Training Camp 2021-22

[mfitz804]

2 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

Anyway, the team straight up came and said “we’re working on this person and have him close” or whatever. If he actually had a legitimate medical reason to not get vaxed they wouldn’t be making statements like that. He’d just be an exemption.

I would like to modify my prior joke and say that we should just use hockey tape to attach syringes of vaccine to Miles Wood at every practice. It’ll only be a matter of time before Blackwood has both doses and a dozen boosters. 

[Nicomo]

Just now, mfitz804 said:

This is a false stereotype that I am personally offended by, I cannot believe in this day and age…

…ah, fvck it, the dude is right. 

My dad was a prosecutor for 30+ years. I’ve been living with it all my life. It doesn’t help that he’s also probably the smartest person I know, so there was obviously never telling him anything lol. 

[mfitz804]

2 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

My dad was a prosecutor for 30+ years. I’ve been living with it all my life. It doesn’t help that he’s also probably the smartest person I know, so there was obviously never telling him anything lol. 

That explains why you're such a "master debater" lol. 

My wife rarely argues with me because she knows she can't win. That predates me being a lawyer, I was the same way when I was pre-med in college. One might argue that it made me predisposed to success as a lawyer, rather than believing that becoming a lawyer made me #relentless at arguing. 

[mfitz804]

I'm going to throw my opinion in on this now. 

I am not against people refusing to have the vaccine. If that is what you want to do, that's great for you. 

I am 100% in favor of people's activities being restricted because they don't have the vaccine. 

I am 100% in favor of an employer's right to require vaccination. If someone doesn't want it, they can find a different job or retire. Employers have the right to enforce that, so tough luck. 

Now, in the hockey team context, my analysis is a bit different. Sure, you still have the same right to choose not to be vaccinated, and the team has the right to tell you that you aren't playing for them. But it goes beyond that. Hockey is a team sport. Pulling yourself out doesn't only affect yourself; if my mailman doesn't want to get vaccinated, another mailman will come in and do the identical job and I will still get my mail. This is not true of, say, a team's starting goalie, who is an integral part of the team's success (or failure). 

By not getting vaccinated, he's not only making a choice for himself. He's letting his teammates, the organization, and its fans down. He's essentially making the decision to (at least partially) bow out of playing. That's a bad decision, a bad look, and a guy not being a team player, IMHO.

[Nicomo]

4 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

I'm going to throw my opinion in on this now. 

I am not against people refusing to have the vaccine. If that is what you want to do, that's great for you. 

I am 100% in favor of people's activities being restricted because they don't have the vaccine. 

I am 100% in favor of an employer's right to require vaccination. If someone doesn't want it, they can find a different job or retire. Employers have the right to enforce that, so tough luck. 

Now, in the hockey team context, my analysis is a bit different. Sure, you still have the same right to choose not to be vaccinated, and the team has the right to tell you that you aren't playing for them. But it goes beyond that. Hockey is a team sport. Pulling yourself out doesn't only affect yourself; if my mailman doesn't want to get vaccinated, another mailman will come in and do the identical job and I will still get my mail. This is not true of, say, a team's starting goalie, who is an integral part of the team's success (or failure). 

By not getting vaccinated, he's not only making a choice for himself. He's letting his teammates, the organization, and its fans down. He's essentially making the decision to (at least partially) bow out of playing. That's a bad decision, a bad look, and a guy not being a team player, IMHO.

Yep. This essentially the exact point I made in my post that was so funny to Mr Leeds…

[jagknife]

Don’t care if I piss some of you all off or not but here goes my 2 cents since I’ve been 98.9% silent on the COVID discussion cause I’m honestly sick of everyone’s bullsh!t. That literally goes The vaccinated and unvaccinated alike.

My huge issue is the extremist stances some people are taking. You want to be upset that so and so didn’t get the shot? Sure, I get it. You want to be upset you’re being essentially forced to get a shot? I also understand that. But the issue needs to be discussed, ESPECIALLY if they’re undecided. Just cause YOU are steadfast on your views doesn’t mean they’re any less ignorant or “uneducated” than YOU are.

