2019 Offseason Thread

[Jerzey]

While I do want to re-sign him for the most part, the truth is he didn’t choose to play here. He was actually pretty pissed when the trade happened. He’s done a good job of being professional about it but I wouldn’t blame him if he wanted to walk. 

The ball is in Shero’s court. He just cannot afford to wait until next offseason or even the trade deadline to make a deal. It has to be this summer. And I really don’t want Shero to go out and make a bunch of stupid trades just to try to entice him. The moves Shero should make for the future of the team greatly depend on what he does with Hall. 

[DevsMan84]

2 minutes ago, Daniel said:

Obviously that's not Stein's job as she works for the team.  There's Masisak, but it seems like Athletic team beat writers don't intrude on the "insiders" scoops as a matter of unofficial policy.

It really can't be that fvcking hard for Abbey or CR to put a phone call into someone.  After all this time, you'd think that one of them would get some kind of source at least to get information on what others have reported, but I guess not.

 

Abbey has 3 tweets in the last 24 hours; one about her flight and the other 2 about the NBA.

[MadDog2020]

REPORT: MY BALLS ARE HAIRY. 🙄 This garbage doesn’t even warrant discussion. Hall isn’t going anywhere. Next. 

[mfitz804]

12 minutes ago, Daniel said:

Admittedly it was second hand, but it was in the offseason prior to the start of 2017-18, i.e. coming off a really bad year, where someone I know and generally trust said he was happy with the organization and the area.

That's not his actions, that's just something he said. Like I said above, he could just be saying what he's supposed to say so the fan base doesn't hate him. It's not until its contract time that you'll know if it is true or not. 

6 minutes ago, Daniel said:

Obviously that's not Stein's job as she works for the team. 

In fact, reporting on it would probably be a fireable offense for her. 

 

4 minutes ago, Jerzey said:

While I do want to re-sign him for the most part, the truth is he didn’t choose to play here. He was actually pretty pissed when the trade happened. He’s done a good job of being professional about it but I wouldn’t blame him if he wanted to walk. 

The ball is in Shero’s court. He just cannot afford to wait until next offseason or even the trade deadline to make a deal. It has to be this summer. And I really don’t want Shero to go out and make a bunch of stupid trades just to try to entice him. The moves Shero should make for the future of the team greatly depend on what he does with Hall. 

Exactly. 

My feeling is, the money is going to be there, that won't be an issue. The sole consideration is whether or not Taylor wants to stay. If he does, I will be happy to have him. If he doesn't, he needs to be traded ASAP to maximize the return; trading him at the deadline doesn't hold as much value as trading him now. Granted, its not MUCH more valuable to get him now, but still, its better than an organization bringing him in to play 20 games. If you get him for the whole season, maybe he has time to fall in love with your city or your organization where at the trade deadline he wouldn't. 

Just now, MadDog2020 said:

REPORT: MY BALLS ARE HAIRY. 🙄 This garbage doesn’t even warrant discussion. Hall isn’t going anywhere. Next. 

Source?

(If you weren't thinking "your mama", I have lost respect lol). 

[Daniel]

3 minutes ago, Jerzey said:

While I do want to re-sign him for the most part, the truth is he didn’t choose to play here. He was actually pretty pissed when the trade happened. He’s done a good job of being professional about it but I wouldn’t blame him if he wanted to walk. 

The ball is in Shero’s court. He just cannot afford to wait until next offseason or even the trade deadline to make a deal. It has to be this summer. And I really don’t want Shero to go out and make a bunch of stupid trades just to try to entice him. The moves Shero should make for the future of the team greatly depend on what he does with Hall. 

I don't think it's necessarily true that the return will be better this summer than at the deadline.  Ottawa got a better return at the deadline for Stone than it did for Karlsson prior to training camp and Karlsson is the better player.

Basically, even if Hall says hell no he's signing, I don't trade him until there's a deal the team is really comfortable with.  A late first round pick and bunch of crap is not that. 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Just now, DevsMan84 said:

I agree but I wouldn't hold my breath.  CR doesn't care, Abbey would rather cover the Mets and Stein is just a glorified PR spokesperson for the Devils.

But I do care!  A lot!  heh heh

1 hour ago, mfitz804 said:

Bottom line is, none of us know what Taylor is thinking at this point. 

This sums up why I really don't get that involved in speculating on what players might do or what "makes sense" for them...as much as we like to believe (as the most hardcore reps of this fanbase) that we have ANY insight into what these guys are thinking, we just don't, and we never will...guys stay in situations that seem mind-boggling to us, and guys leave seemingly ideal places for pastures that don't seem all that green to us. 

