GDT: TBL @ NJD 7pm MSG+

[DevsMan84]

Just now, Devs3cups said:

I understand all this. I don't see them as moot points, since Fitz was in the conversations for those players, if he was just staying pat, as that seems to be the issue here, he wouldn't even look to add those players.

If you want to discredit Fitz for every single move he made, which is basically what you did in your post, you'll most likely do it with every single move he makes. If we get Boeser for example, it'll be because the market was favorable and he has a down season, so he shouldn't get credit. Most hockey moves are for certain reasons that can be explained and used to discredit the GM. Hall only came here because things weren't working out in Edmonton, and the Oilers desperately needed young d-men, hence Shero shouldn't get credit for the Hall trade. Let's not forget that Peter Chiarelli is a bad GM, so that move was a lightning-strike kind of move, once in a decade trade, Shero shouldn't get any credit. Siegenthaler was a low-risk move, so Fitz shouldn't be given credit for the trade. I just don't see how that view of moves makes sense. Maybe we just see that point differently. 

The other thing I'd like to ask you is why do you stick on in-season moves? Our team is young and is not in a position for playoffs or contention. Why not wait for the off-season to look for moves, when more players are available and usually at cheaper prices? I'd like to understand your point a bit more on that front. 

Kinda like what SD tried to do with me in trying to goad me into creating mock trade proposals.

In all seriousness though, I will be thrilled if we made a move for Boeser.  I would much rather be proved wrong than right on this.  For every low-risk/high-reward move that worked out, I can point to one that didn't.  Either way the net result is us still being a bottom 5 team in the league.

In-season moves could also be change of coaching staff as well.  Instead Fitz seems ok with us sticking with this staff that has shown little.  That includes a guy who seems to be teflon in Nass.  They also could have done a little more than trading for a goalie.  A warm body for a Target gift card in Gillies trade doesn't quite scream that you are trying to do anything at all.

[DevsMan84]

4 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

I probably backed you up on that trade, i would have done it.

And the "barely have any assets" was a reference to 2015 until now since you brought up Shero and Fitz. We had literally zero prospects worth sh!t to trade and we had the oldest roster ever, nothing we could do for years until we at least had an NHL roster, I even said that we are JUST starting to have assets to trade now and that back then we only had low risk high rewards type of move to make. Again, you conveniently ignored that.

2015 is 2015.  I am talking about since 2017-18 season.  We have ended up in the bottom 6 teams in the league in the past 3 seasons and are about to do it a 4th year in a row.

[Devs3cups]

1 minute ago, SterioDesign said:

Because those guys are just impatient and just want SOMETHING NOW. And IF something is done, they'd want results for it. Which no moves made this year would guarantee any results, lets be honest. GUARANTEED that even if we would have made moves and not make the playoffs, they'd STILL be whining and only bringing up that we didnt make the playoffs. Like they actually did in our post, they want results, thats it.

That's called being entitled and desperate. Not rational and patient.

The only move I had question marks about was the Tatar signing. He was clearly a last resort sort of signing after Fitz couldn't get something done for Saad/Tarasenko. The Bernier move was great imo, but absolutely blew up in our face. No one could've predicted our 2 starting goalies would get injured. That doesn't usually happen, like at all. I don't think that should be used to discredit Fitz. I understand others see it differently though. 

[DevsMan84]

3 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Because those guys are just impatient and just want SOMETHING NOW. And IF something is done, they'd want results for it. Which no moves made this year would guarantee any results, lets be honest. GUARANTEED that even if we would have made moves and not make the playoffs, they'd STILL be whining and only bringing up that we didnt make the playoffs. Like they actually did in our post, they want results, thats it.

That's called being entitled and desperate. Not rational and patient.

I am wanting more than 1 playoff game win in the past 10 years and I am being entitled and desperate.  OK, got it.

[MadDog2020]

54 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

Oh stop.  No one believes that.  We just see other GM's doing something to salvage their season or make their teams better while our current and previous GM had no problems punting the season away by Christmas and make promises of better days ahead that never comes.

 

[mfitz804]

57 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

He was literally the first warm body that was available for practically nothing and somehow we have to consider that as proof that Fitz was trying to do something lol.

I consider it proof of Fitz trying to do something. 

Tanking. 

[MadDog2020]

32 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

LMAO.  Are you, yet again, killing Lou for being a buyer in a season where we went to the CUP FINALS??!!?  We were having a pretty good season back in 2011-12 and you just wanted Lou to punt the season because they might leave for nothing?!

