mfitz804 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 27 minutes ago, devlman said: But it’s not rose-colored glasses though, it’s reality lol. The kid has been outstanding. Points will come. He’s been very unlucky. Agree re the dreadful power play. You have a very loose definition of outstanding. Also, blaming the power play” is ridiculous, because he is part of that dreadful power play. Again, it seems like you guys are expecting other players to elevate Jack’s game rather than Jack elevating the game of the people he plays with. That’s what an “outstanding” player does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisis Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 minute ago, mfitz804 said: No, it’s smarter to judge it on a chart of missed opportunities. Again, nobody said he can’t play hockey, just that he has basically not produced since game 4 of the season. The chart shows that he is creating chances. Shots and shot assists are the raw, black and white statistics that, in my opinion, best capture creating opportunities. The team as a whole (Jack included) has a problem converting them into goals and assists. The team is shooting 8.3% which is in the bottom quarter of the league. And to pile on, the powerplay is hard to watch. The bombs from the point are not working. Acknowledge that and change it up. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicomo Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 Just now, mfitz804 said: You have a very loose definition of outstanding. Also, blaming the power play” is ridiculous, because he is part of that dreadful power play. Again, it seems like you guys are expecting other players to elevate Jack’s game rather than Jack elevating the game of the people he plays with. That’s what an “outstanding” player does. Everyone on the PP should shoulder some of the blame. Nobody has more than 5 PPP through 34 GP. That’s horrendous. It all starts with Recchi though. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisis Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 minute ago, mfitz804 said: You have a very loose definition of outstanding. Also, blaming the power play” is ridiculous, because he is part of that dreadful power play. Again, it seems like you guys are expecting other players to elevate Jack’s game rather than Jack elevating the game of the people he plays with. That’s what an “outstanding” player does. I might be wrong, but I don't interpret what these other dudes are saying as blaming others for Jack's lack of production. I think the blame is laid across the entire organization. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devlman Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 minute ago, mfitz804 said: You have a very loose definition of outstanding. Also, blaming the power play” is ridiculous, because he is part of that dreadful power play. Again, it seems like you guys are expecting other players to elevate Jack’s game rather than Jack elevating the game of the people he plays with. That’s what an “outstanding” player does. He does elevate the play of his linemates. His linemates’ chances go through the roof when they play with him. You just don’t see it for whatever reason, maybe because it doesn’t show up in the box score...Who knows... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevils1214 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 3 minutes ago, devlman said: He does elevate the play of his linemates. His linemates’ chances go through the roof when they play with him. You just don’t see it for whatever reason, maybe because it doesn’t show up in the box score...Who knows... We need a "high danger shots on glass/60". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 7 minutes ago, devlman said: He does elevate the play of his linemates. His linemates’ chances go through the roof when they play with him. You just don’t see it for whatever reason, maybe because it doesn’t show up in the box score...Who knows... I hope we lead the league in chances, we'll definitely make the playoffs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devlman Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 minute ago, mfitz804 said: I hope we lead the league in chances, we'll definitely make the playoffs. Me too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazer Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarDew Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 What I think is contributing to the inconsistency of the entire team is lack of practice and games almost every other night. No practice to work on mistakes. No practice for the young guys to learn. Oppressive schedule especially for the younger players as well as the vets. Ruff can only try to explain stuff. Practice is where you work to execute that advice. Assistant coaching is another severe problem but I am talking about what I think is the biggest problem. I have more patience. Build confidence and don't look for every negative. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 5 minutes ago, StarDew said: What I think is contributing to the inconsistency of the entire team is lack of practice and games almost every other night. No practice to work on mistakes. No practice for the young guys to learn. Oppressive schedule especially for the younger players as well as the vets. Ruff can only try to explain stuff. Practice is where you work to execute that advice. Assistant coaching is another severe problem but I am talking about what I think is the biggest problem. I have more patience. Build confidence and don't look for every negative. I think that's definitely true. As I have said, you can't judge a guy's future based on what he's doing this season. You can, though, be irritated about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarDew Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 27 minutes ago, mfitz804 said: I think that's definitely true. As I have said, you can't judge a guy's future based on what he's doing this season. You can, though, be irritated about it. I am not irritated with the players as much as I am with the assistant coaches at times. I find myself disappointed sometimes but rarely irritated. Sometimes people here go ballistic when irritated. Hate to see them really angry. 🥴 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimaira_Devil_#9 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 hour ago, mfitz804 said: That’s pretty much exactly what I have been saying. Future is bright. Present is a pile of sh!t. He hasn't been a pile of sh!t though, that's the point of all this. If anything he has been incredibly unlucky. You a right he hasn't put up points, no one can deny that, but apart from the game where he got benched he has been making things happen, setting up looks for people. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 minute ago, Chimaira_Devil_#9 said: He hasn't been a pile of sh!t though, that's the point of all this. If anything he has been incredibly unlucky. You a right he hasn't put up points, no one can deny that, but apart from the game where he got benched he has been making things happen, setting up looks for people. There's a certain point where "unlucky" gets to be a bad argument. 