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Timo’s a Devil!! 13 pieces in Trade!


Colorado Rockies 1976

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1 minute ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

They wouldn't be disappointed if they saw Holtz play.  But not going to pretend it's all on him...Devils handled what should've been a key developmental year very...oddly.

Eh, Eklund isn’t any closer. He’s only played 9 games in the NHL at this point, and is putting up pretty similar numbers to what Holtz did in the AHL last season. The Sharks are in full on rebuild mode. So it’s not like they can’t show some patience with their young prospects. 

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Just now, Nicomo said:

Eh, Eklund isn’t any closer. He’s only played 9 games in the NHL at this point, and is putting up pretty similar numbers to what Holtz did in the AHL last season. The Sharks are in full on rebuild mode. So it’s not like they can’t show some patience with their young prospects. 

I was more talking from the fan standpoint (that if they saw him play at this stage they wouldn't be all that impressed).  But yeah the Sharks can afford to be patient for sure, given their circumstances.

This probably wouldn't happen but I would consider Wood, Holtz and something else (Foote or Walsh?) for Tom Wilson.  Wood is obviously a salary dump, with Holtz being the key young piece going back...and yeah, taking a huge risk in that if Holtz puts it together, you get to see him do it in your division.  Doubt Washington would do it though...they'd probably want a good bit more (like a first-rounder), given that Wilson's good for 54 points per 82 GP over the last 5 seasons (including this one).   

 

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14 minutes ago, RizzMB30 said:

Yeah. Odd, but I'm not ready to deem it a wasted year. 

I think all young players need to understand it's hard to make a deep teams roster in the NHL today, even as league min enforcers are phased out. I think Holtz has been treated fair. It's not arbitrary to sit a young player and say, "Hey, we need to see these things from you."

Holtz has learned the expectations and I think he's taken a step on play away from the puck. I'm willing to give him another year or two yet. 

Huge offseason coming for him...whether it's here or elsewhere.  I can see him being part of a deal for a solid 3rd-liner, with the idea being that even if Holtz someday puts it all together and becomes an offensive force, you know exactly what you're getting with your new third-liner.  If Timo and Bratt are extended, there's not much room in the Top 6 anymore, especially for the foreseeable future (though of course if someone gets hurt, he might get a look out of necessity).  

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44 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Pretty sure everyone not named Meier who came back to the Devils are low ceiling-types...think that part of it was more SJ needing to clear out contracts to take on more contracts.  I'd be stunned if any of the other bodies sent here ever saw more than a handful of games.  Curious to see if Harrington gets much of a look while he's here.

Oh for sure but we could have ended up with some more 26 year old AHL fodder, so it's nice to get a player who has just tuned 22 who still has some potential. 

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1 hour ago, Lateralous said:

Wood has to be gone, right?   McLeod is back if no legal/moral issues arise with the Team Canada Juniors thing.  Can't imagine Boqvist or Bastian will be expensive to re-sign, so they'll be back.  Haula and Tatar can come back as long as they are super cheap contracts.   At their age, there aren't going to be huge paydays awaiting either one so they may both decide they want to stay and be apart of this.   

That leaves Sharagovich.  He's making two million and will probably want a raise and he's frankly got significantly better career stats than Laf and Kakko.   I think he's going to want 3.5 per season.   If so, he's a  guy you move on from.  He falls in the same category as Zacha and Severson for me.  Decent player who will have a long NHL career but not on a championship squad.      

I think the definite goners are Wood, Sharangovich, Seves, and Graves...Wood due to performance, Sharangovich and Seves for both general performance and being too costly for this team as currently constructed, and Graves due to expense.  Graves is good enough that it's hard to imagine he doesn't get a nice raise in the UFA market.

I can't rule out Haula and Tatar, but it all depends upon what they're looking for.  I can't pay Haula much more than he's making right now.  Tatar probably can't come back at his current hit.  The fourth-liners should all be cheap enough to retain, but not like Boqvist or Bastian's slot can't be upgraded.  

