Trade Deadline Targets: Discuss

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

4 minutes ago, MB3 said:

Doing this for fun and because I would do anything to avoid actual work during work hours. For this exercise, I'll assume they trade Sharangovich to look for a real top-6 forward, and I'll assume they move on from / non-tender Mackenzie Blackwood since Schmid looks more than capable.

2023-2024 Devils Roster:

FORWARDS

1. Jack Hughes (8)
2. Nico Hischier (7.25)
3. Jesper Bratt (8.5) (bold indicates my guess for his next contract for the guys I assume stick around)
4. Ondrej Palat (6)
5. Dawson Mercer (.894)
6. Alexander Holtz (.894)
7. Jesper Boqvist (.874)
8. Mike McLeod (1.5)
9. Nate Bastian (2.25)
10. Fabian Zetterlund (1)

DEFENSE

1. Dougie Hamilton (9)
2. Jonas Siegenthaler (3.4)
3. John Marino (4.4)
4. Luke Hughes (.894)
5. Nikita Ohkotiuk (.789)
6. (Blank)
7. Brendan Smith (1.1)

GOALIES

1. Vitek Vanecek (3.4)
2. Akira Schmid (.789)

DEAD CAP

1. Schnieder, Kuokkonen, Kovalchuk (2.5) (ALL of this expires before the following offseason)

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That puts the Devils at $65.289m in used cap space. The cap is expected to be between 87-90m next year (projected to be close to 95 the following year). That gives the Devils COMFORTABLY $22m to play with, and only 2 forward spots and 1 defensive spot to fill. The Devils probably don't want to be a cap team next year, but it's perfectly reasonable to think the team signs/adds Haula ($3), a solid defenseman (Hughes at $7.25? Re-sign Graves at $6?), and a top-line winger (Meier at $9.5?) and stays well short of the cap ceiling, with plenty of loose change to use when Mercer (2024), Luke Hughes (2026), and Nemec (2026) need their raises. 

That's the benefit of having a $12m center like Jack, a $9m center like Nico, an $8m defenseman like Marino and a $6.5m defenseman like Siegenthaler making a combined $22m instead of their $36+m market value. 

This doesn't make much difference in the grand scheme but do you think Bastian will make more than McLeod?  If anything I'd say McLeod would get $2 million or more.

But the bolded is an excellent point, in that you have a number of cost-effective players in the lineup right now.  VV is a part of that group, if you think about it...he's been excellent, in relation to what he's making.   

[MB3]

1 minute ago, SterioDesign said:

I think this desire also comes from a deep deep cut that will never fully heal of Niedermayer leaving to join in brother in Anaheim... lol

That was 100% Lou's fault but still, without his brother being somewhere else, he might have stayed

I know you like to blame Lou for everything but this is an example that just doesn’t make sense. Lou tried for 3 consecutive seasons to trade for Rob. Anaheim knew with Rob they’d likely get Scott in free agency. And the Devils were just a year removed from a Stanley Cup, you can’t expect Lou to trade Nieds even though the writing was on the wall.

2 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

This doesn't make much difference in the grand scheme but do you think Bastian will make more than McLeod?  If anything I'd say McLeod would get $2 million or more.

But the bolded is an excellent point, in that you have a number of cost-effective players in the lineup right now.  VV is a part of that group, if you think about it...he's been excellent, in relation to what he's making.   

eh, I really don’t know. Both will get a bridge deal that carries them until their final RFA season in the ballpark of 1.5-2.5ish. 

[SterioDesign]

2 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

This doesn't make much difference in the grand scheme but do you think Bastian will make more than McLeod?  If anything I'd say McLeod would get $2 million or more.

But the bolded is an excellent point, in that you have a number of cost-effective players in the lineup right now.  VV is a part of that group, if you think about it...he's been excellent, in relation to what he's making.   

Also IF we'd get the 3 Hughes. They'll have to re-sign a contract at some point and well we saw what MacKinnon did with his NEW contract after winning the cup being an amazing deal. But i have a feeling that if the 3 bros can be together, they'd all take a decent pay cut to stay together and keep the team competitive in the future. Which could be a giant bonus.

