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Colorado Rockies 1976

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4 hours ago, Satans Hockey said:

Why do you guys actually give a sh!t about what happens with Arizona? I think it's a great precedent that the league goes above and beyond trying to keep a team in the city instead of just relocating. 

It beats having a situation like Oakland with these billionaire owners running out of town in the mlb and nfl to Vegas just because they are too damn cheap to build their own god damn stadiums. 

Plus it's absolutely fantastic that the arena is going to be built from private funds. It should be illegal to give any sort of breaks to these billionaires to get new stadiums built. sh!t has always been a joke and should never, ever be funded by taxpayers. 

Shouldn't that area actually WANT an NHL team though?  That's my real beef.

But yeah, technically my team appears to be quite safe and won't be going anywhere (in a way it's hard to believe that what was a horrible team coming to an already crowded hockey market has made it this long, but obviously love that they're now firmly entrenched), so I can't say that I have any skin in the Yotes' game.  It just feels like the NHL wasn't truly meant to be in Arizona.

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1 hour ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Shouldn't that area actually WANT an NHL team though?  That's my real beef.

But yeah, technically my team appears to be quite safe and won't be going anywhere (in a way it's hard to believe that what was a horrible team coming to an already crowded hockey market has made it this long, but obviously love that they're now firmly entrenched), so I can't say that I have any skin in the Yotes' game.  It just feels like the NHL wasn't truly meant to be in Arizona.

They have to give fans a reason to come though, only 5 playoff appearances since the 00-01 season. Only 1 playoff appearance since the 12-13 season and that was only cause of the 20 playoffs getting them in on a qualifying round and there was no fans. 

Those kinda stats and teams are gonna kill a ton of cities in the US, even more so a one that was still rather young. 

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25 minutes ago, Satans Hockey said:

They have to give fans a reason to come though, only 5 playoff appearances since the 00-01 season. Only 1 playoff appearance since the 12-13 season and that was only cause of the 20 playoffs getting them in on a qualifying round and there was no fans. 

Those kinda stats and teams are gonna kill a ton of cities in the US, even more so a one that was still rather young. 

Other fanbases have supported lousy teams though...even when it didn't always make all that much sense to do so.  Even if the 'Yotes start to put together a good product, will that be enough to get whatever fans they have to start going?  For other (potential) fans to follow suit?  And I mentioned it before but ANOTHER arena in that general area?  Guess I'm just not sold on hockey ever truly working in Arizona.  

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13 minutes ago, Satans Hockey said:

They have to give fans a reason to come though, only 5 playoff appearances since the 00-01 season. Only 1 playoff appearance since the 12-13 season and that was only cause of the 20 playoffs getting them in on a qualifying round and there was no fans. 

Those kinda stats and teams are gonna kill a ton of cities in the US, even more so a one that was still rather young. 

The whole situation is a total embarrassment, and it’s been going on for 14 years. Enough. EVERYTHING they try doesn’t work or gets shot down. Now they’re playing in a 5,000 seat arena for the foreseeable future while their ‘owner’ fiddles around looking for yet ANOTHER plot of land to build on. Their players deserve better. Their staff deserves better. This has been Bush League from day one; except this isn’t the fvcking minor leagues, it’s the NHL. Do I care ultimately what happens to the Coyotes? No. Am I sick of watching the league fvck this up? Yes I am. Move them the fvck to Houston and be done with it already.  

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13 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

The whole situation is a total embarrassment, and it’s been going on for 14 years. Enough. EVERYTHING they try doesn’t work or gets shot down. Now they’re playing in a 5,000 seat arena for the foreseeable future while their ‘owner’ fiddles around looking for yet ANOTHER plot of land to build on. Their players deserve better. Their staff deserves better. This has been Bush League from day one; except this isn’t the fvcking minor leagues, it’s the NHL. Do I care ultimately what happens to the Coyotes? No. Am I sick of watching the league fvck this up? Yes I am. Move them the fvck to Houston and be done with it already.  

They've been there since 1996-97...that's a loooooooong friggin' time.  At that point, a team should have some semblance of solid footing, if they idea is that they're supposed to stay.  They sure as hell shouldn't be playing in an AHL-sized arena hoping that this time everything will be just fine and somehow work out. 

And yeah, part of the problem is that the Coyotes have become a salary dumping ground...sure, the Yotes will have TEN second-round picks (?!) and seven third-round picks to work with over the next three years, so they can certainly make their share of this 2nd + that 3rd for some team's pretty good cap-casualty player...but why the hell would anyone want to GO there that actually has some options?  Yeah it's just an ugly situation.  

