The Unintended GDT (1/19) Devils @ Kraken 10:00 PM EST MSGSN

[devlman]

1 hour ago, SterioDesign said:

I mean lol we know this was once again just a "in the moment emotional and irrational statement" and nothing more. We know the drill by now. 

Look at the dissertations that follow the obvious bait, too lol. I mean, no one believes we should be subtracting a Jesper Bratt.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

8 minutes ago, Chimaira_Devil_#9 said:

100%,  good teams also do is actually play like a good team lol. So I am hoping the Devil's figure out how to be consistent down the stretch to hopefully be in form when it matters the most. 

Marino really is a difference maker, which is not something I was expecting when we acquired him.

Upgrading Smith really doesn't seem like it would be too difficult. Someone like Luke Schenn from Vancouver with cup experience could be a nice addition. Although his Advanced Stats aren't great and that seems to be something the Devil's front office focus on. 

I haven't started to look around the league yet but gotta think there's some early-to-mid 30s vet around somewhere who's gotta be a decent upgrade to whatever the hell it is that Smith "brings"...if it's a guy whose current team has no interest in re-signing him and isn't playing for much, you could probably get that guy for a mid-round pick + Walsh.  We know how it works...in a deal like that, you take your pick and young longshot prospect (I don't see Walsh ever sticking in the NHL, though maybe he gets a look on a bad "nothing to lose" team for an extended batch of games) and call it a day.  Better than losing a guy with some kind of value for nothing, especially if you're not postseason-bound.  

[EdgeControl]

7 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

I haven't started to look around the league yet but gotta think there's some early-to-mid 30s vet around somewhere who's gotta be a decent upgrade to whatever the hell it is that Smith "brings"...if it's a guy whose current team has no interest in re-signing him and isn't playing for much, you could probably get that guy for a mid-round pick + Walsh.  We know how it works...in a deal like that, you take your pick and young longshot prospect (I don't see Walsh ever sticking in the NHL, though maybe he gets a look on a bad "nothing to lose" team for an extended batch of games) and call it a day.  Better than losing a guy with some kind of value for nothing, especially if you're not postseason-bound.  

aside from Dougie and now marino , is there really a blueliner that we couldnt upgrade?

[mfitz804]

1 minute ago, EdgeControl said:

aside from Dougie and now marino , is there really a blueliner that we couldnt upgrade?

Maybe Siegenthaler. Depends on the day. 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

1 minute ago, EdgeControl said:

aside from Dougie and now marino , is there really a blueliner that we couldnt upgrade?

Siegs is plenty solid most of the time and on a very fair contract.  I like Graves but he’s one of those guys who really isn’t as good as his numbers suggest.  Seves is Seves (forever ready to do something maddeningly stupid to offset any good moments) and Smith is just god-awful.  Okhotiuk might be decent but it’s just too early to tell.  Bahl I just don’t see it happening.  

[EdgeControl]

6 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

Maybe Siegenthaler. Depends on the day. 

exactly

[MB3]

List of forwards who make more than $8m in the NHL:

1. Tomas Hertl
2. Brady Tkachuk
3. Blake Wheeler
4. Jacob Voracek
5. Sebastian Aho
6. Filip Forsberg
7. Leon Draisaitl
8. Steven Stamkos
9. Mika Zibanejad
10. Patrik Laine
11. Sidney Crosby
12. Jeff Skinner
13. Kirill Kaprizov
14. Nick Backstrom
15. Mikko Rantanen
16. Nikita Kucherov
17. Brayden Point
18. Alex Ovechkin
19. Jamie Benn
20. Mark Stone
21. Matt Tkachuk
22. Johnny Gaudreau
23. Tyler Seguin
24. Jack Eichel
25. Anze Kopitar
26. Aleksander Barkov
27. Johnathan Toews
28. Patrick Kane
29. Mitch Marner
30. John Tavares
31. Auston Matthews
32. Artemi Panarin
33. Connor McDavid

Excluding the obvious "they signed their contract 6 years ago and aren't that good any more" guys like Voracek, Toews, Benn, Skinner and Backstrom, if you ranked this list and added Bratt's name, where does he fall? Bottom 5? Bottom 5? Dead last? 

