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GDT: Two bad teams compete to see who isn't the worst (NJD Vs BUF)


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4 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

Johnsson is battling Vatanen for my biggest bum award. 

I don’t think that’s a contest. Johnsson has been doing nothing, but what Vatanen has been doing is worse than doing nothing. 

Disregard what I said about Johnson’s last 20, my vision sucks at night in the dark. 

Edited by mfitz804
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Let's Go Deadline.  I mean Devils.    Ol fish lips has been Palmed.  Tyce Thompson making his debut against his brother Tage. Their parents Turg and Trig will be in attendance

Now that’s how you score a fvcking PavelPoint. 

Zacha heating back up. Fantastic goal. 

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Just now, NJDfan1711 said:

Anyone have any idea when this team last won 5 games in a row?

2012?

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1 minute ago, mfitz804 said:

2012?

I have a terrible feeling that's probably correct, or close to it.  Which is...sad and astonishing.  Almost 10 years?  A fvcking decade?  

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5 minutes ago, Jerrydevil said:

If Jack Hughes were a stock, buy shares now. If you own shares, HOLD.

And hope for the best. 

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1 minute ago, NJDevs4978 said:

This is the rare game that can piss me off without even watching it.  Losing four times to a team with nine wins this year is straight trash.

If we didn’t keep inexplicably eating Boston’s lunch, we’d be in essentially the same boat. 

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38 minutes ago, NJDfan1711 said:

Did I also hear Cangi correctly, that was our SEVENTH game in a row allowing FIVE or more goals in regulation?!?!  That is....fvcking horrendous.  I'm usually the guy who doesn't want to fire people after less than a season , but this is just downright awful.  Someone has to be responsible because this organization, we've said it before, is getting too comfortable with losing.  It's become commonplace for us to set records....the wrong records.  

Seventh game of the season, second in a row

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1 minute ago, NJDevs4978 said:

Seventh game of the season, second in a row

But the other way was totally believable. 

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10 hours ago, Nicomo said:

 

Johnsson is battling Vatanen for my biggest bum award. 

I had hopes for him that he was a Leafs cap casualty and he’d do well here. then I played NHL 21 and was like... uhhhh he’s meh (I know video games don’t translate to reality, duh)..... and then I saw him on the ice.... fvckin’ a.....

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47 minutes ago, jagknife said:

I had hopes for him that he was a Leafs cap casualty and he’d do well here. then I played NHL 21 and was like... uhhhh he’s meh (I know video games don’t translate to reality, duh)..... and then I saw him on the ice.... fvckin’ a.....

Most of what Johnsson has done in his career to this point was built off one hot stretch a couple of years ago, that started with a hat trick...somehow he managed 18 goals and 15 assists over a 37-game burst (25% shooting definitely helped).  I'm sure that Fitz factored that in when he acquired him.  Based on what I've seen, I doubt he ever enjoys a run like that ever again.

And that's why I'm hoping for a different kind of acquisition in the near future.  Give me a player with a real track record, instead of "Well if this guy can do what he did three years ago for roughly half that season..."  The Mets used to build this way for years.  I know we need to be patient a little longer, as some of the kids already here develop and other ones are called up...but I'm starting to run out of patience.  I really need to see this team be consistently competitive by the start of the 2022-23 season...I'll live with one more meh year next year.  

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32 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Most of what Johnsson has done in his career to this point was built off one hot stretch a couple of years ago, that started with a hat trick...somehow he managed 18 goals and 15 assists over a 37-game burst (25% shooting definitely helped).  I'm sure that Fitz factored that in when he acquired him.  Based on what I've seen, I doubt he ever enjoys a run like that ever again.

And that's why I'm hoping for a different kind of acquisition in the near future.  Give me a player with a real track record, instead of "Well if this guy can do what he did three years ago for roughly half that season..."  The Mets used to build this way for years.  I know we need to be patient a little longer, as some of the kids already here develop and other ones are called up...but I'm starting to run out of patience.  I really need to see this team be consistently competitive by the start of the 2022-23 season...I'll live with one more meh year next year.  

