The OFFICIAL Off-Season Thread

[Puckbuster]

On 9/19/2023 at 8:03 AM, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

This is not on the players.

If Babcock is so interested in his players' backgrounds and families and really wants to get to know them better, there's ways to go about it that are a lot more "normal" and less invasive.  He can have one-on-one sitdowns and ask for each player to send him some pics of family and friends in advance...he sure as hell shouldn't expect each player to hand over his phone so that he can just scroll and peruse through their photo files as he sees fit.  A personal cell phone is just that:  PERSONAL.  Some players might have pics on their phones that they simply don't want their coach to see, for reasons that only have to make sense to them; I can see why some players might feel very uncomfortable being put on the spot by their coach like that...especially younger ones who are flat-out terrified to say no.  At the very least, such a thing clearly is NOT standard procedure.

And in a league that can't wait to give a retread yet another shot (see Laviolette, Peter), the fact that it took a while for a guy like Babcock to get another chance as an NHL head coach should've been a clear sign to him that he wasn't in any position to fvck it up...especially given that he not only had a questionable rep to begin with, but also because there were former players very willing to go on record to let people know how little they thought of him.  He needed to tread carefully, especially when it came to off-the-ice matters.

Even if some players didn't have an issue with Babcock wanting to see their phones, that doesn't mean it wasn't an odd request.  And asking a young player like Mitch Marner to rate his teammates' work ethic from best to worst, and then sharing that info with Marner's teammates...I'm sorry, that's definitely fvcking weird.  Scratching Mike Modano so that he wouldn't reach 1500 GP for his career...fvcking weird.  Especially since the Red Wings had nothing at all to lose by playing him:

Mike Modano talks about Babcock benching him: ‘It was a bitter pill’ (clickondetroit.com)

Wow, I didn’t know any of that.  I thought he asked to see a photo in conversation with the players.  I didn’t know he requested their phones and then scrolled through it.

I didn’t have a chance to read up on the incident.  I barely have a chance to login here.  Thanks for the info and the link.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

2 minutes ago, Puckbuster said:

Wow, I didn’t know any of that.  I thought he asked to see a photo in conversation with the players.  I didn’t know he requested their phones and then scrolled through it.

I didn’t have a chance to read up on the incident.  I barely have a chance to login here.  Thanks for the info and the link.

Hell I'm with ya, in that even with what I posted, I didn't realize how fvcked up that he really is.  Guy has absolutely no concept of normal boundaries or respect for others, and has no issues exerting whatever power that he has over people that he thinks can't or won't fight back.  If you get a chance to check out the Spittin' Chiclets Episode #426, they really spell it all out...a lot of people cannot stand this guy and have valid reasons as to why.  Babcock has been absolutely sh!tty to people (even janitors and concession workers) for YEARS and YEARS.  I'm just glad that he'll never get away with it in the NHL again.  

[Puckbuster]

8 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Hell I'm with ya, in that even with what I posted, I didn't realize how fvcked up that he really is.  Guy has absolutely no concept of normal boundaries or respect for others, and has no issues exerting whatever power that he has over people that he thinks can't or won't fight back.  If you get a chance to check out the Spittin' Chiclets Episode #426, they really spell it all out...a lot of people cannot stand this guy and have valid reasons as to why.  Babcock has been absolutely sh!tty to people (even janitors and concession workers) for YEARS and YEARS.  I'm just glad that he'll never get away with it in the NHL again.  

He could have had a family BBQ where everyone was invited and give everyone a chance to meet and bond.

But, we all know have that can go sideways……

https://www.thesportster.com/hockey/top-12-nhl-players-who-allegedly-slept-with-a-teammates-wife/

[Satans Hockey]

 @DevilMinder this tweet is just for you!

 

[NJDevils1214]

Saw on reddit that according to a SVK podcast that Tatar was on he said NJD offered him a 1yr deal and he didn't take it because he wanted more term. NJ then got Toffoli and the door closed. even before Toffoli he would have had a somewhat uphill battle to get a roster spot with Holtz, Foote, Nosek, Lazar, Tierney, and Clarke all fighting...not that Foot, Clarke, and Tierney have shown they are really in contention yet. Source is in the spotify but..ya know can't say for sure cause I don't speak the language.