I don't want the Devils to cut Jesper Bratt. I don't want the Devils to trade Jesper Bratt for pennies. I am aware that Jesper Bratt is a valuable young player. I would just like to see the Devils make a hockey trade with Jesper Bratt in the offseason and bring in guys who compete, who play hard, who won't get pushed around in the playoffs, who don't disappear. I don't know who that guy is, because I'm not an NHL GM. I'm just typing on a message board that I think Jesper Bratt is overvalued by Devils fans, and I'm getting tired of watching the team play games against teams like the Kraken and the Bruins and the Hurricanes and spend 60 minutes getting bullied while Jesper Bratt stays on the half wall and wide of the circles to avoid contact. 

The team reeeeeeeeeally could've used a Matthew Tkachuk or a Kevin Fiala this offseason. 

Edited January 20, 2023 by MB3

[MB3]

54 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

I haven't started to look around the league yet but gotta think there's some early-to-mid 30s vet around somewhere who's gotta be a decent upgrade to whatever the hell it is that Smith "brings"...if it's a guy whose current team has no interest in re-signing him and isn't playing for much, you could probably get that guy for a mid-round pick + Walsh.  We know how it works...in a deal like that, you take your pick and young longshot prospect (I don't see Walsh ever sticking in the NHL, though maybe he gets a look on a bad "nothing to lose" team for an extended batch of games) and call it a day.  Better than losing a guy with some kind of value for nothing, especially if you're not postseason-bound.  

There really aren't many rentals that fit the bill. There are plenty of puck-moving guys -- Ghost-Bear, Klingberg, etc. But the Devils don't want that. 

Couple of guys I'd be interested in:

1. Radko Gudas -- if Florida sees themselves on the outside looking in nearing the trade deadline, he's a perfect mid-round pick for an expiring contract. He's an a$$hole, but it'd be nice to have one of those on our side for once.
2. Vladislav Gavrikov -- pending UFA from Columbus. He's young to be a UFA (just turned 27 a month ago) but he's a reliable, stay at home defenseman that probably wouldn't cost much as a rental. He's eating almost 23 minutes a night with the Blue Jackets, and is somehow only a -2. Has to be doing something right on that sh!tshow. 
3. Kevin Shattenkirk -- again as a low-cost addition. Has a couple of Cups from playing on the 3rd pairing with Colorado. He's not great, but he's better than Smith. 
4. Dmitri Kulikov -- our old friend! Reliable, uninspiring, solid bottom pairing defenseman. Plays his ass off on a bad team. 

[mfitz804]

34 minutes ago, MB3 said:

List of forwards who make more than $8m in the NHL:

1. Tomas Hertl
2. Brady Tkachuk
3. Blake Wheeler
4. Jacob Voracek
5. Sebastian Aho
6. Filip Forsberg
7. Leon Draisaitl
8. Steven Stamkos
9. Mika Zibanejad
10. Patrik Laine
11. Sidney Crosby
12. Jeff Skinner
13. Kirill Kaprizov
14. Nick Backstrom
15. Mikko Rantanen
16. Nikita Kucherov
17. Brayden Point
18. Alex Ovechkin
19. Jamie Benn
20. Mark Stone
21. Matt Tkachuk
22. Johnny Gaudreau
23. Tyler Seguin
24. Jack Eichel
25. Anze Kopitar
26. Aleksander Barkov
27. Johnathan Toews
28. Patrick Kane
29. Mitch Marner
30. John Tavares
31. Auston Matthews
32. Artemi Panarin
33. Connor McDavid

Excluding the obvious "they signed their contract 6 years ago and aren't that good any more" guys like Voracek, Toews, Benn, Skinner and Backstrom, if you ranked this list and added Bratt's name, where does he fall? Bottom 5? Bottom 5? Dead last? 