With how much bullsh!t we all are being fed from all angles, it’s 100% realistic to think another person can be confused or straight up scared. It doesn’t make them any less of a person.

But since we’re in absolutely dogsh!t time of society, the basic concept of having a conversation with someone you don’t agree with is long gone and now we live in the world of hard stances and vitriol. Empathy is a concept a ton of people have waived bye bye to.

Am I vaccinated? Yep. Was I scared about it cause I didn’t trust having to sign emergency waivers absolving a major pharmaceutical corporation of any oopses? Bet your goddamn ass I was. As with any vaccine, there’s also the possibility of extreme adverse reactions to it by an extremely small number, only in this instance, those were highlighted ten-fold.

Personal experience: Conversations are what caused about 50+ Undecided individuals to change their minds to get the shot out of 536 who did get it. Now, only 3 remain in the “no” category. It wasn’t hate, it wasn’t mockery or degradation of them as a human, it was “tell me why you’re against it or why you’re frightened” and then “here’s the facts and what we know” and it wasn’t the media, it was the conversation with the facts.

the more and more angry this site seemingly becomes, the more I find myself checking less and less.

I love it here, I love the people and the DISCUSSIONS or even debates we have, I make sure each time I order stuff from Amazon I use the referral link cause I can’t always chip in like I’d love to to keep this place running. But the more and more times we go off the rails into this hate circle, I fear we approach the levels of Reddit/Twitter/ or even worse, Facebook.

End. Rant.

Edited September 27, 2021 by jagknife

[MadDog2020]

21 minutes ago, MB3 said:

I like you and I always have, but I think this is a bad take. I'm an empath by nature but I have a total absence of empathy towards anyone and everyone who does not get this shot. 

What's the "bullsh!t" that's "being fed" to these morons? "Every single fvcking doctor says you should take this vaccine"? "Every single alt-right psychopath in government you worship has already gotten this vaccine?" Show me pro-vaccine rhetoric that you classify as bullsh!t and then I'll go ahead and try to side with these poor, scared individuals who just wanna not be bullied awwww. You're terrified of signing an emergency waiver? Hope you don't go to fvcking disney world, dog. Read that ticket, if you fly off of space mountain they've got themselves covered. Oopsies happen, that doesn't mean you shouldn't be doing your fvcking DUTY TO SOCIETY in getting the vaccine and keeping yourself and others safe.

Gambling on your health and the health of those around you because you "don't know what's in the vaccine hurrrrrrrr de durrrr" makes my goddamned blood boil. A cousin of my coworker is a tragic example of that. She was pregnant. She read online that 8 miscarriages happen every year because of a fender-bender causing a strong tightening of the seatbelt during a collision, causing fetal termination. Horrible. So, she decided she wouldn't wear a seatbelt any more so that wouldn't happen! She died after a three-car collision that ejected her through the windsheild of her car. Nobody else on the scene even needed medical attention. Some people go so far to make these decisions that they assume are better for themselves that they don't listen to the thousands of healthcare professionals telling them just exactly HOW to make smarter choices. 

You've gotta spare me the sanctimonious "be kind to these people!!!!!! they're scared of you!!!" nonsense. They're active detriments to society, and several months worth of "just get the vaccine. it keeps you and those around you safe" OBVIOUSLY didn't get the point through to them.

In 5 weeks my wife will be giving birth to my first child, a little boy named Lucas. I have not been allowed to be involved in any step of the process. Appointments? Mom only. First heartbeat? Mom only. Gender reveal? Mom only. First imaging? Mom only. to make it even better, I was just told last week that -- due to the obscene number of outbreaks in my state --I will not be able to be in the hospital. While the biggest moment of my life happens, I will be outside in the parking lot like I'm tailgating a fvckin football game. 

Do you know who's fault that is? I do.

And they can go fvck themselves. 

I would like to nominate this for post of the year. 

