2022 Stanley Cup playoffs thread

[mfitz804]

1 minute ago, DevsMan84 said:

At least half of those teams chose players as good or better than Brazal.  I don't think Colorado is upset about picking Rantanen at 10 overall when Barzal was still on the board.

I didn't edit fast enough. So the other half that didn’t get players better than Barzal, they just all missed the fact that he was an All-Star in the making?  
 

You can find a guy like this in every year’s draft. at least one. 

[DevsMan84]

4 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

I didn't edit fast enough. So the other half that didn’t get players better than Barzal, they just all missed the fact that he was an All-Star in the making?  
 

You can find a guy like this in every year’s draft. at least one. 

It's not just that one year.  Devils chose the 2nd worst player in the top 10 in 2015 with the #6 overall.  They chose a 4th line center in McLeod over a top pairing D-man in 2016.  They chose a good center at #1 over a generational D-man, they chose Smith who is currently barely an NHL player over Miller and so on.  That's a lot of fou-tips and singles when other teams are hitting home runs.  Why are people still making esxcuses for this scouting department?  What have they done to get this much of a benefit of a doubt?

Edited June 27, 2022 by DevsMan84

[mfitz804]

This is just the best. 

They go from two weirdos handling it with white gloves to giving it to an animal who does this, within minutes of each other lol. 

Edited June 27, 2022 by mfitz804

[mfitz804]

Just now, DevsMan84 said:

It's not just that one year.  Devils chose the 2nd worst player in the top 10 in 2015 with the #6 overall.  They chose a 4th line center in McLeod over a top pairing D-man in 2016.  They chose a good center at #1 over a generational D-man, they chose Smith who is currently barely an NHL player over Miller and so on.  That's a lot of fou-tips and singles when other teams are hitting home runs.

Correct. Because there are no guarantees. Nobody was complaining about the Smith pick his rookie year. Sh!t happens and you don’t always get the best guy. I’m not going to do it, but I’m sure you can take any other team and do a “they should have drafted…”. 

[Devil Dan 56]

1 minute ago, DevsMan84 said:

It's not just that one year.  Devils chose the 2nd worst player in the top 10 in 2015 with the #6 overall.  They chose a 4th line center in McLeod over a top pairing D-man in 2016.  They chose a good center at #1 over a generational D-man, they chose Smith who is currently barely an NHL player over Miller and so on.  That's a lot of fou-tips and singles when other teams are hitting home runs.  Why are people still making esxcuses for this scouting department?  What have they done to get this much of a benefit of a doubt?

You’ll find that with every single scouting department in the league. It’s the nature of the draft. You don’t have a little piece of paper that says McLeod will definitely be a 4th liner and Makar will be a Norris winner in his 3rd year. It’s all projection, predicting, and then environmental. The Makar that developed in Colorado may not have been the Makar that develops in NJ or Philly. 

For example that same scouting department found Bratt in the 6th so it’s not like 30 teams decided they just didn’t want him 6 times until we took him. 

[jagknife]

3 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

It's not just that one year.  Devils chose the 2nd worst player in the top 10 in 2015 with the #6 overall.  They chose a 4th line center in McLeod over a top pairing D-man in 2016.  They chose a good center at #1 over a generational D-man, they chose Smith who is currently barely an NHL player over Miller and so on.  That's a lot of fou-tips and singles when other teams are hitting home runs.  Why are people still making esxcuses for this scouting department?  What have they done to get this much of a benefit of a doubt?

No one is defending the scouting department, but you’re acting like everyone in the world knew Makar would be an absolutely amazing defender. Who knows, maybe if we draft him, he looks at the disasters you keep pointing out and pulls a Kerfoot, holds out, says fvck jersey, and runs away. Or under the absolute disaster of Nasraddine, he flounders and becomes a raging alcoholic and stops playing anything resembling hockey.

You want to sh!t on scouting, why not give kudos to Colorado’s development of him, cause based on what we saw of our staff, he wouldn’t be playing that well in jersey.

[Devil Dan 56]

I wasn’t a fan of Kadri because of some of his dirty hits, but this playoff run gave me a whole new respect for him. The abuse he and his family took from St Louis fans and coming back from his broken thumb to score an OT goal in the finals… good stuff. 

[mfitz804]

11 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

I wasn’t a fan of Kadri because of some of his dirty hits, but this playoff run gave me a whole new respect for him. The abuse he and his family took from St Louis fans and coming back from his broken thumb to score an OT goal in the finals… good stuff. 

Missed 18 days after a thumb surgery, that’s pretty hardcore. 

[DevsMan84]

1 hour ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

You’ll find that with every single scouting department in the league. It’s the nature of the draft. You don’t have a little piece of paper that says McLeod will definitely be a 4th liner and Makar will be a Norris winner in his 3rd year. It’s all projection, predicting, and then environmental. The Makar that developed in Colorado may not have been the Makar that develops in NJ or Philly. 

For example that same scouting department found Bratt in the 6th so it’s not like 30 teams decided they just didn’t want him 6 times until we took him. 

