Daniel Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, HellOnICE said: Raanta has 18 months left- do they need that salary on their books. We can walk Raanta to free agency while playing well and who knows where we’ll be then. Or lose him to expansion and keep 29 I think the idea is that we’ll take the Hossa contract, which is what some people are speculating putting Morrow on waivers was all about. If they need to give us Raanta for salary purposes, sure. But he’s not a long term answer for the team, which is what this deal should be about. Edited December 14, 2019 by Daniel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HellOnICE Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 27 minutes ago, Daniel said: I think the idea is that we’ll take the Hossa contract, which is what some people are speculating putting Morrow on waivers was all about. If they need to give us Raanta for salary purposes, sure. But he’s not a long term answer for the team, which is what this deal should be about. It can be both. The D is for future and we say 29 is the future but needs help right now with Raanta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevils1214 Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 I've been watching Kovy highlights today and man was he just UNSTOPPABLE while he was here. That is the kind of player this team needs again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 1 hour ago, CarpathianForest said: I would say getting actual NHL defensemen would be top priority, but that's just me I suspect that Shero will not be outbid for Joel Edmundson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guadana Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 20 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said: I've been watching Kovy highlights today and man was he just UNSTOPPABLE while he was here. That is the kind of player this team needs again. He was the kind of douche. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smelly Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 It’s super risky for Shero to take back anyone in college. They can easily pull a Kerfoot/Butcher/Vesey and Devs end up with nothing. Stay away even if it’s Knight, Newhook, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 1 minute ago, smelly said: It’s super risky for Shero to take back anyone in college. They can easily pull a Kerfoot/Butcher/Vesey and Devs end up with nothing. Stay away even if it’s Knight, Newhook, etc. That’s a good point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicomo Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 26 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said: I've been watching Kovy highlights today and man was he just UNSTOPPABLE while he was here. That is the kind of player this team needs again. Why are you doing such a thing to yourself lol 2 minutes ago, smelly said: It’s super risky for Shero to take back anyone in college. They can easily pull a Kerfoot/Butcher/Vesey and Devs end up with nothing. Stay away even if it’s Knight, Newhook, etc. I’d risk it for the chance at Caufield, Knight, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, NJDfan1711 said: I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking that. I mean, what does Jake Allen do for us? I'll actually be pretty disappointed, and quite shocked, if any goalie is part of the deal. Blackwood is fine, and at the moment goaltending is our last area of need, especially with Hall going the other way. Have you seen the non-Blackwood games this year? Goalie isn't the last area of need by a longshot...they do need another goalie to play some games, Blackwood's not going to get Marty-level workloads, especially with this four-alarm fire of a team. Allen or Raanta wouldn't or shouldn't be the major piece of the deal but I could see them being IN a deal as mutually beneficial - them to take back salary, us to get an upgrade from Cory (who's getting bought out this offseason, he has to) or Domingue as the 1B. Edited December 14, 2019 by NJDevs4978 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 2 minutes ago, smelly said: It’s super risky for Shero to take back anyone in college. They can easily pull a Kerfoot/Butcher/Vesey and Devs end up with nothing. Stay away even if it’s Knight, Newhook, etc. I believe the last first rounder who went the NCAA route and made it to free agency was Kevin Hayes, if you’re not counting players who just turned out to be busts. It would be absolutely insane to pass up on a talent like Spencer Knight over concerns like that unless you have specific information that’s what his intentions are. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smelly Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Daniel said: I believe the last first rounder who went the NCAA route and made it to free agency was Kevin Hayes, if you’re not counting players who just turned out to be busts. It would be absolutely insane to pass up on a talent like Spencer Knight over concerns like that unless you have specific information that’s what his intentions are. Oh come on. You’d be the first person bitching about how Shero mismanaged this if they acquired an NCAA talent who never signed. The risk isn’t worth it - why would any of the plausible targets sign with the sh!tshow you incessantly describe? And they aren’t getting Caulfield and likely not Knight either anyway Edited December 14, 2019 by smelly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 9 minutes ago, smelly said: Oh come on. You’d be the first person bitching about how Shero mismanaged this if they acquired an NCAA talent who never signed. The risk isn’t worth it - why would any of the plausible targets sign with the sh!tshow you incessantly describe? And they aren’t getting Caulfield and likely not Knight either anyway The risk that a freshman in college who is ready to make the jump to the pros next year (players like Caufield, Knight) choosing to stick it out in college for the next three to go to free agency is much much smaller than some CHL second rounder who signed his ELC being a below average NHL player. Shero would probably fire himself if he took some meh package because he was afraid someone as good Spencer Knight or even a Newhook would walk in three years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smelly Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 (edited) You are forgetting that the player in that circumstance would have meaningful leverage over Shero by simply saying they aren’t signing and won’t sign in three years. That would result in a Hall-like situation all over again. I also don’t think it’s realistic at all that Knight or