Edited September 27, 2021 by MadDog2020

[Satans Hockey]

2 hours ago, MB3 said:

They're active detriments to society. 

They are plague rats. 

I'm sorry to hear that about you not being allowed in for the birth. I know a few people who went through similar situations and were quite upset about it but this was earlier on during this whole mess so it was at least a bit more understandable. Now having the vaccine and the ability to move past this all if everyone did the right thing and people still going meh it's absolutely infuriating. I'm 100% with you on your anger and frustration.

Edited September 27, 2021 by Satans Hockey

[jagknife]

37 minutes ago, MB3 said:

I like you and I always have, but I think this is a bad take. I'm an empath by nature but I have a total absence of empathy towards anyone and everyone who does not get this shot. 

What's the "bullsh!t" that's "being fed" to these morons? "Every single fvcking doctor says you should take this vaccine"? "Every single alt-right psychopath in government you worship has already gotten this vaccine?" Show me pro-vaccine rhetoric that you classify as bullsh!t and then I'll go ahead and try to side with these poor, scared individuals who just wanna not be bullied awwww. You're terrified of signing an emergency waiver? Hope you don't go to fvcking disney world, dog. Read that ticket, if you fly off of space mountain they've got themselves covered. Oopsies happen, that doesn't mean you shouldn't be doing your fvcking DUTY TO SOCIETY in getting the vaccine and keeping yourself and others safe.

Gambling on your health and the health of those around you because you "don't know what's in the vaccine hurrrrrrrr de durrrr" makes my goddamned blood boil. A cousin of my coworker is a tragic example of that. She was pregnant. She read online that 8 miscarriages happen every year because of a fender-bender causing a strong tightening of the seatbelt during a collision, causing fetal termination. Horrible. So, she decided she wouldn't wear a seatbelt any more so that wouldn't happen! She died after a three-car collision that ejected her through the windsheild of her car. Nobody else on the scene even needed medical attention. Some people go so far to make these decisions that they assume are better for themselves that they don't listen to the thousands of healthcare professionals telling them just exactly HOW to make smarter choices. 

You've gotta spare me the sanctimonious "be kind to these people!!!!!! they're scared of you!!!" nonsense. They're active detriments to society, and several months worth of "just get the vaccine. it keeps you and those around you safe" OBVIOUSLY didn't get the point through to them.

In 5 weeks my wife will be giving birth to my first child, a little boy named Lucas. I have not been allowed to be involved in any step of the process. Appointments? Mom only. First heartbeat? Mom only. Gender reveal? Mom only. First imaging? Mom only. to make it even better, I was just told last week that -- due to the obscene number of outbreaks in my state --I will not be able to be in the hospital. While the biggest moment of my life happens, I will be outside in the parking lot like I'm tailgating a fvckin football game. 

Do you know who's fault that is? I do.

And they can go fvck themselves. 

Will not counter to your stance. At all. You’ve been absolutely horrendously robbed of critical phases of your life. It isn’t fair.

I aired my frustration. You have yours and every single right to it.

I wish you nothing but the best of health, same to your family.

[DevilMinder]

I know this is a emotional topic and it affects our entire walk of life but please try and keep it civil. A reminder that politics are rightly banned from the main area of this forum.

 

 

[NJDfan1711]

4 hours ago, mfitz804 said:

I'm going to throw my opinion in on this now. 

I am not against people refusing to have the vaccine. If that is what you want to do, that's great for you. 

I am 100% in favor of people's activities being restricted because they don't have the vaccine. 

I am 100% in favor of an employer's right to require vaccination. If someone doesn't want it, they can find a different job or retire. Employers have the right to enforce that, so tough luck. 

Now, in the hockey team context, my analysis is a bit different. Sure, you still have the same right to choose not to be vaccinated, and the team has the right to tell you that you aren't playing for them. But it goes beyond that. Hockey is a team sport. Pulling yourself out doesn't only affect yourself; if my mailman doesn't want to get vaccinated, another mailman will come in and do the identical job and I will still get my mail. This is not true of, say, a team's starting goalie, who is an integral part of the team's success (or failure). 