Yet some scouting departments tend to hit bigger than others.  If the nature of the draft tends to be a crapshoot, then that wouldn't happen as everyone would eventually gravitate towards the mean.  Saying that Colorado, Tampa and Steve Yzerman are just lucky with their picks is insulting to them.

1 hour ago, jagknife said:

No one is defending the scouting department, but you’re acting like everyone in the world knew Makar would be an absolutely amazing defender. Who knows, maybe if we draft him, he looks at the disasters you keep pointing out and pulls a Kerfoot, holds out, says fvck jersey, and runs away. Or under the absolute disaster of Nasraddine, he flounders and becomes a raging alcoholic and stops playing anything resembling hockey.

You want to sh!t on scouting, why not give kudos to Colorado’s development of him, cause based on what we saw of our staff, he wouldn’t be playing that well in jersey.

I am not exactly comforted in knowing that both the Devils scouting department and development department are both fvcked.

[Devil Dan 56]

4 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

Yet some scouting departments tend to hit bigger than others.  If the nature of the draft tends to be a crapshoot, then that wouldn't happen as everyone would eventually gravitate towards the mean.  Saying that Colorado, Tampa and Steve Yzerman are just lucky with their picks is insulting to them.

In the 2016 draft, Colorado took Tyson Jost, Cameron Morrison, and Josh Anderson in the first second and third rounds respectively. In 2015 they took our own Utica standout AJ Greer in the second. 

Tampa took Slater Koekkek 9 picks before they took Vasilevskiy. In 2015 they drafted superstars Mitchell Stephens and Matthew Spencer with their second round picks (no firsts). They took Brett Howden in the first in  2016 instead of Adam Fox or Alex Debrincat.  They left Brannstrom and Liljegren on the board to take Cal Foote in 2017. 
 

Literally every team has hits and misses. Some have more than others, and some are way better at developing players. 

[Bonginator11]

2 hours ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

No one had any way of knowing Makar would be what he was, which his why Philly and Dallas also passed 

This. If Makar was the known top player wouldn’t you think Philly or Dallas would be tripping over themselves rushing to get the podium to pick him after we chose Nico? We made the right pick

[SterioDesign]

3 hours ago, NJDfan1711 said:

If both Point and Makar recently came out of the same Junior League... then maybe it's time (for scouts) to start respecting that league a little more?

it's not about "respecting" it's about being very hard to gauge.

Again, if you have to compare 2 kids, same age. One playing in a very sh!t league and he's burning the league playing 25minutes a game and another one playing against men in some european league. Not putting up too much point but also just playing 10 minutes a night. Do you understand how hard it is to gauge talent in that case? How would one kid perform against tougher competition and how would the other perform against lesser competition... it's just educated guesses truly

Edited June 27, 2022 by SterioDesign

[MadDog2020]

3 hours ago, mfitz804 said:

This is just the best. 

They go from two weirdos handling it with white gloves to giving it to an animal who does this, within minutes of each other lol. 

 

[Crisis]

1 hour ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

In the 2016 draft, Colorado took Tyson Jost, Cameron Morrison, and Josh Anderson in the first second and third rounds respectively. In 2015 they took our own Utica standout AJ Greer in the second. 

Tampa took Slater Koekkek 9 picks before they took Vasilevskiy. In 2015 they drafted superstars Mitchell Stephens and Matthew Spencer with their second round picks (no firsts). They took Brett Howden in the first in  2016 instead of Adam Fox or Alex Debrincat.  They left Brannstrom and Liljegren on the board to take Cal Foote in 2017. 
 

Literally every team has hits and misses. Some have more than others, and some are way better at developing players. 

Draft master Yzerman also took Drouin with the 3rd overall instead of Seth Jones, Lindholm, Monahan, Horvat, Mirco Mueller, Guentzel, etc.

[Devil Dan 56]

This is cool. I think he’s hanging ‘em up. 

[MadDog2020]

4 minutes ago, Crisis said:

Draft master Yzerman also took Drouin with the 3rd overall instead of Seth Jones, Lindholm, Monahan, Horvat, Mirco Mueller, Guentzel, etc.

 

[slasher72]

3 hours ago, DevsMan84 said:

It's not just that one year.  Devils chose the 2nd worst player in the top 10 in 2015 with the #6 overall.  They chose a 4th line center in McLeod over a top pairing D-man in 2016.  They chose a good center at #1 over a generational D-man, they chose Smith who is currently barely an NHL player over Miller and so on.  That's a lot of fou-tips and singles when other teams are hitting home runs.  Why are people still making esxcuses for this scouting department?  What have they done to get this much of a benefit of a doubt?

Some organizations are 'ok' with being mediocre and don't want to make changes as long as revenue is getting generated. I'm starting to think that could be the case with ours. 

The 2015 selection on Zacha was more Lou-Conte but 2016 onward there's no excuse. The Devils are just a bad organization from top to bottom and have been for a long time. 

