Devils Goaltending

[Steadevils]

For the first time in my lifetime goaltender is the #1 problem with the Devils in my opinion. I thought a thread to discuss possible paths forward (near and long term) to solve the issue would be an interesting discussion. Short term I really do not have a good answer. I just know the status quo is killing the team this year. 

Short Term-Buy out Cory as discussed in another thread? Continue to hope Kinkaid is a late bloomer (I really have no hope in this one anymore as he's been extremely lucky this year and still is only posting a.906)? Make a trade? Target an FA next year? Play Cory every night until he gets hurt again and put in on LITR? 

 

Long Term-With nothing of note in the farm it really is a situation of needing to totally re-vamp a position with a barren cupboard. The good news is that goaltenders, moreso than other positions, can be found fairly randomly in later rounds. So I actually don't disagree with Shero's approach of drafting goalies late and adding undrafted goalies...The problem is that they all look like big whiffs up to this point. My instinct is to keep this approach as you only need to hit on 1, but maybe getting a few extra 3/4th round picks and taking a goalie or two with higher pedigree might up the batting average. 

 

 

[Nicomo]

I wouldn’t say there’s nothing in the farm system. They used a 2nd rd pick on Blackwood. He’s having a good year in the AHL, and as bad as KK and Cory are playing we might get a look at him soon. Then again Hynes will probably give him one start and then send him back down...

Edited December 6, 2018 by Nicomo

[Devilsfan118]

To be honest I think you've gotta ride Cory for 15 of the next 20 games and hope he figures it out.

What do we have to lose? The team is losing anyway with KK. 

We've gotta figure out what we have in Cory going forward. 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

I talked about the Cory buyout option in another thread...the hit for doing so really isn't THAT bad (especially for a team that has both a lot of cap room and will only see more money coming off, and especially since the Devils will save $4 million over the next three seasons if they go this route). 

I think Plan A still has to be to see if Cory can be righted...I really wish the Devils would send him down to Bingo to begin that process, but it's obvious that they won't.  Fine, but I don't think sticking Cory in games here and there is going to work either...I'm not implying that Shero and Hynes are screwing up, because it doesn't get more Catch 22 than it does with the Devils' goalie situation.  It's kind of hard when the guy who looked like a Top-10 (Possible Top-5) goalie sees his level of play fall completely off a cliff. 

I think KK is what he is...if anything, I think any team that might have been even a little tempted to sign him as a potential #1 has been scared off.  What KK is has been more clearly defined...under ideal circumstances, he's a 25-35 game backup who may be able to fill in for a while as your #1 guy if something happens to your actual #1.  He's just not meant to be an every-season #1...the warts start to show, especially when luck isn't on his side. 

8 minutes ago, Devilsfan118 said:

To be honest I think you've gotta ride Cory for 15 of the next 20 games and hope he figures it out.

What do we have to lose? The team is losing anyway with KK. 

We've gotta figure out what we have in Cory going forward. 

It's probably still too early for this...I expect the Devils to approach the season as still salvageable at this point, and though KK hasn't played as well lately, I think you gotta take your chances with him just a little longer (or try to get someone via waiver or by not having to give up much in return, just to get another body in there, if Blackwood isn't going to get a shot in 2018-19 with the big club)...right now it just feels like Sad Sack Cory gives his team NO chance to win, and I think that lack of confidence rubs off on his teammates.  But yeah, if the Devils drop another 3-4 games in a row, I think you can start to clamor for "fvck it just play Cory and find out if he can be saved", even if it comes at everyone else's expense.  If anything, it's one of those "Well boys, you were losing without Cory, so now you can lose with him." 

Edited December 6, 2018 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[RunninWithTheDevil]

17 minutes ago, Devilsfan118 said:

To be honest I think you've gotta ride Cory for 15 of the next 20 games and hope he figures it out.

What do we have to lose? The team is losing anyway with KK. 

We've gotta figure out what we have in Cory going forward. 

This. Give Cory the starting position we pay him $6m for. If he can't manage a winning percentage of those games, then I think we have our answer.

[Jerzey]

Too bad the Seattle expansion and next CBA are so far away. They’re probably going to offer compliance buyouts again. And a deal with Seattle probably could have been made around Schneider. Lots of goalies seem to be struggling right now. Maybe a trade is possible. Maybe we should just throw a shooter tutor up.

[jagknife]

How many straight games has KK given up 4 goals or more, five or six? At this point, even if they start out behind the eight-ball, I feel as though starting Cory for a game or two wouldn't be a bad idea. I'm sure its been announced for tonight and I just haven't seen, but I'd give him the Kings as they're as much of a dumpster fire as we are right now.

Otherwise, I'm on board with the CR idea of buyout, especially with the cap going up and we can allocate the hit to that, but the savings elsewhere

[Triumph]

If Cory continues like this, he can't be on the team next year.  I'd say if his SV% isn't over .900 by the end of the year, they've got to get rid of him - and that's with an awareness that .900 isn't good, but it means that his SV% was quite good from this point until the end of the season.  The Devils can't wait for a compliance buyout (which may never arrive) - they have to either trade him or buy him out this offseason.  Trading him while picking up half his contract might work, especially to take on a shorter deal with more money (e.g. Scott Darling's) that they can then buy out, but that's only if he shows some improvement here - there's no way anyone will take him on when his SV% is well below .900.

