GDT: Stars @ Devils 7PM 1/25/22

[Devilsfan118]

59 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

I mean - sure they are, but after like the 100th time it gets a little old. He does it every single time someone posts one. 

As far as “name calling?” Ok snowflake…

Wasting your time.

Join the club, I'll make us jackets.  Does make this forum a bit unreadable though since, like you said, there's clearly a quota that needs to be hit here.

[mfitz804]

5 minutes ago, Devilsfan118 said:

Wasting your time.

Join the club, I'll make us jackets.  Does make this forum a bit unreadable though since, like you said, there's clearly a quota that needs to be hit here.

If they say 'Pu$$yboy Club" on the back, I'll pay for yours...

[SterioDesign]

41 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

It’s not that flawed. It’s literally showing 1 team that has a worse amount of playoff appearances in the last decade. Half the teams make in. In 2020, almost everyone made it.
 

That being said, I understand your point. But do you think the fans of those teams just said “oh well it happens to everyone”? I’m sure they were also upset. And I’m sure they also said so on their message boards or whatever equivalent they have. 
 

Those teams also fired coaches and GM’s that weren’t getting the job done. The Shero/Fitz era of wait-and-see is hitting year 7 and so far we have excellent center depth, a really special late round steal in Bratt, and decent lower depth wings. Those are good things. But the defense is aimless, the goaltending seems to be an afterthought, and the coaches don’t have the ability to get the most out of players or even have them properly prepared for games. People are going to be frustrated, especially when there’s no end in sight. 

Of course and i never said fans shouldn't feel frustrated. I'm frustrated too to be in that situation.

But that doesn't mean that any frustrated claim is fair or relevant either and some deserve to be challenge or criticized too. 

I'll never argue against fans calling for the coaching staff's head. We need a change there and that i'm right or wrong. I do think Fitz is too patient. But i'm also considering that maybe there's a reason he's patient. Maybe he has a plan for next season already and something aligned and just see no point in firing a coaching staff and somehow replace it by a temporary staff for 2-3 months. Would that help that much in the long run? But also, maybe he has no clue and he's just foolishly too patient.

I personally think we're only entering a time when we should have "some slight" expectations. I think its very unfair to put all those years from 2015 til recently on shero and fitz. They started from the ground with almost nothing to work with. It takes a fvcking long time to rebuild from that. The Rangers rebuild went way faster than us, yeah. But they didn't wait until they hit absolute rock bottom to start a rebuild either. Plus they are an attractive destination but it helped. But they had young players to build around and valuable players to trade to jump start the rebuild. We had nothing in 2015. That's a context that we just can't ignore, i honestly don't think i've ever seen a team in a worst position roster and prospect wize than the devils in 2015. You don't recover from that in 7 years unless you are an attractive destination and a crystal ball so that you hit the jackpot on every draft pick AND just happen to land on the right year for drafts. 

If we were a stacked team just unable to get it done year after year i'd get the whole "its been 7 years" but we had an enormous hole to climb outside of.

We've made a lot of progress since 2015. It may not show in the standings at the moment but its pretty clear that were trending up

Edited January 26, 2022 by SterioDesign

[Devil Dan 56]

58 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Of course and i never said fans shouldn't feel frustrated. I'm frustrated too to be in that situation.

But that doesn't mean that any frustrated claim is fair or relevant either and some deserve to be challenge or criticized too. 

I'll never argue against fans calling for the coaching staff's head. We need a change there and that i'm right or wrong. I do think Fitz is too patient. But i'm also considering that maybe there's a reason he's patient. Maybe he has a plan for next season already and something aligned and just see no point in firing a coaching staff and somehow replace it by a temporary staff for 2-3 months. Would that help that much in the long run? But also, maybe he has no clue and he's just foolishly too patient.

I personally think we're only entering a time when we should have "some slight" expectations. I think its very unfair to put all those years from 2015 til recently on shero and fitz. They started from the ground with almost nothing to work with. It takes a fvcking long time to rebuild from that. The Rangers rebuild went way faster than us, yeah. But they didn't wait until they hit absolute rock bottom to start a rebuild either. Plus they are an attractive destination but it helped. But they had young players to build around and valuable players to trade to jump start the rebuild. We had nothing in 2015. That's a context that we just can't ignore, i honestly don't think i've ever seen a team in a worst position roster and prospect wize than the devils in 2015. You don't recover from that in 7 years unless you are an attractive destination and a crystal ball so that you hit the jackpot on every draft pick AND just happen to land on the right year for drafts. 