 

[2ELIAS6]

20 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said:

Saw on reddit that according to a SVK podcast that Tatar was on he said NJD offered him a 1yr deal and he didn't take it because he wanted more term. NJ then got Toffoli and the door closed. even before Toffoli he would have had a somewhat uphill battle to get a roster spot with Holtz, Foote, Nosek, Lazar, Tierney, and Clarke all fighting...not that Foot, Clarke, and Tierney have shown they are really in contention yet. Source is in the spotify but..ya know can't say for sure cause I don't speak the language.

 

Tatar did well for us last year, could he replicate that? I dont know, but Toffoli is definitely an upgrade so i think the right thing happened for us there.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

30 minutes ago, 2ELIAS6 said:

Tatar did well for us last year, could he replicate that? I dont know, but Toffoli is definitely an upgrade so i think the right thing happened for us there.

Agree completely about Toffoli.  Especially since Tatar absolutely vanishes in the playoffs.

[Guadana]

11 hours ago, NJDevils1214 said:

Saw on reddit that according to a SVK podcast that Tatar was on he said NJD offered him a 1yr deal and he didn't take it because he wanted more term. NJ then got Toffoli and the door closed. even before Toffoli he would have had a somewhat uphill battle to get a roster spot with Holtz, Foote, Nosek, Lazar, Tierney, and Clarke all fighting...not that Foot, Clarke, and Tierney have shown they are really in contention yet. Source is in the spotify but..ya know can't say for sure cause I don't speak the language.

 

Tatar would be great, he developed his retrieving and was very useful. But roster spots are limited. And there is a time to give real opportunity to Holtz and Foote may be.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

3 hours ago, Guadana said:

Tatar would be great, he developed his retrieving and was very useful. But roster spots are limited. And there is a time to give real opportunity to Holtz and Foote may be.

Yeah Tatar greatly overestimated his value...he had a nice regular season last year, no doubt, but the two prior weren't so great, and the guy goes MIA whenever the playoffs start.  No one was signing up for more than a year of what he brings.

Tatar would've strictly been an extended stopgap, with Holtz hopefully ready enough to leave any potential AHL seasoning behind...Toffoli is pretty much here to be the replacement stopgap-type, but depending on how he does this year (as well as how Holtz does this year), I think there's a slight chance Toffoli could be re-upped here...I don't think that would've been the case with Tatar.

At any rate, glad it's Toffoli; I think he's just better and will bring more this year.

 

[Nicomo]

44 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

I think there's a slight chance Toffoli could be re-upped here

Just saw this this morning. 

 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

19 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

Just saw this this morning. 

 

It depends on how much less than he might fetch somewhere else, to stick around...with Dawson up for an extension after this year, Luke up for one after next season, and goaltending quite possibly not being bargain-priced for much longer...been over it but Fitz is already reaching the "tough decisions to be made" stage of building his team.

So much depends on Holtz, who is the real wild card in all of this.  As much as I like Toffoli (especially over Tatar), if Holtz really has improved to the point where he's at minimum a Top 9 guy this year, who spends most of the season up here and looks more and more comfortable and sees him either produce (or show promise of producing), I just don't know how or why Fitz wouldn't try to spread potential Toffoli extension money around to others.

Now, if Holtz somehow really just gave the impression that it's just not going to happen with him, and Toffoli fits in seamlessly and puts up Palms numbers (say 30 G and 50-60 points per 82 GP), then I can see Fitz maybe offering two years, $3.5 - 3.7 million AAV per to keep Toffoli (though I suspect Fitz's Plan A was to let Toffoli play this year out, then let him walk).  A two-year offer shouldn't cripple Fitz's flexibility...Dawson will obviously get a massive raise, but hard to imagine any of the Devils' remaining UFAs (McLeod, Nolan Foote, and Schmid) getting crazy money, though I guess if Schmid plays like a legit #1, suddenly he might command $5 million AAV in a bridge deal. 