The trouble is that Kinkaid isn't showing a whole lot here recently.  It's a long season and maybe he'll recover, but he doesn't look capable of handling 60 games a year.  That's not surprising - he's mostly been an average goalie in his career.  The UFA goalie market doesn't look great - Varlamov's having a nice season, but he's 31 in April, Bobrovsky is not having a good season and he wants big money on his next deal.  I'm really not sure what the way forward here is other than that it cannot be Kinkaid and Schneider next season.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

8 minutes ago, Triumph said:

If Cory continues like this, he can't be on the team next year.  I'd say if his SV% isn't over .900 by the end of the year, they've got to get rid of him - and that's with an awareness that .900 isn't good, but it means that his SV% was quite good from this point until the end of the season.  The Devils can't wait for a compliance buyout (which may never arrive) - they have to either trade him or buy him out this offseason.  Trading him while picking up half his contract might work, especially to take on a shorter deal with more money (e.g. Scott Darling's) that they can then buy out, but that's only if he shows some improvement here - there's no way anyone will take him on when his SV% is well below .900.

The trouble is that Kinkaid isn't showing a whole lot here recently.  It's a long season and maybe he'll recover, but he doesn't look capable of handling 60 games a year.  That's not surprising - he's mostly been an average goalie in his career.  The UFA goalie market doesn't look great - Varlamov's having a nice season, but he's 31 in April, Bobrovsky is not having a good season and he wants big money on his next deal.  I'm really not sure what the way forward here is other than that it cannot be Kinkaid and Schneider next season.

This is why you cross your fingers REALLY hard and hope that Blackwood can be at least a little above average if he can come up and get settled (hopefully better, but considering all of the Devils' goalie picks that did nothing as NHLers or never even made it, I'll take decent and serviceable)...and that he could be ready as soon as next season.  Because that not happening is a pretty scary thought. 

Agree fully on Cory, if it doesn't happen this year, don't pull an Alderson and hope it magically gets better next year.  Just cut bait.  If he somehow finds his game elsewhere as a reclamation project, so be it.

[Daniel]

Since Cory does not have an NMC (just a NTC) and isn't on an over 35 contract, could they not just put him on waivers and send him down to Bingo and incur no cap hit and just pay him his money which isn't ours?  Even if not, at the very least, I'd try and keep him in the organization through next year so you're not stuck with the dead cap hit for so long.  And even then, the fact that he's taking up a roster spot means more than his cap hit.  The Devils will have enough cap space so that they could re-sign all the players they need to and probably give Auston Mathews a $16 million AAV offer sheet if they were so inclined.

[Devil Dan 56]

1 hour ago, Daniel said:

Since Cory does not have an NMC (just a NTC) and isn't on an over 35 contract, could they not just put him on waivers and send him down to Bingo and incur no cap hit and just pay him his money which isn't ours?  Even if not, at the very least, I'd try and keep him in the organization through next year so you're not stuck with the dead cap hit for so long.  And even then, the fact that he's taking up a roster spot means more than his cap hit.  The Devils will have enough cap space so that they could re-sign all the players they need to and probably give Auston Mathews a $16 million AAV offer sheet if they were so inclined.

That's going under the assumption that ownership wants to pay 6 million for a guy who isn't even on the roster. And if they do, would they really be willing to allow Shero to spend an additional 6 million on roster spots?

[Daniel]

13 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

That's going under the assumption that ownership wants to pay 6 million for a guy who isn't even on the roster. And if they do, would they really be willing to allow Shero to spend an additional 6 million on roster spots?

Generally, no owner wants to pay money to someone who isn't playing, or they want to pay him as little as possible.  And if we had an owner like Melnyk, that would be the priority over improving the team.  But I'm pretty certain that the current owners would be willing to eat the actual money by sending him down to Bingo as opposed to a buy out if that's what it took have the cap space needed to bring in a really good player that will improve the team's fortunes significantly enough. 

[Triumph]

2 hours ago, Daniel said:

Since Cory does not have an NMC (just a NTC) and isn't on an over 35 contract, could they not just put him on waivers and send him down to Bingo and incur no cap hit and just pay him his money which isn't ours?  Even if not, at the very least, I'd try and keep him in the organization through next year so you're not stuck with the dead cap hit for so long.  And even then, the fact that he's taking up a roster spot means more than his cap hit.  The Devils will have enough cap space so that they could re-sign all the players they need to and probably give Auston Mathews a $16 million AAV offer sheet if they were so inclined.

All but $1M or so of Schneider's cap hit would count in Binghamton.

[Satans Hockey]

We have plenty of cap space with or without Cory anyway. 

