.  Don't try a slippery slope argument where 'the next level' is now defined as 'winning a Stanley Cup'.  If this team wins a playoff round in the next 3 years I'll take that as a win considering where they started out in April 2015.

I will always talk down to anyone who tries the rhetorical trick you just did.  If you sincerely believed we were in agreement, you do not know how to read and decipher an argument - you have nearly 10,000 posts here, so it'd be strange if you couldn't follow the logic.

Where did I say the Devils will be considered cup contenders in a finite period of time?  Best I put is "a few years down the line."  Somehow you interpreted that as in 2-3 years which even I would say is not too realistic.  However, I will say with how the league operates these days teams can go from a dumpster fire to a contender in a few years, but again I understand there are variables.  You make it seem like the Devils will take another 1-2 decades which I acknowledge is an assumption on my part.

Regarding bolded: This part I find hilarious.  This is very much the pot calling the kettle black.  You are right in that I have nearly 10,000 posts on here so I know enough about how you operate to be confident in my statement.

[Triumph]

5 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

Where did I say the Devils will be considered cup contenders in a finite period of time?  Best I put is "a few years down the line."  Somehow you interpreted that as in 2-3 years which even I would say is not too realistic.  However, I will say with how the league operates these days teams can go from a dumpster fire to a contender in a few years, but again I understand there are variables.  You make it seem like the Devils will take another 1-2 decades which I acknowledge is an assumption on my part.

Regarding bolded: This part I find hilarious.  This is very much the pot calling the kettle black.  You are right in that I have nearly 10,000 posts on here so I know enough about how you operate to be confident in my statement.

I'm saying there are no guarantees at all, especially with where the Devils are now.  They have the goalie and Taylor Hall is a top-line forward.  But there is absolutely no guarantee that this team is even on a Cup contending trajectory.  

You were the first person to mention the Stanley Cup.  You said " I will gladly eat my words if he is still our coach the next time this team wins the cup, but I do not think that will happen."   And I remarked that this is stupid because how many coaches will win the Stanley Cup with their current team?  3?  4?  Maybe?  It's a low number, and most of the guys who will win the Cup with their current team are right now coaching a Cup contender.  So making that the basis of 'eating your words' is silly.  You've somehow divined that Hynes is not the right coach to get this team to the next level from the wind, and now you're hooked to that position.

Coaches get fired all the time and while Hynes probably has a longer leash than most, he will probably be fired in the next 3 years.  It won't make him a bad coach or not the coach to get the team to the next level.

 

[mfitz804]

4 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Not sure if those four would be that much better than Zajac.  After Pap Smear and JJ, it feels pretty crapshoot-ish with this group.

I'm more saying that it's probably too early to worry about what kind of coach Hynes will be long-term, or even to look for tendencies.  He's learning too...much like the team, he's a work-in-progress.  If nothing else, the past few seasons have taught me to be patient with this bunch.  It's still ragged at times, but at least it looks like things are headed the right way.   

"Well, you can't get any worse".