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Prospects Thread - 2020-2021 Season


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2 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Wasn't trying to imply that you specifically were giving up on him (though I can see where it seemed like I was).  Just that it seems like many are down on him, and rather quickly.  

What's the potential timetable for Holtz?  2022-23 I'm guessing?  

I think the "right now" part of what I said wasn't clear. I meant I would give him the job for right now since Palmieri is playing bad. Not I would give him the job forever "right now". Bad wording on my part. 

I haven't heard anything about his timetable, but if he's already 19, is there a reason he couldn't try for a spot in 21-22 (if that's a thing)?

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44 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

I think the "right now" part of what I said wasn't clear. I meant I would give him the job for right now since Palmieri is playing bad. Not I would give him the job forever "right now". Bad wording on my part. 

I haven't heard anything about his timetable, but if he's already 19, is there a reason he couldn't try for a spot in 21-22 (if that's a thing)?

If he is on the same trajectory next season I don't see why Holtz wouldn't make the team out of camp. I'm not sure you say the same thing this season, whether he was on the hook to play in Sweden or not. 

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I feel rather confident we'll be seeing Holtz in New Jersey in 2021-22, it's possible the organization could want him to marinate an extra season in Sweden but I think he would be ready to ride shotgun with one of our centers in that sesaon.

We could be in for another big youth push next season, because I'm also expecting both Bahl and Mercer to make big pushes to make the team out of camp in 2021-22.

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5 hours ago, CommonDreads said:

I feel rather confident we'll be seeing Holtz in New Jersey in 2021-22, it's possible the organization could want him to marinate an extra season in Sweden but I think he would be ready to ride shotgun with one of our centers in that sesaon.

We could be in for another big youth push next season, because I'm also expecting both Bahl and Mercer to make big pushes to make the team out of camp in 2021-22.

Maybe Okhotyuk, too? Didn’t he have a pretty good camp? 

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7 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

I'm not as ready to give up on him as some are, but he looks like he might have been Space Jammed.  He's been that shaky...especially alarming (for such a small sample) is the 5 SOG through 4 GP.  Even when he wasn't necessarily finding the net during a cold streak, he was at least still getting his shots (which you knew would eventually go in).  

idk if you came up with the phrase “space jammed” but when I tell you i just snort laughed, hooooly sh!t that’s good stuff.

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2 hours ago, MB3 said:

idk if you came up with the phrase “space jammed” but when I tell you i just snort laughed, hooooly sh!t that’s good stuff.

Yeah that was me heh heh.  Glad I could spread a chuckle.

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5 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Yeah that was me heh heh.  Glad I could spread a chuckle.

I just read it and was like “that’s exactly right”. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
1 hour ago, Chimaira_Devil_#9 said:

No points for Holtz in 6 games. The WJC really broke his flow. 

Is he back on a line with Eklund? If he’s not producing even playing with that kid I’ll start to worry a bit...

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53 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

Is he back on a line with Eklund? If he’s not producing even playing with that kid I’ll start to worry a bit...

Obvious bust. ;) 

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7 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

Obvious bust. ;) 

Gotta admit, not that I’m close to worried about a kid so young, but a part of me keeps wondering about a “sniper” that doesn’t seem to find the back of the net all that much.  

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Mercer might end up being the better player from that draft. Holtz did have COVID though didn’t he? Maybe that took a lot out of him. Marco Rossi is missing a whole season because of COVID from what I understand.

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4 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Gotta admit, not that I’m close to worried about a kid so young, but a part of me keeps wondering about a “sniper” that doesn’t seem to find the back of the net all that much.  

Yeah, I’m also obviously not really worried yet, but just out of curiosity I looked to see what Laine did his final season before coming into the NHL, and he had 17 goals (46 GP) in Liiga. A ton of goals in all the tournaments he played in, too. Holtz is currently at 6 goals in 28 GP in the SHL, and obviously wasn’t scoring at the WJC. Now I know the SHL is supposed to be a much better league than Liiga, so I don’t think it’s all that useful to compare the two, but I heard a lot about how he’s possibly the best pure sniper since Laine, so I wanted to see how they did around the same age. 

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12 hours ago, Nicomo said:

Is he back on a line with Eklund? If he’s not producing even playing with that kid I’ll start to worry a bit...

Eklund is not in the lineup right now, he's sick. And Holtz is on the 3rd line.

I sure hope im wrong and eating crows but man am i ever not feeling that pick at all. 

