NJDevs4978 Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 45 minutes ago, devlman said: We’re rebuilding around a bunch of 18-20 year olds. Part of the core will undoubtedly still be in juniors/minors and are works in progress. When you stockpile a number of them, like we have, chances are a few will stick, which means we should have a good core around Nico/Jack in the coming years. Or, maybe they all don’t. But we’re set up very nicely to give ourselves a good chance to have a few of them make it. It’s not fair to say we won’t have a good D core or view it as empty in the coming years when those prospects are still simmering. Except we heard and perpetuated the same song and dance we're doing with Smith and Bahl on Santini, Severson, Larsson, Merrill and Gelinas just several years ago. We supposedly had a strong homegrown defensive core coming and of those only Severson is barely a top four D, Larsson was that for a couple years but not really one and the others are third-paring/washouts. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, MB3 said: If you believe the NHL that the lotto balls aren’t rigged — and I do — the fact that we’ve won 2 lottery’s in the past three years has no bearing on this season. i still stand by “I want to see this team put some dubs on the board and feel good about themselves.” I've always been that way. I don't believe in the whole losing to make you better especially when you already have a lot of younger players on the team. Losing just means the younger players you have aren't doing jack and you don't have much on the roster that you hope will lead a turnaround. Plus it's a lotto anyway. You're almost as likely to win a lotto missing the playoffs as you are with the worst record. Lucking into Nico and Hughes doesn't change the fact that these last several seasons have been mostly miserable and whether they put together a junktime second half stretch a la the football Jets or not, this season was over by Halloween. Edited January 3, 2020 by NJDevs4978 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devlman Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) 35 minutes ago, NJDevs4978 said: Except we heard and perpetuated the same song and dance we're doing with Smith and Bahl on Santini, Severson, Larsson, Merrill and Gelinas just several years ago. We supposedly had a strong homegrown defensive core coming and of those only Severson is barely a top four D, Larsson was that for a couple years but not really one and the others are third-paring/washouts. All you need to do is hit on a couple. Severson and Larson are top 4 dmen and Merrill is a solid third pairing NHLer. It was a pretty decent crop - not great but still pretty decent. If we can get a couple top 4 guys from this current crop we’ll be just fine supplementing them with FA’s, trades, and any surprise players. This current crop will actually have talent in front of them to greatly reduce the amount of times being penned and demoralized in the D Zone night after night. Edited January 3, 2020 by devlman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicomo Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 7 minutes ago, devlman said: All you need to do is hit on a couple. Severson and Larson are top 4 dmen and Merrill is a solid third pairing NHLer. If we can get a couple top 4 guys from this crop we’ll be just fine supplementing them with FA’s, trades, and any surprise players. This current crop will actually have talent in front of them to greatly reduce the amount of times being penned and demoralized in the D Zone night after night. Actually, Merill is a forward now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SterioDesign Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) I mean... it's like some fans think it's easy to just "pick the right guys" lol and that if you don't have a strong group that it's cause you failed. Sometimes looking at the big picture can help understand how hockey teams are built. There's so much luck involved on top of scouting. if you look at how the best defensive teams are built... Nashville for example... they drafted "really well" in 2008-2009 picking 3 of their current top 4 but since then? Current Lineup Josi (29 years old / #38 overall 2008) - Ellis (29 years old / #11 overall 2009) Ekholm (29 years old / #102 overall 2009) - Fabbro (21 years old / #17 overall 2016) Hamhuis (37 years old / #12 overall 2001) - Irwin (32 years old / Undrafted) Well that's all great... but since the 2008 draft... here's the D they drafted.... Roman Josi (#38 - 2008) Jeff Foss (#166 - 2008) - Zero NHL game Played Ryan Ellis (#11 - 2009) Charles-Olivier Roussel (#42 - 2009) - Zero NHL game Played Matthias Ekholm (#102 - 2009) Taylor Aronson (#78 - 2010) - Zero NHL Game Played Anthony Bitetto (#168 - 2010) - Zero NHL Game Played Garrett Noonan (#112 - 2011) - Zero NHL Game Played Simon Karlsson (#142 - 2011) - Zero NHL Game Played Mikko Vainonen (#118 - 2012) - Zero NHL Game Played Simon Fernholm (#164 - 2012) - Zero NHL Game Played Seth Jones (#4 - 2013) Jonathan-Ismael Diaby (#64 - 2013) - Zero NHL Game Played Temmu Kivihalme (#140 - 2013) - Zero NHL Game Played Jack Dougherty (#51 - 2014) - Zero NHL Game Played Joonas Lyytinen (#132 - 2014) - Zero NHL Game Played Aaron Irving (#162 - 2014) - Zero NHL Game Played Alexandre Carrier (#115 - 2015) - Zero NHL Game Played Dante Fabbro (#17 - 2016) Samuel Girard (#47 -2016) Frederic Allard (#78 - 2016) - Zero NHL Game Played Hady Haman Aktell (#108 - 2016) - Zero NHL Game Played Adam Smith (#198 - 2016) - Zero NHL Game Played David Farrance (#92 - 2017) - Zero NHL Game Played Spencer Stastney (#131 - 2018) - Zero NHL Game Played Vladislav Yeryomenko (#151 - 2018) - Zero NHL Game Played Marc Del Gaizo (#109 - 2019) - Zero NHL Game Played Semyon Chysayuakov (#117 - 2019) - Zero NHL Game Played So in 12 years of drafting... Nashville got 6 NHL players... the rest (22 players) never played a single game in the NHL. They drafted Hamhuis back in 2001... he got traded and came back but he's an NHL player... and i suspect if i'd continue this process all the way to 2001 it would be the same thing. TONS of failures We may not have drafted NHL talent like Nashville did... and as much as Gelinas, Merrill, Urbom, Helgeson, Santini, Jacobs, White, etc etc... at least those guys played at LEAST 1 NHL game. Which is better than all but 6 drafted players from Nashville. So all of that to say, it takes time and luck and there's never any guarantee. Edited January 3, 2020 by SterioDesign 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 5 hours ago, SterioDesign said: I mean... it's like some fans think it's easy to just "pick the right guys" lol and that if you don't have a strong group that it's cause you failed. Sometimes looking at the big picture can help understand how hockey teams are built. There's so much luck involved on top of scouting. if you look at how the best defensive teams are built... Nashville for example... they drafted "really well" in 2008-2009 picking 3 of their current top 4 but since then? Current Lineup Josi (29 years old / #38 overall 2008) - Ellis (29 years old / #11 overall 2009) Ekholm (29 years old / #102 overall 2009) - Fabbro (21 years old / #17 overall 2016) Hamhuis (37 years old / #12 overall 2001) - Irwin (32 years old / Undrafted) Well that's all great... but since the 2008 draft... here's the D they drafted.... Roman Josi (#38 - 2008) Jeff Foss (#166 - 2008) - Zero NHL game Played Ryan Ellis (#11 - 2009) Charles-Olivier Roussel (#42 - 2009) - Zero NHL game Played Matthias Ekholm (#102 - 2009) Taylor Aronson (#78 - 2010) - Zero NHL Game Played Anthony Bitetto (#168 - 2010) - Zero NHL Game Played Garrett Noonan (#112 - 2011) - Zero NHL Game Played Simon Karlsson (#142 - 2011) - Zero NHL Game Played Mikko Vainonen (#118 - 2012) - Zero NHL Game Played Simon Fernholm (#164 - 2012) - Zero NHL Game Played Seth Jones (#4 - 2013) Jonathan-Ismael Diaby (#64 - 2013) - Zero NHL Game Played Temmu Kivihalme (#140 - 2013) - Zero NHL Game Played Jack Dougherty (#51 - 2014) - Zero NHL Game Played Joonas Lyytinen (#132 - 2014) - Zero NHL Game Played Aaron Irving (#162 - 2014) - Zero NHL Game Played Alexandre Carrier (#115 - 2015) - Zero NHL Game Played Dante Fabbro (#17 - 2016) Samuel Girard (#47 -2016) Frederic Allard (#78 - 2016) - Zero NHL Game Played Hady Haman Aktell (#108 - 2016) - Zero NHL Game Played Adam Smith (#198 - 2016) - Zero NHL Game Played David Farrance (#92 - 2017) - Zero NHL Game Played Spencer Stastney (#131 - 2018) - Zero NHL Game Played Vladislav Yeryomenko (#151 - 2018) - Zero NHL Game Played Marc Del Gaizo (#109 - 2019) - Zero NHL Game Played Semyon Chysayuakov (#117 - 2019) - Zero NHL Game Played So in 12 years of drafting... Nashville got 6 NHL players... the rest (22 players) never played a single game in the NHL. They drafted Hamhuis back in 2001... he got traded and came back but he's an NHL player... and i suspect if i'd continue this process all the way to 2001 it would be the same thing. TONS of failures We may not have drafted NHL talent like Nashville did... and as much as Gelinas, Merrill, Urbom, Helgeson, Santini, Jacobs, White, etc etc... at least those guys played at LEAST 1 NHL game. Which is better than all but 6 drafted players from Nashville. So all of that to say, it takes time and luck and there's never any guarantee. Not for nothing but going 6 for 22 out of the draft is a sh!t ton better than most teams fare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) All the bolded guys other than Ekholm were top fifty picks. Hitting on almost all the top fifty picks is pretty good, missing on a bunch of 3rd-7ths is par for the course. There's also no luck in developing, Nashville's always been good at churning out defensemen. Edited January 3, 2020 by NJDevs4978 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgeControl Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 our pesky little kids are becoming hard to play against, I didnt see that coming this year! gotta give Nas credit hes added some patience to getting the puck out of our zone at times and has drawn up some pretty nice exits and entry's.. Blackwood has the tools and nice technique, just needs the experience. hes keeping us in games and allowing the offense to get clicking. lets just enjoy the moment. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDfan1711 Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 1 hour ago, jagknife said: Not for nothing but going 6 for 22 out of the draft is a sh!t ton better than most teams fare. Not to mention you could pretty easily make the argument that some of the guys we drafted that he mentioned ("Gelinas, Merrill, Urbom, Helgeson, Santini, Jacobs, White, etc etc") probably cracked the lineup simply because it wasn't hard to beat out the guys who were already occupying roster spots. It's a sad truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgeControl Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 1 hour ago, NJDfan1711 said: Not to mention you could pretty easily make the argument that some of the guys we drafted that he mentioned ("Gelinas, Merrill, Urbom, Helgeson, Santini, Jacobs, White, etc etc") probably cracked the lineup simply because it wasn't hard to beat out the guys who were already occupying roster spots. It's a sad truth. which is why Ty not making THIS ROSTER was such a bummer! merril is getting 17 mins each night btw, his shot never lived up to the expectations but hes in the positive and serviceable. Id flip him for mirco right now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikepeluso8 Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Fire Hynes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilsfan118 Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) 9 hours ago, NJDevs4978 said: Except we heard and perpetuated the same song and dance we're doing with Smith and Bahl on Santini, Severson, Larsson, Merrill and Gelinas just several years ago. We supposedly had a strong homegrown defensive core coming and of those only Severson is barely a top four D, Larsson was that for a couple years but not really one and the others are third-paring/washouts. Remember when our supposed D prospect group was one of the tops in the league? In fairness, who'd have thought that the bolded would largely turn out to be a whole lot of nothing, and that Larsson and Severson would top out as top-4 guys at best. Edit: oh man I'm late to the party, lots of discussion on this already Edited January 3, 2020 by Devilsfan118 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicomo Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 1 hour ago, EdgeControl said: which is why Ty not making THIS ROSTER was such a bummer! merril is getting 17 mins each night btw, his shot never lived up to the expectations but hes in the positive and serviceable. Id flip him for mirco right now He seems to be enjoying Vegas lol 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Eco Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 13 hours ago, Triumph said: This is the first game I've seen since the Christmas break - glad I wasn't a jinx. Solid game against a decent team. Devils played them even and got a bounce. Blackwood was great. I still don't like the R-R/L-L pairings. Let's see less of that in 2020, please. Glad the broadcast highlighted Gusev's insane fake mishandle of the puck on the PP - I was pretty sure live that that was deliberate and had to go back to check. Sure enough. A bit ballsy to do it while up 1 in the 3rd period. The Islanders seem to have a ton of plugs. I don't know how they have won so many games. Yep, same as last year: a bunch of plugs, and really boring "get dominated, but counterattack occasionally" system, but their record is what it is, so strange they can get away with this in the new game, but Trotz is a guy who knows what he's doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Ottawa Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 The really surprising thing about them is their goaltending. You'd think they would have a superstar in net to absorb the 'being dominated and then counterattack' strategy, but they have a couple of b grade netminders and they even swapped one out for another in the offseason, yet the results are the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicomo Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 6 minutes ago, DJ Eco said: Yep, same as last year: a bunch of plugs, and really boring "get dominated, but counterattack occasionally" system, but their record is what it is, so strange they can get away with this in the new game, but Trotz is a guy who knows what he's doing. 2 goalies playing around .920 certainly helps... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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