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1 hour ago, MadDog2020 said:

The whole situation is a total embarrassment, and it’s been going on for 14 years. Enough. EVERYTHING they try doesn’t work or gets shot down. Now they’re playing in a 5,000 seat arena for the foreseeable future while their ‘owner’ fiddles around looking for yet ANOTHER plot of land to build on. Their players deserve better. Their staff deserves better. This has been Bush League from day one; except this isn’t the fvcking minor leagues, it’s the NHL. Do I care ultimately what happens to the Coyotes? No. Am I sick of watching the league fvck this up? Yes I am. Move them the fvck to Houston and be done with it already.  

For me the older I get the less I care about the league as a whole. Unless it's the Devils or affects us someway I really don't care. The only non Devils NHL hockey I watch at this point is the playoffs and outdoor games. Other then those I'd rather watch almost literally anything else. I just don't have any desire or investment in watching other teams playing regular season games.

The league is what it is, it's only going to become less popular as time moves on, they need all the dinosaurs to be removed from being in charge. I just don't care how the league embarrasses themselves or messes up stuff at this point.

If the Devils somehow folded or moved I'd never watch another game in the league. I'd just watch team USA. 

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1 hour ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Other fanbases have supported lousy teams though...even when it didn't always make all that much sense to do so.  Even if the 'Yotes start to put together a good product, will that be enough to get whatever fans they have to start going?  For other (potential) fans to follow suit?  And I mentioned it before but ANOTHER arena in that general area?  Guess I'm just not sold on hockey ever truly working in Arizona.  

 

We really can't throw stones, we have only averaged a few more thousand than them and our team has actually winning history behind it. Look at what the last decade of losing hockey did to a lot of our attendance. 

Our area let the Islanders build yet another arena around here, their attendance numbers for awhile were just as bad if not worse at times than the Coyotes. Should have shipped them off too. 

This new arena is at least going to be paid with private funding. Unlike the vast majority of the arenas in our area. Remember all those people who paid PSLs to help build metlife and they couldn't even put a damn retractable roof on what is the absolute worst of the newer NFL stadiums? 

The economy sucks, people aren't going to piss their money or time away on a sh!tty team. It's just how it is here in the US for almost every single team with the rare exceptions. 

The Coyotes have only made it out of the 1st round 1x since they moved there for the 96-97 season. Only made the playoffs 8x since then cause I'm not counting the 2020 mess. 

You move a team to almost any new city and have results like that fans won't be around. 

Our fan base alone has so many bandwangon fans, hell look at this season alone. Then when we are finally winning people still bitch and moan about the pricing.

I 100% completely understand why people won't spend their money on a dog sh!t team. Realistically I shouldn't have dropped a dime on this team for the majority of the last decade but I still enjoy going and realize I'm lucky enough to be able to afford it while others can't justify spending money on a loser team. 

I just think it's silly to get up in arms about the Coyotes situation when our fan base has a notoriously bad rep for sh!t attendance, even when we were actually good and winning and I've spent many nights over the last decade in a half empty arena watching our Devils. 

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1 hour ago, MadDog2020 said:

Zacha is their top center now 🤣

Oof, last season he was put in a perfect position to have some success...let the bigger names do the heavy lifting, and this guy more who's a little more behind the scenes is able to rather quietly put up some points...yes, he did manage to finish 4th in points, though he was surrounded by a bunch of guys in the 50+ point group on the Bruins.  Also didn't hurt that he enjoyed good puck luck last year (16.0% shooting).  That might have been a career year for him. 

He is not a 1C...just isn't.  We've seen what happens when a guy is asked to do too much or be more than he is...they usually get exposed and they remind you why they're better off not taking on more responsibility.  

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I think we'll see a downturn in Boston this year. IMO they won't be near as good as last season. They need 31, but lack the cap space unless $$ goes the other way. Couture said he wants to be part of SJ rebuild, and Lindholm (if not signed) will get over 9 mil easily.  

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1 hour ago, MadDog2020 said:

Scheifele to Boston. Calling it now. I just can’t see them starting the season as presently constituted down the middle.

How though?  They don't have any picks in the first three rounds of the 2024 draft and they don't have much cap space (less than $500k).

Not saying that the Bruins wouldn't love to add him, just that they may not have the ability to bring him in...might have to be something that they do closer to the deadline.

Guess you can make the argument that a locked-up, cost-controlled Zacha as part of some package for Scheifele might get something done...the idea of course that Boston upgrades their 1C spot with an actual 1C talent (though they'll be thin overall at C), and Winnipeg gets something back for a guy who doesn't appear to be staying.  Man going from Scheifele to Zacha is rough though, if you're a Jets fan.  Better hope to get at least one more helpful piece coming back with him.