If we were a stacked team just unable to get it done year after year i'd get the whole "its been 7 years" but we had an enormous hole to climb outside of.

We've made a lot of progress since 2015. It may not show in the standings at the moment but its pretty clear that were trending up

We’ve definitely made a lot of progress. A ton. There’s no denying that. There are good pieces in place, like at center and the 2nd 3rd and 4th wingers, and Bratt seems to have really turned a corner. But I do feel that the talent on this team is capable of a little more than what we’ve seen out of them. I feel this team should be flirting with a wild card spot. Obviously covid and injuries played a part, but I don’t trust this coaching staff nor do I trust that Fitz is willing to break them up already. I’m willing to see what happens in the offseason with that though. There will be more opportunities to replace them then.

I also really dislike Fitz’ handling of the goaltending. If we knew Blackwood was getting surgery in the summer and wouldn’t be ready for the season, I just don’t know why he went with Bernier and then Scott Wedgewood as the 3rd behind him. I like Bernier as a temp starter but Wedge has shown he can’t handle regular back up duties. 

It’s frustrating. As Mel Brooks would say.. “harumpf” 

[DevsMan84]

2 hours ago, Nicomo said:

I mean - sure they are, but after like the 100th time it gets a little old. He does it every single time someone posts one. 

As far as “name calling?” Ok snowflake…

I legit cannot remember the last time I questioned Cordell's little shot attempts/assists chart lol.

If you wanted me to say that Cordell's chart shows Hughes played awesome you should have just asked.  He did play very well yesterday.  Sheesh.

 

[SterioDesign]

8 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

We’ve definitely made a lot of progress. A ton. There’s no denying that. There are good pieces in place, like at center and the 2nd 3rd and 4th wingers, and Bratt seems to have really turned a corner. But I do feel that the talent on this team is capable of a little more than what we’ve seen out of them. I feel this team should be flirting with a wild card spot. Obviously covid and injuries played a part, but I don’t trust this coaching staff nor do I trust that Fitz is willing to break them up already. I’m willing to see what happens in the offseason with that though. There will be more opportunities to replace them then.

I also really dislike Fitz’ handling of the goaltending. If we knew Blackwood was getting surgery in the summer and wouldn’t be ready for the season, I just don’t know why he went with Bernier and then Scott Wedgewood as the 3rd behind him. I like Bernier as a temp starter but Wedge has shown he can’t handle regular back up duties. 

It’s frustrating. As Mel Brooks would say.. “harumpf” 

Before the season i figured that IF literally everything went as good as it possibly could, that we may be real close to a wild card spot. That was my realistic expectations.

Now, our best player got injured and missed a ton of games from the get-go, bunch of players got covid, both our goalies are fvcked with injuries and some players like Smith kind of regressed. And now our best D has been out for awhile. And our special units has been very bad for most of the season

So by definition, the best possible scenario didn't happen lol So i kind of understand and accept where we are in the standings. It sucks, but at the same time fully understandable to me.

For me the biggest thing is Nas. Is he the problem? Who knows. But the fact that he's still here despite basically not showing anything why he should still be here. If he's still there next season i'm going full force gorilla

 

Edited January 26, 2022 by SterioDesign

[PacificDevil]

Everything seems like a bad timing since 2015:

1) The So-so results of the loaded 2015 draft (Lou era still)

2) 1OAs don’t end up being McDavid or Matthews but somehow consensus 3OA - 4 OA(Makar, Heiskenen) becoming stars 

3) Schneider falling off the earth exactly at the time things started to look a bit promising (2017-18)

4) All reasonable on paper top 6 for 2nd rounder type of improvements on paper never working out (Johansson, Gusev)

5) Guys drafted further like Boqvist that are highly rated not really becoming anything special 

[SterioDesign]

Just now, PacificDevil said:

Everything seems like a bad timing since 2015:

1) The So-so results of the loaded 2015 draft (Lou era still)

2) 1OAs don’t end up being McDavid or Matthews but somehow consensus 3OA - 4 OA(Makar, Heiskenen) becoming stars 

3) Schneider falling off the earth exactly at the time things started to look a bit promising (2017-18)

4) All reasonable on paper top 6 for 2nd rounder type of improvements on paper never working out (Johansson, Gusev)

5) Guys drafted further like Boqvist that are highly rated not really becoming anything special 