Couldn’t agree more. I hate the feeling of being apathetic halfway through the season when it comes to the Devils. I freaking love hockey, love the Devils, but to have hope at the start of the year, even if it’s my own misguided fault, and then be done by now is getting exhausting, never mind demoralizing. It used to be “hey, the game’s on” it’ll at least be on the TV while I do other stuff, now I’m like oh look, we sucked again, glad I missed most of it. 

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20 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

He also looks strangely like...a woman.  I know this because my daughter must have said it at least 10 times during his interview.

My daughter saw a replay of when Tage and Tyce got together before the game for a picture, and she just said "those are some strange looking dudes". 

Not wrong.

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Johnsson can be best placed into Fitz's "you tried" bucket.  There was that chance that was he was looking like a Palmieri 2.0 where he was the victim of being a good player playing limited minutes due to his team's (TOR) forward depth.  However, it looks like this was not the case here.  Can't beat up Fitz too much for this one as he gave up limited assets for Johnsson, but it still sucks that he hasn't worked out at all and is invisible almost every game.

Hughes actually looks a little bit better finally getting Palmieri off his line.  I had someone tell me a couple of weeks back that I should evaluate Hughes once Palms comes off his wing almost every night and I have to say he does look better without him.  I still don't like how guys like Kuokkanen and Sharangovich plays with him, but that's an organizational problem.

Hischier can't come back soon enough.  Zacha at center is brutal.  Yeah he scored last night, but he is much better at wing than center.

Tyce looked fine last night, but a lot of players look good in their first game due to sheltered minutes and the adrenaline getting them going.  I still think the Devils have an issue with their top 6 in the near future.  Unless at least either Foote, Holtz or Mercer works out we are looking at more pain.  Guys like Sharangovich, Kuokkanen, Merkley and Zacha ideally shouldn't play top 6 minutes, but they are right now.  

Also, last minute thought, this goes double for our defense.  Right now, who do we have in the pipeline that can we be excited about?  I've heard mixed things about Bahl (and I am not nearly as high on him as others are), Jacobs seems to be a bottom 4 defenseman at best, and Muk is a raw, giant gamble no matter what % draft experts gave him to be an everyday NHL player.

There could be some more reasons to be hopeful if Fitz makes some trades for some sure-fire guys at this deadline, but a lot of the Devils future is still pinned on a lot of question marks.  Also, landing a top 2 win in this coming draft lottery will certainly go a long way too, especially for our defense.

Edited by DevsMan84
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2 hours ago, DevsMan84 said:

Johnsson can be best placed into Fitz's "you tried" bucket.  There was that chance that was he was looking like a Palmieri 2.0 where he was the victim of being a good player playing limited minutes due to his team's (TOR) forward depth.  However, it looks like this was not the case here.  Can't beat up Fitz too much for this one as he gave up limited assets for Johnsson, but it still sucks that he hasn't worked out at all and is invisible almost every game.

Hughes actually looks a little bit better finally getting Palmieri off his line.  I had someone tell me a couple of weeks back that I should evaluate Hughes once Palms comes off his wing almost every night and I have to say he does look better without him.  I still don't like how guys like Kuokkanen and Sharangovich plays with him, but that's an organizational problem.

Hischier can't come back soon enough.  Zacha at center is brutal.  Yeah he scored last night, but he is much better at wing than center.

Tyce looked fine last night, but a lot of players look good in their first game due to sheltered minutes and the adrenaline getting them going.  I still think the Devils have an issue with their top 6 in the near future.  Unless at least either Foote, Holtz or Mercer works out we are looking at more pain.  Guys like Sharangovich, Kuokkanen, Merkley and Zacha ideally shouldn't play top 6 minutes, but they are right now.  

Also, last minute thought, this goes double for our defense.  Right now, who do we have in the pipeline that can we be excited about?  I've heard mixed things about Bahl (and I am not nearly as high on him as others are), Jacobs seems to be a bottom 4 defenseman at best, and Muk is a raw, giant gamble no matter what % draft experts gave him to be an everyday NHL player.

