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Taylor Hall to AZ, 1st Rnd pick, 3rd Rnd Conditonal Pick, Bahl and 2 Prospects.Dvs Retain 50% salary

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3 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

And if he’s ad good as advertised you have your goalie for the next decade +.

The reported return the Avs might be sending back for Hall are unproven players and picks anyway. It’s all a gamble. I’d rather get the guy with the highest amount of potential. 

You're missing the point where the Devils have a bunch of areas of need. That's why you need the assets. Florida probably drafted Knight higher than would normally be smart to do so - but from their vantage point going into the draft, they had a pretty complete lineup and system outside of a goalie prospect, so it's at least a bit more understandable. They probably did the right thing but could have drafted a d-man as well. In any case, they didn't have Bobrovsky yet.

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i could be totally wrong but id be worried trading for a goalie... just cause they are soooooo inconsistent. How often does even TOP goalies just fall off a cliff suddenly? We see it every year. Price, Rinne, Schneider, Miller etc etc then some random dude like Jordan Binnington pops out of nowhere and win a cup. Or guys like Dubnyk sucking ass everywhere he played... then he goes to Minny and suddenly he's crazy for awhile. Then how many times teams thought they had a young stud and they'd be set for a decade... then 2 years later that dude is not even around anymore. You just never fvcking know with goalies, its suchhhhh a gamble.

Plus our last trade for a goalie is a good example of that... Schneider was a fvcking stud. I'd love to have horvat or whoever instead of him now though.

That mean said... obviously we need a goalie... but i'd rather sign one or get one through a smaller trade than for our top player.

 

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11 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

i could be totally wrong but id be worried trading for a goalie... just cause they are soooooo inconsistent. How often does even TOP goalies just fall off a cliff suddenly? We see it every year. Price, Rinne, Schneider, Miller etc etc then some random dude like Jordan Binnington pops out of nowhere and win a cup. Or guys like Dubnyk sucking ass everywhere he played... then he goes to Minny and suddenly he's crazy for awhile. Then how many times teams thought they had a young stud and they'd be set for a decade... then 2 years later that dude is not even around anymore. You just never fvcking know with goalies, its suchhhhh a gamble.

Plus our last trade for a goalie is a good example of that... Schneider was a fvcking stud. I'd love to have horvat or whoever instead of him now though.

That mean said... obviously we need a goalie... but i'd rather sign one or get one through a smaller trade than for our top player.

 

I fully believe we should get the best deal available. My gut tells me that’s NOT going to be a goalie. 

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11 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

i could be totally wrong but id be worried trading for a goalie... just cause they are soooooo inconsistent. How often does even TOP goalies just fall off a cliff suddenly? We see it every year. Price, Rinne, Schneider, Miller etc etc then some random dude like Jordan Binnington pops out of nowhere and win a cup. Or guys like Dubnyk sucking ass everywhere he played... then he goes to Minny and suddenly he's crazy for awhile. Then how many times teams thought they had a young stud and they'd be set for a decade... then 2 years later that dude is not even around anymore. You just never fvcking know with goalies, its suchhhhh a gamble.

Plus our last trade for a goalie is a good example of that... Schneider was a fvcking stud. I'd love to have horvat or whoever instead of him now though.

That mean said... obviously we need a goalie... but i'd rather sign one or get one through a smaller trade than for our top player.

 

That’s easier said than done. 

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1 minute ago, mfitz804 said:

I fully believe we should get the best deal available. My gut tells me that’s NOT going to be a goalie. 

I don’t think we’re a getting a deal any of us will be happy with tbh. Byram, Knight...these are pipe dreams. 

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1 minute ago, Nicomo said:

That’s easier said than done. 

oh of course but i'd rather get a safer return for the biggest asset we've ever traded.

and again, obviously it could be the best trade we've ever made too, who knows. But like i said its basically impossible for scouts to really know for prospects when even top NHL goalies can fall off a cliff so fast

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We need Byram. Get it done Shero. come on just do it.

Edited by Devils01

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9 hours ago, Nicomo said:

That’s easier said than done. 

I'd want any goalie coming back in a Hall trade to be the 2nd or 3rd piece and not the center piece of the trade. I agree with Shero's approach to goalie. Draft one every year and hope to strike gold. Hasn't worked yet, but Schmid/Brady have shown some signs in the USHL and Senns has been the best goalie in the Bing (not saying much, but still he's taken control of the #1 job in his first year in NA).  