10 points in 30 games out of 33 games played isn't just "unlucky". Like I said, plenty of reasons to think his future is bright. But thinking he has been "outstanding" when he's basically been mostly ineffective at generating any scoring is a stretch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisis Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 5 minutes ago, mfitz804 said: There's a certain point where "unlucky" gets to be a bad argument. 10 points in 30 games out of 33 games played isn't just "unlucky". Like I said, plenty of reasons to think his future is bright. But thinking he has been "outstanding" when he's basically been mostly ineffective at generating any scoring is a stretch. Is there anyone on the team that you would consider mostly effective at generating scoring over the 34 games played this season? Just to set a baseline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 Just now, Crisis said: Is there anyone on the team that you would consider mostly effective at generating scoring over the 34 games played this season? Just to set a baseline. On this team?? Nobody has been consistently effective, it’s why we have maybe 1-2 guys that will get 25 points this season. Hughes was for the first 3 games. Zacha was for 10-11 games Palms has been for 2 weeks. Etc. But am I more encouraged by the fact that Kuokkanen has 16 points as a 3rd or 4th liner than that Jack has 16 as our #1 center? Probably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicomo Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 4 minutes ago, mfitz804 said: On this team?? Nobody has been consistently effective, it’s why we have maybe 1-2 guys that will get 25 points this season. Hughes was for the first 3 games. Zacha was for 10-11 games Palms has been for 2 weeks. Etc. But am I more encouraged by the fact that Kuokkanen has 16 points as a 3rd or 4th liner than that Jack has 16 as our #1 center? Probably. Tbf Kuokkanen has been seeing a lot of ice time since Ruff put him with Zajac and Sharongovich . And he’s been playing top 6 minutes for a while now. His last 5 games TOI: 14:06 14:11 16:06 15:59 16:58 Jack’s last 5: 17:03 14:11 11:48 (that’s the game he got benched) 17:37 14:11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devlman Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 20 minutes ago, mfitz804 said: There's a certain point where "unlucky" gets to be a bad argument. 10 points in 30 games out of 33 games played isn't just "unlucky". Like I said, plenty of reasons to think his future is bright. But thinking he has been "outstanding" when he's basically been mostly ineffective at generating any scoring is a stretch. Since you’re so points-oriented you’ll have to seriously consider the amount of scoring chances Palmieri has cost Jack this season. Don’t forget how dreadful Palms has been most of the year. Also, no Nico and no Bratt early in the year, bad PP, etc...there’s a ton of reasons why Jack’s point totals are suppressed. But again, focusing on point totals to evaluate a 19 year old doesn’t make any sense to begin with. 13 minutes ago, mfitz804 said: On this team?? Nobody has been consistently effective, it’s why we have maybe 1-2 guys that will get 25 points this season. Hughes was for the first 3 games. Zacha was for 10-11 games Palms has been for 2 weeks. Etc. But am I more encouraged by the fact that Kuokkanen has 16 points as a 3rd or 4th liner than that Jack has 16 as our #1 center? Probably. The 22 year old Kuokkanen with several years of pro experience isn’t seeing the other team’s top pairings nor is the opposition game planning around him. He’s been good so far but it’s apples and oranges trying to compare him to Jack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 This year has been so fvcked in general (especially with the Covid outbreak, lack of practices, and insane compression of the schedule) that I'm inclined to more or less give everyone a pass...as irritated as I sometimes get with the results (and especially nASS and W-recky). Jack has another offseason to put on more muscle (or at the very least gain back what was lost), and hopefully will have legit practices and occasionally longer than two days off between games. If he shows up stronger and is getting the benefit of practices and is somehow still struggling to put up points (even if it's not all his fault), and we're headed into 2022, then I'm going to start to worry a little. But not today. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 19 minutes ago, devlman said: Since you’re so points-oriented you’ll have to seriously consider the amount of scoring chances Palmieri has cost Jack this season. Don’t forget how dreadful Palms has been most of the year. Also, no Nico and no Bratt early in the year, bad PP, etc...there’s a ton of reasons why Jack’s point totals are suppressed. But again, focusing on point totals to evaluate a 19 year old doesn’t make any sense to begin with. Yes, there are many reasons and none of them are Jack. It’s everyone else’s fault. Please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevils1214 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 7 minutes ago, devlman said: The 22 year old Kuokkanen with several years of pro experience isn’t seeing the other team’s top pairings nor is the opposition game planning around him. He’s been good so far but it’s apples and oranges trying to compare him to Jack. Age is just a number, and fact is that Jack is in the NHL and is a pro now. Pointing out he's playing against competition like multiple Selke winning Patrice Bergeron, generational counterpart Sidney Crosby, high flying future hall of famer Alexander Ovechkin, one of the best coached teams in the league, and defensive powerhouse, New York Islanders, and other elite players in the division which include Panarin, Backstrom, Barzal, Malkin, Girux, Couturier, Rat, Eichel, etc are just excuses. 50000 super mega atomic danger quality chances-- who gives a sh!t if it doesn't go in the net. Straight up disappointment. /s 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devlman Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 5 minutes ago, mfitz804 said: Yes, there are many reasons and none of them are Jack. It’s everyone else’s fault. Please. Lol never said none were related to him. He’s 19, he’s going to have lots of faults still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 3 minutes ago, devlman said: Lol never said none were related to him. He’s 19, he’s going to have lots of faults still. You just chose not to mention them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devlman Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 Just now, mfitz804 said: You just chose not to mention them. Why would I? It’s already been mentioned countless times that he’s 19. Didn’t think that would require further expansion on the faults of a young player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 minute ago, devlman said: Why would I? It’s already been mentioned countless times that he’s 19. Didn’t think that would require further expansion on the faults of a young player. And nobody has mentioned all of the other excuses that you did mention? You’re delusional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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