NHL Entry Draft Thread - 2021

[vadvlfan]

11 hours ago, Nicomo said:

Tortorella’s shtick has a finite shelf life, and it’s probably safe to say his time is up in Columbus. 

I think it applies the most all coaches in NHL at least. You can't only say, "More net front presence, keep em to the outside, get in front of shots, protect the house" so many times. Next coach comes in, teaches new "system", and says same thing. Rinse, repeat.

[Lateralous]

11 hours ago, vadvlfan said:

I think it applies the most all coaches in NHL at least. You can't only say, "More net front presence, keep em to the outside, get in front of shots, protect the house" so many times. Next coach comes in, teaches new "system", and says same thing. Rinse, repeat.

I think a team like Nashville would be a great fit for him.   He would be able to get so much more out of that roster of under achieving vets than John f’ing Hynes or Laviolette one year after his shelf life in NASH had already expired 

[Chimaira_Devil_#9]

Brandt Clarke had 2 goals and 2 assists yesterday in the WJC u18's. 

[SterioDesign]

https://www.sportingnews.com/ca/nhl/news/nhl-draft-2021-matthew-beniers-luke-hughes-10-options-no-1-overall/6fe26l8avlia13i6gvhpyuyce

i mean when some people are saying that there's 10 options for #1 overall... and that a guy who's been considered first for awhile is all the way down to 6th on some mock drafts? it's really all over the place lol

Edited April 29, 2021 by SterioDesign

[mfitz804]

No sure thing at #1? That certainly SOUNDS like our year!!

[Devilsfan118]

So after that epic slide where we flirted with a top2/3 pick, we're back to most likely picking 5th overall.  Kinda sh!tty considering how pointless the hockey this season has been, but it is what it is.

[SterioDesign]

3 hours ago, Devilsfan118 said:

So after that epic slide where we flirted with a top2/3 pick, we're back to most likely picking 5th overall.  Kinda sh!tty considering how pointless the hockey this season has been, but it is what it is.

Well no cause apparently if we didn't win those few extra games in this sh!t season all our young players would have been ruined long term and would have accepted to lose the rest of their career and not even try to win.

Or some bullsh!t along those lines....

[Devil Dan 56]

36 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Well no cause apparently if we didn't win those few extra games in this sh!t season all our young players would have been ruined long term and would have accepted to lose the rest of their career and not even try to win.

Or some bullsh!t along those lines....

You said this for years because it was gonna ruin our chances and we won 2 lotteries. It doesn't kill the kids (or the few fans who bother to still watch this team) to have a few wins. We're still gonna get someone in the top 5-6 to add to the rebuild. 

[mfitz804]

2 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

You said this for years because it was gonna ruin our chances and we won 2 lotteries. It doesn't kill the kids (or the few fans who bother to still watch this team) to have a few wins. We're still gonna get someone in the top 5-6 to add to the rebuild. 

Not to mention, what else were they supposed to do? Traded away the vets, and possibly our best defensive defenseman, and played a bunch of AHLers. Were they supposed to tell them to go out and lose? That would mean our management, coaches and players have zero integrity. 

[SterioDesign]

11 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

You said this for years because it was gonna ruin our chances and we won 2 lotteries. It doesn't kill the kids (or the few fans who bother to still watch this team) to have a few wins. We're still gonna get someone in the top 5-6 to add to the rebuild. 

Yeah and if you think we're still in a bad spot even if we won the lottery twice. imagine sliding back just one spot and having Kakko and Nolan Patrick instead of Hughes and Nico right now.

That's the kind of difference ONE win through a season can make. We're rebuilding, meaning trying to add the RIGHT piece to the team. So i prefer being in the best possible position to make the best decision we can with what we have.

[Devil Dan 56]

10 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Yeah and if you think we're still in a bad spot even if we won the lottery twice. imagine sliding back just one spot and having Kakko and Nolan Patrick instead of Hughes and Nico right now.

That's the kind of difference ONE win through a season can make. We're rebuilding, meaning trying to add the RIGHT piece to the team. So i prefer being in the best possible position to make the best decision we can with what we have.

But if we moved one spot up or down in the standings either of those years we wouldn't have won the lottery. The whole point of the lottery is that tanking doesn't guarantee anything. 

 

[SterioDesign]

5 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

But if we moved one spot up or down in the standings either of those years we wouldn't have won the lottery. The whole point of the lottery is that tanking doesn't guarantee anything. 

 

I never suggested to tank on purpose or wtv. But i'm certainly not upset with losing cause that's technically what could give us the best chance at getting out of the giant hole we've been in. And i'm pointing out that winning just for the sake of winning so fans can be happy could actually not be beneficial to the long-term success of the team.

