Schneider: done or finished?

[mfitz804]

26 minutes ago, titans04 said:

I don't think KK will have many options as a # 1 elsewhere, I just don't see it.  He's extremely valuable to us primarily because Cory stinks and has been injured.  He's a backup imo.

He's also kinda old. He'll be hitting the free agent market at age 30 (ok, maybe 29 by a couple days, but still). I'm not sure what the market will be for a career backup who has *sorta* proven he can start *some* of the time? 

How many goalies have gotten their first true starting job at age 30?

That said, at this point I'd rather go with him as starter than Cory.

34 minutes ago, NJDfan1711 said:

In all honesty, the more I think about it, has Schneider really and actually had decent numbers while shouldering a starting job on his own, outside of maybe one or two seasons (I'm thinking maybe 2015-2017?)…?

2014-15 he had a .925 SV% and a 2.26 GAA. That ain't bad. If we had a few more NHL caliber players on that team, he probably would have won 30-35 games that year. 

 

Edited November 20, 2018 by mfitz804

[titans04]

11 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

He's also kinda old. He'll be hitting the free agent market at age 30 (ok, maybe 29 by a couple days, but still). I'm not sure what the market will be for a career backup who has *sorta* proven he can start *some* of the time? 

How many goalies have gotten their first true starting job at age 30?

That said, at this point I'd rather go with him as starter than Cory.

 

 

Same here but only because he's the lesser of two evils.  Being the lesser of two evils on a mediocre team imo won't bring him big money or term in FA.

[Crisis]

15 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

How many goalies have gotten their first true starting job at age 30?

Stanley Cup Champion Tim Thomas!

[Devil Dan 56]

The thing with this last game is if Cory would have allowed those goals at say 10 minutes into the game and the other sometime in the second or third period, it would have been considered his best game in a while, not including playoffs. Allowing the first 2 shots just looks so terrible. 

 

As for Kinkaid, I love him and think he's a great back up who can step it up when the starter is down. I think over longer periods of time though, his warts start to show. I think of his run along the lines of Clemmensen. Towards the end of that run when Marty was hurt people were figuring him out a bit. Although KK has a way better glove hand and lateral movement. 

As CR79 said, I definitely see KK as a Terreri type. Very very reliable but not quite a starter. 

[NJDfan1711]

7 hours ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

The thing with this last game is if Cory would have allowed those goals at say 10 minutes into the game and the other sometime in the second or third period, it would have been considered his best game in a while, not including playoffs. Allowing the first 2 shots just looks so terrible. 

This is definitely true, and for the last 59 minutes and 30 seconds he played pretty well, but, context does matter.  

[Devil Dan 56]

1 hour ago, NJDfan1711 said:

This is definitely true, and for the last 59 minutes and 30 seconds he played pretty well, but, context does matter.  

 yes it does, I agree. I was just saying someone who read the final stat line and didn't see the game night not see just how demoralizing it was in the moment. 

[Satans Hockey]

On 11/20/2018 at 2:43 AM, AEWHistory said:

It is a real shame, but I’m not at all surprised.  I posted this THREAD back in 2015 and was eviscerated.  It was basically the last time I created a topic (I don’t need any more strangers being a$$holes to me).  I argued then that this team was not going to be a contender before CS was no longer a top level goalie.  Consequently, why not trade him for some younger, longer term talent that will be part of the building pieces going forward.  I don’t know what we might have gotten for CS back in 2015, but it is a helluva lot more than we will get now.  

Frankly, if we had traded CS for just about any decent talent we would be much better off.  A defenseman?  We need that.  A forward?  We could use depth and it might have freed up a draft pick to use on our anemic looking defensive group.  Or maybe some draft picks.  Who knows, maybe we draft a goalie who will be with us when the Devils are truly ready for a cup run in a few years.  As it is, we got nothing.....  

"Did you all read the post? What happens three or four years from now when we become solid competitors and he is declining?"

This was from the old thread but with the way team is going now, with or without Cory, the only thing this team will be contending for is the draft lottery and even with last year's surge they were never contenders. Even if we traded Cory back then I don't think we would be in that much different of a place when it comes to competing for anything. 

Also I wouldn't stop posting threads just because some people are more brash than others. It's the internet, I like pretty much everyone that posts here and we all have our moments but I still never take anything personal.