I'm with you in that I haven't the slightest idea what Hall's going to do this offseason.  But what I do believe is that if it looks like he's not going to sign prior to the season, Shero's gotta move on...I might feel differently if the Devils were close to winning a Cup in 2020, but I don't think anyone sees that coming.  As we've seen, the returns on these kinds of deals can definitely be underwhelming, and in Hall's case, coming off a year where he missed so many games isn't going to up his value any.  But the Devils just aren't in the position to roll the dice on 2019-20 being a huge year or Hall deciding to either forego UFA before 7/1/2020, or shopping himself around and then deciding to stay.  This is a situation where I'd definitely say do the best that you can in the trade market, and then regroup.

[MadDog2020]

19 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

That's not his actions, that's just something he said. Like I said above, he could just be saying what he's supposed to say so the fan base doesn't hate him. It's not until its contract time that you'll know if it is true or not. 

In fact, reporting on it would probably be a fireable offense for her. 

 

Exactly. 

My feeling is, the money is going to be there, that won't be an issue. The sole consideration is whether or not Taylor wants to stay. If he does, I will be happy to have him. If he doesn't, he needs to be traded ASAP to maximize the return; trading him at the deadline doesn't hold as much value as trading him now. Granted, its not MUCH more valuable to get him now, but still, its better than an organization bringing him in to play 20 games. If you get him for the whole season, maybe he has time to fall in love with your city or your organization where at the trade deadline he wouldn't. 

Source?

(If you weren't thinking "your mama", I have lost respect lol). 

CAA security guard. He’s my source on all things Devils. 😛

[Daniel]

To put things another way, if Hall exploited some loophole in his contract that none of us knew about and walked away two hours ago, we are probably in better shape going forward than Columbus, who in the end nobody faulted for not trading Panarin or Bob (unless someone was offering an unreal return) and trading for Duchene. 

The point is not be oblivious to what might eventually occur.  It's just that a trade should not be forced by the start of training camp. 

[Guadana]

Only for talking in post-season

 

Toronto need some passion. Organisation dreams about cup so much. Like Hall. And Hall loves toronto(raptors especially). And Toronto need cup space. Hall can make some discount for them... and Marner doesn`t want to make discount. 

And we can give all money of this world to marner. In his 20 years. 

Couple of conditional picks and Hall for Marner - i think evrybody in NJ erea will be ok with this.

 

Dreams-dreams.

Edited June 3, 2019 by Guadana

[NJDfan1711]

1 hour ago, mfitz804 said:

You can't say it makes no sense. You can argue it either way. 

He's been here for three years, as the result of a trade, i.e. against his will. He never wanted to come here. Immediately after getting traded, he said he would like to go back to Edmonton. He's Canadian, and there are Canadian teams that are way more competitive than we are right now. 

He won the Hart and we made the playoffs ONLY because he was the only good player on the team. If we had another star player on the roster, the whole "he carried the whole team" argument is invalid and one of the other guys wins the Hart. Should he be excited that the team sucked so bad that they gave him an award?

He got hurt and the team reverted to its previous state, not a playoff team, barely playing NHL hockey, and battling for last place overall. 

Add to all of that that he could make more money on the same contract in other states that don't have a State income tax. 

Is it more exciting for him to think that the Devils are moving in the right direction with young stars, or maybe consider going to a team that made the playoffs where he could maybe be the difference between a second round exit and a Stanley Cup?

All of the above are just counterpoints to your points. Bottom line is, none of us know what Taylor is thinking at this point. 

 

Oh I agree.  I think what I said was confusing, and/or hard to interpret.  I was just saying that I don't think it makes sense to suggest that there are no reasons for Hall to want to be here.  Because there are.  Quite a few, in fact.  But, like you said, there are reasons for him to want to possibly go elsewhere as well.  But just like it wouldn't make sense to say "there's no reason Hall would want to look elsewhere", it doesn't make sense to say "there's no reason Hall would want to return to the Devils".  That's what I was refuting, which is essentially what that moron reporter was saying.

[Jerzey]

1 hour ago, Daniel said:

I don't think it's necessarily true that the return will be better this summer than at the deadline.  Ottawa got a better return at the deadline for Stone than it did for Karlsson prior to training camp and Karlsson is the better player.

Basically, even if Hall says hell no he's signing, I don't trade him until there's a deal the team is really comfortable with.  A late first round pick and bunch of crap is not that. 

I definitely agree that we should try to get the best deal we can but I think the best deal we can get would be this summer. I’m not sure why the Sens got a better deal for Stone but I wouldn’t want to risk it. 