I don't want the Devils to cut Jesper Bratt. I don't want the Devils to trade Jesper Bratt for pennies. I am aware that Jesper Bratt is a valuable young player. I would just like to see the Devils make a hockey trade with Jesper Bratt in the offseason and bring in guys who compete, who play hard, who won't get pushed around in the playoffs, who don't disappear. I don't know who that guy is, because I'm not an NHL GM. I'm just typing on a message board that I think Jesper Bratt is overvalued by Devils fans, and I'm getting tired of watching the team play games against teams like the Kraken and the Bruins and the Hurricanes and spend 60 minutes getting bullied while Jesper Bratt stays on the half wall and wide of the circles to avoid contact. 

The team reeeeeeeeeally could've used a Matthew Tkachuk or a Kevin Fiala this offseason. 

Bratt is currently outscoring 18 of those 33. Logic dictates that he should be in the list of forwards making more than $8m a season. 

Edited January 20, 2023 by mfitz804

[SterioDesign]

This is such a unicorn request lol

 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

35 minutes ago, MB3 said:

There really aren't many rentals that fit the bill. There are plenty of puck-moving guys -- Ghost-Bear, Klingberg, etc. But the Devils don't want that. 

Couple of guys I'd be interested in:

1. Radko Gudas -- if Florida sees themselves on the outside looking in nearing the trade deadline, he's a perfect mid-round pick for an expiring contract. He's an a$$hole, but it'd be nice to have one of those on our side for once.
2. Vladislav Gavrikov -- pending UFA from Columbus. He's young to be a UFA (just turned 27 a month ago) but he's a reliable, stay at home defenseman that probably wouldn't cost much as a rental. He's eating almost 23 minutes a night with the Blue Jackets, and is somehow only a -2. Has to be doing something right on that sh!tshow. 
3. Kevin Shattenkirk -- again as a low-cost addition. Has a couple of Cups from playing on the 3rd pairing with Colorado. He's not great, but he's better than Smith. 
4. Dmitri Kulikov -- our old friend! Reliable, uninspiring, solid bottom pairing defenseman. Plays his ass off on a bad team. 

Devils could attempt one-stop shopping and deal for both Henrique and Shattenkirk...man it would be weird to ever have Shattenkirk in the fold (think I'd rather deal for someone else on this list just because).  Devils would have to do some cap gymnastics to make it happen.  Sharangovich and Walsh and maybe a mid-rounder going the other way...Ducks gotta retain some money.  Not sure if that's enough, but maybe I'd give them another very marginal prospect...there's only so much the Ducks can expect to get for players who don't fit into their rebuild at all...I have no interest in overpaying for these players, though I do like the idea of having Henrique for one more year beyond this season.   

[mfitz804]

50 minutes ago, MB3 said:

Vladislav Gavrikov

I like the idea of forcing Ken Daneyko to try to say this. 

[jagknife]

1 hour ago, MB3 said:

There really aren't many rentals that fit the bill. There are plenty of puck-moving guys -- Ghost-Bear, Klingberg, etc. But the Devils don't want that. 

Couple of guys I'd be interested in:

1. Radko Gudas -- if Florida sees themselves on the outside looking in nearing the trade deadline, he's a perfect mid-round pick for an expiring contract. He's an a$$hole, but it'd be nice to have one of those on our side for once.
2. Vladislav Gavrikov -- pending UFA from Columbus. He's young to be a UFA (just turned 27 a month ago) but he's a reliable, stay at home defenseman that probably wouldn't cost much as a rental. He's eating almost 23 minutes a night with the Blue Jackets, and is somehow only a -2. Has to be doing something right on that sh!tshow. 
3. Kevin Shattenkirk -- again as a low-cost addition. Has a couple of Cups from playing on the 3rd pairing with Colorado. He's not great, but he's better than Smith. 
4. Dmitri Kulikov -- our old friend! Reliable, uninspiring, solid bottom pairing defenseman. Plays his ass off on a bad team. 

Gudas I feel like is one of those guys who you hate if he’s not on your team, but man can he actually hit and stand up for teammates. We need that, BADLY

[MadDog2020]

4 minutes ago, jagknife said:

Gudas I feel like is one of those guys who you hate if he’s not on your team, but man can he actually hit and stand up for teammates. We need that, BADLY

I would love Gudas. He brings copious amounts of ‘fvck you’ to the table. 

