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2021-2022 Around the League thread


MadDog2020

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2 minutes ago, Lateralous said:

One other point is that if you include the #2 in the upcoming draft, we have three top 10 picks on board that are not yet on the roster.  Assuming Slaf is the pick, all three address major holes in the roster when they do arrive, if they pan out of course.   The Devils are far from a finished product that is just wildly underachieving.     

At least with respect to the prospects, I think Fitz has done a nice job taking a long term approach and not rushing guys up 

We're actually at the point where we have a pretty deep prospect pool and these type trades can make a lot more sense than when Shero was doing them.   I don't know if Palmieri qualifies as falling short of his draft position but imagine if we could land that type of player now for just a 2nd and 3rd?     

And of course Shero didn't have much else to work with in assets to trade, in trying to find some guys who could play on his team right away.  That picks-for-NHLer kind of deal worked out just fine with Palms, in that the Devils got five cost-effective and relatively productive seasons out of him.  Unfortunately not many similar moves (MoJo, Mueller, etc) worked out nearly as well. 

But yeah kids will be coming soon to add to the kids already here (definitely not convinced about Holtz, but he'll be getting his shot soon enough).  It's just a question of will the right guys be working with them?  If I have any fears re:  Fitz at the moment, I wonder if he's like several MLB GMs who see their managers as their puppets.  I'm with others who feel that if you're committed to Rupp for a third season, let the guy pick his own assistants.  I'm with MD2020 in that I'm done bellyaching about him still being here (and getting ticked off when other teams sign new coaches), but at least give the guy some level of power if you don't want to explore other head coaching options.

re:  SD's analogy, that one does make sense, but it does get to a point where even if there's not much left to lose, you just hate seeing losers being allowed to stick around.  Nas and Recchi were never going to be the answer...it was sickening just seeing them continuing not being the answer game after game after game.  But yeah, as SD correctly noted, a sh!t-ton went wrong.  

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3 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

And of course Shero didn't have much else to work with in assets to trade, in trying to find some guys who could play on his team right away.  That picks-for-NHLer kind of deal worked out just fine with Palms, in that the Devils got five cost-effective and relatively productive seasons out of him.  Unfortunately not many similar moves (MoJo, Mueller, etc) worked out nearly as well. 

But yeah kids will be coming soon to add to the kids already here (definitely not convinced about Holtz, but he'll be getting his shot soon enough).  It's just a question of will the right guys be working with them?  If I have any fears re:  Fitz at the moment, I wonder if he's like several MLB GMs who see their managers as their puppets.  I'm with others who feel that if you're committed to Rupp for a third season, let the guy pick his own assistants.  I'm with MD2020 in that I'm done bellyaching about him still being here (and getting ticked off when other teams sign new coaches), but at least give the guy some level of power if you don't want to explore other head coaching options.

re:  SD's analogy, that one does make sense, but it does get to a point where even if there's not much left to lose, you just hate seeing losers being allowed to stick around.  Nas and Recchi were never going to be the answer...it was sickening just seeing them continuing not being the answer game after game after game.  But yeah, as SD correctly noted, a sh!t-ton went wrong.  

At the very least it is poor optics to make a declaration at the beginning of the season that you want to play meaningful games in March and when the ship starts sinking fast in Nov/Dec you sit on your hands.

It also wasn't very encouraging to see that his big deadline move was to acquire a goaltender who was back in the NHL for the first time in 4 years this year and whose injury escaped our GM's notice when he traded for him.

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16 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

It also wasn't very encouraging to see that his big deadline move was to acquire a goaltender who was back in the NHL for the first time in 4 years this year and whose injury escaped our GM's notice when he traded for him.

I’m not sure what other deals he could have made, I guess moving PK was an option but for nobody wanting him. Otherwise it would be us trying to trade away pieces of sh!t, which isn’t what people are looking for at the trade deadline. 

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8 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

I’m not sure what other deals he could have made, I guess moving PK was an option but for nobody wanting him. Otherwise it would be us trying to trade away pieces of sh!t, which isn’t what people are looking for at the trade deadline. 

He said at the time the purpose of the trade was to give the team a chance to win games down the stretch and that he owes it to them.  That's fine and all, but giving them a goalie who hasn't played in 4 years plus who was injured doesn't seem to fit the bill.  It probably would have been just as effective if he did nothing.

I am not going to fault him for the moves he could have made but he didn't; but the one he did make and how confounding it was.

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25 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

He said at the time the purpose of the trade was to give the team a chance to win games down the stretch and that he owes it to them.  That's fine and all, but giving them a goalie who hasn't played in 4 years plus who was injured doesn't seem to fit the bill.  It probably would have been just as effective if he did nothing.

I am not going to fault him for the moves he could have made but he didn't; but the one he did make and how confounding it was.

the fact that Hammond is the BEST option Fitz could get. And that there wasn't much movement with other goalies moving, eventhough it was reported that many playoffs teams wanted to add a goalie. Plus just looking into who could have been available etc etc.. there just wasnt many options.