Edited November 21, 2018 by Satans Hockey

[MadDog2020]

Okay so I was looking at HF this morning and there is a poster there with a podcast (not sure if said poster also posts here or not), who said he was recently chatting with a member of the hockey media (he wouldn’t say who, but gave enough hints to figure out it’s Pierre McGuire). According to this ‘anonymous’ hockey media member, the Devils and Flyers have been discussing Schneider for Simmonds (probably not one for one though). I don’t see why Philly does that if they claim to love Carter Hart so much, but this makes for an interesting discussion, so..... DISCUSS. 

Edited November 21, 2018 by MadDog2020

[NJDfan1711]

10 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

Okay so I was looking at HF this morning and there is a poster there with a podcast (not sure if said poster also posts here or not), who said he was recently chatting with a member of the hockey media (he wouldn’t say who, but gave enough hints to figure out it’s Pierre McGuire). According to this ‘anonymous’ hockey media member, the Devils and Flyers have been discussing Schneider for Simmonds (probably not one for one though). I don’t see why Philly does that if they claim to love Carter Hart so much, but this makes for an interesting discussion, so..... DISCUSS. 

I think Simmonds is quite the a$$hole.  I don't really want a guy who is top 5 in the league in penalty minutes joining our squad.  We're already too undisciplined.  BUT...seeing as how that's probably the highest return I could see us getting for Schneider at the moment, I wouldn't exactly hate it.  Hell, maybe we acquire Simmons and then flip him.  

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

11 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

Okay so I was looking at HF this morning and there is a poster there with a podcast (not sure if said poster also posts here or not), who said he was recently chatting with a member of the hockey media (he wouldn’t say who, but gave enough hints to figure out it’s Pierre McGuire). According to this ‘anonymous’ hockey media member, the Devils and Flyers have been discussing Schneider for Simmonds (probably not one for one though). I don’t see why Philly does that if they claim to love Carter Hart so much, but this makes for an interesting discussion, so..... DISCUSS. 

Odd...Flyers would take on a potentially rotten contract for one that's expiring (and the Devils would REALLY have some serious cap room).  Devils would also have to be very sure that Cory is never going to bounce back fully...that would mean definitely signing KK to at least a 2 year deal, and hoping that Blackwood will be at least as good as KK currently is (as previously mentioned, he's now a passable #1, a guy you can get by with, but the kind of #1 that a contending team would want to upgrade)...but really needing Blackwood to challenge and eventually take the #1 job away from KK sooner than later.  That's an awful lot to bank on. 

[Nicomo]

Depends what else they’re asking for. It would be amazing to get out of Cory’s horrendous contract though. And Simmonds’ 8 goals would make him 2nd on the team after Palms. He’s a giant pain in the ass to play against too. Unless Philly wants Ty Smith, Bratt, or Severson I’d be open to it. 

[NJDevils1214]

Philadelphia's goaltending is the thing that guarantees they stay far away from success year after year, so in my ignorant fandom I say there is no way Simmons is enough or that I'd do it. Devils really lack a size guy up front that can get in those dirty areas though. Boyle and Noesen aren't that good at it.

[NJDfan1711]

Does anyone think Blackwood would be called up if this were to really happen?  Wouldn't Lack be the next in line?  I figure he would take 30% of the load and Kinkaid would get 70.  I can't see them keeping Lack down in the minors if there were to be a vacancy on the team.

[Devilsfan118]

1 hour ago, NJDfan1711 said:

I think Simmonds is quite the a$$hole.  I don't really want a guy who is top 5 in the league in penalty minutes joining our squad.  We're already too undisciplined.  BUT...seeing as how that's probably the highest return I could see us getting for Schneider at the moment, I wouldn't exactly hate it.  Hell, maybe we acquire Simmons and then flip him.  

Simmonds is the exact kind of guy we need imo.

We're soft as tissue paper.  Need a guy out there with skill who can also bury someone if they take liberties against our young kids.

That said, I just don't see how this deal happens.

[NJDfan1711]

Just now, Devilsfan118 said:

Simmonds is the exact kind of guy we need imo.

We're soft as tissue paper.  Need a guy out there with skill who can also bury someone if they take liberties against our young kids.

That said, I just don't see how this deal happens.

Ya know, I think you're right.  I think I just let my hatred completely cloud my judgment and vision for what we need.  I still really hate how penalty-prone he is, but I agree, we lack pretty much any physical presence outside of some of the gritty guys like Coleman and Noesen - but that's not really the same.  