There could be some more reasons to be hopeful if Fitz makes some trades for some sure-fire guys at this deadline, but a lot of the Devils future is still pinned on a lot of question marks.  Also, landing a top 2 win in this coming draft lottery will certainly go a long way too, especially for our defense.

Sounds good but who's giving up sure-fire guys at the deadline?  The only piece we have worth anything is Palms and the talk so far doesn't seem to include any sure fire guys.  If anything it seems like more picks which would mean more waiting for them to pan out which means taking another step back in the short term.  IF they continue to not bring in meaningful established pieces who are actually going to contribute and at a high level we'll be stuck on the hamster wheel.  It's tiring.  You already pointed out the guys we have playing top six that are only there because the team is a bottom 3rd in the league. That's just the forwards. The D is whole additional sh!tshow where we need a good number of pieces. After all these years we're still only hoping to maybe be competitive one of these years. 

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13 hours ago, titans04 said:

Sounds good but who's giving up sure-fire guys at the deadline?  The only piece we have worth anything is Palms and the talk so far doesn't seem to include any sure fire guys.  If anything it seems like more picks which would mean more waiting for them to pan out which means taking another step back in the short term.  IF they continue to not bring in meaningful established pieces who are actually going to contribute and at a high level we'll be stuck on the hamster wheel.  It's tiring.  You already pointed out the guys we have playing top six that are only there because the team is a bottom 3rd in the league. That's just the forwards. The D is whole additional sh!tshow where we need a good number of pieces. After all these years we're still only hoping to maybe be competitive one of these years. 

Looks like you were right in terms of the return that Palmieri would bring in.  Apparently Boston had an offer on the table that was either a 2nd rounder or a later rounder plus a Bahl-level prospect.  Given that I am not enamored with Bahl as a prospect, getting that first rounder is at least a win and we got bodies back that can be exposed in the upcoming expansion draft.

Problem is with the flat cap and soft free agent market this upcoming offseason, there unfortunately isn't really much help coming in the immediate future.  With Zajac, Palmieri, and likely guys like Gusev, Murray and Vatanen coming off the books, we have a ton of cap space.  Now, it just depends on 1) If the owners are willing to spend it and 2) how it is being spent.  With first issue I know the owners have been willing to spend in the past to an extent, but with the previously mentioned flat cap and uncertainty around the next 1-2 seasons around COVID, they may be hesitant to spend even with all the space.  The figurative shots in the arm from both the new TV deal with ESPN and from the expansion fees help, but they will likely go to cover losses from the COVID situation than towards player salary.  The second issue is the one that makes me even more worried actually.  In last night's trade call, Fitz used the "weaponize our cap space" line again which made me cringe.  I know Shero has said and went out and did so, but in recent memory it was on guys like Gusev and Subban.  Just those two alone take up about $13M in cap space and would you say that those have been the wisest uses of weaponizing cap space (Admittedly I cannot kill Shero over Gusev as no one predicted him to completely fall off the cliff this year).  So far, weaponizing cap space has been used to take on other team's salary headaches with zero improvement with the on-ice product.  I am not going to be fooled for the 3rd (or is it 4th?) time again.

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6 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

Looks like you were right in terms of the return that Palmieri would bring in.  Apparently Boston had an offer on the table that was either a 2nd rounder or a later rounder plus a Bahl-level prospect.  Given that I am not enamored with Bahl as a prospect, getting that first rounder is at least a win and we got bodies back that can be exposed in the upcoming expansion draft.

