Devilsfan118 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 17 minutes ago, Jerzey said: I guess we should also wait to see how much Trouba extends for before getting too upset. He might want like 9-10 million per. I'm guessing 7 x 7 just to piss everyone off even more. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 19 minutes ago, Jerzey said: I guess we should also wait to see how much Trouba extends for before getting too upset. He might want like 9-10 million per. Enough for the Rags to sign Panarin while Ray asks Harris to pay for a parade to announce the re-acquisition of Brian Boyle. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 Watch, Point signs for 4x$4m. People will really lose their minds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 11 minutes ago, jagknife said: Watch, Point signs for 4x$4m. People will really lose their minds Waiting for Tampa to give the Rags 27 overall for Callahan. When asked for comment why he just sat there and did nothing, Ray will say that it's an inefficient use of cap space per our analytics department, also known as the Department of Not Winning. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevsMan84 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 Quick thoughts on the Trouba trade: 1) Jets seemed to be very gung-ho about getting a 1st rounder back. We don't have that unless we want to give up our first overall which ain't happening. You can argue our 2nd rounder which amounts to a 34th overall is not much different (talent-wise) than the 20th overall they got back, but to many GM's it does. I guess the whole mentality that if you are picking someone in the second round that means the player you are selecting has already been passed over by every team once comes into play. The closest thing we have to a 20th overall is Ty Smith, which is off-limits IMO. 2) I think there is some overreactions going on here, but I don't think it is wrong to be concerned. I actually like how the Rangers are rebuilding more than how the Devils are doing it. They are trading top-end talent (Zucc, Hayes, etc) on their team and getting first rounders for them. We, on the other hand, are trading guys like Boyle, Lovejoy and MoJo and appropriately getting 2nd and 3rd's for them. If the Devils want to speed up the process, we gotta be in the mentality of giving up guys of value and really work on getting first rounders. That means going forward anyone not named Smith, Hischier and Hughes are available. 3) I am pretty much resigned to the fact that Hall is gone sooner rather than later. I am fine with that. However, I am fully expecting the meltdown when the return is going to be less than thrilling for him. I don't think he is going to fetch peanuts, but he isn't going to command a king's ransom even if we trade him tomorrow. If we get a first rounder for him I would be content enough with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matteau#32 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 1 hour ago, NJDfan1711 said: I don't know that it's a given by any means that they land Panarin. For one, there's lots of other teams he himself could be interested in, secondly, there's lots of other teams that maybe he isn't interested in but the teams have flexibility and room to add him so they make him an offer, and three, the Rangers don't exactly have a ton of room themselves. This year they still have to sign Buchnevich and Trouba, and next year if they plan to keep any of these guys they'll have to sign Kreider, Namestikov, Strome, Vesey and Fast. I don't think they are signing Panarin. Of Kreider, Namestikov, Strome, Vesey, and Fast, the only guys who will be extended are possibly Kreider and Fast. If Kreider is not extened before the trade deadline, he is likely moved. Namestikov, Strome likely traded at deadline or allowed to just walk. Seems like Vesey will be traded soon, possibly by friday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 12 hours ago, Daniel said: Am really starting to think that Shero is evil twin of Sandy Alderson. A Trouba trade is something he had to and could have easily pulled off based on what the Rags gave up, and he just sat there. In the end, Shero has had two first overall picks, and the Rangers have completed their rebuild faster than we have. I’m pretty disgusted right now. If Shero was Sandy he’d be outbidding himself signing a bunch of second tier guys and role players. I wouldn’t say the Rangers have completed their rebuild but Gordon sure had a lot more pieces to flip than Shero did and only one fewer lotto win. Where was our McDonaugh, Stepan, Hayes or Zucc to deal off for assets? Our most tradeable pieces were Jagr and Zidlicky, both of whom Lou had already dealt off, and Shero more or less turned Jagr into Palmieri. Don’t get me wrong, I have my gripes with Shero and think he needs to kick things into gear starting this weekend but other than our failure to take full advantage of cap space I don’t see an obvious non move to ding him on. O’Reilly? I guess...that certainly looked like a horrible trade from the moment it was made. Edited June 18, 2019 by NJDevs4978 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonDreads Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 "SHARU UR CHEEP WAKE UP !!!" 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevsMan84 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, NJDevs4978 said: If Shero was Sandy he’d be outbidding himself signing a bunch of second tier guys and role players. I wouldn’t say the Rangers have completed their rebuild but Gordon sure had a lot more pieces to flip than Shero did and only one fewer lotto win. Where was our McDonaugh, Stepan, Hayes or Zucc to flip for high picks and prospects? Hall, Palms, Vatanen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, Daniel said: Waiting for Tampa to give the Rags 27 overall for Callahan. When asked for comment why he just sat there and did nothing, Ray will say that it's an inefficient use of cap space per our analytics department, also known as the Department of Not Winning. (to paraphrase the artist formerly known as KITB) Seriously. Rangers make one fvcking move and you've completely lost your sh!t over it. Can you at least give Shero the friggin' offseason before making all of your over-the-top declarations? Your endless bitching is becoming exhausting man. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDfan1711 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 6 minutes ago, Matteau#32 said: I don't think they are signing Panarin. Of Kreider, Namestikov, Strome, Vesey, and Fast, the only guys who will be extended are possibly Kreider and Fast. If Kreider is not extened before the trade deadline, he is likely moved. Namestikov, Strome likely traded at deadline or allowed to just walk. Seems like Vesey will be traded soon, possibly by friday. I think that's spot on. Kreider's still young enough to be considered a core piece, and Namestikov doesn't have any real ties to the team. I wonder what Vesey brings back in a trade after 3 consistent, yet pretty uninspiring seasons. He improved a little bit this year, but I'm not sure that he ever becomes a 50 point player. He's young enough where he could put together a 25-25 season I suppose, but he seems like he's a 3rd line guy. Best thing he's got going for him is his age and his durability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said: Hall, Palms, Vatanen There's no more Chiarelli to pick on anymore and it'll all be for nothing anyway when Hall demands a trade because Joonas Doonskoi doesn't do it for him. Palms and Vatanen have gotten us exactly what? Ray has a cargo cult understanding of what it takes to build a winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevsMan84 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, Daniel said: There's no more Chiarelli to pick on anymore and it'll all be for nothing anyway when Hall demands a trade because Joonas Doonskoi doesn't do it for him. Palms and Vatanen have gotten us exactly what? Ray has a cargo cult understanding of what it takes to build a winner. Like I said before, the return for Hall is going to be underwhelming no matter when and if we trade him. I still say he is worth a 1st to most teams. Vats may have some value. Palms probably has a lot. Yeah it would suck to trade away ~30 goals a season but he aren't winning cups with him being on the top line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 1 hour ago, CMONPETEYD said: I can't blame anyones negativity at this point..... for the last year and a half or so the moves that have been made have been uninspiring at best while we see other teams make nice smart moves. If you want to point at this one deal i think thats misguided in some sense, but I think its the opportunities passing us by that probably hurt more.... Could we have paid the same price for Skinner - probably! How about O'Reilly? Sure - didn't seem too high.... Now Trouba - Price was reasonable... So when the fans see 30 million + in cap space, 10 picks, a ton of prospects (some better than others) and then all of these deals & signing happen where we miss out... I think collectively it takes a toll on the fan base. At some point soon - and I mean soon (2-3 months), Ray better do something more than an over reaction to missing the bus on some of these other trades. Agreed...that’s the real issue here and why people are prematurely freaking out. Because we have been sold this bill of goods before and wind up finding reasons or excuses not to do anything. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonDreads Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 10 minutes ago, Daniel said: There's no more Chiarelli to pick on anymore and it'll all be for nothing anyway when Hall demands a trade because Joonas Doonskoi doesn't do it for him. Palms and Vatanen have gotten us exactly what? Ray has a cargo cult understanding of what it takes to build a winner. The Rangers trade for Jacob Trouba, a top 4 defenseman: An astute move that deserves praise Shero trades for Sami Vatanen, a top 4 defenseman: Ray has a cargo cult understanding of what it takes to build a winner. Step off the ledge, bud. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 I'm sure Ray will "do something." It will involve bringing in guys who might have scored twenty goals in a season once whose Corsi really impressed some twitter randos and who Dellows says is a better value per cap dollar spent than Panarin. But, man any day that cap space is going to lace up some skates and really win us some games. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 1 minute ago, CommonDreads said: The Rangers trade for Jacob Trouba, a top 4 defenseman: An astute move that deserves praise Shero trades for Sami Vatanen, a top 4 defenseman: Ray has a cargo cult understanding of what it takes to build a winner. Step off the ledge, bud. Jacob Trouba instantly becomes our best defenseman by a longshot. Vatanen is a guy who can't stay healthy and is one dimensional. Ray sees some depth guys on teams that win and think that's how the Devils will win. Hence bringing in a third liner like Kevin Labanc instead of an impact player. That's what's going to happen. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonDreads Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 52 minutes ago, Daniel said: Jacob Trouba instantly becomes our best defenseman by a longshot. Vatanen is a guy who can't stay healthy and is one dimensional. Ray sees some depth guys on teams that win and think that's how the Devils will win. Hence bringing in a third liner like Kevin Labanc instead of an impact player. That's what's going to happen. Sami Vatanen instantly became our best defenseman when we traded for him, so it's different...how? Wasn't aware Hall was a depth guy and not an impact player. Shero has made his big impact player trade and has worked to supplement pieces around him. He stole Palmieri and Palms is arguably a 1st line NHL forward who's capable of scoring 30 goals, that's an impact player. Johansson, while it didn't work out here, is a 2nd line forward on most teams, that's an impact player. You can't selectively whine and twist around history to fit your narrative when our rivals acquire good players. That's how pro sports works, the teams you dislike are going to get good players from time to time. Edited June 18, 2019 by CommonDreads 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDog2020 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 6 minutes ago, Daniel said: Jacob Trouba instantly becomes our best defenseman by a longshot. Vatanen is a guy who can't stay healthy and is one dimensional. Ray sees some depth guys on teams that win and think that's how the Devils will win. Hence bringing in a third liner like Kevin Labanc instead of an impact player. That's what's going to happen. I don’t know how often you listened to WFAN back in the day, but you sound like Jerome from Manhattan. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDog2020 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 28 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said: Like I said before, the return for Hall is going to be underwhelming no matter when and if we trade him. I still say he is worth a 1st to most teams. Vats may have some value. Palms probably has a lot. Yeah it would suck to trade away ~30 goals a season but he aren't winning cups with him being on the top line. I understand is as fans have a strong tendency to over value our own players, but if Shero only gets a first for Hall, a guy one year removed from being the MVP of the league and pulling a team to the playoffs damn near single handedly, then Shero failed. We also have missed the playoffs three out of four seasons. While he has rebuilt our farm system from the roster equivalent of a fourth world country, not fielding a team that can finish in the top 20, let alone in the post season outside of the aforementioned season, will also be an issue. I alluded to it yesterday after my initial “fvck fvck fvck” post when the deal was announced, he’s got the next two weeks to show progress. If we stand pat at the draft while others make moves, and/or 1 July ends with nothing to show, i’m going to be upset. not like a keyboard warrior being upset matters but it might make me feel better for exactly 6.9 seconds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevsMan84 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, jagknife said: I understand is as fans have a strong tendency to over value our own players, but if Shero only gets a first for Hall, a guy one year removed from being the MVP of the league and pulling a team to the playoffs damn near single handedly, then Shero failed. We also have missed the playoffs three out of four seasons. While he has rebuilt our farm system from the roster equivalent of a fourth world country, not fielding a team that can finish in the top 20, let alone in the post season outside of the aforementioned season, will also be an issue. I alluded to it yesterday after my initial “fvck fvck fvck” post when the deal was announced, he’s got the next two weeks to show progress. If we stand pat at the draft while others make moves, and/or 1 July ends with nothing to show, i’m going to be upset. not like a keyboard warrior being upset matters but it might make me feel better for exactly 6.9 seconds It might be a first and some prospect or middling to lower roster player. Or some package that involves a first, a middling prospect, and maybe a 3rd rounder. I am not 100% sure of the return but it will be underwhelming. By how much is yet to be seen but the guy is 1 season removed from UFA and is coming off a season where he was out for more than half due to injury. He isn't going to command a huge haul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matteau#32 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 50 minutes ago, NJDfan1711 said: I think that's spot on. Kreider's still young enough to be considered a core piece, and Namestikov doesn't have any real ties to the team. I wonder what Vesey brings back in a trade after 3 consistent, yet pretty uninspiring seasons. He improved a little bit this year, but I'm not sure that he ever becomes a 50 point player. He's young enough where he could put together a 25-25 season I suppose, but he seems like he's a 3rd line guy. Best thing he's got going for him is his age and his durability. Supposedly, Buffalo is interested in Vesey. They have the 31st, but the Rangers would have to add to it, to get it. They do not have a 2nd, but have a 3rd. I think a 3rd is too little, so maybe a 2nd next year? Maybe Vesey and something (the Stars 2nd, which is 49th) for the 31st? Namestnikov likely moved in a deal similar to Grabner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilsfan118 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 1 hour ago, CommonDreads said: "SHARU UR CHEEP WAKE UP !!!" Wait I'm confused - he's an RFA isn't he? Why the hell does he have a say where he goes? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 14 minutes ago, jagknife said: I understand is as fans have a strong tendency to over value our own players, but if Shero only gets a first for Hall, a guy one year removed from being the MVP of the league and pulling a team to the playoffs damn near single handedly, then Shero failed. We also have missed the playoffs three out of four seasons. While he has rebuilt our farm system from the roster equivalent of a fourth world country, not fielding a team that can finish in the top 20, let alone in the post season outside of the aforementioned season, will also be an issue. I alluded to it yesterday after my initial “fvck fvck fvck” post when the deal was announced, he’s got the next two weeks to show progress. If we stand pat at the draft while others make moves, and/or 1 July ends with nothing to show, i’m going to be upset. not like a keyboard warrior being upset matters but it might make me feel better for exactly 6.9 seconds If that happens, Ray needs to be fired immediately, but of course he won't since our owners really really love that cap space. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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