[mfitz804]

7 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

I would love Gudas. He brings copious amounts of ‘fvck you’ to the table. 

Sure, but when me and @MB3 do it, everyone is like "I wish we had a better ignore feature". 

[NJDevils1214]

2 hours ago, mfitz804 said:

Bratt is currently outscoring 18 of those 33. Logic dictates that he should be in the list of forwards making more than $8m a season. 

Why are you bringing logic into the conversation at a time like this!?!

[SterioDesign]

2 hours ago, mfitz804 said:

Bratt is currently outscoring 18 of those 33. Logic dictates that he should be in the list of forwards making more than $8m a season. 

Yesterday Jack was sort of invisible for a large portion of the game.

So if we could trade jack for a guy that brings the same production, control the play just as much (or more) but a lot better on faceoffs, 6'5, 250lbs, never takes a shift off, plays hard all game and doesn't get pushed around for the playoffs. Also if he wouldn't be more expensive than 8.5m that'd be ideal. I'm sure any team having a player like this wouldnt mind trading him in a good hockey trade right?

I won't point out who in the NHL fits that description since i'm not an NHL gm. But basically that's what i want, please. 

Edited January 20, 2023 by SterioDesign

[MB3]

4 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Yesterday Jack was sort of invisible for a large portion of the game.

So if we could trade jack for a guy that brings the same production, control the play just as much (or more) but a lot better on faceoffs, 6'5, 250lbs, never takes a shift off, plays hard all game and doesn't get pushed around for the playoffs. Also if he wouldn't be more expensive than 8.5m that'd be ideal. I'm sure any team having a player like this wouldnt mind trading him in a good hockey trade right?

I won't point out who in the NHL fits that description since i'm not an NHL gm. But basically that's what i want, please. 

Are you capable of having any sort of debate without these weird hypothetical strawman arguments that you always win? It’s getting tiring seeing you totally win those shower arguments bro!! 

Kevin Fiala and Matthew Tkachuk last off-season were examples of that. Neither guy was projected to be available until the summer, so if you asked me this time last year I’d say “idk yet”.

I’m not asking for him to be given away for free. I’m not calling him useless or terrible. I’m saying he’s soft and prone to stretches of invisibility. I’m not asking for a unicorn. I’m asking for a guy who isn’t that. 

[SterioDesign]

3 minutes ago, MB3 said:

Are you capable of having any sort of debate without these weird hypothetical strawman arguments that you always win? It’s getting tiring seeing you totally win those shower arguments bro!! 

Kevin Fiala and Matthew Tkachuk last off-season were examples of that. Neither guy was projected to be available until the summer, so if you asked me this time last year I’d say “idk yet”.

I’m not asking for him to be given away for free. I’m not calling him useless or terrible. I’m saying he’s soft and prone to stretches of invisibility. I’m not asking for a unicorn. I’m asking for a guy who isn’t that. 

I'm totally able yes. But to me this whole thing is a giant knee-jerk reaction to Bratt being on the ice and not giving his best effort on the game losing goal.

If Blackwood makes that save, we get the puck and score off the rush. You're absolutely not there claiming 20 minutes later that you don't want our 2nd guy in points who's a PPG player not on the team next season.

And i mean, sure there's conversations to have here. Like how much are we willing to actually spend on Bratt? And if what he wants is not reasonable. Then what? Sure. 

But again, i'll bring this up again. When the team is struggling to score in a game. You sure like to bring up that we failed to get Gaudreau and tag Guadana or whoever disagreed. You said many times you would have been fine giving Gaudreau 9.5/10m wtv. Yet....Gaudreau is also known to disappear for stretches, he's pretty soft, has less point than Bratt right now, older AND he's costing more. But you want him... but not Brat who's arguably a better value than Gaudreau.

You always do this. We lose, you get upset, pick a scapegoat and then common sense goes out the window.

 

[mfitz804]

20 minutes ago, MB3 said:

Are you capable of having any sort of debate without these weird hypothetical strawman arguments that you always win? It’s getting tiring seeing you totally win those shower arguments bro!! 

