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The 2021 Offseason Thread


jagknife
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Kind of an interesting Lundqvist anecdote I may have shared on this forum before, but I'll share it again. I'm an architect, and when I was working in Manhattan we were hired to re-do the Lundqvist's kitchen, bathroom, and bedroom. We're a few weeks into the project and I'm at the Lundqvist's house working with Therese (his wife) on some cabinetry layouts and going over backsplash samples. I had still never met Henrik, but I was excited to -- even though I hate the Rangers, it's always cool to meet a pro hockey player, especially one like Henrik. 

So we're working away and she says that she doesn't want to make an autonomous decision, and asks if I could hang out for 15 minutes because he was on his way back in from a workout. Sure, no problem. 15 minutes later he walks in drenched in sweat and gives me a kind of "hey, one second" point. No problem, he's the client. He walks over to the sink and is just GUZZLING down water, making these hideously awful gulping noises. Water was literally getting everywhere. At one point, he starts using his hands to scoop the water into his mouth. He's drenched at this point and Therese is totally un-phased. 

Finally he stops, looks at my (obviously confused?) face and says "Oh, I'm sorry. I'm just thirsty, and I don't have any cups." 

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2 minutes ago, MB3 said:

Kind of an interesting Lundqvist anecdote I may have shared on this forum before, but I'll share it again. I'm an architect, and when I was working in Manhattan we were hired to re-do the Lundqvist's kitchen, bathroom, and bedroom. We're a few weeks into the project and I'm at the Lundqvist's house working with Therese (his wife) on some cabinetry layouts and going over backsplash samples. I had still never met Henrik, but I was excited to -- even though I hate the Rangers, it's always cool to meet a pro hockey player, especially one like Henrik. 

So we're working away and she says that she doesn't want to make an autonomous decision, and asks if I could hang out for 15 minutes because he was on his way back in from a workout. Sure, no problem. 15 minutes later he walks in drenched in sweat and gives me a kind of "hey, one second" point. No problem, he's the client. He walks over to the sink and is just GUZZLING down water, making these hideously awful gulping noises. Water was literally getting everywhere. At one point, he starts using his hands to scoop the water into his mouth. He's drenched at this point and Therese is totally un-phased. 

Finally he stops, looks at my (obviously confused?) face and says "Oh, I'm sorry. I'm just thirsty, and I don't have any cups." 

GFY i wasted 40 seconds of my lunch break reading this you beautiful bastard

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53 minutes ago, MB3 said:

Kind of an interesting Lundqvist anecdote I may have shared on this forum before, but I'll share it again. I'm an architect, and when I was working in Manhattan we were hired to re-do the Lundqvist's kitchen, bathroom, and bedroom. We're a few weeks into the project and I'm at the Lundqvist's house working with Therese (his wife) on some cabinetry layouts and going over backsplash samples. I had still never met Henrik, but I was excited to -- even though I hate the Rangers, it's always cool to meet a pro hockey player, especially one like Henrik. 

So we're working away and she says that she doesn't want to make an autonomous decision, and asks if I could hang out for 15 minutes because he was on his way back in from a workout. Sure, no problem. 15 minutes later he walks in drenched in sweat and gives me a kind of "hey, one second" point. No problem, he's the client. He walks over to the sink and is just GUZZLING down water, making these hideously awful gulping noises. Water was literally getting everywhere. At one point, he starts using his hands to scoop the water into his mouth. He's drenched at this point and Therese is totally un-phased. 

Finally he stops, looks at my (obviously confused?) face and says "Oh, I'm sorry. I'm just thirsty, and I don't have any cups." 

I only needed to read the first sentence to remember this one 🤣

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54 minutes ago, MB3 said:

Kind of an interesting Lundqvist anecdote I may have shared on this forum before, but I'll share it again. I'm an architect, and when I was working in Manhattan we were hired to re-do the Lundqvist's kitchen, bathroom, and bedroom. We're a few weeks into the project and I'm at the Lundqvist's house working with Therese (his wife) on some cabinetry layouts and going over backsplash samples. I had still never met Henrik, but I was excited to -- even though I hate the Rangers, it's always cool to meet a pro hockey player, especially one like Henrik. 