[MadDog2020]

4 minutes ago, Jerzey said:

I definitely agree that we should try to get the best deal we can but I think the best deal we can get would be this summer. I’m not sure why the Sens got a better deal for Stone but I wouldn’t want to risk it. 

The Sens got a better deal for Stone because he agreed to an extension with Vegas. Karlsson did not agree to an extension with SJ.

[mfitz804]

8 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

The Sens got a better deal for Stone because he agreed to an extension with Vegas. Karlsson did not agree to an extension with SJ.

Yup. The idea was fundamentally flawed anyway, you can't compare return on two deals for two different players in different circumstances (one with the extension, one not) from two different organizations with two different GM's. 

[Jerzey]

10 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

The Sens got a better deal for Stone because he agreed to an extension with Vegas. Karlsson did not agree to an extension with SJ.

That’s true. I had just put that together in my head and came to post that. 

[Daniel]

14 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

The Sens got a better deal for Stone because he agreed to an extension with Vegas. Karlsson did not agree to an extension with SJ.

Fine, but the point is that we're better off trying to have a good run this year with Hall than trading him for an HF Boards offer from a Flames fan.  And there's no rule that says offers will be better in August or September than in February. 

Edited June 3, 2019 by Daniel

[mfitz804]

39 minutes ago, Daniel said:

And there's no rule that says offers will be better in August or September than in February. 

No, that’s true, but there’s a general understanding that there would be more value in a full season of a star player than in 15-20 games. 

It doesn’t guarantee that you will get more value, though, because a team at the deadline could be more desperate than they were coming out of camp, that would be the better argument. 

[Daniel]

26 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

No, that’s true, but there’s a general understanding that there would be more value in a full season of a star player than in 15-20 games. 

It doesn’t guarantee that you will get more value, though, because a team at the deadline could be more desperate than they were coming out of camp, that would be the better argument. 

I think the only advantage to trading before the season starts from our standpoint is that a team that agrees to trade a first rounder might end doing worse than expected, but even then the picks are usually lottery protected.  Otherwise, you can make the case that a team would be willing to part with better assets when there's more of a certainty that someone like Hall is going to help them make a deep playoff run. 

[Nicomo]

5 hours ago, Guadana said:

Only for talking in post-season

 

Toronto need some passion. Organisation dreams about cup so much. Like Hall. And Hall loves toronto(raptors especially). And Toronto need cup space. Hall can make some discount for them... and Marner doesn`t want to make discount. 

And we can give all money of this world to marner. In his 20 years. 

Couple of conditional picks and Hall for Marner - i think evrybody in NJ erea will be ok with this.

 

Dreams-dreams.

Getting back a player the caliber of Marner would be amazing. If he’d re-sign. 

[glenwo2]

On 6/2/2019 at 11:36 PM, Nicomo said:

We were fvcked the moment Hall went down. 

If we only knew then what would transpire later....

 

 

My mind is still blown.

[vadvlfan]

David Pagnotta (4th period) is an occasional guest on XM.  A few years ago they used to have Ekland  (2.3%) on. Then all of a sudden he disappeared (upon realizing he had no credibility) Hopefully the same fate will go to Pagnotta after this rumor.

But, I understand to a certain extent Hall wanting to see how the off season goes. My fear is he might  pull a Tavares. I hope Ray puts a time limit on Hallsy's decision.( i.e. if he doesn't want to sign by mid November-) We can't continually kiss his backside & genuflect.  He's not the only one holding the cards. I hope he signs here, but to lose him for nada would be no so good.

[vadvlfan]

Also, after I read the Marner for Hall "swap" (idea above Guadana)  I thought it was pretty far out there.   But, not so much any more.  Kinda makes sense.

I'm calling Ray! 

[Devilsfan118]

Man I cannot imagine they would deal Marner for Hall unless we packaged something very, very significant along with him.

I just can't see it happening.

[mfitz804]

Probably would have to add Ty Smith, and two other assets.

[Rob_Ottawa]

1 minute ago, mfitz804 said:

Probably would have to add Ty Smith, and two other assets.

I'd tell Dubas to fvck off and call Edmonton for a swindle like that.

Marner is talented yes, but also a mini-mite who would get eaten alive in a long series with men like the current Stanley cup final.

 

 

[Daniel]

Regarding the comparisons to Tavares, the bottom line is that Ray is smarter than Garth Snow (Lou has very little role to play in what eventually happened) and Harris is a better and more experienced sports team owner than the people who own the Isles.  He has yet to been outsmarted or forced into an untenable position.  So I have confidence that he’ll get the best possible result here.