Yeah this. You definitely have to made good decisions to build a good team. But luck and how things actually turn out is even more important. And that just didn't go our way at all

[DevsMan84]

1 minute ago, PacificDevil said:

Everything seems like a bad timing since 2015:

1) The So-so results of the loaded 2015 draft (Lou era still)

2) 1OAs don’t end up being McDavid or Matthews but somehow consensus 3OA - 4 OA(Makar, Heiskenen) becoming stars 

3) Schneider falling off the earth exactly at the time things started to look a bit promising (2017-18)

4) All reasonable on paper top 6 for 2nd rounder type of improvements on paper never working out (Johansson, Gusev)

5) Guys drafted further like Boqvist that are highly rated not really becoming anything special 

A couple things going the wrong way I would chalk up to bad timing/luck.

Repeated patterns over several years means something else is going on.

[titans04]

7 hours ago, Crisis said:

That's exactly right.  Shot attempt is basically anything a player sends towards the net - so shots on goal, misses, posts, blocks.  And shot assists are times a player passed to someone who felt like they are in a good enough position to send a shot towards the net.  So the graph is showing just how much offense Jack has created.  You can see how much he and Bratt are feeding Rango.  Yegor has more shot attempts than everyone else (less Jack) has shot attempts + assists.

This is why it would be just ducky if Fitzgerald can throw a true sniper on Jack's wing.  Imagine a player who can be more efficient at converting those opportunities.

Thanks Crisis! Appreciate it.

[Devilsfan118]

1 hour ago, PacificDevil said:

Everything seems like a bad timing since 2015:

1) The So-so results of the loaded 2015 draft (Lou era still)

2) 1OAs don’t end up being McDavid or Matthews but somehow consensus 3OA - 4 OA(Makar, Heiskenen) becoming stars 

3) Schneider falling off the earth exactly at the time things started to look a bit promising (2017-18)

4) All reasonable on paper top 6 for 2nd rounder type of improvements on paper never working out (Johansson, Gusev)

5) Guys drafted further like Boqvist that are highly rated not really becoming anything special 

1) Self inflicted

2) Bad luck

3) Stupid trade by Lou to begin with.  Self inflicted

4) Bad luck but also a result of poor drafting and player development that these positions couldn't be filled internally.  50-50

5) Late round picks are such a crapshoot.  Bad luck.

Just my opinions here but it's not simply bad luck for the team.  Lots of Lou-era mistakes that we're still paying the price for.

Edited January 26, 2022 by Devilsfan118

[SterioDesign]

28 minutes ago, Devilsfan118 said:

1) Self inflicted

2) Bad luck

3) Stupid trade by Lou to begin with.  Self inflicted

4) Bad luck but also a result of poor drafting and player development that these positions couldn't be filled internally.  50-50

5) Late round picks are such a crapshoot.  Bad luck.

Just my opinions here but it's not simply bad luck for the team.  Lots of Lou-era mistakes that we're still paying the price for.

I don't think its fair to say that it was a stupid trade by Lou. On paper it was a great move. Just one of many who didn't pan out in the long run. Schneider was actually amazing for the first few seasons. Literally standing on his head while the team couldn't score a goal to save their lives. Then when we finally had a team that could somewhat score... then Schneider fell off a cliff. That's bad luck.

Sure in hindsight it may look bad but as much as i dont see eye to eye with Lou on a lot of his decisions. Can't fault him for that one.

Edited January 26, 2022 by SterioDesign

[Devil Dan 56]

3 hours ago, SterioDesign said:

Before the season i figured that IF literally everything went as good as it possibly could, that we may be real close to a wild card spot. That was my realistic expectations.

Now, our best player got injured and missed a ton of games from the get-go, bunch of players got covid, both our goalies are fvcked with injuries and some players like Smith kind of regressed. And now our best D has been out for awhile. And our special units has been very bad for most of the season

So by definition, the best possible scenario didn't happen lol So i kind of understand and accept where we are in the standings. It sucks, but at the same time fully understandable to me.

For me the biggest thing is Nas. Is he the problem? Who knows. But the fact that he's still here despite basically not showing anything why he should still be here. If he's still there next season i'm going full force gorilla

 

Re: your last paragraph. I don’t think Nas is THE problem but he’s certainly part of it. He’s absolutely not part of the solution though. The defense is just too often out of position. There’s something fundamentally wrong going on there. 