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43 minutes ago, Steadevils said:

I'd want any goalie coming back in a Hall trade to be the 2nd or 3rd piece and not the center piece of the trade. I agree with Shero's approach to goalie. Draft one every year and hope to strike gold. Hasn't worked yet, but Schmid/Brady have shown some signs in the USHL and Senns has been the best goalie in the Bing (not saying much, but still he's taken control of the #1 job in his first year in NA).  

That would be fine if you were talking about some random backup, or a mid round prospect. Which Knight is not. 

Something tells me when we actually see what we’re going to get back for Hall people will be wishing we could have got a one-for-one for Knight...

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Now I will be happy getting a low 1st round pick a defensive prospect and a 1st string ahl goalie.. wow how thing have spiraled 

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11 hours ago, Nicomo said:

I don’t think we’re a getting a deal any of us will be happy with tbh. Byram, Knight...these are pipe dreams. 

The only way the above changes is if a team that feels strongly that it can win a Cup suddenly sees one or two key offensive contributors in their forward corps go down with a long-term injury, and becomes desperate to keep their chances alive.  Then Shero will have more leverage.

But we've seen teams suddenly go to Plan B when they feel the asking price for a certain player is too high...it's easy for fans to beat their chests and say "This player or bust, that's it!"  Barring a scenario like the one I just described, no, we probably won't be thrilled with the initial return for Hall.  We'll be a lot less thrilled if Hall is somehow here past the deadline, or even worse, suffers an injury before Shero gets a deal done for him.  I'm all for whatever's going to suck the least...and that's getting some pieces back for Hall. 

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The longer Shero waits, the more the return diminishes (theoretically).

Tick, tock.

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Does anyone think there's a chance he remains here until free agency, or even re-signs here before then? I know all things seem to point to the contrary, but aside from the fact that there's been plenty of rumors and now some circulations of talks being pretty far apart between Shero and other GMs, one thing that has also been apparent is that we really haven't heard much from Shero and/or Hall (or his agent) in terms of whether or not they're negotiating with one another, or whether or not they've officially given up and are not even trying anymore.  

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I guess, to add to my post...why wouldn't a reporter just come right out and ask him "Taylor, there've been a lot of rumors about your contract that's up after this season and whether or not you plan to re-sign here, or if you might be traded before then.  Have you been in talks with your GM Ray Shero about signing a new contract and continuing to play in New Jersey?"  I would.

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1 minute ago, NJDfan1711 said:

Does anyone think there's a chance he remains here until free agency, or even re-signs here before then? I know all things seem to point to the contrary, but aside from the fact that there's been plenty of rumors and now some circulations of talks being pretty far apart between Shero and other GMs, one thing that has also been apparent is that we really haven't heard much from Shero and/or Hall (or his agent) in terms of whether or not they're negotiating with one another, or whether or not they've officially given up and are not even trying anymore.  

Other than an injury, I suppose if Shero is getting really low-balled he can not trade him as a message to other GMs down the road that he will call their bluffs.  That would take some really terrible offers though.

2 minutes ago, NJDfan1711 said:

I guess, to add to my post...why wouldn't a reporter just come right out and ask him "Taylor, there've been a lot of rumors about your contract that's up after this season and whether or not you plan to re-sign here, or if you might be traded before then.  Have you been in talks with your GM Ray Shero about signing a new contract and continuing to play in New Jersey?"  I would.

They did more or less after the Ranger game.  He said he hasn't demanded a trade and that his agent is handling contract issues.

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3 minutes ago, Daniel said:

Other than an injury, I suppose if Shero is getting really low-balled he can not trade him as a message to other GMs down the road that he will call their bluffs.  That would take some really terrible offers though.

They did more or less after the Ranger game.  He said he hasn't demanded a trade and that his agent is handling contract issues.

Gotcha.  I suppose that's a standard answer and by 'handling contract issues' that could essentially mean his agent isn't doing anything since he's under contract until this season and will resume negotiations at that point, and therefore he's effectively just waiting patiently to see if he gets traded.....but at the same time, it could be what I mentioned, and perhaps they (Shero and Hall) are just ignoring the rumors and working things out amongst themselves, behind the scenes....slowly.  