Caulfield will want to or be ready to leap to the NHL next year anyway. And they aren’t leaving school to play in the AHL. In any event, let’s just agree now that in the extremely unlikely event Shero acquires a Knight, Newhook, Caulfield etc and then they end up going the NCAA free agent route, you won’t have a peep of criticism, and will in fact commend Shero for having made the unquestionably correct call, ok? Edited December 14, 2019 by smelly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 5 minutes ago, smelly said: You are forgetting that the player in that circumstance would have meaningful leverage over Shero by simply saying they aren’t signing and won’t sign in three years. I also don’t think it’s realistic at all that Knight or Caulfield will want to or be ready to leap to the NHL next year anyway. And they aren’t leaving school to play in the AHL. In any event, let’s just agree now that in the extremely unlikely event Shero acquires a Knight, Newhook, Caulfield etc and they end up going the NCAA free agent route, you won’t have a peep of criticism, and will in fact commend Shero for having made the unquestionably correct call, ok? The college players have very little leverage because they don't get paid while they're in college and it's longer until they get out of their ELC's when they can start making real money. As I have explained to you, but you ignore, that's why it's extremely rare for any NCAA player who has been drafted in the first round to go that route, and why the last such player to do it was drafted in 2010 (coincidentally enough with the pick we traded in the Kovy deal). That's why the ones who you see going to free agency are almost always the ones who would not be ready for the AHL until they are at least done with their sophomore years. Sure, Cole Caufield can tell the Canadians (or us if he gets traded here or wherever) I want to play for the Rangers, and I'll stay in college for three more years if that's what it takes, as you suggest. He's passing up several million dollars to do so, which again, is why it makes sense for the Veseys and Adam Fox's of the world who need to stay in college for at least 3 years anyway. But anyway, you have me on record as saying that a fear of a really good player like Knight or Newhook sticking it out in college to go to free agency should absolutely not be a deterrent to trading for either of them, again, unless there is some specific information that they would go that route. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smelly Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 (edited) Caulfield is not playing in the NHL next year. He’s more another Fox. Same with Knight. And def same with Newhook. And you are weaseling out. You cannot credibly at any time in the future question Shero’s trading Hall for a deal built around an NCAA talent who in the future ends up not signing. Edited December 14, 2019 by smelly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, smelly said: Daniel - Adam Fox says hello. Read carefully, players drafted in the first round. EDIT: and even so, the Rangers paid a big price for a third round pick that they knew they could have for free if they waited a year. Edited December 14, 2019 by Daniel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smelly Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Daniel said: Read carefully, players drafted in the first round. EDIT: and even so, the Rangers paid a big price for a third round pick that they knew they could have for free if they waited a year. That’s a false distinction. Once they are drafted it doesn’t matter what round they were drafted in. Only matters how they develop and whether and when they are ready to make the jump and when they want to leave school. I’m a Harvard alum and have watched Fox since he announced he was going there. The fact that he was drafted in a later round was entirely irrelevant to his career path. He wanted to go Harvard (see: Garrett Cole and Yankees/UCLA), stay in school and also was not ready. The AHL was an entirely unappealing option, especially if it meant he had to sign with CAR where he did not want to be. The same factors will dictate how Caulfield’s and Knight’s careers progress, and it is now inconsequential what round they were selected in. Edited December 14, 2019 by smelly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SterioDesign Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guadana Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, SterioDesign said: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, smelly said: That’s a false distinction. Once they are drafted it doesn’t matter what round they were drafted in. Only matters how they develop and whether and when they are ready to make the jump and when they want to leave school. I’m a Harvard alum and have watched Fox since he announced he was going there. The fact that he was drafted in a later round was entirely irrelevant to his career path. He wanted to go Harvard (see: Garrett Cole and Yankees/UCLA), stay in school and also was not ready. The AHL was an entirely unappealing option, especially if it meant he had to sign with CAR where he did not want to be. The same factors will dictate how Caulfield’s and Knight’s careers progress, and it is now inconsequential what round they were selected in. Players drafted in the first round typically are more ready to make the jump to the NHL. And they also don’t give signals th at they intend to stay in college for a long time. So the distinction matters, and you know which is why you kept ignoring it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 Well, Incarcerated Bob and his bad of merry men are claiming Yotes have acquired Hall. He’s citing a TSN report that I can’t find anywhere. Take that for what it’s worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 TheFraudPeriod also saying deal is close to done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 Here’s EJ’s take: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HellOnICE Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 That’s what I been saying. 1st Raanta Bahl and conditional first Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SterioDesign Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 sounds a lot like Arizona but problem is... outside of Chychrun and soderstrom there's not much that'd id want that'd help us much. I mean i'd be okay with Barrett Hayton cause he's projected as a really good player but i really feel we need D there's Bahl but he's not ready to step in next year so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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