Of course, Zacha did just sign an extension, with Year 1 of that commencing this season...is the idea that the Bruins would move him right now even realistic?  

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4 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Guess you can make the argument that a locked-up, cost-controlled Zacha as part of some package for Scheifele might get something done...the idea of course that Boston upgrades their 1C spot with an actual 1C talent (though they'll be thin overall at C), and Winnipeg gets something back for a guy who doesn't appear to be staying.  Man going from Scheifele to Zacha is rough though, if you're a Jets fan.  Better hope to get at least one more helpful piece coming back with him.

Scheifele wants out and Winnipeg was looking to move him earlier this offseason; I don’t know what Boston may give up, but that team is trying to win a Cup still, and I don’t buy for a minute that Sweeney goes into the season with Zacha as his 1C. 

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9 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

Scheifele wants out and Winnipeg was looking to move him earlier this offseason; I don’t know what Boston may give up, but that team is trying to win a Cup still, and I don’t buy for a minute that Sweeney goes into the season with Zacha as his 1C. 

I don’t disagree at all that Boston will try to make some kind of move at some point; I’m just not sure how much they can do right at the moment, as far as taking on someone who’s got a sizable hit.  They’re going to need a trade partner to take some salary back, if a guy like Scheifele is who they’re targeting.

Could I see them dealing for Scheifele in-season (even at the deadline) and then locking him up for a while?  Wouldn’t surprise me.

Has Scheifele been linked to any teams?

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2 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Has Scheifele been linked to any teams?

I actually heard Boston back in July; I didn’t pull this one out of thin air lol. I think they were waiting to see what happened with Bergeron and Krejci. Now that they know, I’m sure a phone call was made to Winnipeg. You may be right though- these things take time, and I wouldn’t be surprised if it happened in-season. 

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25 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

I actually heard Boston back in July; I didn’t pull this one out of thin air lol. I think they were waiting to see what happened with Bergeron and Krejci. Now that they know, I’m sure a phone call was made to Winnipeg. You may be right though- these things take time, and I wouldn’t be surprised if it happened in-season. 

Maybe Boston makes a separate salary dump move to clear space in an attempt to expedite a Scheifele acquisition.  I agree with you 100% that the Bruins can’t possibly view Zacha as their 1C as remotely ideal.

FWIW, saw some chatter about the Bruins potentially being interested in Calgary’s Elias Lindholm.  Also a UFA-to-be…not as productive as Scheifele but has a lower cap hit for 2023-24.

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47 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

@Colorado Rockies 1976 this guy does a great job of breaking down what a Schiefele to Boston trade could look like: https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/a-different-beast-bruins-still-in-win-now-mode-even-without-bergeron-krejci/

Yeah the author echoes the same issues that I brought up…lack of cap space and draft capital (as well as not much in the system).  But yeah, guess they might as well give up what little they have in prospects and players to deal, and find some way to land Scheifele or Lindholm.  

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26 minutes ago, Rob_Ottawa said:

Or embrace the rebuild like a smart org would do and trade vets for picks instead 

They just gave Pastrnak a massive extension and McAvoy still has seven years left on his deal (as does Lindholm).  All still have several prime years left.  They’re not going to blow this thing up just yet.  

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1 hour ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

They just gave Pastrnak a massive extension and McAvoy still has seven years left on his deal (as does Lindholm).  All still have several prime years left.  They’re not going to blow this thing up just yet.  


Yeah, if you can move a forward or two and an NHL defenseman for Shieflele(sp?), you'll see them pull the trigger. Both Boston and WPG want to still go for it I think. Both teams are still invested in their cores. 

EDIT: Looking at their cap friendly, the Bs don't have a lot of options when it comes to player assets. They can't/won't trade any of the newly signed this early, so JVR, Lucic, Boqvist, Geekie, Shattenkirk were all recently signed, so the likelyhood of them being moved out is low(at least before the season starts, maybe deadline these names come up). Pasternak, Marchand, Zacha, and H.Lindholm, Coyle, Forbert, and Carlo all have a NTC of some kind or another and are probably untouchable. I doubt there's much interest in a AJ Greer or Patrick Brown as bottom sixers. 

This leaves the shortlist of Swayman, Zboril, Grzelcyk, and Debrusk, and maybe Frederic and maybe some draft picks they can fork over to WPG. They will probably have to ask someone to waive a NMC or NTC to get Shieflele. That shortlist is not super appealing, but maybe a combination of 2-3 NHLers, maybe a prospect and a draft pick gets it done. I think WPG would do something for Swayman, another NHL body, and a pick. 

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