[Devil Dan 56]

45 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

Just saw this this morning. 

 

How cool is it to have players now hoping they play well enough to stay here?

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

2 minutes ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

How cool is it to have players now hoping they play well enough to stay here?

Yeah forgot to mention that but I was thinking the same thing.  Meier wanting 8 years.  Bratt making it clear that despite the occasional negotiating headaches that came with his past contracts, that he did indeed want to stay for many years.  Hellebuyck apparently saying that he'd approve a trade to the Devils.  Toffoli hoping he'll get to stick around beyond this season.  Haula making it clear that he didn't want to play anywhere else.  Bastian and McLeod admitting that they wanted a little more money, but realized that Fitz knew that they both wanted to stay and would have to be willing to accept less for that to happen.

Yeah, very cool indeed.

[NJDevils1214]

2 hours ago, Devil Dan 56 said:

How cool is it to have players now hoping they play well enough to stay here?

It is cool. It's also weird we have so many dad's chiming in these days lol.

[2ELIAS6]

NJ is finally a desirable destination for talent. Talent wants to play with other talent, no doubt other players see who we have here and are interested. 

[Guadana]

On 9/28/2023 at 4:14 PM, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Yeah Tatar greatly overestimated his value...he had a nice regular season last year, no doubt, but the two prior weren't so great, and the guy goes MIA whenever the playoffs start.  No one was signing up for more than a year of what he brings.

Tatar would've strictly been an extended stopgap, with Holtz hopefully ready enough to leave any potential AHL seasoning behind...Toffoli is pretty much here to be the replacement stopgap-type, but depending on how he does this year (as well as how Holtz does this year), I think there's a slight chance Toffoli could be re-upped here...I don't think that would've been the case with Tatar.

At any rate, glad it's Toffoli; I think he's just better and will bring more this year.

 

I think Toffolli is different from what we had in Tatar in second year, but I think he can bring what we need too. I’m not waiting 30+ goals, but 25 goals per 82 games would be great.

 

Tatar… I liked what he did. Even when he didn’t score in the first round, he made good 200 foot impact. In the serious against Hurricanes only Jack was good imho. Anyway I don’t know why he wanted multi year deal. I believe Fitz offered something like he had, only for one year. He losted 2 may be even three millions. I would kill agent for mistake like this(I exaggerated) 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

52 minutes ago, Guadana said:

I think Toffolli is different from what we had in Tatar in second year, but I think he can bring what we need too. I’m not waiting 30+ goals, but 25 goals per 82 games would be great.

 

Tatar… I liked what he did. Even when he didn’t score in the first round, he made good 200 foot impact. In the serious against Hurricanes only Jack was good imho. Anyway I don’t know why he wanted multi year deal. I believe Fitz offered something like he had, only for one year. He losted 2 may be even three millions. I would kill agent for mistake like this(I exaggerated) 

Re:  Toffoli, I’m certainly not expecting him to repeat what he did last season…of course, I’m not really expecting Tatar to either.

Tatar and/or his agent definitely didn’t take into account that GMs usually do some homework…prior to last season, Tatar had put up 15 goals and 18 assists in 88 GP…and was also getting healthy-scratched at times (and of course was now in his 30s).  Not good…at the very least, not the kind of guy GMs look to sign to more than a year.

Sure, he was a very pleasant surprise, but no way would I expect another season like that.  Honestly I’m a bit surprised that Fitz even made him an offer…I would’ve just been happy that I’d gotten a good season out of Tatar in his walk year, and moved on.

I like that Toffoli’s pure production ceiling should be a good bit higher than Tatar’s.  I think Toffoli’s going to have a solid year…55-60 points, 25-30 goals. 

[Guadana]

4 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Re:  Toffoli, I’m certainly not expecting him to repeat what he did last season…of course, I’m not really expecting Tatar to either.