So we're working away and she says that she doesn't want to make an autonomous decision, and asks if I could hang out for 15 minutes because he was on his way back in from a workout. Sure, no problem. 15 minutes later he walks in drenched in sweat and gives me a kind of "hey, one second" point. No problem, he's the client. He walks over to the sink and is just GUZZLING down water, making these hideously awful gulping noises. Water was literally getting everywhere. At one point, he starts using his hands to scoop the water into his mouth. He's drenched at this point and Therese is totally un-phased. 

Finally he stops, looks at my (obviously confused?) face and says "Oh, I'm sorry. I'm just thirsty, and I don't have any cups." 

POTY. 

This is so good 

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1 hour ago, MadDog2020 said:

I’m so sick of this sh!t. Move that fvcking franchise already. It isn’t working, it’s never worked- move them to Houston and be done with it. I’ve never seen a league bend over backwards to save an absolutely worthless franchise like the NHL does with Arizona.

No I'm with you, I just don't think hockey was meant to be, as far as Arizona goes.  Hard to believe that they've been there for 25 years.  

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8 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

Imagine if we retired every great player that didn't contribute to winning anything.

https://nypost.com/2021/08/20/rangers-honor-henrik-lundqvists-brilliant-career-by-immediately-retiring-number/

 

On another note, still think it is a shame NJ hasn't done more to recognize Sergei Brylin. 

I mean, let’s be fair here- Lundqvist is probably the best goalie they’ve ever had, and he’s going to the HOF. I have no issue with them retiring his number. 

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2 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

Imagine if we retired every great player that didn't contribute to winning anything.

https://nypost.com/2021/08/20/rangers-honor-henrik-lundqvists-brilliant-career-by-immediately-retiring-number/

 

On another note, still think it is a shame NJ hasn't done more to recognize Sergei Brylin. 

I get it, he's a Ranger so of course we all hate him by default, and we all love that he never won a Cup, but the guy absolutely deserves to have his number retired and he's definitely going into the HHoF...I'd say he has a good shot to get in on his first try (6th all-time in wins, 8th all-time in regular season GP, .918 career save%, etc).  We'll see if the lack of a Cup means he has to wait a little longer, but it really shouldn't.  The team failed him at times more than he ever failed them.

Kinda weird that the whole Ring Of Honor/whatever seems to have died with the McMullen Night.  Yeah there's plenty of guys who deserve some kind of recognition.    

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15 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

No I'm with you, I just don't think hockey was meant to be, as far as Arizona goes.  Hard to believe that they've been there for 25 years.  

If the NHL is smart (🤣), they’ll move that team to Houston. It’s a huge market with millions of people and tons of corporate sponsorship. Plus the natural rivalry with Dallas. It’s as no-brainer as no-brainer gets. If the 32 owners wanna stop taking a damn bath on that stupid franchise, Houston is where they should go. 

Edited by MadDog2020
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2 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

If the NHL is smart (🤣), they’ll move that team to Houston. It’s a huge market with millions of people and tons of corporate sponsorship. Plus the natural rivalry with Dallas. It’s as no-brainer as no-brainer gets. If the 32 owners wanna stop taking a damn bath on that stupid franchise, Houston is where they should go. 

Whatever they do, they need to stop doing the equivalent of trying to make fetch happen, when it comes to bending over backwards to keep the Yotes in Arizona.  And yeah, sure seems like Houston makes plenty of sense.      

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19 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

I mean, let’s be fair here- Lundqvist is probably the best goalie they’ve ever had, and he’s going to the HOF. I have no issue with them retiring his number. 

Yeah this one actually makes total sense.  Can't even pretend to make fun of the reasoning behind it or even hinting it's not deserved.

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22 minutes ago, titans04 said:

Yeah this one actually makes total sense.  Can't even pretend to make fun of the reasoning behind it or even hinting it's not deserved.

Well, I'll carry the unpopular opinion then.

Devils advocate:

Does that mean we can retire Zajac's number? The argument I see here all the time is we never won anything while he was here, so no, but he can go in the Ring of Honor.

He's 4th in all time games played with 1024, tied for 3rd all time goals/points with 202/550. I get he isn't as important as Lundqvist was to NYR, since he really carried them, but seems a bit unfair to say no to Zajac because no cup/winning but Lundqvist gets a resounding yes despite never winning anything. You could argue plenty of the years Zajac invested here the team/management failed him too.

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14 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

Well, I'll carry the unpopular opinion then.

Devils advocate:

Does that mean we can retire Zajac's number? The argument I see here all the time is we never won anything while he was here, so no, but he can go in the Ring of Honor.