Especially when you want to get a goalie... without sending one the other way (since our goalies were injured). What team would send a goalie who can be either a starter or solid backup without getting another one in exchange?

Im glad we gave Daws a good look and experience at the NHL level instead of making a desperate move that'd cost us too much just to please the fans. in a season that was clearly lost anyway

And its worth noting that Fitz HAD a good setup. With Blackwood, Bernier and Wedgewood. The first 2 got injured and Wedge got picked up on waivers and had a pretty good season. But that happened when we had 2 healthy goalies ahead of him. So it's really not his fault

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1 hour ago, DevsMan84 said:

At the very least it is poor optics to make a declaration at the beginning of the season that you want to play meaningful games in March and when the ship starts sinking fast in Nov/Dec you sit on your hands.

It also wasn't very encouraging to see that his big deadline move was to acquire a goaltender who was back in the NHL for the first time in 4 years this year and whose injury escaped our GM's notice when he traded for him.

The good ol' "he's not doing anything, sitting on his hands" when fans don't see results, is so so so so shortsighted

Clearly many have no idea what it is to be a GM and how much work and calls you make that simply doesn't pan out more often than not.

Again, going back to my analogy it's like the dad spending his entire days making calls and sending his resume to companies, going on interviews. He's just not landing any jobs, not his fault, it takes 2 to tango. And his family who's working all day or at school don't see that and simply assume he's playing videogames all day not even trying. Like come on. 

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13 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

the fact that Hammond is the BEST option Fitz could get. And that there wasn't much movement with other goalies moving, eventhough it was reported that many playoffs teams wanted to add a goalie. Plus just looking into who could have been available etc etc.. there just wasnt many options.

Especially when you want to get a goalie... without sending one the other way (since our goalies were injured). What team would send a goalie who can be either a starter or solid backup without getting another one in exchange?

Im glad we gave Daws a good look and experience at the NHL level instead of making a desperate move that'd cost us too much just to please the fans. in a season that was clearly lost anyway

And its worth noting that Fitz HAD a good setup. With Blackwood, Bernier and Wedgewood. The first 2 got injured and Wedge got picked up on waivers and had a pretty good season. But that happened when we had 2 healthy goalies ahead of him. So it's really not his fault

If an injured, rusty goalie was the best option then the trade shouldn't have been made; especially when you go in front of 3 in-house "reporters" and try to justify it by saying you are trying to get the team wins to make themselves feel good.

I also cannot for the life of me understand how Fitz not knowing Hammond was injured doesn't faze you in the slightest.  I bet if Lou traded for a player and immediately admitted he didn't know he was injured we would be hearing it for at least a decade from you.

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4 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

The good ol' "he's not doing anything, sitting on his hands" when fans don't see results, is so so so so shortsighted

Clearly many have no idea what it is to be a GM and how much work and calls you make that simply doesn't pan out more often than not.

Again, going back to my analogy it's like the dad spending his entire days making calls and sending his resume to companies, going on interviews. He's just not landing any jobs, not his fault, it takes 2 to tango. And his family who's working all day or at school don't see that and simply assume he's playing videogames all day not even trying. Like come on. 

You mean that Fitz firing with a D-coach who has been around for 7 years and whose D-men under him seem to develop backwards during his time while also sticking with another coach who has lead to the worst PP 2 years in a row is out of reach?  Not only that but he ended up firing both at the end of the season anyways lol.

As with the trade deadline, again I am not going after Fitz for the deals that didn't happen, but the one that did.  I really am flabbergasted at the fact that Fitz being surprised to hear from his own in-house media telling him that Hammond was injured the day he acquired him does not seem to raise a major red flag for you as well as others.

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13 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

If an injured, rusty goalie was the best option then the trade shouldn't have been made; especially when you go in front of 3 in-house "reporters" and try to justify it by saying you are trying to get the team wins to make themselves feel good.

I also cannot for the life of me understand how Fitz not knowing Hammond was injured doesn't faze you in the slightest.  I bet if Lou traded for a player and immediately admitted he didn't know he was injured we would be hearing it for at least a decade from you.

Exactly. A move wasn't made for months because there wasn't good options, fans with little knowledge of what was available whined away their lives for months about it.

And i was not happy with Fitz many times this year too. I'm really not a Fitz fanboy. But i sure can defend him when there's unfair criticism. And i was really vocal about not being happy with him riding the recchi, Nas tandem for this long.

The big difference is that when I don't agree with something Fitz do or doesnt do. I try to understand why and try to imagine logical explaination why. While you just assume he's not doing anything and doesnt care / just bad at his job

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15 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Exactly. A move wasn't made for months because there wasn't good options, fans with little knowledge of what was available whined away their lives for months about it.

And i was not happy with Fitz many times this year too. I'm really not a Fitz fanboy. But i sure can defend him when there's unfair criticism. And i was really vocal about not being happy with him riding the recchi, Nas tandem for this long.

The big difference is that when I don't agree with something Fitz do or doesnt do. I try to understand why and try to imagine logical explaination why. While you just assume he's not doing anything and doesnt care / just bad at his job

lol to this day you still nail Lou to the cross over what he should have done and what he shouldn't have done.  I wish you would extend the same standards to Fitz.