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2 minutes ago, Chimaira_Devil_#9 said:

Oh for sure but we could have ended up with some more 26 year old AHL fodder, so it's nice to get a player who has just tuned 22 who still has some potential. 

Yeah that's fair...the younger the warm body, the better.  Not like he's Dalton Prout.

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16 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

I was more talking from the fan standpoint (that if they saw him play at this stage they wouldn't be all that impressed).  But yeah the Sharks can afford to be patient for sure, given their circumstances.

This probably wouldn't happen but I would consider Wood, Holtz and something else (Foote or Walsh?) for Tom Wilson.  Wood is obviously a salary dump, with Holtz being the key young piece going back...and yeah, taking a huge risk in that if Holtz puts it together, you get to see him do it in your division.  Doubt Washington would do it though...they'd probably want a good bit more (like a first-rounder), given that Wilson's good for 54 points per 82 GP over the last 5 seasons (including this one).   

 

it`s all in and it would killed our offensive depth. 

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1 minute ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

The thing I love most about this trade is it kicks the devils cup window wide open. This is Fitz saying “we’re going for it.” This team will be in the conversation for the next 5-8 years at least. 

They should have more. Jack is only 29 yo after 8 years, Mercer is 28, Luke is 27, Simon is 26.

If they find legit top-6 center in the next 5-6 years, we can talk about 10+ window.

Edited by Guadana
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7 minutes ago, Guadana said:

it`s all in and it would killed our offensive depth. 

Really depends on how much you believe in Holtz.  Wilson's averaged 26 G per 82 GP since the start of the 2018-19 season, and obviously brings a serious physical element.  Of course he's a UFA after next season, and that could be the real issue...Devils can only dole out so many $5 million AAV contracts.  

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I was listening to the Locked On Sharks podcast to see how they reacted to this and they're clearly a bit disappointed. But I did hear one thing that made me scratch my head.

One of the hosts said "New Jersey is going to be insanely good this year, but good luck with the goaltending" and kinda chuckled

Do they think Blackwood is still in net and that VV isn't having a Vezina-level season?

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52 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

They wouldn't be disappointed if they saw Holtz play.  But not going to pretend it's all on him...Devils handled what should've been a key developmental year very...oddly.

Curious to see if Muk's playing with the Sharks next season.  No matter what he turns out to be, I still make this deal every time.  But definitely interested to see what he becomes. 

Fitz claimed Muk was in their plans to get in games ‘this’ year, if that was the case I imagine he’ll come over to the Sharks once his KHL season is done 

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14 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

The thing I love most about this trade is it kicks the devils cup window wide open. This is Fitz saying “we’re going for it.” This team will be in the conversation for the next 5-8 years at least. 

And going for it in a way that's SUSTAINABLE.  If Fitz gets both Meier and Bratt locked up, hell of a job, especially in nabbing a player who should fit right in (in time) and still have several prime years left.  Much rather this route than dealing for Tarasenko and Kane and hoping for the best (of course, the Devils will probably be making similar rental deals in time, if they need that one last vet piece to try to get over the hump).

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If Fitz doesn’t believe in Holtz, and doesn’t see a fit for him on the team moving forward, why wasn’t he the one traded instead of Mukhamadullin? Holtz certainly has more trade value than Muk. Fitz is either keeping Holtz because he sees a fit (or is attached to the early first round pick he selected) OR he’s keeping him for ammo for another trade. 

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1 minute ago, RunninWithTheDevil said:

I was listening to the Locked On Sharks podcast to see how they reacted to this and they're clearly a bit disappointed. But I did hear one thing that made me scratch my head.

One of the hosts said "New Jersey is going to be insanely good this year, but good luck with the goaltending" and kinda chuckled

Do they think Blackwood is still in net and that VV isn't having a Vezina-level season?

