Jump to content

Ray Shero and Devils Part Ways Effective Immediately


Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, RunninWithTheDevil said:

RE: bolded, you make a great point 

And yeah I said before that the timing is absolutely mind-boggling and looks very "Mickey Mouse" from the outside in. I stop short of 'dysfunctional' ONLY because we don't really know what happened in that room. 

Re:  the bolded, sure, could be that if there was some big-time argument and difference of opinion, that it reached the point where it could only end one way.  We'll probably never find out exactly what happened...if/when Shero does release a statement, I would expect it to be "I thank the Devils for the opportunity, but unfortunately we all felt we'd be better served by moving on as the vision did not meet the reality, we had different ideas, blah blah blah..."  Definitely won't be "I told Harris and Blitzer where they could stick it if they wanted to start getting involved with on-ice personnel decisions, and then they told me where I could stick my job."  

Def not the best optics though, regardless of the circumstances.  

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 674
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Looks like Shero sent Fitzgerald down to the bench to diagnose the problems with team and he came back to the owners and told them the problem is Ray Shero.

I’d believe that 100% to be honest

I'm so sick of hearing about 2015. The end of the 2019-2020 season is a couple of months away. I don't care about 2015. We know it wasn't much, but like I said earlier, I'm focused on 2018. That team

Posted Images

2 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Two years would've represented more of a "good faith, at least you're not a lame duck" kind of move.  Four years should show that you fully and firmly trust your GM...and that you're willing to stand by him even if there's some detours in his "process"...not necessarily for four years, but at least a couple.  To see that shattered just a half-season later...does make one wonder what the hell changed so fast, in ownership's eyes...of course, we've done plenty of speculating as to why this happened, but it's still amazing that ownership had become so disillusioned with Shero that they decided the guy who they had just committed heavily to suddenly and absolutely had to go.  That's the part that feels dysfunctional.  

I really think Hall was huge in this. I think ownership's expectations were that the season would start and pick up from the strong-ish ending to last year, Hall re-signs, PK is PK, Hughes jumps right in, the Devils are in the wild card picture etc. When not one of those things happened and Ray didn't seem to want to fire Hynes, I feel like things soured very quickly. Once they realized Hall wasn't re-signing and HAD to be moved, they were probably very unhappy. 

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

I wonder if Hall publicly stating that he never even got a contract offer from Shero is what set the alarms off for Harris and Blitzer.

It certainly was concerning for me.  If you two are way too far apart that is one thing, but to not at least throw something out there is very odd.

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites
38 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

I really think Hall was huge in this. I think ownership's expectations were that the season would start and pick up from the strong-ish ending to last year, Hall re-signs, PK is PK, Hughes jumps right in, the Devils are in the wild card picture etc. When not one of those things happened and Ray didn't seem to want to fire Hynes, I feel like things soured very quickly. Once they realized Hall wasn't re-signing and HAD to be moved, they were probably very unhappy. 

What I will wonder about is if Ray (over)pitched an aggressive offseason plan to ownership, who then gave him the full green light to do anything that he wanted (especially if part of the pitch was that this flurry of offseason activity would work out well enough that Hall would be a certainty to re-sign, even if Ray knew that there were still no guarantees on that front)...with ownership coming back with "OK Ray, you sold us, but this all better work!"...or if ownership pushed Ray to make "right now" moves before he was fully ready to do so, to speed things up.  Even if we don't know the exact details, seems fairly clear that one party had a sudden change of heart.  Almost feels like ownership was bottling up some anger as this thing fell apart, and then finally exploded (seemingly out of nowhere, especially with the team actually playing better as of late).  

The one move I would suspect was "collaborative" was PK.  I could picture Shero making some kind of Pros and Cons list re:  PK and presenting it to ownership...I think Shero has always been thorough when it comes to player acquisitions, which is why even the ones that didn't work just about all seemed to make good sense at the time they were made (I don't think Shero could've had worse luck that he did with MoJo...that seemed like an absolute no-brainer at the time, and it didn't work out at all).  I could see Shero pointing out that though PK could regain his 2017-18 form, and that he wouldn't have to give up an insane amount in assets to get him, that there were reasons that it might not work...and that the numbers from 2018-19 could be interpreted as the beginning of a decline.  I think the owners liked the idea of a high-profile player like Subban coming aboard, and that if he could be even 80-90% of what he'd been at his peak, that it could be a killer move both off and on the ice.  So even if Shero might have been on the fence about bringing him in, the owners maybe pushed him just enough on making that move that he took the plunge.  

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, lucifer91 said:

Has there been any comments or interviews from Shero yet?  I wonder if at some point he sheds a little light on what happened??