He's 4th in all time games played with 1024, tied for 3rd all time goals/points with 202/550. I get he isn't as important as Lundqvist was to NYR, since he really carried them, but seems a bit unfair to say no to Zajac because no cup/winning but Lundqvist gets a resounding yes despite never winning anything. You could argue plenty of the years Zajac invested here the team/management failed him too.

Lundqvist was one of the best goalies in the league every year for most of his career. Zajac was the guy that we all thought we would need to bury on our third line before the Devils would become competitive. I get that most of us aren’t a fan of Henrik, but he was quite a player. 

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7 minutes ago, nessus said:

Lundqvist was one of the best goalies in the league every year for most of his career. Zajac was the guy that we all thought we would need to bury on our third line before the Devils would become competitive. I get that most of us aren’t a fan of Henrik, but he was quite a player. 

I just don't see how Zajac would be a yes only if he won something but winning doesn't matter for others. Meanwhile Brylin won 3 here but still doesn't get any recognition. I'm alone in thinking there is no consistency. There doesn't seem to be a standard criteria being applied across the board. 

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1 hour ago, titans04 said:

Yeah this one actually makes total sense.  Can't even pretend to make fun of the reasoning behind it or even hinting it's not deserved.

He was the second best goalie #30 in the Tri State Area during his era, so…

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6 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

I just don't see how Zajac would be a yes only if he won something but winning doesn't matter for others. Meanwhile Brylin won 3 here but still doesn't get any recognition. I'm alone in thinking there is no consistency. There doesn't seem to be a standard criteria being applied across the board. 

Winning a Cup should not be the standard for retiring a guy’s number. Longevity, dedication to the team, and on-ice performance are all relevant criteria. 

Do I think they should retire Zajac’s number? No. Would I protest it if they did? Also no. 

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54 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

Well, I'll carry the unpopular opinion then.

Devils advocate:

Does that mean we can retire Zajac's number? The argument I see here all the time is we never won anything while he was here, so no, but he can go in the Ring of Honor.

He's 4th in all time games played with 1024, tied for 3rd all time goals/points with 202/550. I get he isn't as important as Lundqvist was to NYR, since he really carried them, but seems a bit unfair to say no to Zajac because no cup/winning but Lundqvist gets a resounding yes despite never winning anything. You could argue plenty of the years Zajac invested here the team/management failed him too.

This is not a great argument.  It's not apples to apples at all.  

I liked Zajac a lot, but Lundqvist was a top player at his position for many years.  Won a Vezina and was in the Top 3 in voting five times.  Zajac was a solid intangibles guy who could contribute some offense here and there, but outside of two seasons where he clicked with Langs and Parise, he never cracked so much as 20 goals or 50 points in any other season.  

I actually asked this question a while back on here, if Zajac would be a worthy candidate to have his number retired, and the consensus was absolutely not.  And as much as I like Zajac, that consensus is correct.  He's a nice player and a good soldier who was able to stay healthy enough to compile his way into some solid milestone numbers, and he'll always be remembered fondly by most Devils fans who saw his whole career, but looking at the numbers currently up in the rafters, he shouldn't be up there with them.  

Lundqvist's first 11 years were really friggin' good...he'd get into the HHoF on those numbers alone.  He's a great player.  He was a great Ranger...largely because of his play, the Rangers reached two Conference Finals and one SC Final in a four-year stretch.  Not all of the greats wind up winning Cups.  Doesn't mean he wasn't great, or less worthy of a jersey retirement.

27 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

I just don't see how Zajac would be a yes only if he won something but winning doesn't matter for others. Meanwhile Brylin won 3 here but still doesn't get any recognition. I'm alone in thinking there is no consistency. There doesn't seem to be a standard criteria being applied across the board. 

It's not like there's some checklist for jersey retirements, and even if there was, it's also not like "Must have won a Cup" must be on it.  Shane Doan's #19 was retired by the Yotes.  Think Marleau's #12 is getting retired by the Sharks?  In Lundqvist's case, he played all of his games for the Rangers, was a big reason that they were in the hunt for a Cup for a while, and we've already been over the rest.  He was a great Ranger.  Zajac was a nice Devil, who was plenty likable and popular, but if his number goes up to the rafters, then the Devils are lowering the bar pretty significantly.  Those first five were all special and none could be disputed, and that's the idea. 

