2017-2018 Out of Town Thread

[Antiquated Colorado Rockie]

Islanders lose

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

7 hours ago, Antiquated Colorado Rockie said:

Islanders lose

I gotta admit, I definitely don't think the Isles nor Carolina have what it takes to threaten the Devils...either team might draw a little closer to them temporarily (say within 6 points, max), but never enough to truly start fearing either one...neither is showing the ability to go on that 8-2-0 kind of burst that might make them a little interesting...in Carolina's case, they had their chance to climb up at the Devils' expense, but only came away with one point in two games...and the Isles just lost another game to the Devils (Devs are 2-0-1 against the Isles this year).  We've been over Columbus...if making the playoffs is our chief concern, then who cares whether or not they finish ahead of the Devils?  As long as the Devils don't fall off a cliff, the only team to really keep an eye on that could somehow overtake them in the WC standings is the Panthers (due to the three games in hand)...and even then, a regulation win against them tonight would really make it hard for the Panthers to finish ahead of the Devils...even with three games in hand, 12 points is a lot to overcome.  The team at this point that should be a lot more worried about their WC chances is the Blue Jackets...not saying that the Devils have anything sewn up, but they're clearly in much better position than the teams behind them. 

[SterioDesign]

well i guess we better lower our expectations when it comes to Hall and the Hart.

Cause of course these awards almost never make sense and there's never much thought put into the votings

https://www.nhl.com/news/kucherov-bergeron-and-malkin-leading-race-for-hart-trophy/c-296470080?tid=277729400

 

[Devilsfan118]

Nikita Kucherov, Lightning, 77 points (13 first-place votes);

Patrice Bergeron, Boston Bruins, 29 (two first-place votes);

Evgeni Malkin, Pittsburgh Penguins, 27 (two first-place votes); 

Blake Wheeler, Winnipeg Jets, 27; 

Taylor Hall, New Jersey Devils, 25 (one first-place vote);

I mean, he's climbed from probably not even in the conversation to 5th over the last few months.

If he finishes strong, who knows what could happen.

It'll be Kucherov, though, because he's a more marketable player on a more marketable team.

[MadDog2020]

well i guess we better lower our expectations when it comes to Hall and the Hart.
Cause of course these awards almost never make sense and there's never much thought put into the votings
https://www.nhl.com/news/kucherov-bergeron-and-malkin-leading-race-for-hart-trophy/c-296470080?tid=277729400
 

What a joke. Safe to say all three of those teams can survive just fine without those guys. Us without Hall? Not so much.


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[MadDog2020]

Nikita Kucherov, Lightning, 77 points (13 first-place votes);

Patrice Bergeron, Boston Bruins, 29 (two first-place votes);

Evgeni Malkin, Pittsburgh Penguins, 27 (two first-place votes); 

Blake Wheeler, Winnipeg Jets, 27; 

Taylor Hall, New Jersey Devils, 25 (one first-place vote);

I mean, he's climbed from probably not even in the conversation to 5th over the last few months.

If he finishes strong, who knows what could happen.

It'll be Kucherov, though, because he's a more marketable player on a more marketable team.

A Russian on a small market team is more marketable than a Canadian playing in the biggest media market in the country? I know the Devils aren't a franchise the league loves to suck off like Tampa, Pittsburgh, and Boston, but the point stands.

 

 

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[Devilsfan118]

9 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

A Russian on a small market team is more marketable than a Canadian playing in the biggest media market in the country? I know the Devils aren't a franchise the league loves to suck off like Tampa, Pittsburgh, and Boston, but the point stands.

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I don't disagree - we SHOULD in theory be a sweetheart to the league being part of this media market.  And Hall should be the talk of the town right now with what he's doing, but, outside of an occasional article/tweet by the NHL, it doesn't seem like he's getting much acknowledgement.  I mean if Auston Matthews was on this streak, it's all you'd be fvcking hearing about 24/7.