You are literally attacking Lou for holding onto players who helped take us to the cup finals but defending Shero/Fitz to the death for 1 playoff win in 7 seasons.  You are just in a "anyone but Lou is a better GM!" sh!tck-coma.

SD claims he hates agendas. But he always has one.

[MadDog2020]

9 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Because those guys are just impatient and just want SOMETHING NOW. And IF something is done, they'd want results for it. Which no moves made this year would guarantee any results, lets be honest. GUARANTEED that even if we would have made moves and not make the playoffs, they'd STILL be whining and only bringing up that we didnt make the playoffs. Like they actually did in their posts, they want results, thats it.

That's called being entitled and desperate. Not rational and patient.

You really need to look up the word ‘entitled’, because you have no fvcking idea what it means or what context to ever apply it in. 

[Devs3cups]

2 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

Kinda like what SD tried to do with me in trying to goad me into creating mock trade proposals.

In all seriousness though, I will be thrilled if we made a move for Boeser.  I would much rather be proved wrong than right on this.  For every low-risk/high-reward move that worked out, I can point to one that didn't.  Either way the net result is us still being a bottom 5 team in the league.

In-season moves could also be change of coaching staff as well.  Instead Fitz seems ok with us sticking with this staff that has shown little.  That includes a guy who seems to be teflon in Nass.  They also could have done a little more than trading for a goalie.  A warm body for a Target gift card in Gillies trade doesn't quite scream that you are trying to do anything at all.

Yes, the end result is the same. I just don't think we can understate the effects of goaltending on this team. Our team generates offense 5-on-5 at a top 10 level. Our defence is slightly above average, our PP is getting better, our PK is very good. The one point that is holding us back this season is goaltending. There is no way to spin it otherwise, it's otherworldly bad. I saw somewhere on Twitter that with only average goaltending, we'd have 5-6 more wins, which would put us on the bubble, exactly where most of us thought we would be. We are better in many metrics than let's say, the Rangers, that barely generate any offense 5-on-5, but they have absolutely ELITE goaltending. Sub .900% goaltending across the board is absolutely brutal, any way you want to slice it. Gillies has allowed 3 goals or more in 10 of his 12 starts here. It's horrible. This might be the worst goaltending stretch this franchise has seen. With that being said, I'm sure Fitz will look to improve it in the off-season. No goalie can be acquired right now, in season, at a reasonable price that can significantly move the needle. I'd be very surprised if it's not addressed in the off-season.

As for the staff, I absolutely agree with you. I'd be shocked if the staff is back next year and if they are, I'd really like to hear Fitz on that. I feel he wants to keep a certain stability until the end of the season, but they'll get canned in the off-season. Nas is getting a bad rep here, but the PK is excellent this season and the improvements of D-men like Siegenthaler show me that maybe he can help defensively. With that being said, I won't be that upset if he's let go. Recchi and Ruff can go though. The PP is ass and it shouldn't be with the skill we have on the first unit. I also believe Ruff's system is not intuitive at all and complicated for our young team, which creates missed assignments and defensive struggles. He also doesn't seem to adapt his system at all. I also don't like his TOI disparities most games.  

 

[SterioDesign]

17 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

I am wanting more than 1 playoff game win in the past 10 years and I am being entitled and desperate.  OK, got it.

Based on context. Yeah you are. You're I WANT TO WIN NOW AT ALL COST mentality is precisely why we're in this mess to start with. Other teams don't start their rebuild when they hit absolute rock bottom like we did, we literally had to fire Lou to start ours cause he just ran the team into the ground and wouldnt do it and wouldnt fire his head scout who sucked for decades and got us nothing in our prospect pool. And now you whine cause it takes too long to dig ourselves out of the hole it created.

And like there's any promise that you just have to wait a few years and suddenly your team is successful. It takes so much fvcking luck, patience and making the right moves, getting the right players for that to happen. But of course you don't understand that. Wtv im done with your entitlement and your non-sense. I'm a happy fan cause i have common sense and understand the task the management has. If you want to be miserable and whine your life away, do your thing. 

Edited February 18, 2022 by SterioDesign

[MadDog2020]

5 minutes ago, MB3 said:

It has been 0 days since SD has told another fan how to feel. 

The ultimate gatekeeper.