Tatar and/or his agent definitely didn’t take into account that GMs usually do some homework…prior to last season, Tatar had put up 15 goals and 18 assists in 88 GP…and was also getting healthy-scratched at times (and of course was now in his 30s).  Not good…at the very least, not the kind of guy GMs look to sign to more than a year.

Sure, he was a very pleasant surprise, but no way would I expect another season like that.  Honestly I’m a bit surprised that Fitz even made him an offer…I would’ve just been happy that I’d gotten a good season out of Tatar in his walk year, and moved on.

I like that Toffoli’s pure production ceiling should be a good bit higher than Tatar’s.  I think Toffoli’s going to have a solid year…55-60 points, 25-30 goals. 

Yeah, its absolutely harder to build the game like Tatar did last season with the age. It was surprise he actually did. I think he deserved one year on a good deal, his season game was great overall, he was very active positionally,  very active in forecheck, very low and strong on the boards. It is a perfect complimentary forechecker. But we don't have any guarantee it will going on. And its ok to give him one year for his level of production and intensity, there are no risks. But two years, especially after his ups and downs. His agent deserved his hire. Anyway I wish Tatar all the best on the west and cash on the next deal. One year deal most likely.

 

Toffoli is interesting case. I think he is one year story no matter how good he will be. Mostly. Luke, Mercer on the horizon. May be if Palat will be bad, they will try to hide or retain him. But now I'm talking about 300 miles away things. 

Edited September 29 by Guadana

[RunninWithTheDevil]

 

 

[Guadana]

 

[Puckbuster]

On 9/28/2023 at 10:48 AM, Devil Dan 56 said:

How cool is it to have players now hoping they play well enough to stay here?

That’s awesome!  The players are just like everyone else.  Yeah, they’re doing what they love and make a lot of money doing so, but there is a lot to be said about the culture of the organization.  I think Fitz, not only does right building a team that is competitive, but it seems as though the players are genuinely happy to play in New Jersey.  I think Fitz did a great job shedding the stigma of a Mickey Mouse organization that plays a boring defensive game.

The Devils are in a position to grow into a big market team.  If they can win a cup or two, preferably 3, over the next decade that’s another generation of fans that will grow up watching a dynasty.  One that is exciting, fun to watch and to be proud of.  What is more exciting about the team is, they are stacked with talented and likable players too!

Let’s go Devils!!!!!!

P.S.  I also think ownership has trust in Fitz and they are stepping back to allow him to run the team effectively.  I’m not sure if Shero had that luxury.  Looking back at the P.K. signing and all the promotion, it reeked  of ownership involvement, but that is pure speculation.

 

[nessus]

Nemec still with the team.

I'm glad Willman is signed. He deserved a contract, even if he will most likely be playing in the AHL for the whole season. Hatakka had a pretty good camp I thought. Thompson needs a huge season with Utica or else an NHL future isn't looking good for him.

 

EDIT: MD2020 beat me to it in the other thread

Edited October 7 by nessus

[RunninWithTheDevil]

ICYMI Shannon picked the Devils to win over the Stars

 

 

[Guadana]

17 hours ago, RunninWithTheDevil said:

ICYMI Shannon picked the Devils to win over the Stars

 

 

I think he is the best youtuber from nhl topics. He knows teams well, he knows their systems, what kind of narrative fans talks, what the actual shape is. Ofcourse he isn't on the level with some knowledgable youtubers from specific teams, but he is way better than most YouTube of their specific teams. He is very polite and accurate with what he is talking. And I like his personality. And the biggest price for being calm and smart, not being stupid like Biz, Whitney, Dangle or Wild - another big names.

[RizzMB30]

14 hours ago, Guadana said:

I think he is the best youtuber from nhl topics. He knows teams well, he knows their systems, what kind of narrative fans talks, what the actual shape is. Ofcourse he isn't on the level with some knowledgable youtubers from specific teams, but he is way better than most YouTube of their specific teams. He is very polite and accurate with what he is talking. And I like his personality. And the biggest price for being calm and smart, not being stupid like Biz, Whitney, Dangle or Wild - another big names.

Agreed. His Devils takes are well-measured and come off as unbiased.