I would expect something from him eventually, but nothing that telling or incriminating.  I think he would like to get another GM gig, and ripping your old team in the process doesn't always go over well...especially since from a strictly forensic angle, Shero's track record here doesn't look terribly impressive.  Sometimes you take the high road until you're truly out of the game...and that's when you go full Neil Smith (DM84 saw him speak at a jersey expo and suffice it to say that Smith was PLENTY forthcoming about how he felt about certain people then).  

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

He may not have made hall an offer cause they wernt taking any until season end.

 

Hall can still say they didnt make an offer knowing he was holding out.

Edited by lazer
Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, lazer said:

He may not have made hall an offer cause they wernt taking any until season end.

 

Hall can still say they didnt make an offer knowing he was holding out.

That's possible.  Shero did have at least a few sit-downs with Hall's agent from what we have learned and Ray may have figured they were just really too far apart.

However, if that is indeed how it went down, I still wish Shero would have at least thrown a formal offer out there.  At least that way he could have covered himself in telling the owners "hey, I tried and he said no."  Instead we hear from Hall saying he never got any offers from Ray.  Is that how he is going to deal with every pending top-tier free agent going forward?

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

That's possible.  Shero did have at least a few sit-downs with Hall's agent from what we have learned and Ray may have figured they were just really too far apart.

However, if that is indeed how it went down, I still wish Shero would have at least thrown a formal offer out there.  At least that way he could have covered himself in telling the owners "hey, I tried and he said no."  Instead we hear from Hall saying he never got any offers from Ray.  Is that how he is going to deal with every pending top-tier free agent going forward?

It’s basic negotiating. You don’t put an offer on the table on the other side says they are not willing to consider any offer at this time. Are use that tactic every single day.

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

It’s basic negotiating. You don’t put an offer on the table on the other side says they are not willing to consider any offer at this time. Are use that tactic every single day.

Maybe I am reading into Hall's words wrong, but he seemed at least somewhat disappointed that an offer wasn't made.

I do think Hall and his agent were probably playing hardball but judging by what I think I saw/heard I don't think they weren't at least open to some sort of offer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

And IIRC, Shero even made a competitive offer to Shattenkirk 3 years ago even though Shattenkirk made it pretty well known that he was certainly going to sign with the Rangers.

No one, even the owners, can fault Shero for kicking tires on someone even though you have next to zero chance of getting the player.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/12/2020 at 7:06 PM, moustic said:

Please no Marty! 

I get that people feel that good players do not, necessarily, make good coaches and FO people.  However, the record in hockey is quite a bit different than in many other sports.  Gretzky turned out to be a pretty mediocre coach, but if memory serves the Devils two best coaches, Lemaire and Robinson, had somewhat promising careers, right folks?  😉  So if Lemaire and Robinson can win us Stanley Cups then I don’t see why Brodeur can’t do the same.  That doesn’t mean he is a guaranteed success, after all we are talking about GMing and not coaching, but I don’t see how hiring Marty is doomed to fail.  It seems to me, given his time in St. Louis, that he is more likely to succeed than most other options.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the GM job is Marty's to lose at this point.

Give him a shot and see what he can do. What is there to lose at this point.

Marty should have a good building block with Nico and Hughes 1-2 down the middle.

I think Marty has the understanding that this organization needs to start developing Dman prospects and go from there.

I think the biggest reason Shero got fired is that he had 4+ years to develop quality defenseman and NOT ONE turned up during his time here. 

Just my cents.

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

I'm not sure about that one. With poile involved that felt like all Ray with the aim being to appease Hall and strengthen the blue line. I'm sure ownership was all about that one too though. And I still like that trade because the thought of this defense with no PK but with Santini in there every night is a little scary. 

Appease Hall for what though...the evidence has come out that Ray never even made Hall an offer.  It seems obvious Ray only wanted Hall back at like a five-year deal which wasn't going to get it done anyway.

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, mfitz804 said:

It’s basic negotiating. You don’t put an offer on the table on the other side says they are not willing to consider any offer at this time. Are use that tactic every single day.

Vatanen has also said Shero didn't make him an offer either.  If you want the guy back you at least 'attempt' to negotiate with him.

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Two years would've represented more of a "good faith, at least you're not a lame duck" kind of move.  Four years should show that you fully and firmly trust your GM...and that you're willing to stand by him even if there's some detours in his "process"...not necessarily for four years, but at least a couple.  To see that shattered just a half-season later...does make one wonder what the hell changed so fast, in ownership's eyes...of course, we've done plenty of speculating as to why this happened, but it's still amazing that ownership had become so disillusioned with Shero that they decided the guy who they had just committed heavily to suddenly and absolutely had to go.  That's the part that feels dysfunctional.  