[Devil Dan 56]

21 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Based on context. Yeah you are. You're I WANT TO WIN NOW AT ALL COST mentality is precisely why we're in this mess to start with. Other teams don't start their rebuild when they hit absolute rock bottom like we did, we literally had to fire Lou to start ours cause he just ran the team into the ground and wouldnt do it and wouldnt fire his head scout who sucked for decades and got us nothing in our prospect pool. And now you whine cause it takes too long to dig ourselves out of the hole it created.

And like there's any promise that you just have to wait a few years and suddenly your team is successful. It takes so much fvcking luck, patience and making the right moves, getting the right players for that to happen. But of course you don't understand that. Wtv im done with your entitlement and your non-sense. I'm a happy fan cause i have common sense and understand the task the management has. If you want to be miserable and whine your life away, do your thing. 

How many losing seasons where we are out of the running before New Years is it until we are “allowed” to be unhappy about it? 

And once again. 2015 was 7 years ago. The cupboard was bare 7 years ago. This team was in the playoffs in 2018 and Shero failed to build on it. 

[Devs3cups]

1 minute ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

How many losing seasons where we are out of the running before New Years is it until we are “allowed” to be unhappy about it? 

And once again. 2015 was 7 years ago. The cupboard was bare 7 years ago. This team was in the playoffs in 2018 and Shero failed to build on it. 

This team was in the playoffs because of most likely the best season from a Devils' forward ever. Hall had over 40 points more than our second scorer, it was, quite literally a one man job. I don't think it could've been built on in any way. 

You're 100% allowed to be unhappy with the team's situation though. I don't usually comment on this subject but I will say our cupboard was not only bare, it was EXTREMELY weak. We now have assets and good prospects to be able to make some moves and grow as the youngest team in the league. I have a hard time seeing how any fan wouldn't be somewhat optimistic for the future of the team when we see the steps that players like Hughes, Nico and Bratt have taken respectively and various categories, the addition of an elite #1 d-man, prospects like Mercer, Rango, Holtz, L. Hughes, Gritsyuk, Mukhamadullin, Zetterlund, etc. This team has some problems, that's for sure. We're also generating offense 5-on-5 at a top 10 clip, have a great PK, and an average defence and that's with the youngest team in the league. Our real problem is goaltending, it can't be understated. 

I'm definitely optimistic about the future, but I wouldn't say you aren't allowed to be unhappy, not at all. I understand it's frustrating to lose. I just think context is important. But I wouldn't want to tell disappointed fans that they can't be and I apologize if that's how my posts came across. 

[SterioDesign]

13 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

How many losing seasons where we are out of the running before New Years is it until we are “allowed” to be unhappy about it? 

And once again. 2015 was 7 years ago. The cupboard was bare 7 years ago. This team was in the playoffs in 2018 and Shero failed to build on it. 

And how fast do you expect a team where no UFA wants to go and where you have to start from nothing with no prospect to be competing? Understanding that it takes time for draft picks to make the NHL and make an impact. And that there's never any guarantee that prospects do pan out.

You rebuild through the draft. Our 7 years of draft brought us. Zacha (mostly a bust), McLeod (4th line center), Smith (top 4 d), Holtz (not in the NHL), Mercer (middle of the pack F), Mukhamadullin (not in the NHL), Hughes (Top line Center), L.Hughes (non in NHL). We got lucky getting Bratt and Sharangovich so far.

We're still very much rebuilding. I mean, add Hughes, Holtz and Mercer to say... Colombus right now. They are fvcking set. Cause they were not rock bottom. But add the same guys to MTL right now... they are still fvcked for quite awhile with the roster they have. 

Also i never said you're not "allowed" to be unhappy about it. I said DEMANDING and expecting that the team makes the playoffs or wtv like it's owed to you is entitled and bringing up that we didn't make the playoffs in 10 years while ignoring context on how bad we had nothing to build on and that it would take years for anyone to rebuild from that is just not understanding context

Edited February 18, 2022 by SterioDesign

[mfitz804]

49 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

The ultimate gatekeeper.

I think that makes @MB3 the keymaster, I'm not sure. 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

20 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

I think that makes @MB3 the keymaster, I'm not sure. 

[mfitz804]

1 hour ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

You aren't supposed to post his personal pictures for public consumption. 

 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

8 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

You aren't supposed to post his personal pictures for public consumption. 

 

Ah man you're right...sometimes I can be such a Loser...

😉

[Devil Dan 56]

2 hours ago, Devs3cups said:

This team was in the playoffs because of most likely the best season from a Devils' forward ever. Hall had over 40 points more than our second scorer, it was, quite literally a one man job. I don't think it could've been built on in any way. 