[MB3]

3 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Also IF we'd get the 3 Hughes. They'll have to re-sign a contract at some point and well we saw what MacKinnon did with his NEW contract after winning the cup being an amazing deal. But i have a feeling that if the 3 bros can be together, they'd all take a decent pay cut to stay together and keep the team competitive in the future. Which could be a giant bonus.

This is the debate that I refuse to get into (not with just you, I see a lot of people saying stuff like this). Yes, at the end of this contract, it's very likely that Jack will get a pay raise. No, I'm not worried about what the Devils cap situation will be in the year 2030. 2030! The NHL might have 4 more teams and the cap might be $200m. They might do away with the cap, or introduce a soft cap/luxury tax threshold like baseball. Maybe the Devils have won 4 cups by then and Hughes wants to retire on top. Maybe the league has folded and we're all talking about a different team with different players in a different league. There are too many variables to even begin to entertain that topic. 

For the guys that we have right now, the Devils have the cap flexibility to add a marquee free agent on both sides of the puck with plenty of money to take care of their own boys too. Not many teams can say that. 

[SterioDesign]

37 minutes ago, MB3 said:

I know you like to blame Lou for everything but this is an example that just doesn’t make sense. Lou tried for 3 consecutive seasons to trade for Rob. Anaheim knew with Rob they’d likely get Scott in free agency. And the Devils were just a year removed from a Stanley Cup, you can’t expect Lou to trade Nieds even though the writing was on the wall.

How about trying to sign him when you still have leverage? how 'bout that? And not making an offer 2 weeks before free agency when you have his brother on a strong team wanting him.

Honestly, imagine Luke didn't exist and that 30 years old Jack is playing his last year and he's a UFA in the summer. And that Vancouver is a powerhouse with Q. Hughes and you know they'd like to play together, and would have room to sign him

Are you honestly okay with our GM not making an effort to offer a contract to Jack before his last season as a UFA or during his last season at the very least? NOT EVEN TRYING. You're totally okay with letting Jack make it weeks before free agency?

No you wouldn't be, don't even try it. Scott almost re-signed with us it was really hard. It's almost guaranteed that he would have signed that same offer if the offer came before the season or when the pull from his brother wasn't as strong and that he had time to think about the possibility since he had plenty of time after the season. that's just terrible managing.

And the year after this, he clearly didn't learn and let Elias walk right into free agency and he almost signed with the Rangers. The year after he let Rafalski walk right to free agency. etc etc the list is endless. Stop making excuses for Lou and his UFA handling. It was disgusting and unnecessary. There's no excuses for systematically letting all your top players walk directly into free agency. 

 

Edited January 17, 2023 by SterioDesign

[mfitz804]

30 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Also we'd have a lot of more offensively oriented dmen so i might get ugly from that aspect.

This would be my concern, as you cannot have too many defenseman on one team that are offensive minded and a little weak on the D (hehehe). It's a recipe for disaster. 

[MB3]

1 minute ago, mfitz804 said:

This would be my concern, as you cannot have too many defenseman on one team that are offensive minded and a little weak on the D (hehehe). It's a recipe for disaster. 

The way the league is going, I'm not sure that's much of a concern. Quinn is obviously offense-first but Luke is bigger and stronger than both of his brothers already, and he's just as fast. 

The Devils have Siegenthaler and Marino already as shutdown defenseman. None of their other big prospects (other than Casey, but he's still a ways away) are really offense-first defenseman. Nemec certainly isn't, but I know we're talking about the hypothetical of Nemec being moved for Quinn. 

In today's NHL, I think having half of your defense (Siegenthaler, Marino, Okhhotiuk/Mukhmadulin/Bahl) solid sound defensive-defenseman is the right recipe. Look at Colorado last year -- Makar, Toews, and Byram are all offense-first (I think Luke is a bit in the Toews build -- just as good offensively as he is defensively). If the Devils have Hamilton, Hughes, and Hughes at the back-end that should work just fine. 

[Jerrydevil]

I don't know if we'd deal with Philadelphia, but Van Riemsdyk might be a good fit. I also like Ivan Barbachev.

[mfitz804]

16 minutes ago, MB3 said:

The way the league is going, I'm not sure that's much of a concern. Quinn is obviously offense-first but Luke is bigger and stronger than both of his brothers already, and he's just as fast. 