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I watched a lot of video on Holtz (and most other top 10 prospects) leading up to this draft. It's a shame that the WJC was the best exposure to him for many of us, because apart from one game, it wasn't a good display of what he has to offer as a player. If the Devils had drafted any other player with the 7th pick, I'd still say the same thing: Holtz is the best shooter from that draft. But he's not only that, he's an underrated playmaker/passer, an above average skater, very good on the PP, and not a guy who's going to shy away physically. While he's not likely to be the guy carrying a top line in the NHL (e.g. Pastrnak), he still is a pretty complete player. He'll just need a Hischer/Hughes to reach his potential. 

I've seen this guy score goals from all over the offensive zone: from the blue line to the goal line.  And he had kept it up in the SHL this year leading up the the WJC, where he has since cooled off. Then I saw this video:

You're of course not seeing much play away from the puck in this video, and it's a small sample size. But it's striking how different he looks here. The shots he's getting off are either being blocked (which he's normally good at avoiding) or are these low percentage slappers from far out. He's making quick, panicked plays. He is getting outskated when he has the puck. His creativity with playmaking is nearly entirely gone. Losing his edge, losing puck battles, giving up on plays early - all more frequently than normal. He isn't playing with the intensity he normally plays with. 

Maybe his mental game is totally thrown off, and he's having a hard time getting that back. But I wouldn't be surprised if he's playing with some kind of nagging injury. Stupid thing to do at this stage of his career. But the way that he's avoiding tough areas, making the easy play when he faces opposition, and getting so easily outskated has me feeling like there's got to be something more to it than just being on a cold streak.

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13 hours ago, nessus said:

I watched a lot of video on Holtz (and most other top 10 prospects) leading up to this draft. It's a shame that the WJC was the best exposure to him for many of us, because apart from one game, it wasn't a good display of what he has to offer as a player. If the Devils had drafted any other player with the 7th pick, I'd still say the same thing: Holtz is the best shooter from that draft. But he's not only that, he's an underrated playmaker/passer, an above average skater, very good on the PP, and not a guy who's going to shy away physically. While he's not likely to be the guy carrying a top line in the NHL (e.g. Pastrnak), he still is a pretty complete player. He'll just need a Hischer/Hughes to reach his potential. 

I've seen this guy score goals from all over the offensive zone: from the blue line to the goal line.  And he had kept it up in the SHL this year leading up the the WJC, where he has since cooled off. Then I saw this video:

You're of course not seeing much play away from the puck in this video, and it's a small sample size. But it's striking how different he looks here. The shots he's getting off are either being blocked (which he's normally good at avoiding) or are these low percentage slappers from far out. He's making quick, panicked plays. He is getting outskated when he has the puck. His creativity with playmaking is nearly entirely gone. Losing his edge, losing puck battles, giving up on plays early - all more frequently than normal. He isn't playing with the intensity he normally plays with. 

Maybe his mental game is totally thrown off, and he's having a hard time getting that back. But I wouldn't be surprised if he's playing with some kind of nagging injury. Stupid thing to do at this stage of his career. But the way that he's avoiding tough areas, making the easy play when he faces opposition, and getting so easily outskated has me feeling like there's got to be something more to it than just being on a cold streak.

He has no confidence right now. It’s plain as day to see. He is playing with no confidence. When your confidence is shaky, your game is shaky, and you do the exact things you talked about: indecision, making panicked plays, losing puck battles, etc. Holtz needs to get a little confidence in his game again, and hopefully that will get him back to the level he was playing at pre-WJC.

Edited by MadDog2020
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Yeahhh, i'm not a scout or anything but I see patterns. So often we read about prospects and their potential, how amazing they are based on wtv measure... but you watch their videos and you just don't really see the... not even sure how to describe it... you just see the "oomph" factor. You can see that they are skilled and getting success but you just don't see the top top potential. I felt that way with Larsson, Josefson, Zacha, McLeod, etc And we all remember hearing about Larsson oozing skills and offensive potential, that literally never came. He always looked stiff and uninterested to me. Then we heard about Josefson "elite" defensive play and IQ... we heard about Zacha lethal shot and offensive instinct... meh...

To be fair i was pretty high on Boucher, Gelinas and Tedenby... which were all failures too lol

I just don't see the oomph with Holtz and he was last one my list of players in our reach i wanted to draft but let's hope i'm wrong and eating crows. 

 

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26 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

Walsh and Foote had a nice night for Bing in their AHL debuts. Both scored goals, and Walsh’s was the game winner in OT. 

That’s good news. 

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