[Devilsfan118]

2 hours ago, SterioDesign said:

I don't think its fair to say that it was a stupid trade by Lou. On paper it was a great move. Just one of many who didn't pan out in the long run. Schneider was actually amazing for the first few seasons. Literally standing on his head while the team couldn't score a goal to save their lives. Then when we finally had a team that could somewhat score... then Schneider fell off a cliff. That's bad luck.

Sure in hindsight it may look bad but as much as i dont see eye to eye with Lou on a lot of his decisions. Can't fault him for that one.

The value was fine, but the team should've just entered a rebuild. I think everybody could see the writing on the wall.

Cory was literally a bandaid. He kept us from truly bottoming out for a long while with his stellar play. Such a waste.

Edited January 26, 2022 by Devilsfan118

[SterioDesign]

55 minutes ago, Devilsfan118 said:

The value was fine, but the team should've just entered a rebuild. I think everybody could see the writing on the wall.

Cory was literally a bandaid. He kept us from truly bottoming out for a long while with his stellar play. Such a waste.

Well you're right. And... some here may or may not have noticed that i've been on record "a few times" saying that i was truly against Lou's all-in at all cost / bandaid approach and refusing to start a rebuild. So that's true 100% from that angle.

But i also think we still really needed to get a goalie so i wouldnt blame Lou too much on this one. 

[Brewskies]

22 hours ago, Jerrydevil said:

We need more talent but I believe it's possible that a different coach could get more out of the current group.

Sorry you can't make chicken salad out of chicken sh!t. I  don't care who the chef(coach) is. 

 

Edited January 27, 2022 by Brewskies

[Brewskies]

I have been reading some of the posts here. The Devils are bringing out the worst in it's fans. Play nice boys. 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

16 hours ago, Devilsfan118 said:

The value was fine, but the team should've just entered a rebuild. I think everybody could see the writing on the wall.

Cory was literally a bandaid. He kept us from truly bottoming out for a long while with his stellar play. Such a waste.

Finishing 2010-11 on a flourish, then coming within two wins of a SC in 2011-12 and starting 2013 well had Lou thinking he could still squeeze another Cup run out of his team...Cory was a "right now" move that, given his age, could've still worked out even if the team had some down years.  The problem was that the Devils turned out to be not nearly good enough to win, and then Cory's prime lasted a solid five years less than expected...he was basically done as an upper-echelon puck-stopper by the time he was 30.  A pretty good move that blew up.

 

16 hours ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

Re: your last paragraph. I don’t think Nas is THE problem but he’s certainly part of it. He’s absolutely not part of the solution though. The defense is just too often out of position. There’s something fundamentally wrong going on there. 

As aggravated as I am with the situation, if Fitz cans this whole lot come the offseason, I'm actually willing to give him one more hire...I do think he's capable of solid personnel decisions.  Yeah, I wish he'd tried to keep the ship from taking on so much water, but there's been just enough injuries (to guys like Hughes, Hamilton, etc) to wonder how much he could've done in-season.  Doesn't mean I'm happy with what feels like lethargic indifference, just that I don't know what really could've been done. 

If he tries to sell us all on The Three Stooges getting another shot in 2022-23, then I'm absolutely done with him.  Maybe SD's right in that Fitz doesn't see the point of canning the staff until the offseason...that better be the case.

[Jerrydevil]

4 hours ago, Brewskies said:

Sorry you can't make chicken salad out of chicken sh!t. I  don't care who the chef(coach) is. 

 

Do you think better coaching would have the team closer than 15 points from the last playoff spot? I do. I'm not talking about competing for a Cup, I'm talking about being competitive -- period. There's enough talent to play better defense in front of our goaltender. Then again, maybe the goaltending situation is too much to overcome.

Should we try to add a better goalie and bring back the coaching staff next year and give them another whack at it?

[mfitz804]

4 hours ago, Brewskies said:

Sorry you can't make chicken salad out of chicken sh!t. I  don't care who the chef(coach) is. 

I bet Bobby Flay or some sh!t could come close. 

[Brewskies]

22 hours ago, Jerrydevil said:

Do you think better coaching would have the team closer than 15 points from the last playoff spot? I do. I'm not talking about competing for a Cup, I'm talking about being competitive -- period. There's enough talent to play better defense in front of our goaltender. Then again, maybe the goaltending situation is too much to overcome.

Should we try to add a better goalie and bring back the coaching staff next year and give them another whack at it?

Personally, I think they need a better goalie and a new coaching staff, a complete change of coaches plus better players to make the playoffs not win the Cup just make the playoffs.