You're 100% allowed to be unhappy with the team's situation though. I don't usually comment on this subject but I will say our cupboard was not only bare, it was EXTREMELY weak. We now have assets and good prospects to be able to make some moves and grow as the youngest team in the league. I have a hard time seeing how any fan wouldn't be somewhat optimistic for the future of the team when we see the steps that players like Hughes, Nico and Bratt have taken respectively and various categories, the addition of an elite #1 d-man, prospects like Mercer, Rango, Holtz, L. Hughes, Gritsyuk, Mukhamadullin, Zetterlund, etc. This team has some problems, that's for sure. We're also generating offense 5-on-5 at a top 10 clip, have a great PK, and an average defence and that's with the youngest team in the league. Our real problem is goaltending, it can't be understated. 

I'm definitely optimistic about the future, but I wouldn't say you aren't allowed to be unhappy, not at all. I understand it's frustrating to lose. I just think context is important. But I wouldn't want to tell disappointed fans that they can't be and I apologize if that's how my posts came across. 

I wasn’t referring to you at all with the thing about being allowed. SD tends to tell people how they should or shouldn’t feel about the team and how to properly be a fan.

And I’m very optimistic about the future. I like what’s been put in place. I have just lost faith in the coaching staff and Diet Shero. I understand they have THE PLAN. But what I don’t like is their refusal to adjust. If something doesn’t go according to plan (like goaltending injuries or an historically terrible defense or underperformances from Zacha, Smith, Johnsson, Kuok etc) then I think it’s unfair to the rest of the team to punt the season. If a GM truly believes this team should be competing in March and then the team is WAY off that trajectory then he should acknowledge it and adjust. 

For example, MB pointed out in another thread that with even mediocre goaltending this team jumps 4 spots in the standings and is 7 points away from the wild card as opposed to 19 points away.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

14 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

I wasn’t referring to you at all with the thing about being allowed. SD tends to tell people how they should or shouldn’t feel about the team and how to properly be a fan.

And I’m very optimistic about the future. I like what’s been put in place. I have just lost faith in the coaching staff and Diet Shero. I understand they have THE PLAN. But what I don’t like is their refusal to adjust. If something doesn’t go according to plan (like goaltending injuries or an historically terrible defense or underperformances from Zacha, Smith, Johnsson, Kuok etc) then I think it’s unfair to the rest of the team to punt the season. If a GM truly believes this team should be competing in March and then the team is WAY off that trajectory then he should acknowledge it and adjust. 

For example, MB pointed out in another thread that with even mediocre goaltending this team jumps 4 spots in the standings and is 7 points away from the wild card as opposed to 19 points away.

I think part of the reluctance to address the goaltending in any significant way is that Fitz & Co still think Blackwood is the goalie of the present AND the future (not saying I necessarily agree).

Mounting evidence suggests that Fitz could be very wrong on that one...at the very least, if Blackwood is meh and/or injured next season, Fitz has to be extremely willing to change course, and attempt to find someone else...even if he'd want to keep Mac around, at least accept that he'll need someone better/more durable as your projected true #1-type.

Fitz appears to have put damned near ALL of his eggs in the "We have a lot of young assets and they're all going to be up here contributing very soon" basket.  He'd better be right about the kids.  

[SterioDesign]

1 hour ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

I wasn’t referring to you at all with the thing about being allowed. SD tends to tell people how they should or shouldn’t feel about the team and how to properly be a fan.

And I’m very optimistic about the future. I like what’s been put in place. I have just lost faith in the coaching staff and Diet Shero. I understand they have THE PLAN. But what I don’t like is their refusal to adjust. If something doesn’t go according to plan (like goaltending injuries or an historically terrible defense or underperformances from Zacha, Smith, Johnsson, Kuok etc) then I think it’s unfair to the rest of the team to punt the season. If a GM truly believes this team should be competing in March and then the team is WAY off that trajectory then he should acknowledge it and adjust. 

For example, MB pointed out in another thread that with even mediocre goaltending this team jumps 4 spots in the standings and is 7 points away from the wild card as opposed to 19 points away.

I never told anyone how to feel. Stop with that non-sense.

Telling people they are acting like little entitled bitches is just a mere observation and personal opinion. It's not a warrant or an order to act differently. You can keep doing it if you want, you're 100% allowed to give your opinion on anything. I'll just keep giving my opinion about it cause i also have the right to do it. This is the internet, where criticism of criticism exist. What a concept.