The Devils have Siegenthaler and Marino already as shutdown defenseman. None of their other big prospects (other than Casey, but he's still a ways away) are really offense-first defenseman. Nemec certainly isn't, but I know we're talking about the hypothetical of Nemec being moved for Quinn. 

In today's NHL, I think having half of your defense (Siegenthaler, Marino, Okhhotiuk/Mukhmadulin/Bahl) solid sound defensive-defenseman is the right recipe. Look at Colorado last year -- Makar, Toews, and Byram are all offense-first (I think Luke is a bit in the Toews build -- just as good offensively as he is defensively). If the Devils have Hamilton, Hughes, and Hughes at the back-end that should work just fine. 

I'm not sure I agree, but we have no idea what Luke's defense will be like at this level yet.

If Hamilton had half the amount of points he has right now, it would almost be like having two Seversons. That's the kind of thing I would like to avoid, as it can be a huge problem. 

Also assuming that Okhotiuk/Mukh/Bahl are "solid sound defensive-defensemen" is a limb I wouldn't really be willing to go out on right now. One has played ok in a handful of games this season, one has never played in America, and one is Bahl. 

All of that being said, I said it would be "my concern". It wouldn't stop me from getting Quinn, I would just be worried about what the impact might be on our defense. 

[NJDevils1214]

6 minutes ago, Jerrydevil said:

I don't know if we'd deal with Philadelphia, but Van Riemsdyk might be a good fit. I also like Ivan Barbachev.

Not sold on JVR at all but Barbachev could be a decent pickup. Top two needs are another top 6 winger and someone up front with size, like a Pat Maroon type, that can win board battles and play hard around the net. I'm wondering when Zetterlund gets another shot at the lineup and where he fits in longer term(development pending).

[Nicomo]

As long as you have a defensive minded guy on each of the top 2 pairings (which they do with Siegs and Marino) you’re good with both their partners bringing mostly offense. That’s the way I look at it anyway. 

[Jerrydevil]

12 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

Not sold on JVR at all but Barbachev could be a decent pickup. Top two needs are another top 6 winger and someone up front with size, like a Pat Maroon type, that can win board battles and play hard around the net. I'm wondering when Zetterlund gets another shot at the lineup and where he fits in longer term(development pending).

I mention JVR because he could help our power play and because he's a decent two-way player.

[RunninWithTheDevil]

 

 

Edited January 17, 2023 by RunninWithTheDevil

[MB3]

7 minutes ago, RunninWithTheDevil said:

 

 

“never would have thought a guy like demko would be available” lmao the 3-10 goalie with a GAA near 4 and a save percentage that starts with an 8? You didn’t think that guy would ever be available?

[Jerrydevil]

8 minutes ago, RunninWithTheDevil said:

 

 

That's pretty wild.

[mfitz804]

3 minutes ago, MB3 said:

“never would have thought a guy like demko would be available” lmao the 3-10 goalie with a GAA near 4 and a save percentage that starts with an 8? You didn’t think that guy would ever be available?

Yeah that’s more based on his performance this year rather than the Canucks’ desire to rebuild. Before this season, sure, I could see someone making that argument. 

[MB3]

6 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

Yeah that’s more based on his performance this year rather than the Canucks’ desire to rebuild. Before this season, sure, I could see someone making that argument. 

I think I even specifically made that argument this offseason. I watched a decent amount of Canucks games last year and loved Demko's game, and who wouldn't? 

Haven't tuned in much. I'm sure the Canucks horrid defensive system isn't helping, but it also seems like he's made out of swiss cheese this season. He has 15 starts this season and only 3 of them are "quality starts" (SV% better than the league average). That's hilariously bad. 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

17 minutes ago, RunninWithTheDevil said:

 

 

Damn, I would've guessed both Petterson and Quinn would've been untouchable.

The fact that two Hugheses are already in this organization (with one obviously locked up for SEVERAL more years) and the fact that the Devils have a big-time D prospect to create a trade package around certainly makes it feel that little bit more possible that Fitz could actually consider this.  Quinn should have a hell of a lot of prime years left and there's no development time with him...he's as much of a "young right now" player as it gets.

Do I think it actually happens?  Probably not.  But it doesn't seem as crazy to consider.  

[MadDog2020]

5 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Damn, I would've guessed both Petterson and Quinn would've been untouchable.