Kucherov is having an outstanding season statistically though.  But I wonder how many points Hall would have if you stuck him on a line with Point and Stamkos...

Edited March 1, 2018 by Devilsfan118

[NJDevils1214]

1 minute ago, Devilsfan118 said:

I don't disagree - we SHOULD in theory be a sweetheart to the league being part of this media market.  And Hall should be the talk of the town right now with what he's doing, but, outside of an occasional article/tweet by the NHL, it doesn't seem like he's getting much acknowledgement.  I mean if Auston Matthews was on this streak, it's all you'd be fvcking hearing about 24/7.

Kucherov is having an outstanding season statistically though.  But I wonder how many points Hall would have if you stuck him on a line with Point and Stamkos...

That is what sets Hall apart for me. He is pretty much doing it on his own. All those other guys have other all-star caliber players on their team to share burden with. When Taylor Hall couldn't make the all-star game NJ didn't know who to send in his place. Brian Boyle made sense for more reasons outside of hockey.

[MadDog2020]

I don't disagree - we SHOULD in theory be a sweetheart to the league being part of this media market.  And Hall should be the talk of the town right now with what he's doing, but, outside of an occasional article/tweet by the NHL, it doesn't seem like he's getting much acknowledgement.  I mean if Auston Matthews was on this streak, it's all you'd be fvcking hearing about 24/7.
Kucherov is having an outstanding season statistically though.  But I wonder how many points Hall would have if you stuck him on a line with Point and Stamkos...

It's just a general lack of respect for the Devils. Nothing new. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't sick of it, but it's par for the course for a league that has 31 teams, but pretends it only has 10. And while Kucherov, Malkin, and Bergeron are all outstanding hockey players who deserve all the accolades they get, an argument cannot be made that their teams wouldn't survive an extended stretch without them- Tampa and Pittsburgh are as deep as it gets, and Boston is no slouch. Without Taylor Hall, we're talking draft lottery this morning, not playoffs. That's the definition of an MVP. But hey, 'marketing'- right NHL? [emoji849]


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[Devilsfan118]

19 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

That is what sets Hall apart for me. He is pretty much doing it on his own. All those other guys have other all-star caliber players on their team to share burden with. When Taylor Hall couldn't make the all-star game NJ didn't know who to send in his place. Brian Boyle made sense for more reasons outside of hockey.

Totally agree with you 100%.

I mean, what's more impressive of the following when looking at both Kucherov and Hall:

Tampa:

1. Kucherov - 63 GP, 33 G, 49 A, 82 P, +15, 1.3 PPG

2. Stamkos - 64 GP, 24 G, 47 A, 71 P,  +20,  1.1 PPG

3. Point - G4 GP, 25 G, 29 A, 54 P, +17,  .84 PPG

New Jersey:

1. Hall - 58GP, 27 G, 41 A, 68 P, +12, 1.17 PPG

2. Hischier - 63 GP, 13 G, 28 A, 41P, +7, .65 PPG

3. Bratt - 63 GP, 12 G, 21 A, 33 P, -12,  .51 PPG

I mean for fvcks sake, Hall is pretty much carrying this team on his back.  You take Kucherov off of Tampa, and they probably still have a pretty damn good team.  You take Hall off the Devils, and we're probably back in the basement (or at least, well out of the playoff discussion).

In my mind, this clearly makes Hall the MVP (read: MOST VALUABLE PLAYER). His value to the Devils can't be understated.  It shouldn't just be about point totals - we have another trophy for that, don't we?