I like Brylin too, but he was really was more of a "In the right place at the right time" kind of player...he had his moments, but I would never overstate his impact on the Devils.  It's great that he was here for all three Cups, that he spent his entire career here, and he should get some recognition, sure...but nothing more than a Ring of Honor mention, if that ever becomes a thing again.     

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976
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Retiring numbers is a team/franchise decision.  If the Rangers threshold is lower than the Devils, that is there business.  However, I do think Lundqvist is worthy of having his jersey retired.

As for about no more Ring of Honor nights, that 100% was done for $ and nothing else.  Plus IIRC, the game wasn't even sold out so there went that idea.

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2 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

This is not a great argument.  It's not apples to apples at all.  

I liked Zajac a lot, but Lundqvist was a top player at his position for many years.  Won a Vezina and was in the Top 3 in voting five times.  Zajac was a solid intangibles guy who could contribute some offense here and there, but outside of two seasons where he clicked with Langs and Parise, he never cracked so much as 20 goals or 50 points in any other season.  

I actually asked this question a while back on here, if Zajac would be a worthy candidate to have his number retired, and the consensus was absolutely not.  And as much as I like Zajac, that consensus is correct.  He's a nice player and a good soldier who was able to stay healthy enough to compile his way into some solid milestone numbers, and he'll always be remembered fondly by most Devils fans who saw his whole career, but looking at the numbers currently up in the rafters, he shouldn't be up there with them.  

Lundqvist's first 11 years were really friggin' good...he'd get into the HHoF on those numbers alone.  He's a great player.  He was a great Ranger...largely because of his play, the Rangers reached two Conference Finals and one SC Final in a four-year stretch.  Not all of the greats wind up winning Cups.  Doesn't mean he wasn't great, or less worthy of a jersey retirement.

It's not like there's some checklist for jersey retirements, and even if there was, it's also not like "Must have won a Cup" must be on it.  Shane Doan's #19 was retired by the Yotes.  Think Marleau's #12 is getting retired by the Sharks?  In Lundqvist's case, he played all of his games for the Rangers, was a big reason that they were in the hunt for a Cup for a while, and we've already been over the rest.  He was a great Ranger.  Zajac was a nice Devil, who was plenty likable and popular, but if his number goes up to the rafters, then the Devils are lowering the bar pretty significantly.  Those first five were all special and none could be disputed, and that's the idea. 

I like Brylin too, but he was really was more of a "In the right place at the right time" kind of player...he had his moments, but I would never overstate his impact on the Devils.  It's great that he was here for all three Cups, that he spent his entire career here, and he should get some recognition, sure...but nothing more than a Ring of Honor mention, if that ever becomes a thing again.     

I'm not trying to make an argument comparing Zajac to Lundqvist directly. I'm aware they aren't in the same strata of player. I'm asking a question about what the criteria is for jersey retirement and how important winning really is. If people here say Zajac could be retired if he won something, like he is that good that  if he had just won something it would be a no brainer, then why does Hank get a day 1 retirement announcement but Brylin gets squat but he had 3 cups.

1 hour ago, DevsMan84 said:

Retiring numbers is a team/franchise decision.  If the Rangers threshold is lower than the Devils, that is there business.  However, I do think Lundqvist is worthy of having his jersey retired.

As for about no more Ring of Honor nights, that 100% was done for $ and nothing else.  Plus IIRC, the game wasn't even sold out so there went that idea.

I think DevsMan84's answer is the best in that it is up to the franchise and what "feels" right and there is no equation. 

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16 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

I think DevsMan84's answer is the best in that it is up to the franchise and what "feels" right and there is no equation. 

Second it, he is in charge of it going forward.

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4 hours ago, NJDevils1214 said:

Well, I'll carry the unpopular opinion then.

Devils advocate:

Does that mean we can retire Zajac's number? The argument I see here all the time is we never won anything while he was here, so no, but he can go in the Ring of Honor.

He's 4th in all time games played with 1024, tied for 3rd all time goals/points with 202/550. I get he isn't as important as Lundqvist was to NYR, since he really carried them, but seems a bit unfair to say no to Zajac because no cup/winning but Lundqvist gets a resounding yes despite never winning anything. You could argue plenty of the years Zajac invested here the team/management failed him too.

Bro- Lundqvist is a HOF’er. If you are a HOF’er and arguably the best player at a position in the history of (a really fvcking old) franchise, you deserve to have your jersey retired. You can’t compare Lundqvist to Zajac, it’s apples to grapes lol.

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