[DevsMan84]

2 hours ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

In the 2016 draft, Colorado took Tyson Jost, Cameron Morrison, and Josh Anderson in the first second and third rounds respectively. In 2015 they took our own Utica standout AJ Greer in the second. 

Tampa took Slater Koekkek 9 picks before they took Vasilevskiy. In 2015 they drafted superstars Mitchell Stephens and Matthew Spencer with their second round picks (no firsts). They took Brett Howden in the first in  2016 instead of Adam Fox or Alex Debrincat.  They left Brannstrom and Liljegren on the board to take Cal Foote in 2017. 
 

Literally every team has hits and misses. Some have more than others, and some are way better at developing players. 

Again, for the I don't know how many times now, I said it is about hitting more than not.  I never said they have to be perfect, but the core of Tampa was drafted by Yzerman and he got a pretty good return for Drouin in Sergachev (and not one of Shero and Fitz's patented picks and parts for other teams most expendable players).  Not only that, but most of their current core players were drafted before 2016, so that is an interesting line to draw since you know they were picking in later parts of the first rounds after that.

Colorado took Ratanen in the first round in 2015.  That makes up for Greer in the second round.  Hell Ratanen alone is better than all of our 2015 picks combined.  In 2017 they chose Makar over Hischier.  They picked MacK with the first overall in 2013 even though they were "set" at center with Duschene and Stastny.

All I am saying is that the Devils are a team that has more misses than hits.  The fact that the Devils also suck at developing players is just a double-whammy.

42 minutes ago, slasher72 said:

Some organizations are 'ok' with being mediocre and don't want to make changes as long as revenue is getting generated. I'm starting to think that could be the case with ours. 

The 2015 selection on Zacha was more Lou-Conte but 2016 onward there's no excuse. The Devils are just a bad organization from top to bottom and have been for a long time. 

Shero gets equal blame for Zacha.  He was the GM at the time he was sitting at the table at the draft.  He could have stopped it.

[MadDog2020]

1 minute ago, DevsMan84 said:

In 2017 they chose Makar over Hischier. 

They did? I wasn’t aware Hischier was on the board when Colorado picked Makar. 

[DevsMan84]

52 minutes ago, Crisis said:

Draft master Yzerman also took Drouin with the 3rd overall instead of Seth Jones, Lindholm, Monahan, Horvat, Mirco Mueller, Guentzel, etc.

Drouin turned into Sergachev lol.

Just now, MadDog2020 said:

They did? I wasn’t aware Hischier was on the board when Colorado picked Makar. 

My mistake; Devils chose Hischier over Makar.  That makes it even worse lol.

[MadDog2020]

2 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

My mistake; Devils chose Hischier over Makar.  That makes it even worse lol.

My question to Joe Sakic would be: would you have taken Makar #1 overall? I’m gonna bet he says ‘no’.

[mfitz804]

5 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

In 2017 they chose Makar over Hischier. 

Say what?? Nobody chose anyone over Hischier. 

Just now, MadDog2020 said:

My question to Joe Sakic would be: would you have taken Makar #1 overall? I’m gonna bet he says ‘no’.

Pretty much. It assumes Makar was #1 on their board, which nobody knows. 

[devlman]

16 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

Again, for the I don't know how many times now, I said it is about hitting more than not.  I never said they have to be perfect, but the core of Tampa was drafted by Yzerman and he got a pretty good return for Drouin in Sergachev (and not one of Shero and Fitz's patented picks and parts for other teams most expendable players).  Not only that, but most of their current core players were drafted before 2016, so that is an interesting line to draw since you know they were picking in later parts of the first rounds after that.

Colorado took Ratanen in the first round in 2015.  That makes up for Greer in the second round.  Hell Ratanen alone is better than all of our 2015 picks combined.  In 2017 they chose Makar over Hischier.  They picked MacK with the first overall in 2013 even though they were "set" at center with Duschene and Stastny.

All I am saying is that the Devils are a team that has more misses than hits.  The fact that the Devils also suck at developing players is just a double-whammy.

Shero gets equal blame for Zacha.  He was the GM at the time he was sitting at the table at the draft.  He could have stopped it.

You have no evidence that Yzerman’s hit rate is greater than anyone else’s though. Give me the league average hit rate and then give me Yzerman’s.

[mfitz804]

5 minutes ago, devlman said:

You have no evidence that Yzerman’s hit rate is greater than anyone else’s though. Give me the league average hit rate and then give me Yzerman’s.

Then give me the anticipated draft hit rate also. 

[Brewskies]

23 hours ago, mfitz804 said:

 

It’s irrelevant, the question was whether Panarin would walk away from his contract,  the simple fact is that Kovy walked away from more. Whether bad or good for the team, whether they colluded together to get the best result, he still walked away from a sh!t ton of money, and I believe more than Panarin would be. 

I agree with you. I personally think they did collud for the best results for everyone. Ít was a ton of money. I just want two sound, fit, goalies for the Devils in the 2022/23 season. I am not counting on Blackwood or Bernier to be in the mix.

 

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