Edited March 1, 2018 by Devilsfan118

[MadDog2020]

Totally agree with you 100%.
I mean, what's more impressive of the following when looking at both Kucherov and Hall:
Tampa:
1. Kucherov - 63 GP, 33 G, 49 A, 82 P, +15, 1.3 PPG
2. Stamkos - 64 GP, 24 G, 47 A, 71 P,  +20,  1.1 PPG
3. Point - G4 GP, 25 G, 29 A, 54 P, +17,  .84 PPG
New Jersey:
1. Hall - 58GP, 27 G, 41 A, 68 P, +12, 1.17 PPG
2. Hischier - 63 GP, 13 G, 28 A, 41P, +7, .65 PPG
3. Bratt - 63 GP, 12 G, 21 A, 33 P, -12,  .51 PPG
I mean for fvcks sake, Hall is pretty much carrying this team on his back.  You take Kucherov off of Tampa, and they probably still have a pretty damn good team.  You take Hall off the Devils, and we're probably back in the basement (or at least, well out of the playoff discussion).
In my mind, this clearly makes Hall the MVP (read: MOST VALUABLE PLAYER). His value to the Devils can't be understated.  It shouldn't just be about point totals - we have another trophy for that, don't we?

This where the Devils as an organization need to step up and stump for Hall. Social media, billboards, whatever- but they need to push for him.


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[NJDevils1214]

46 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

This where the Devils as an organization need to step up and stump for Hall. Social media, billboards, whatever- but they need to push for him.


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I'd like for this to happen, but I'd also like our management team to make a bigger deal when Marchand puts an elbow into player's heads. I don't think they are outspoken enough. 

[mfitz804]

Kucherov could end up outscoring Hall by 20+ points, he's the top scorer in the league, and he plays on the top team in the standings and they will likely play for and/or win the Cup. 

As much as I would like it if they would consider the best guy on a borderline playoff team over a guy like that, and that clearly Hall is "most valuable" more so than Kucherov, the realist in me tells me its not going to happen. 

[jagknife]

As if right on cue, this is the headline article on TSN right now:

https://www.tsn.ca/devils-backing-hall-for-hart-as-he-nears-the-30-goal-mark-1.1014619

 

Edited March 1, 2018 by jagknife

[Muevelos]

Tampa could survive with Kuch, but he isn't a joke. He makes Stamkos and Point better players. 

Not sure Boston would fair to well without Bergeron though, he's their heart and soul IMO. 

Wheeler shouldn't be up there

 

Malkin is having an amazing year, for once we barely hear about Sid. Thank god.

 

I doubt Hall gets it but the recognition is good.

[Muevelos]

3 minutes ago, Martyisth3b3st said:

Don't think a single person is calling Kucherov a joke. Just hard to say he's the most valuable player to his team in the NHL, which is what the Hart Trophy was made for. 

Not that. But more so like he's a product of Stamkos and that isn't the case. At least to me.  I think Value wise to team it's Hall or Bergeron. 

[SterioDesign]

8 minutes ago, CarterforPresident said:

Tampa could survive with Kuch, but he isn't a joke. He makes Stamkos and Point better players. 

Not sure Boston would fair to well without Bergeron though, he's their heart and soul IMO. 

Wheeler shouldn't be up there

 

Malkin is having an amazing year, for once we barely hear about Sid. Thank god.

 

I doubt Hall gets it but the recognition is good.

well Bergeron out for 2 weeks at least, i guess that's a good test right there lol

[Muevelos]

1 minute ago, SterioDesign said:

well Bergeron out for 2 weeks at least, i guess that's a good test right there lol

Guess it's time for Rick Nash to take over=-O

[NJDevils1214]

6 minutes ago, CarterforPresident said:

Not that. But more so like he's a product of Stamkos and that isn't the case. At least to me.  I think Value wise to team it's Hall or Bergeron. 

I don't think anyone is saying this either. What people are saying is that Tampa would be okay without Kuch because of their other star talent that would carry their team. NJ without Hall would pretty much be a joke. No one is saying Kuch isn't a great player in his own right. 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

In the pure spirit of what an MVP is supposed to be...I don't know how Hall can't possibly be a top candidate, if not the leading candidate. 