By not getting vaccinated, he's not only making a choice for himself. He's letting his teammates, the organization, and its fans down. He's essentially making the decision to (at least partially) bow out of playing. That's a bad decision, a bad look, and a guy not being a team player, IMHO.

I agree with everything you said, but regarding the bolded, I think someone's decision about their own health and well being (which is exactly what getting the vaccine is), trumps and transcends a guy's perceived obligation of being a "team player".  Don't get me wrong, there's no bigger "play for the logo on the front, not the name on the back" guy than myself, but I know I wouldn't want someone telling me I'm not a team player just because I don't want to compromise my own personal health choices.  I don't think those things are mutually exclusive.

[mfitz804]

14 minutes ago, NJDfan1711 said:

I agree with everything you said, but regarding the bolded, I think someone's decision about their own health and well being (which is exactly what getting the vaccine is), trumps and transcends a guy's perceived obligation of being a "team player".  Don't get me wrong, there's no bigger "play for the logo on the front, not the name on the back" guy than myself, but I know I wouldn't want someone telling me I'm not a team player just because I don't want to compromise my own personal health choices.  I don't think those things are mutually exclusive.

Sometimes you don’t get what you want. 

[NJDfan1711]

Just now, mfitz804 said:

Sometimes you don’t get what you want. 

I mean, I can rephrase that.  I don't think it's right to tell someone they aren't a team player because they don't want to compromise their personal health choices.

[mfitz804]

2 minutes ago, NJDfan1711 said:

I mean, I can rephrase that.  I don't think it's right to tell someone they aren't a team player because they don't want to compromise their personal health choices.

That’s an opinion. 

[NJDfan1711]

2 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

That’s an opinion. 

Correct. Welcome to a message board.

[NJDevils1214]

[moustic]

Is there any hockey around there? 

[Rock]

9 hours ago, moustic said:

Is there any hockey around there? 

1st preseason game is tomorrow 9/29. Maybe some hockey talk will increase.😎

[SterioDesign]

20 hours ago, jagknife said:

Don’t care if I piss some of you all off or not but here goes my 2 cents since I’ve been 98.9% silent on the COVID discussion cause I’m honestly sick of everyone’s bullsh!t. That literally goes The vaccinated and unvaccinated alike.

My huge issue is the extremist stances some people are taking. You want to be upset that so and so didn’t get the shot? Sure, I get it. You want to be upset you’re being essentially forced to get a shot? I also understand that. But the issue needs to be discussed, ESPECIALLY if they’re undecided. Just cause YOU are steadfast on your views doesn’t mean they’re any less ignorant or “uneducated” than YOU are.

With how much bullsh!t we all are being fed from all angles, it’s 100% realistic to think another person can be confused or straight up scared. It doesn’t make them any less of a person.

But since we’re in absolutely dogsh!t time of society, the basic concept of having a conversation with someone you don’t agree with is long gone and now we live in the world of hard stances and vitriol. Empathy is a concept a ton of people have waived bye bye to.

Am I vaccinated? Yep. Was I scared about it cause I didn’t trust having to sign emergency waivers absolving a major pharmaceutical corporation of any oopses? Bet your goddamn ass I was. As with any vaccine, there’s also the possibility of extreme adverse reactions to it by an extremely small number, only in this instance, those were highlighted ten-fold.

Personal experience: Conversations are what caused about 50+ Undecided individuals to change their minds to get the shot out of 536 who did get it. Now, only 3 remain in the “no” category. It wasn’t hate, it wasn’t mockery or degradation of them as a human, it was “tell me why you’re against it or why you’re frightened” and then “here’s the facts and what we know” and it wasn’t the media, it was the conversation with the facts.

the more and more angry this site seemingly becomes, the more I find myself checking less and less.