At least I make my claims are based on what im actually seeing and not on what im not seeing and imagining while i have no idea what's going on behind closed doors.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 18, 2022 by SterioDesign

[Devil Dan 56]

6 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

I never told anyone how to feel. Stop with that non-sense.

Telling people they are acting like little entitled bitches is just a mere observation and personal opinion. It's not a warrant or an order to act differently. You can keep doing it if you want, i'll just keep giving my opinion about it. This is the internet, where criticism of criticism exist. What a concept.

At least I make my claims are based on what im actually seeing and not on what im not seeing and imagining while i have no idea what's going on behind closed doors.

 

 

 

 

Another observation is that you sit on your high horse telling everyone how they should or shouldn’t react and how a fan should or shouldn’t feel or else they are quote “little entitled bitches”. I don’t recall ever calling you names 

And you make claims based on what you are seeing and not imagining? Like… when you said part of the reason Kovalchuk left because Parise and Clarkson weren’t re-signed? I don’t recall ever reading that. 

[MadDog2020]

10 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

Another observation is that you sit on your high horse telling everyone how they should or shouldn’t react and how a fan should or shouldn’t feel or else they are quote “little en

SD throws the word ‘entitled’ around all the time. It’s pretty clear he doesn’t actually know what it means. 

[SterioDesign]

33 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

Another observation is that you sit on your high horse telling everyone how they should or shouldn’t react and how a fan should or shouldn’t feel or else they are quote “little entitled bitches”. I don’t recall ever calling you names 

And you make claims based on what you are seeing and not imagining? Like… when you said part of the reason Kovalchuk left because Parise and Clarkson weren’t re-signed? I don’t recall ever reading that. 

No the little entitled bitches part is just towards the fans making claim like "it's been X amount of years and we're still not in the playoffs". As if being part of the playoffs is something fans automatically deserve after X amount of years. I didn't say that towards you, just towards whoever said that, which is mostly those other 2 guys, you i dont know. Again, my opinion, not telling people what to do. I literally just said people can do wtv they want.

Kovalchuk IMO left in a fvck you to the NHL as a whole i'm sure after the lockdown and them fvcking him over and being welcomed by his country at the time. I also think he clearly saw the team was a sinking ship and im sure played in his decision knowing he wouldn't win a cup in NJ. That's 100% my theory and not necessarily factual. So yeah, i shouldnt have make that claim i can fully admit it. Those other guys sure won't take their claims back though. 

But that little part was just added to the whole list of UFAs Lou let walk into free agency, Niedermayer, Elias, Gomez, Rafalski, Holik, Parise, etc etc. It doesn't change the point i was making in any way. He let all those guys mostly in their prime walk into free agency and lost all of them except Elias. Imagine all those guys staying with the club or getting assets for them how it would have kept the franchise going. You don't even have to put clarkson and parise in that list and its still absolutely unacceptable. 

 

Edited February 18, 2022 by SterioDesign

[SterioDesign]

22 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

SD throws the word ‘entitled’ around all the time. It’s pretty clear he doesn’t actually know what it means. 

Fully aware what the term mean. We can disagree as to if some fans on here are or not. It's really not important.

It's understandable to be angry and frustrated that we havent made the playoffs more than we have in the last decade. We're all feeling it.

It's something else to act like the reason we're not a playoff team now is because our GMs fvcked up and completely ignore so many factors and context. As if after X amount of years we should be a playoffs team by now. There's no such thing as a guarantee.

Especially when you start from almost nothing. We started from scratch in 2015 with almost nothing, no core player to build around and no prospects. How long do you realistically think it takes to rebuild a roster and prospect pool from that? Considering not all your picks will pan out and some will take years to maybe make an impact and that we haven't been a top UFA destination until last summer basically. 

All we could do for the first few years is a) trade one of our roster player for something equivalent... which would just create another hole in our lineup  b) make low risk high rewards trades. Which almost all the trades we made were great trades on paper, and almost all of them didn't pan out, it's insane.  c) sign free agents... for the first few years all we could get were guys with something to prove. And 7 years of drafting. Even winning 2 lottery, one of them is playing his first good season THIS YEAR and the other one is a very underwhelming first overall, not his fault our ours, we made the good pick based on what we knew then. McLeod wasnt supposed to be much, Zacha was the last Conte pick, he should have been fired a decade before. The rest of our picks are still too young or not even in our lineup. So again, realistically, it was going to take a long fvcking time to rebuild from nothing and we needed luck to go our way a lot more than it did.