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2021 Around The League Thread


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19 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

Everyone conveniently ignored we lead the league or were in the top 5 in scoring every year during our run of dominance. It’s just haterade. They know how good the Devils were, and they knew how dominant they were. 

Yeah the main myths were that the Devils won most games 2-1, and that Marty only faced 13 shots per game.  And that all they did was clutch and grab.  The dumbest fanbase in all the land (Rangers) would repeat those ad nauseam.

Some of the post-Cup teams were definitely lower-scoring and had to grind out close wins, but the 93-94 through 02-03 teams scored more than given credit for.  I’d say the 1995-96 and 2001-02 teams were the toughest watches in that time frame.  But the 93-94 and 99-00 and 00-01 teams could score aplenty.  And the 1995 Devils found their offense in the playoffsu, after struggling to score for much the regular season.

 

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976
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1 hour ago, MadDog2020 said:

Everyone conveniently ignored we lead the league or were in the top 5 in scoring every year during our run of dominance. It’s just haterade. They know how good the Devils were, and they knew how dominant they were. 

Having to hear about the trap ruining hockey while Detroit also used the trap and Pittsburgh being celebrated for their left wing lock which was essentially the trap. 

Also no one seemed to complain about the trap when Montreal won a bunch of cups with it. People hate when non-league darlings are good 

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23 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

Having to hear about the trap ruining hockey while Detroit also used the trap and Pittsburgh being celebrated for their left wing lock which was essentially the trap. 

Also no one seemed to complain about the trap when Montreal won a bunch of cups with it. People hate when non-league darlings are good 

Yeah like Lemaire just invente the trap out of thin air when he came to NJ and didn't play it before lol

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It always made me laugh, like playing incredible defense and preventing the other team from scoring was the wrong way to play hockey. You’re supposed to shut the other team down, it’s half of the game!!

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The Devils seemed to get blamed almost singularly for “killing” hockey, but the fact is that several other factors led to less scoring around the league:  goaltenders and defensemen were improving (and coming into league bigger physically), expansion was diluting talent, less-talented teams more and more were trying to keep scores down to stay in games, etc.  Even if the Devils had never existed, I don’t think the course of the NHL would’ve changed all that much.

As far as the Devils went, I think in 1992-93 the plan was to be more of an offensive team (hence why Herb Brooks was named the coach), but Lou realized after one season that given the personnel that he had, that the Devils simply weren’t equipped to try to win that way.  So then it’s Lemaire, who brought with him the Montreal blueprint for winning…and obviously, it was much better suited to the Devils’ talent.  

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1 hour ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

The Devils seemed to get blamed almost singularly for “killing” hockey, but the fact is that several other factors led to less scoring around the league:  goaltenders and defensemen were improving (and coming into league bigger physically), expansion was diluting talent, less-talented teams more and more were trying to keep scores down to stay in games, etc.  Even if the Devils had never existed, I don’t think the course of the NHL would’ve changed all that much.

As far as the Devils went, I think in 1992-93 the plan was to be more of an offensive team (hence why Herb Brooks was named the coach), but Lou realized after one season that given the personnel that he had, that the Devils simply weren’t equipped to try to win that way.  So then it’s Lemaire, who brought with him the Montreal blueprint for winning…and obviously, it was much better suited to the Devils’ talent.  

Very good points on the player size. I remember reading that the average height for a defenseman went from roughly 5'11 to 6'2 during the 90's. Goalies as well. I think Saros is the only one in the NHL under 6 feet now. There's no more Terreri's, Pang's, or Vernon's anymore. 

Goaltending also started to involve a lot more strategy than just stop the puck. Angles, positioning, rebound control, all of that developed big time as the 90's progressed. 

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3 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

There's no more Terreri's, Pang's, or Vernon's anymore. 

I remember meeting Terreri as a kid and being amazed at how tiny he was. I was at least a head taller and probably 50 pounds heavier. 

I was 13. 

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10 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

I remember meeting Terreri as a kid and being amazed at how tiny he was. I was at least a head taller and probably 50 pounds heavier. 

I was 13. 

Chico’s on the shorter side too.  I’m just over 6’, and I tower over him.  He’s listed at 5’ 9”, and that seems a little generous.  Burke looked huge when he first came up (6’ 4”), but now it seems like most goalies are at least 6’.  Those quick lil’ reflex guys that DD56 mentioned have just disappeared.

Just looked it up…apparently the average height of today’s goalie is a slight tick under 6’ 3”.  So yeah, bigger goalies.