I love it here, I love the people and the DISCUSSIONS or even debates we have, I make sure each time I order stuff from Amazon I use the referral link cause I can’t always chip in like I’d love to to keep this place running. But the more and more times we go off the rails into this hate circle, I fear we approach the levels of Reddit/Twitter/ or even worse, Facebook.

End. Rant.

Yup.

With just about any subject, that it's sports, politics, anything. The problem in society in general is that too many people now live in echo chambers on the extremes and are completely brainwashed / trained into living through one narrative and dismissing everything that doesn't support that. Cause they are convinced and told they are the "good guys". Which makes it okay to them to be complete a$$holes, demonizing and mocking the opposition like they are literally the worst people on earth. And that both sides are doing it, 100% of the time. Problem is everyone on one side is convinced that only the other side is doing it. And this all brings SO many double standards in people's logic and critical thinking. And in general, empathy is only a thing for the people on your side. People don't have empathy for people they disagree with for the most part, cause that'd be throwing away their ammunitions. 

Like you said, this sh!t is usually resolved in discussions with people from both sides actually willing to listen to the other side to understand what their angle is and see where they can meet in the middle and if there's misconception, that's where you calmy present facts and alternative takes. When people discard AUTOMATICALLY something said by someone on the opposition like "oh well that's bullsh!t that person is a "wtv", then you're just as biased. Through the last few years i really discovered that you don't have to believe everything, but listening to both sides is very very important, cause that's when you really compare and see what both sides are ommiting and twisting to their favour or to hurt the other side. Then once you have all the infos you can dig more and figure out things. It's incredibly easy to see when you're actually willing to be fair.

If the goal is to change someone's mind. That's how you do it, through calm discussions. Most people screaming about how wrong and dumb others are, posting memes and demonizing the opinion will never change someone's mind, as a matter of fact it's dividing people even more and making it harder for both sides to meet in the middle. How many people changed their mind after been screamed at that they are dumb. When that happens your mind goes in fight or flight mode, get really defensive and that's when denial and all that sh!t kicks in and you will NOT be able to look at the big picture and try to see another angle.

Sad part is the people screaming the most are not really trying to change people mind. They are just craving the praises and be accepted by the people with the same opinion that they have. So they are making things worst and dividing people just to feel better about themselves, which is sad.

And as for your post in general. Easy to see who's willing to be fair and neutral. They'll understand what you're saying. People standing on the extremes won't. 

Edited September 28, 2021 by SterioDesign

[SterioDesign]

15 minutes ago, MB3 said:

With legitimate sincerity if I have to read another one of your self-obsessed diatribes on the state of society I am going to shove a pencil into my urethra. 

Yup i know. As i described in that post, that sort of reaction is perfectly normal for someone only willing to live in their own echo chamber.

You don't agree with what is said so you attack the person. Would love to see how this post is self-obsessed when all i said it pointing out structures of thinking/mindset and their reactions on both sides, never referring anything to myself. But yeah, common sense is not working too well for someone emotional.

Put that pencil away though. Life is worth living. 

Edited September 28, 2021 by SterioDesign

[Guadana]

 

 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Guadana

[RunninWithTheDevil]

Ooo lunch break hockey. I like.

[jagknife]

So I know we haven't played a single game yet, but I wouldn’t mind seeing Vesey sign and then promptly get hat tricks against Buffalo and the Rangers.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

5 minutes ago, jagknife said:

So I know we haven't played a single game yet, but I wouldn’t mind seeing Vesey sign and then promptly get hat tricks against Buffalo and the Rangers.

Hear ya on that, heh heh, but my only issue with guys like Vesey making the team is that it usually doesn't take all that long before they remind you of why they had to take a PTO in the first place.  Guess we'll see.

[mfitz804]

1 hour ago, MB3 said:

With legitimate sincerity if I have to read another one of your self-obsessed diatribes on the state of society I am going to shove a pencil into my urethra. 

Are you trying to encourage him to do it again, or not do it again? It’s unclear. Pencil in the urethra sounds like good viral video fun…