I've mentioned it previously, but what he's doing reminds me so much of 2003-04 Patrik Elias.  On what was a very meh offensive team (the EGG line had a nice run, thanks in large part to Elias), Patrik somehow finished that season with 18 G and 18 A in his final 24 games of the season.  As far as forwards went, Jeff Friesen ranked third in points...with a whopping 37 in 81 GP.  Patrik scored 38 goals that year...exactly one other player had more than 20, and that was Gionta, with 21...of course, a nice chunk of that resulted from the EGG line (he scored 13 of those goals over his final 27 GP).  I know the 2003-04 Devils were only one season removed from a Cup win, but where would that team have been without Elias? 

Edited March 1, 2018 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[Daniel]

46 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

In the pure spirit of what an MVP is supposed to be...I don't know how Hall can't possibly be a top candidate, if not the leading candidate. 

I've mentioned it previously, but what he's doing reminds me so much of 2003-04 Patrik Elias.  On what was a very meh offensive team (the EGG line had a nice run, thanks in large part to Elias), Patrik somehow finished that season with 18 G and 18 A in his final 24 games of the season.  As far as forwards went, Jeff Friesen ranked third in points...with a whopping 37 in 81 GP.  Patrik scored 38 goals that year...exactly one other player had more than 20, and that was Gionta, with 21...of course, a nice chunk of that resulted from the EGG line (he scored 13 of those goals over his final 27 GP).  I know the 2003-04 Devils were only one season removed from a Cup win, but where would that team have been without Elias? 

That team had Neidermeyer who was arguably the best player in hockey at that time, notwithstanding that he only finished ninth in the Hart voting.  Point about Elias is otherwise well taken.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Just now, Daniel said:

That team had Neidermeyer who was arguably the best player in hockey at that time, notwithstanding that he only finished ninth in the Hart voting.  Point about Elias is otherwise well taken.

Nieds obviously had an excellent season (won the Norris) and Gomer had one of his better years, and Marty was Marty, but you look at the rest of those forwards and you realize how difficult of a time that team would've had without Elias.  Just like this one would have a hell of a time without Hall.   

[DevsMan84]

1 minute ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Nieds obviously had an excellent season (won the Norris) and Gomer had one of his better years, and Marty was Marty, but you look at the rest of those forwards and you realize how difficult of a time that team would've had without Elias.  Just like this one would have a hell of a time without Hall.   

Friesen being a complete shell of himself that season was one of the biggest reasons why I think they flopped out early in the playoffs that year.  He had zero points in 5 games in the playoffs and was 17-20-37 in the regular season after being 23-28-51 in the regular season and 10-4-14 in the playoffs the season before.

['7']

On 2/26/2018 at 2:49 PM, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

As far as Ratelle goes, basically the Rangers needed someone to tell them that he was an all-time Top 100 player before they suddenly decided that he was worthy of a jersey retirement, despite Ratelle last having been a Ranger on 11/7/1975.  (Yes, I bolded and underlined the 1975 for a reason).  His NHL career ended with the 1980-81 season...but it took the friggin' Rangers about THIRTY-SIX years to realize that he deserved to see his number raised to the rafters...and Ratelle's #19 was apparently so friggin' scared that EIGHTEEN OTHER RANGERS wore it after Ratelle was dealt...including such greats as Mark Heaslip, Christian Dube, and Darren Langdon.  Could this have been any more forced and anticlimactic? 

The whole thing is a joke because the ONLY reason this happened was because of the Top 100 list.  It was a completely reactionary move...sorry, if you can't figure out on your own and with a mountain of evidence that the guy should've had this happen when there were still plenty of fans who actually saw him play and was still fresh in fans' memories...just a total farce. 

It's a cash grab for the Rags now. They were very tight fisted with number retirements early and now are handing them out like Halloween Candy. Graves was a joke and now Vic Hadfield is an even bigger joke. So the entire gag line will be up there...so what? One good line doesn't mean all three have to have their number retired. And the Rags are once again inflating the importance of the GAG line in NHL history.