 

[mfitz804]

9 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

I never suggested to tank on purpose or wtv. But i'm certainly not upset with losing cause that's technically what could give us the best chance at getting out of the giant hole we've been in. And i'm pointing out that winning just for the sake of winning so fans can be happy could actually not be beneficial to the long-term success of the team.

 

Who says that’s the reason they’re winning? They’re winning because they’re still going out there to compete, and then not losing on purpose. The idea that they’re willing for the sake of the fans is made up.

[Devil Dan 56]

29 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

I never suggested to tank on purpose or wtv. But i'm certainly not upset with losing cause that's technically what could give us the best chance at getting out of the giant hole we've been in. And i'm pointing out that winning just for the sake of winning so fans can be happy could actually not be beneficial to the long-term success of the team.

 

Of course they are going to compete, that has nothing to do with fans. And if you think winning is not beneficial, you have to remember that this is New Jersey, not Montreal or Toronto or some other team that's gonna sell out every year regardless of the on ice product. This market needs fans coming to games, and those fans need a reason to come. Watching the stuffing get kicked out of your team every night gets very old. 

[mfitz804]

2 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

Of course they are going to compete, that has nothing to do with fans. And if you think winning is not beneficial, you have to remember that this is New Jersey, not Montreal or Toronto or some other team that's gonna sell out every year regardless of the on ice product. This market needs fans coming to games, and those fans need a reason to come. Watching the stuffing get kicked out of your team every night gets very old. 

Yup. Well said. 

Edited May 4, 2021 by mfitz804

[SterioDesign]

3 hours ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

Of course they are going to compete, that has nothing to do with fans. And if you think winning is not beneficial, you have to remember that this is New Jersey, not Montreal or Toronto or some other team that's gonna sell out every year regardless of the on ice product. This market needs fans coming to games, and those fans need a reason to come. Watching the stuffing get kicked out of your team every night gets very old. 

Well that's fine, but just go and watch the movie Jaws and realize you're Larry Vaughn the mayor right now and i'm chief Brodie.

Then see who they should have listened to in the first place lol 

[Devil Dan 56]

2 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Well that's fine, but just go and watch the movie Jaws and realize you're Larry Vaughn the mayor right now and i'm chief Brodie.

Then see who they should have listened to in the first place lol 

What in the world are you talking about? How does any of that line up? 

These guys are excited to be winning a few games even if they are meaningless.  None of them care about picking 3rd instead of 6th. 

[mfitz804]

2 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

What in the world are you talking about? How does any of that line up? 

These guys are excited to be winning a few games even if they are meaningless.  None of them care about picking 3rd instead of 6th. 

Imma try it.

Mayor Vaughn was like fvck it, a giant shark is eating my constituents but we need the beaches open. 

Chief Brodie was like, close the beaches, a giant shark is eating all of your constituents. 
 

You’re Vaughn because you think winning (analogous to opening the beach) is important, and he’s Brodie because he wants them to lose (analogous to closing the beach).

You are going to learn you were wrong because a shark is going to eat your family.  
 

I think I nailed it. 

 

[SterioDesign]

1 minute ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

What in the world are you talking about? How does any of that line up? 

These guys are excited to be winning a few games even if they are meaningless. None of them care about picking 3rd instead of 6th. 

Oh it does line up perfectly but you seem to be all over the place here. You say it's not about the fans.. then say if they don't win the fans won't show up. So your point is about the fans...... but then you reply with what the players are feelings, which obviously they are happy to win.

My point is that in just about anything, short term and narrow "feel good" CAN affect future outcome negatively.

Landing the RIGHT player is a lot more important for the team's future success than an extra 3-4 wins in a sh!t season like this so the players feel all fuzzy inside. That's a hill i'm ready to die on.

 

[SterioDesign]

7 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

Imma try it.

Mayor Vaughn was like fvck it, a giant shark is eating my constituents but we need the beaches open. 

Chief Brodie was like, close the beaches, a giant shark is eating all of your constituents. 
 

You’re Vaughn because you think winning (analogous to opening the beach) is important, and he’s Brodie because he wants them to lose (analogous to closing the beach).

You are going to learn you were wrong because a shark is going to eat your family.  
 

I think I nailed it. 

Thats kind of it.

It's just the point that at times you need to look at your ultimate goal. Understand what are the necessary steps to get there and understand that falling into the shortcuts or go for the "feel good" / patching work / win now things can really affect your goal negatively.