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4 minutes ago, NJDfan1711 said:

Gotcha.  I suppose that's a standard answer and by 'handling contract issues' that could essentially mean his agent isn't doing anything since he's under contract until this season and will resume negotiations at that point, and therefore he's effectively just waiting patiently to see if he gets traded.....but at the same time, it could be what I mentioned, and perhaps they (Shero and Hall) are just ignoring the rumors and working things out amongst themselves, behind the scenes....slowly.  

it would make absolutely no sense to sign taylor hall right now in NJ for either side. Even if he wanted to, why wouldn't the Devils and Hall just pull an Aroldis Chapman and say - get as much as you can for me and I'll re-sign in the summer here with some extra parts as this year is a waste. Sure there's risk all around there, but that's certainly something that could be said. The only downside to Hall would be he could only get a 7 year deal and not an 8 year deal.

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1 minute ago, sundstrom said:

it would make absolutely no sense to sign taylor hall right now in NJ for either side. Even if he wanted to, why wouldn't the Devils and Hall just pull an Aroldis Chapman and say - get as much as you can for me and I'll re-sign in the summer here with some extra parts as this year is a waste. Sure there's risk all around there, but that's certainly something that could be said. The only downside to Hall would be he could only get a 7 year deal and not an 8 year deal.

Yeah I understand that - but from Hall's perspective, if he intends on playing here, then there's really no reason not to do it now, if an agreement can be reached that he's happy with.  We know he can get 8 years, and if Ray's willing to go full term, and it's at a price Hall wants, then might as well do it now.  Obviously that's if he wants to stay here - if he doesn't then yeah it makes sense to wait until the off-season and entertain all offers, but if all he's said is that "my agent is handling negotiations", then that doesn't specifically mean he has no interest in playing here.  I know it doesn't really sound promising, but as we all know and have said many times....we really don't know who these guys are and what they're thinking.  

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6 minutes ago, NJDfan1711 said:

Yeah I understand that - but from Hall's perspective, if he intends on playing here, then there's really no reason not to do it now, if an agreement can be reached that he's happy with.  We know he can get 8 years, and if Ray's willing to go full term, and it's at a price Hall wants, then might as well do it now.  Obviously that's if he wants to stay here - if he doesn't then yeah it makes sense to wait until the off-season and entertain all offers, but if all he's said is that "my agent is handling negotiations", then that doesn't specifically mean he has no interest in playing here.  I know it doesn't really sound promising, but as we all know and have said many times....we really don't know who these guys are and what they're thinking.  

if you read between the lines of media posts, ray hasn't offered 8 years (or likely even 6+) and that's a sticking point.

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1 minute ago, sundstrom said:

if you read between the lines of media posts, ray hasn't offered 8 years (or likely even 6+) and that's a sticking point.

Does ownership start to get a sense of how bleak things are going to be by seeing 5,000 in the arena and instruct Ray to give him 8 years?  Guess not, but who knows.

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2 minutes ago, sundstrom said:

if you read between the lines of media posts, ray hasn't offered 8 years (or likely even 6+) and that's a sticking point.

Ah - I hadn't seen or paid attention to that.  I guess that's because he must think he's a little too old and doesn't want him til he's 35?  Like you mentioned, we don't really have many bargaining points other than that 8th year, so to not use/offer that seems pretty stupid.

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a serious question when has that scenario ever played out in the NHL with a top tier player?

It always sounds great on the surface, no doubt about that.

Honestly imo at this point I think he can not wait to pack his sh!t and leave town.

Edited by titans04

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4 minutes ago, titans04 said:

a serious question when has that scenario ever played out in the NHL with a top tier player?

It always sounds great on the surface, no doubt about that.

Honestly imo at this point I think he can not wait to pack his sh!t and leave town.

For the record, I think this is probably the case too - just playing Devil's advocate and pointing out that there's a somewhat reasonable chance that it may not be.

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1 minute ago, NJDfan1711 said:

For the record, I think this is probably the case too - just playing Devil's advocate and pointing out that there's a somewhat reasonable chance that it may not be.

same, just wondering if there's a case where this played out and my frustration is blinding my memory.

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