They're probably looking at VV's good-but-not-great .913 save% and not realizing that he's actually been light's out for very long stretches.  He has one of the most misleading save%s that I can remember.  

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Just now, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

And going for it in a way that's SUSTAINABLE.  If Fitz gets both Meier and Bratt locked up, hell of a job, especially in nabbing a player who should fit right in (in time) and still have several prime years left.  Much rather this route than dealing for Tarasenko and Kane and hoping for the best (of course, the Devils will probably be making similar rental deals in time, if they need that one last vet piece to try to get over the hump).

Sometimes things work out for the best, we tried for Gaudreau, Thackuk and maybe others but instead got a big fish who actually wants to be here

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1 minute ago, nessus said:

If Fitz doesn’t believe in Holtz, and doesn’t see a fit for him on the team moving forward, why wasn’t he the one traded instead of Mukhamadullin? Holtz certainly has more trade value than Muk. Fitz is either keeping Holtz because he sees a fit (or is attached to the early first round pick he selected) OR he’s keeping him for ammo for another trade. 

Because I think the Sharks preferred Muk.  Like I said, right now I think Holtz's stock is down, and Muk's is up.  But doesn't mean that Holtz's stock can't go back up...it absolutely can.  

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6 minutes ago, nessus said:

If Fitz doesn’t believe in Holtz, and doesn’t see a fit for him on the team moving forward, why wasn’t he the one traded instead of Mukhamadullin? Holtz certainly has more trade value than Muk. Fitz is either keeping Holtz because he sees a fit (or is attached to the early first round pick he selected) OR he’s keeping him for ammo for another trade. 

Your trading partner has to agree that Holtz is more valuable than Muk.  Besides, I'm not sure you kick off a rebuild with a boom or bust winger that at a minimum has had a few red flags this season.   

I think getting two pretty good D prospects and a proven bottom 6 F was smart on their end.    

Edited by Lateralous
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9 minutes ago, Lateralous said:

Your trading partner has to agree that Holtz is more valuable than Muk.  Besides, I'm not sure you kick off a rebuild with a boom or bust winger that at a minimum has had a few red flags this season.   

I think getting two pretty good D prospects and a proven bottom 6 F was smart on their end.    

Muk is literally the definition of a boom or bust prospect though. 

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4 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

Muk is literally the definition of a boom or bust prospect though. 

Then ignore my second sentence and focus on the first one.   😉

 

Seriously though, I do think it is different to take on a boom or bust D man.   If they hit on Muk, he could become a fixture for the rebuild.  Not so sure a sniper, if that's what Holtz becomes, sticks through an entire 5 year plan.   

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25 minutes ago, nessus said:

If Fitz doesn’t believe in Holtz, and doesn’t see a fit for him on the team moving forward, why wasn’t he the one traded instead of Mukhamadullin? Holtz certainly has more trade value than Muk. Fitz is either keeping Holtz because he sees a fit (or is attached to the early first round pick he selected) OR he’s keeping him for ammo for another trade. 

because he isn`t especially in SJ eyes. And not only in their eyes. 

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1 minute ago, NJDevils1214 said:

I'm sure he has 9mm reasons a year to not really care what anyone in NJ thinks.

Sure, if a little more money is more important than playing on a contender, and winning a lot of hockey games. 

And it’s not like NJ weren’t also offering him a lot. 

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38 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Really depends on how much you believe in Holtz.  Wilson's averaged 26 G per 82 GP since the start of the 2018-19 season, and obviously brings a serious physical element.  Of course he's a UFA after next season, and that could be the real issue...Devils can only dole out so many $5 million AAV contracts.  

Agree. But he still has huge potential. And we have a lot of top-6 options for now. It`s too much on my taste. If we have a chance to trade him for something outside Holtz\Gritsyuk, I`m in, but I don`t see any real assets for that, we traded first round picks yesterday. We still should think about 5-6 years, not 1-2 years.

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