I've said it a million times, we're in this mess precisely because of this. 1) not getting the right players in the draft cause our scout sucked really bad for over a decade and whoever was in charge of firing him never did it. 2) because we always went all-in to win now and it ran out team to the ground. That's why we sucked for this long. Not because "our players forgot how to win or accepted losing. No we just had a sh!t roster with no prospects lol We needed to rebuild from scratch.

So right now to me anyway the most important thing in order to eventually become a contender again is to put the right players together. Our scouting staff has been doing pretty good since we fired that useless piece of sh!t.

Obviously we may win more and still somehow land with the best player of the draft, who fvcking knows, its crapshoot. But the best thing we can "hope" for is for our scouting staff to have the best position they can have to play with.

And again, im not suggesting tanking. It's just saying that trying to convince yourself that a few extra wins is more important than landing the right player at the draft is complete BS and just something fans with no patience are telling themselves.

 

[Devil Dan 56]

11 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Oh it does line up perfectly but you seem to be all over the place here. You say it's not about the fans.. then say if they don't win the fans won't show up. So your point is about the fans...... but then you reply with what the players are feelings, which obviously they are happy to win.

My point is that in just about anything, short term and narrow "feel good" CAN affect future outcome negatively.

Landing the RIGHT player is a lot more important for the team's future success than an extra 3-4 wins in a sh!t season like this so the players feel all fuzzy inside. That's a hill i'm ready to die on.

 

I said the players competing has nothing to do with the fans. The players are always going to play to win. They don't care about draft position. 

Enjoy that hill. We are about to hit year 7 of this rebuild. We've been cheering on lottery balls for years. We don't need to look for the perfect RIGHT player every single draft, and especially not in a year that has no clear number 1.

[Devil Dan 56]

3 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

 

And again, im not suggesting tanking. It's just saying that trying to convince yourself that a few extra wins is more important than landing the right player at the draft is complete BS and just something fans with no patience are telling themselves.

 

No. BS is claiming that fans who have been watching this and giving lots of money to this franchise for nearly a decade have no patience. If we had no patience, we wouldn't be here. We'd have given up long ago. 

Fitz is finally getting this thing moving after Shero sputtered out. A few wins isn't going to ruin the whole thing because we might move down a spot or 2.  

[SterioDesign]

1 minute ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

No. BS is claiming that fans who have been watching this and giving lots of money to this franchise for nearly a decade have no patience. If we had no patience, we wouldn't be here. We'd have given up long ago. 

Fitz is finally getting this thing moving after Shero sputtered out. A few wins isn't going to ruin the whole thing because we might move down a spot or 2.  

Well you can argue all you want but landing a specific player can 100% make a difference between winning a cup or not. 

Winning a few extra games in a lost season will 100% not make a difference between winning a cup or not.

That's just pure fact. 

[Devil Dan 56]

11 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Well you can argue all you want but landing a specific player can 100% make a difference between winning a cup or not. 

Winning a few extra games in a lost season will 100% not make a difference between winning a cup or not.

That's just pure fact. 

Great. So how many years do you try for that specific player? At this rate, the players that we drafted to start the rebuild will be UFAs before they see a real playoff run. Do you just lose until you get a McDavid and then its ok to go for it? 

At some point, the cycle needs to end and you need to actually play some hockey. These players we have now don't want to keep waiting for the next draft. 

 

[SterioDesign]

32 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

Great. So how many years do you try for that specific player? At this rate, the players that we drafted to start the rebuild will be UFAs before they see a real playoff run. Do you just lose until you get a McDavid and then its ok to go for it? 

At some point, the cycle needs to end and you need to actually play some hockey. These players we have now don't want to keep waiting for the next draft. 

 

No the kids already showed this year that they are really close.

That's something else. Lots of doom and gloom here seem to focus on the fact that we lose lost of games.

What i see is an incredibly young roster never giving up and falling short of one goal almost every lost. That means we're really fvcking close to do a lot better. ALL our young players already doing good will be better next season. Many of our players had great personal seasons. We got rid of a lot of dead weight. Smart UFAs actually looking into things can see that we're obviously up and coming.

Then there's Holtz and Mercer coming. And we might land an important D man this year through the draft. We're in good shape. Results from this years means absolutely nothing. 

You dont want to do like Karlsson who jumped to a win now team who suddenly drop and looks like he's stuck there. Also guaranteed that the Sens will be better than the Sharks soon. Same thing.

And to be clear, what i really called out that you responded to is the claim some are making here that the players are developing a losing mentality making them okay with losing. I call bullsh!t on that.

Edited May 5, 2021 by SterioDesign