[mfitz804]

2 hours ago, Daniel said:

Generally, no owner wants to pay money to someone who isn't playing, or they want to pay him as little as possible.  

Whereas I would be happy to have them pay Cory not to play. In fact, we should take up a collection and see if we can raise the money. 

[NJDevs4978]

8 hours ago, Daniel said:

Generally, no owner wants to pay money to someone who isn't playing, or they want to pay him as little as possible.  And if we had an owner like Melnyk, that would be the priority over improving the team.  But I'm pretty certain that the current owners would be willing to eat the actual money by sending him down to Bingo as opposed to a buy out if that's what it took have the cap space needed to bring in a really good player that will improve the team's fortunes significantly enough. 

I don't know that...we've been sitting on a ton of cap space for like three years now with no sign we'll ever actually use it other than on Hall, assuming he isn't turned off by this tire fire display reminiscent of the Oiler days.  Even Hynes took a little dig the other day, pointing out the Lightning were a cap team with talent.

Odds are they're going to have to pay some money for a bridge starter cause Blackwood's still a year or two away.  Keith's not anything more than a platoon guy who can get hot for a few weeks but can't sustain a high level through 82 games, and Cory's beyond repair at this point.  It's just never worked out for him from day one, when he stopped the puck they didn't score for him and now he can't stop the puck - it's like whatever he needs to do to lose he does.

[Daniel]

9 hours ago, NJDevs4978 said:

I don't know that...we've been sitting on a ton of cap space for like three years now with no sign we'll ever actually use it other than on Hall, assuming he isn't turned off by this tire fire display reminiscent of the Oiler days.  Even Hynes took a little dig the other day, pointing out the Lightning were a cap team with talent.

Odds are they're going to have to pay some money for a bridge starter cause Blackwood's still a year or two away.  Keith's not anything more than a platoon guy who can get hot for a few weeks but can't sustain a high level through 82 games, and Cory's beyond repair at this point.  It's just never worked out for him from day one, when he stopped the puck they didn't score for him and now he can't stop the puck - it's like whatever he needs to do to lose he does.

We've been making fun of Ray for sitting on the cap space, but to be fair I think it's pretty clear that he's been trying to land a big fish, but it just wasn't in the cards.  Like, I'm sure he would have been aggressive going after Tavares if he didn't have that short list of predetermined teams he was going to talk to.  He said he would have pursued Carlson, and probably talked to him during the tampering period, but he extended with the Caps after winning a Cup.  I believe the reports that he tried to trade for Karlsson and he apparently was at least in on trade discussions for Nylander. 

So it really comes down to Ray not wanting to be saddled with something akin to a Lucic contract.  But if he went to ownership and said he wanted to sign Matthews to a gigantic offer sheet, Harris would probably be more concerned about losing the draft picks and the cap space implications than he would the actual money.

[mfitz804]

I just want to add, not that it was what Daniel was saying or what he meant, let's not get started on the whole "signing Auston Matthews" thing. There's zero chance that the best free agent in a very long time is going to take a look at the Devils and be like "THAT's what I want to be a part of". And a RFA on top of that. Not happening AT ALL. 

[MadDog2020]

1 hour ago, mfitz804 said:

I just want to add, not that it was what Daniel was saying or what he meant, let's not get started on the whole "signing Auston Matthews" thing. There's zero chance that the best free agent in a very long time is going to take a look at the Devils and be like "THAT's what I want to be a part of". And a RFA on top of that. Not happening AT ALL. 

Actually, the biggesst reason Auston Matthews won’t become a Devil is because, if we (or any other team, for that matter) offer sheeted him the biggest offer sheet in the history of offer sheets, Toronto would STILL match it... and if they didn’t, their entire organization should be fired. 

[titans04]

Until they spend rather than sit on a sh!tton of cap space I'll lean towards they are operating under some limitations from ownership.  I hate hearing that nobody wants to come here it's HIS job to make this team better and to find ways to do it.  Getting a free pass because nobody wants to come here makes me cringe. Nobody here including me knows who's available via trade etc. nor how hard they are pressing and yeah to me it's harder to do during the season which makes the offseason even more frustrating.  

[eaglejelly]

1 hour ago, MadDog2020 said:

Actually, the biggesst reason Auston Matthews won’t become a Devil is because, if we (or any other team, for that matter) offer sheeted him the biggest offer sheet in the history of offer sheets, Toronto would STILL match it... and if they didn’t, their entire organization should be fired. 

I not sure if Auston Matthews is the answer to our goaltending issues

[Daniel]

If Matthews is most interested in the money, there are very few teams that could outbid the Devils.  

[mfitz804]

3 hours ago, Daniel said:

If Matthews is most interested in the money, there are very few teams that could outbid the Devils.  

He can get the money from a team that’s closer to winning. That’ll be more important. 

[Crisis]

41 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

He can get the money from a team that’s closer to winning. That’ll be more important. 

He's young.  He has plenty of time to win.  He could also get hurt and never get another contract.

[fsu1852]

I wonder if a swap for Cory and Jake Allen could work out. Maybe a change of places could work