When Fitz doesn't know the health status of the guy he is trading for it doesn't exactly instill confidence in me.  Maybe I am just crazy at being flabbergasted that a GM of a professional major league team didn't know that.

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13 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

He said at the time the purpose of the trade was to give the team a chance to win games down the stretch and that he owes it to them.  That's fine and all, but giving them a goalie who hasn't played in 4 years plus who was injured doesn't seem to fit the bill.  It probably would have been just as effective if he did nothing.

I am not going to fault him for the moves he could have made but he didn't; but the one he did make and how confounding it was.

No doubt, that was a sh!t move. 

1 hour ago, DevsMan84 said:

lol to this day you still nail Lou to the cross over what he should have done and what he shouldn't have done.  I wish you would extend the same standards to Fitz.

When Fitz doesn't know the health status of the guy he is trading for it doesn't exactly instill confidence in me.  Maybe I am just crazy at being flabbergasted that a GM of a professional major league team didn't know that.

Flabbergasted is a really underrated word. 

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5 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

No doubt, that was a sh!t move. 

Flabbergasted is a really underrated word. 

It's the only word I can use to describe it.  A GM trading for a player he doesn't know is injured is what you would expect out of a sports comedy movie.  He looked like Mr. Magoo when he was informed that the player he just acquired was injured.

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2 hours ago, SterioDesign said:

Exactly. A move wasn't made for months because there wasn't good options, fans with little knowledge of what was available whined away their lives for months about it.

And i was not happy with Fitz many times this year too. I'm really not a Fitz fanboy. But i sure can defend him when there's unfair criticism. And i was really vocal about not being happy with him riding the recchi, Nas tandem for this long.

The big difference is that when I don't agree with something Fitz do or doesnt do. I try to understand why and try to imagine logical explaination why. While you just assume he's not doing anything and doesnt care / just bad at his job

Dude, Anton Khudobin was languishing away on the Iowa Stars. I doubt Fitz even thought for a second to inquire about him

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3 minutes ago, CarpathianForest said:

Dude, Anton Khudobin was languishing away on the Iowa Stars. I doubt Fitz even thought for a second to inquire about him

2021-22 Dallas Stars NHL 9 0 0 462 28 0 0 3.63 3 4 1 203 0.879      
2021-22 Texas Stars AHL 6 0 4 353 15 3 0 2.55 2 4 0 140 0.903

 

Not a strong argument. Those are crap #s. (also 36 years old) c'mon, there was no goalie move. 

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5 hours ago, SterioDesign said:

the fact that Hammond is the BEST option Fitz could get. And that there wasn't much movement with other goalies moving, eventhough it was reported that many playoffs teams wanted to add a goalie. Plus just looking into who could have been available etc etc.. there just wasnt many options.

Especially when you want to get a goalie... without sending one the other way (since our goalies were injured). What team would send a goalie who can be either a starter or solid backup without getting another one in exchange?

Im glad we gave Daws a good look and experience at the NHL level instead of making a desperate move that'd cost us too much just to please the fans. in a season that was clearly lost anyway

And its worth noting that Fitz HAD a good setup. With Blackwood, Bernier and Wedgewood. The first 2 got injured and Wedge got picked up on waivers and had a pretty good season. But that happened when we had 2 healthy goalies ahead of him. So it's really not his fault

To be fair, we dont know Hammond was the best option. Hammond was also traded one time before we got him, so he was available twice which, in addition to the not knowing about the injury thing, is why I question just just how thorough he was being. It very well could be that Minny decided to trade him to Montreal instead of Jersey the first time, and you’re right, we’ll never know the truth there.

As for the Wedgewood thing though, I’m sorry. That’s 100% mismanagement of assets by Fitz. Blackwood was still recovering from surgery and Bernier was “day to day” playing hurt (he was injured in the preseason) when Wedge went on waivers. We had 2 wonky goalies and sending Wedge through waivers while Mason “Second Rate Facepuncher” Geertson is on the roster was a terrible decision. Especially since Geertson wasn’t even dressing for games at the time! 

And I need to clarify… we aren’t “whining because nothing is happening”. We are watching everyone around us figuring out how to build a team while we are seemingly stuck in first gear for a decade. We have some great pieces, especially at forward, but filling out this roster seems like an endless game of wack-a-mole at times. 

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5 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

As for the Wedgewood thing though, I’m sorry. That’s 100% mismanagement of assets by Fitz.

Add to that the fact that he was very unlikely to clear. He had bounced around a lot but there’s always a taker. Everyone knows post-COVID you need a third goalie option, and Wedgewood was perfect for that, semi-reliable at a very low cost. 

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20 minutes ago, Crisis said:

How many more games do we think the Devils would have won with Wedgewood?  Or Khudobin?  Maybe 5?  So that would have put us in 7th place in the Metro instead of.. let me check my notes here.. ah yes, 7th.

Oh, it definitely would not have helped. But you wouldn’t have had to trade for Gillies and Hammond, and we’re just talking about it from an asset management perspective. 

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