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1 minute ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Chico’s on the shorter side too.  I’m just over 6’, and I tower over him.  He’s listed at 5’ 9”, and that seems a little generous.  Burke looked huge when he first came up (6’ 4”), but now it seems like most goalies are at least 6’. Those quick lil’ reflex guys that DD56 mentioned have just disappeared.

The rise of the butterfly style really killed off a lot of smaller goalies. It became all about being big. I think Marty and Chris Osgood were really the last of the old school style. I was excited about Frazee when he was in our system because he played a little bit of that old reflex style but he was never the same after he got cut by that skate. 

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20 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Chico’s on the shorter side too.  

Used the urinal next to him at the CAA, and you are correct. I guess Terreri was more striking because he was a current professional athlete, whereas Chico looked like a tiny version of the dad from Addams Family. 

 

 

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On 8/14/2021 at 2:51 PM, Devil Dan 56 said:

The rise of the butterfly style really killed off a lot of smaller goalies. It became all about being big. I think Marty and Chris Osgood were really the last of the old school style. I was excited about Frazee when he was in our system because he played a little bit of that old reflex style but he was never the same after he got cut by that skate. 

The increasing height of the goaltenders in the 90's, coupled with their use of the butterflying blocking style and increasing size of their pads at the same time, is the biggest factor for the decrease in scoring during that period.  My kids watch highlights of games from the 80's and laugh about how the goalies back then were worse than some 11 year old goalies now.  They can't believe how small they were and how tiny their leg pads are.  They also laugh that they try to make everything a kick save, instead of going down into the butterfly and swallowing the puck.  The game is just dramatically different now - from the training to the equipment, to the talent of the players and goalies themselves.

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17 hours ago, MadDog2020 said:

The Lightning and their players are really leaning into the "supervillain" thing and I think it's great for the league tbh.  Let them become the Yankees where everyone outside of Florida fvcking despises them.

Realistically they're probably good for another cup in the next 2-3 years anyway, right?  Let the hate keep flowin'

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1 hour ago, Chuck the Duck said:

The increasing height of the goaltenders in the 90's, coupled with their use of the butterflying blocking style and increasing size of their pads at the same time, is the biggest factor for the decrease in scoring during that period.  My kids watch highlights of games from the 80's and laugh about how the goalies back then were worse than some 11 year old goalies now.  They can't believe how small they were and how tiny their leg pads are.  They also laugh that they try to make everything a kick save, instead of going down into the butterfly and swallowing the puck.  The game is just dramatically different now - from the training to the equipment, to the talent of the players and goalies themselves.

The old DVDs I have of Rockies and Devils games (from the late 70s - early 80s) are a hoot to watch...the net behind Chico looks almost soccer-sized, by comparison to today.

Yeah pre-"play the percentages" butterfly, you had goalies who relied completely on reflexes and instincts...and some of them would commit so hard to a guess, that they weren't in position to try to recover...and when that happened, the goalies could really look bad...and you saw this a LOT in the 80s.

The barometer that I've always used as the guy who was around for many years, as goaltending improved drastically, has been Ron Hextall...when he first came up, he quickly gained a rep as a bit of a headcase, but for his first several years he was considered to be pretty damned good.  Toward the end of his career, he was considered to be much shakier, a guy that would have that way of giving up that ugly goal at the worst possible time...the funny thing is, if you look as his numbers, his save%s actually got to be a little BETTER in his later years...it wasn't so much of a case of him getting all that much worse, as other goalies just becoming a hell of a lot better.  And those "hell of a lot better" guys weren't giving up those same kinds of ugly goals that Hextall and many of his peers would.  

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2 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Yeah pre-"play the percentages" butterfly, you had goalies who relied completely on reflexes and instincts...and some of them would commit so hard to a guess, that they weren't in position to try to recover...and when that happened, the goalies could really look bad...and you saw this a LOT in the 80s.

Yup, you watch those old clips now and goalies were flying all over the place, sliding out of the crease by multiple feet, and by today's standards, you are wondering why they are so out of position. 

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6 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

I do like that they gave the buffalo Jack's hair. That was a nice touch. I'm all about the details.

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28 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

Let them get him. I hope they sell tons of young talent and Jack's artificial titanium neck makes him a shell of his former self on the ice. 

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13 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

Let them get him. I hope they sell tons of young talent and Jack's artificial titanium neck makes him a shell of his former self on the ice. 

Once he is a Ranger, yes, that’s what I hope. I feel bad rooting against the guy before he’s on the Rangers. 

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2 hours ago, MadDog2020 said:

Ranger fans: TRADE HIM!

Sabres: Ok, Jack to Vegas

Rangers fans: WAIT WE PAID FOR YOU TO SEND HIM TO NY!

Sabres: It was $350....

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