The fact that two Hugheses are already in this organization (with one obviously locked up for SEVERAL more years) and the fact that the Devils have a big-time D prospect to create a trade package around certainly makes it feel that little bit more possible that Fitz could actually consider this.  Quinn should have a hell of a lot of prime years left and there's no development time with him...he's as much of a "young right now" player as it gets.

Do I think it actually happens?  Probably not.  But it doesn't seem as crazy to consider.  

I think the gist here is that while Vancouver is open to moving Quinn, I think it would take a Godfather offer. Nemec, unprotected 1, and go from there.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

4 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

I think the gist here is that while Vancouver is open to moving Quinn, I think it would take a Godfather offer. Nemec, unprotected 1, and go from there.

And that's why I think it ultimately doesn't happen.  I think in the end Fitz will say "I have Nemec here already and I think he'll be excellent himself before long, so why give up so much to get Quinn?"  

[mfitz804]

21 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

I think the gist here is that while Vancouver is open to moving Quinn, I think it would take a Godfather offer. Nemec, unprotected 1, and go from there.

Would you go unprotected for Quinn? Lol. 

[Guadana]

After time, when talks about raising cap are more serious, would be great to add Meier. We have plenty assets to do. Only Luke and Nemec shouldn't be involved. 

If some team will trade something more(like rangers can trade Kakko just for example), we can target different players like JVR - he can help with redurections and rebounds. Or even Henrique - he can add depth scoring and make our third line great again. Perron could be interesting veteran depth addition. Kuzmenko is interesting if they will take 1st+Holtz for trade&sign. He is scoring right handed right winger with good skating. Nick Ritchie could be a good depth addition if we will need bottom line scoring/forechecking forward. Plenty of options, devils should find interior scorer(as I remember devils are 21st team in scoring from rebounds), who can make Haula's work and score at the same time, and send Haula to the third line where he can help to Yegor/Dawson/etc with secondary scoring.

 

Very interesting what kind of move Fitz will decide to do, because this year is a good year to try to compete. And players should awarded for their good game. 

 

Edited January 18, 2023 by Guadana

[SterioDesign]

4 hours ago, MB3 said:

“never would have thought a guy like demko would be available” lmao the 3-10 goalie with a GAA near 4 and a save percentage that starts with an 8? You didn’t think that guy would ever be available?

I assume you just missed my post so i'll ask again.

Considering you were upset at our GM for NOT signing Gaudreau. Would you not be upset with our GM if he'd let a 30 years old Jack Hughes walk right into free agency when it's known his brother is on a stack team with cap space to sign him? Would YOU not try to get him locked up the summer before or during the season... or you'd wait 2 weeks before free agency to make your first offer? Legit question.

Then the next summer, would you let Nico walk right into free agency? Then the summer after would you let Bratt AND Mercer walk right into free agency? And the summer after... would you let Nemec walk into free agency? Probably not right? Well that's precisely what he did.

The man systematically let all his top UFA walk right into free agency without trying to sign him until the very last minute where he had no leverage. Even Elias, so please stop making excuses, honestly.

 

[mfitz804]

Yeah, and I bet Lou doesn’t even like Doritos either. 

[MB3]

35 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

I assume you just missed my post so i'll ask again.

Considering you were upset at our GM for NOT signing Gaudreau. Would you not be upset with our GM if he'd let a 30 years old Jack Hughes walk right into free agency when it's known his brother is on a stack team with cap space to sign him? Would YOU not try to get him locked up the summer before or during the season... or you'd wait 2 weeks before free agency to make your first offer? Legit question.

Then the next summer, would you let Nico walk right into free agency? Then the summer after would you let Bratt AND Mercer walk right into free agency? And the summer after... would you let Nemec walk into free agency? Probably not right? Well that's precisely what he did.

The man systematically let all his top UFA walk right into free agency without trying to sign him until the very last minute where he had no leverage. Even Elias, so please stop making excuses, honestly.

 

I didn’t miss it. I’m just trying out this new thing where I don’t engage in the same argument 6832 times, because you know there’s no way you’ll ever convince me and I know there’s no way I’ll ever convince you.

Your argument against Lou repeatedly and heavily relies on conjecture (at best) and oftentimes bizarre allegories and heavy handed anecdotes. 

I didn’t reply because I’m choosing to not open that can of worms again. That’s all.