They know next year is going to be a dark one and they just need an event to bask in their glory and rich history. They think just hanging undeserving jerseys up will somehow add to their allure as a storied original 6.

The only Rags that deserve their number retired:

Messier, Leetch, Ratelle, Gilbert, Howell, Giacomin

And that's it until Lundqvist

Edited March 1, 2018 by '7'

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

21 minutes ago, '7' said:

It's a cash grab for the Rags now. They were very tight fisted with number retirements early and now are handing them out like Halloween Candy. Graves was a joke and now Vic Hadfield is an even bigger joke. So the entire gag line will be up there...so what? One good line doesn't mean all three have to have their number retired. And the Rags are once again inflating the importance of the GAG line in NHL history.

They know next year is going to be a dark one and they just need an event to bask in their glory and rich history. They think just hanging undeserving jerseys up will somehow add to their allure as a storied original 6.

I still believe Graves was legit...he was a big part of 1994, he had several other fine seasons for them (10 seasons and 840 games total, including the playoffs), and in a lot of ways he was one of the NHL's ultimate overachievers...and of course, a great guy to have representing your organization both on and off the ice.  He's always done a ton of good for the community.  That retirement was both for Graves the player and Graves the human being, and I get that and understand it. 

From Wikipedia...along with the fact that he squeezed every last bit of ability that he had out of himself, I think this stuff is significant:

During the 1993–94 season Graves was awarded with the King Clancy Memorial Trophy which is given annually to the NHL player who best exemplifies leadership qualities or has made a noteworthy humanitarian contribution to his community. Graves also won the NHL foundation award during the 1999–2000 season. This award is given annually to the player who applies core values of hockey, commitment and teamwork, to enrich the lives of people in the community.

During the 1991–92 season, 1992–93 season, 1993–94 season, 1998–99 season, and the 1999–2000 season Graves received the Steven McDonald Award. This award is given annually to the Rangers player who goes "above and beyond the call of duty", named after a paralyzed NYC police officer, Steven McDonald.

The Players' Player Award which is given to the best "team player" as voted on by the players was also won by Graves in 1991–92, 1992–93, 1994–95, and 1998–99. In the 1992–93, and 1993–94 seasons, Graves won the Rangers Most Valuable Player Award given to the Rangers most valuable player as voted on by the media. Also during the 1992–93 season Graves was given the "Rangers Good Guy" award. During the Rangers Stanley Cup winning season Graves was awarded the Frank Boucher Trophy given by the Rangers Fan Club given to the most popular player on and off the ice. Yet another fan club award Graves was awarded the "Rangers Fan Club Ceil Saidel Memorial Award" during the 1995–96, 1996–97, and 1999–2000 seasons. This award is for dedication on and off the ice.

1993 was a good year for Graves, as he was also awarded the "Crumb Bum Award" given annually for services to New York youngsters as voted on by the media. Another "Good Guy" award Graves won was The Sporting News "Good guy" award in 2000. Along with other professional athletes such as Al Leiter, Troy Aikman, and Terry Cummings this award was given to charitable and community service efforts. Graves is now an instructor at the New York Rangers youth hockey camp. He focuses on instilling pride in the youngsters attending the camp.

He also won the Bill Masterton Memorial Trophy in the 2000–01 season.

 

Ratelle and Hadfield are a complete joke, that I couldn't agree with more.  Like I said earlier, I can't expect Ratelle to feel this way, but for the Rangers to wake up NOW and do this, after nearly 20 more players wore #19 after Ratelle did...it's almost a little insulting.   

EDIT:  I checked some of their others and I'm sorry, in Bathgate's and Howell's case, why does it take about 40 years or more for an organization to decide that "Yep, now it's time!"  I just don't get that.

Edited March 1, 2018 by Colorado Rockies 1976