Problem is with the flat cap and soft free agent market this upcoming offseason, there unfortunately isn't really much help coming in the immediate future.  With Zajac, Palmieri, and likely guys like Gusev, Murray and Vatanen coming off the books, we have a ton of cap space.  Now, it just depends on 1) If the owners are willing to spend it and 2) how it is being spent.  With first issue I know the owners have been willing to spend in the past to an extent, but with the previously mentioned flat cap and uncertainty around the next 1-2 seasons around COVID, they may be hesitant to spend even with all the space.  The figurative shots in the arm from both the new TV deal with ESPN and from the expansion fees help, but they will likely go to cover losses from the COVID situation than towards player salary.  The second issue is the one that makes me even more worried actually.  In last night's trade call, Fitz used the "weaponize our cap space" line again which made me cringe.  I know Shero has said and went out and did so, but in recent memory it was on guys like Gusev and Subban.  Just those two alone take up about $13M in cap space and would you say that those have been the wisest uses of weaponizing cap space (Admittedly I cannot kill Shero over Gusev as no one predicted him to completely fall off the cliff this year).  So far, weaponizing cap space has been used to take on other team's salary headaches with zero improvement with the on-ice product.  I am not going to be fooled for the 3rd (or is it 4th?) time again.

For whatever it's worth, one thing the Devils absolutely will not have to worry about is signing their own youth to extensions...Smith, Hughes, Zacha, etc.  

I'd rather not hear the Devils talk about "weaponizing their cap space".  Goose I understood (just didn't work out, it happens) and I'll always believe ownership was involved in Subban.  But yeah, let me see that money get used on a slam-dunk kind of move, instead of a question mark, or a "we have the space, what do we have to lose" acquisition.  I know this is supposed to be taboo, but if there's a team that could take advantage of an RFA offer sheet situation, it's the Devils.  

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2 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

For whatever it's worth, one thing the Devils absolutely will not have to worry about is signing their own youth to extensions...Smith, Hughes, Zacha, etc.  

I'd rather not hear the Devils talk about "weaponizing their cap space".  Goose I understood (just didn't work out, it happens) and I'll always believe ownership was involved in Subban.  But yeah, let me see that money get used on a slam-dunk kind of move, instead of a question mark, or a "we have the space, what do we have to lose" acquisition.  I know this is supposed to be taboo, but if there's a team that could take advantage of an RFA offer sheet situation, it's the Devils.  

I also forgot that Cammalleri is finally coming off the books after this year too, so that's another $1.67M coming off the books.

Yeah I am getting really tired of the "weaponizing cap space" line myself.  I rolled my eyes when Fitz said it last night.  So far we have weaponized our cap space to help other teams sign or keep better players (ex: Preds moved Subban so they could sign Duschene).  To truly weaponize it, we need to spend it on players who actually help us first and foremost and not us being used as a dumping ground for other teams.

Yeah I wish Devils would actually make an attempt at offer sheeting someone.  We are literally the perfect team to try it and with the COVID cap crunch a ton of teams will never be able to match.  Unfortunately, I do not think neither ownership or management has the backbone to upset other teams for fear they might not want to deal with us again.

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2 hours ago, DevsMan84 said:

I also forgot that Cammalleri is finally coming off the books after this year too, so that's another $1.67M coming off the books.

Yeah I am getting really tired of the "weaponizing cap space" line myself.  I rolled my eyes when Fitz said it last night.  So far we have weaponized our cap space to help other teams sign or keep better players (ex: Preds moved Subban so they could sign Duschene).  To truly weaponize it, we need to spend it on players who actually help us first and foremost and not us being used as a dumping ground for other teams.

Yeah I wish Devils would actually make an attempt at offer sheeting someone.  We are literally the perfect team to try it and with the COVID cap crunch a ton of teams will never be able to match.  Unfortunately, I do not think neither ownership or management has the backbone to upset other teams for fear they might not want to deal with us again.

Yes and no cause we've always finishing at the bottom of the standings so wtv player were getting may not be worth 3-4 top 10 first round picks. 

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5 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Yes and no cause we've always finishing at the bottom of the standings so wtv player were getting may not be worth 3-4 top 10 first round picks. 

The thinking is that the player we get would elevate us to where we wouldn't be getting 3-4 top 10 first round picks.  Plus that player with guys like Hischier and hopefully Hughes would made that more of a certainty.

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