Well that and the fact they fired him an hour and a half before a home game and not only after giving him a long extension but after letting him fire a coach and trade Hall, just like Hynes got fired a couple hours before a home game, and Hall was scratched and in limbo for like four days before they traded him.  Everything about the way things have been handled this season is third-class.

Edited by NJDevs4978
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, DevsMan84 said:

Maybe I am reading into Hall's words wrong, but he seemed at least somewhat disappointed that an offer wasn't made.

I do think Hall and his agent were probably playing hardball but judging by what I think I saw/heard I don't think they weren't at least open to some sort of offer.

No, i heard him to, i think he said it in the coyotes presser so you can see his body language.

And i think its stupid to not atleast make an offer.

And glad shero didnt overpay for him to.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Think the defense played a part as well. We had no defense before Shero, and still basically the same thing now, we suck still. The development on the defensive side is nill it seems and he's had plenty of time to do his thing. Don't get me wrong I like Ray and definitely see him getting a gig somewhere else within a year or two, but this isn't surprising,tl the timing is but not the move itself 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, NJDevs4978 said:

Vatanen has also said Shero didn't make him an offer either.  If you want the guy back you at least 'attempt' to negotiate with him.

IF the guy hasn’t said “I’m not ready to negotiate”, then I agree. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

What I will wonder about is if Ray (over)pitched an aggressive offseason plan to ownership, who then gave him the full green light to do anything that he wanted (especially if part of the pitch was that this flurry of offseason activity would work out well enough that Hall would be a certainty to re-sign, even if Ray knew that there were still no guarantees on that front)...with ownership coming back with "OK Ray, you sold us, but this all better work!"...or if ownership pushed Ray to make "right now" moves before he was fully ready to do so, to speed things up.  Even if we don't know the exact details, seems fairly clear that one party had a sudden change of heart.  Almost feels like ownership was bottling up some anger as this thing fell apart, and then finally exploded (seemingly out of nowhere, especially with the team actually playing better as of late).  

The one move I would suspect was "collaborative" was PK.  I could picture Shero making some kind of Pros and Cons list re:  PK and presenting it to ownership...I think Shero has always been thorough when it comes to player acquisitions, which is why even the ones that didn't work just about all seemed to make good sense at the time they were made (I don't think Shero could've had worse luck that he did with MoJo...that seemed like an absolute no-brainer at the time, and it didn't work out at all).  I could see Shero pointing out that though PK could regain his 2017-18 form, and that he wouldn't have to give up an insane amount in assets to get him, that there were reasons that it might not work...and that the numbers from 2018-19 could be interpreted as the beginning of a decline.  I think the owners liked the idea of a high-profile player like Subban coming aboard, and that if he could be even 80-90% of what he'd been at his peak, that it could be a killer move both off and on the ice.  So even if Shero might have been on the fence about bringing him in, the owners maybe pushed him just enough on making that move that he took the plunge.  

I was under the impression Ray/ownwership pursued & got PK to show Hallsy commitment to improving the team. Keeping a high profile guy like Hall helped w/ butts in seats. Too bad it didn't work.

Thinking back on our shortcomings, I honest believe it was Devils D zone play (man to man) that killed us. They were chasing their man around and spending so much time, (in D zone) and exhausting themselves doing it. The system didn't work.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, vadvlfan said:

I was under the impression Ray/ownwership pursued & got PK to show Hallsy commitment to improving the team. Keeping a high profile guy like Hall helped w/ butts in seats. Too bad it didn't work.

Thinking back on our shortcomings, I honest believe it was Devils D zone play (man to man) that killed us. They were chasing their man around and spending so much time, (in D zone) and exhausting themselves doing it. The system didn't work.  

In fairness, I think the current Devils D could make a lot of systems look like they don't work.  Overall they've been a bit less scary for a while (though inconsistent from game to game), but as last night reminded us, when they're bad, they can really be tough to watch.

Good news is that it looks like Mueller should be done here after this season.  Understood what Ray was doing there, but it didn't work out, and it's not going to.  Like I've said, at this point, start purging the losers.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, CarpathianForest said:

He ain't wrong. I like how he mentions that we were lucky that Scuderi and Eaton retired

 

 

Damn...This seems pretty darn spot on to me. Brutal, but hard to argue with any of his points and is a pretty good summary on the current state and how we got here. I am not positive we have a single defenseman that will be here when/if we are contending again, so I am not sure it is much of a blame on the system as this gentleman seems to mainly put it on. Ty Smith has a shot and Bahl and walsh and prospect XX maybe, but there is no one that I'd make a significant bet on. There isn't a single defenseman up and down the franchise that you can say  "He'll be a cornerstone 4-5 years from now". That scares me...

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.