I don't see how the deal happens either.  You have to imagine Philly knows they have goaltending issues, and as stupid as they are, I don't think they're stupid enough to think Schneider is much of an upgrade over what they have right now.  His play has just been too poor for even the biggest optimists to see anything bright or positive about it.

[DevsMan84]

That rumor was also posted in a couple of the FB groups about a week or so ago.  Has little to no merit.  It is one of those heard it from a buddy who knows a guy who is friends with someone in the know.

Edited November 21, 2018 by DevsMan84

[Devilsfan118]

Maybe something like:

Schneider (50% retained)

Mid-Level Prospect

Mid-to-late round pick

for

Simmonds

MacDonald

Elliot

The bolded, whether it be 10% or 50%, would worry me a bit.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

1 minute ago, NJDfan1711 said:

Does anyone think Blackwood would be called up if this were to really happen?  Wouldn't Lack be the next in line?  I figure he would take 30% of the load and Kinkaid would get 70.  I can't see them keeping Lack down in the minors if there were to be a vacancy on the team.

If Lack's the call-up, then the Devils are basically waving the white flag...even if he's just the back up.  He might have a nice game here and there, but there's a reason he's not only in the AHL now, but also not playing terribly well in the AHL.

That being said, if Blackwood is starting to head in the right direction, I think he's gotta spend more time in the AHL getting lots of starts...let him keep building off what he's done in his short sample to date.  Depending on how the year shakes out, the Devils can get a look at him much later in the season. 

[Crisis]

Bob is UFA this summer, eh?

[MadDog2020]

12 minutes ago, Devilsfan118 said:

Maybe something like:

Schneider (50% retained)

Mid-Level Prospect

Mid-to-late round pick

for

Simmonds

MacDonald

Elliot

The bolded, whether it be 10% or 50%, would worry me a bit.

If I’m making this deal with an arch rival like the Flyers, I’m not retaining sh!t. I’m not paying 50% of Schneider’s salary so he can beat me, while helping them solve a problem they’ve had for 30 years. It’s a straight ‘take it or leave it’ deal. I’d be willing to retain for a team that isn’t the Flyers, but taking the full deal is the tax they’d have to pay if they actually, really want Schneider that badly. 

Edited November 21, 2018 by MadDog2020

[mfitz804]

26 minutes ago, NJDfan1711 said:

Does anyone think Blackwood would be called up if this were to really happen?  Wouldn't Lack be the next in line?  I figure he would take 30% of the load and Kinkaid would get 70.  I can't see them keeping Lack down in the minors if there were to be a vacancy on the team.

Depends if a goalie came back in the deal, and I imagine one would. 

 

10 minutes ago, Devilsfan118 said:

Maybe something like:

Schneider (50% retained)

The bolded, whether it be 10% or 50%, would worry me a bit.

Not on a team $18m under the cap. Honestly, what's worse, him being gone and a $3m cap hit or watching him play and having a $6m cap hit?

And really, 10%? Retaining $600,000 would be troublesome to you??

[MadDog2020]

2 minutes ago, Crisis said:

Bob is UFA this summer, eh?

Yes he is. It’s an intriguing possibility.

[NJDevs4978]

On 11/20/2018 at 4:03 AM, Chimaira_Devil_#9 said:

Jesus, going back and reading through that was tough. I think the franchise and the team were in a very bad place at that time and so were the fans. It took basically nothing to set people off back then. 

What is interesting reading that thread is that a few players mentioned as trade pieces for the Devil's to acquire are now on the team , people both mentioned Hall and Palmieri. 

Plus it was going to take a GM change and a philosophy change to even consider trading Cory.  Lou was the one who traded for him and signed him to an extension months before said thread.  No trade was happening regardless.  My argument at the time for keeping him iirc is that you needed a good goalie to help your young defensemen (Severson, Merrill, Gelinas, Larsson) develop, little did we know only one of those guys would BE on the team three years later or that Kinkaid would be a better goalie and within a year and a half.

Edited November 25, 2018 by NJDevs4978

[slasher72]

And with that 9th pick that Lou traded, Vancouver selected Bo Horvat. To think.we could have had Bo Horvat and Matt Barzal on this team if it weren't for the previous regime.

 

Oye vey.

Edited November 26, 2018 by slasher72

[NJDevs4978]

The funny thing is now people are using Cory's last two years to eviscerate the trade when there's really no reason other than injury he should have had such a dramatic falloff early in his contract.  People have short memories, all I read online for years was that Lou wasn't doing enough to plan for the post-Marty future.  He finally does and people still hold it against him.