Kevin Fiala and Matthew Tkachuk last off-season were examples of that. Neither guy was projected to be available until the summer, so if you asked me this time last year I’d say “idk yet”.

I’m not asking for him to be given away for free. I’m not calling him useless or terrible. I’m saying he’s soft and prone to stretches of invisibility. I’m not asking for a unicorn. I’m asking for a guy who isn’t that. 

He’s better than a point per game. How much better than a point per game player do you want? You know that’s only like 30-40 players in the whole league, most of whom are not anywhere close to available, right?

Edited January 21, 2023 by mfitz804

[SterioDesign]

14 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

He’s better than a point per game. How much better than a point per game player do you want? You know that’s only like 30-40 players in the whole league, most of whom are not anywhere close to available, right?

Question is... if a point per game player who "disappear at time" is not good enough for us at 8.5m to the point where that would be a giant mistake.

The player we'd trade Bratt for... a guy who never takes a shift off, plays hard... but bring in less production than bratt... how low would he be okay with? 0.90/PPG? 0.75/PPG? i mean if the game plays REAAAAAALLY HARD and only cost 6millions? could he be a .50PPG? Is that better?

Edited January 21, 2023 by SterioDesign

[mfitz804]

The problem is, the whole idea is based on a flawed premise that he disappears for games at a time. He had one streak of 4 games with no points (in December when the whole team was awful), and one streak of 2 games with no points, and zero other streaks of no points for the entire season. 

Last season, he had a few more. He was still just shy of PPG by 3 points. 

I ask again, what the fvck more do you need from him??

[SterioDesign]

8 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

The problem is, the whole idea is based on a flawed premise that he disappears for games at a time. He had one streak of 4 games with no points (in December when the whole team was awful), and one streak of 2 games with no points, and zero other streaks of no points for the entire season. 

Last season, he had a few more. He was still just shy of PPG by 3 points. 

I ask again, what the fvck more do you need from him??

Yeah lol

It's like when people call out 30 goals scorers as being streaky... like it's a problem.

Like... what's your expectation exactly? If you score 30 goals... it means that you basically score a goal per 2-3 games over the season. which... in my modest opinion... pretty good.

So to those having a problem with those 30 goals scorers... disappearing... what's your expectations? if you score 30 goals... it means that you didn't score in 52 games sure but like? haha So do yo want them to score... more than 30 ? or... you want the scoring to be spread out more evenly? like steady every 2-3 games... meaning that... if you score a hat trick or like 5 goals in 5 games... it means you'll have a longer goalless streak later down the line....... But... what if you really needed those 2 goals that game to win? 

I truly but truly don't understand what their expectations are lol 

[MB3]

43 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

He’s better than a point per game. How much better than a point per game player do you want? You know that’s only like 30-40 players in the whole league, most of whom are not anywhere close to available, right?

Matt Tkachuk, Kevin Fiala and Alex deBrincat weren’t available, until they were. Taylor Hall wasn’t available, until we acquired him. 

That’s why I don’t bother with naming names, because you and SD run full speed to your keyboard to say “NAAAAA NEVER GONNA HAPPEN!!!!”. Why waste both of our time? 

[MB3]

2 minutes ago, SterioDesign said:

Yeah lol

It's like when people call out 30 goals scorers as being streaky... like it's a problem.

Like... what's your expectation exactly? If you score 30 goals... it means that you basically score a goal per 2-3 games over the season. which... in my modest opinion... pretty good.

So to those having a problem with those 30 goals scorers... disappearing... what's your expectations? if you score 30 goals... it means that you didn't score in 52 games sure but like? haha So do yo want them to score... more than 30 ? or... you want the scoring to be spread out more evenly? like steady every 2-3 games... meaning that... if you score a hat trick or like 5 goals in 5 games... it means you'll have a longer goalless streak later down the line....... But... what if you really needed those 2 goals that game to win? 

who are you possibly doing this for? This is such a garbage dump of a post lol. 

One time you saw a guy on TV ask himself a rhetorical question and answer it to sound smart and you just decided to make that your entire personality? It’s exhausting, man.