Patrice Cormier Elbow

[Derek21]

Your right, Cormier caught Tam with an elbow and Pronger caught Datsyuk with a shoulder. The hitting motion is identical though. Another one with Stevens.

1:18

Stevens' was much cleaner. Don't forget that in each instance, the victim had to deal with a backchecker. That's how a lot of these hits happen. Because they don't see it coming. Watch the Elias hit again. He had to deal with Duchene and never had time to notice Wilson, who just lined him up. In comparison, Cormier's hits are far worse. The blow to Tam was dangerous because it was more elbow. You could at least argue that he had the puck. The Rodin hit was a blatant cheapshot from behind as Cormier was changing. Brutal. Here's a cleaner one from Patrice on Kulikov last year:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wye1w1EON1w

Nothing wrong with that as he had puck and Cormier finishes him. Also for interest which might be posted already was Patrick Roy's take. He coaches the Quebec Remparts and was on the bench for the Tam blow which sent him into convulsions. This is a good video as Roy discusses these kind of hits and what must happen. There's also a package of other Cormier hits. Plus Patrick had an interesting comment at 1:35.

Patrick Roy Discusses Cormier

Edited January 20, 2010 by Derek21

[Jimmy Leeds]

My $.02 is he should be criminally charged and open to a civil lawsuit.

This guy better clean it up when he gets back on the ice.

How many Devs will even want to play with him?

It'll just open up Parise and Zajac to vicious hits.

[jim777]

Another take

http://www.tsn.ca/columnists/bob_mckenzie/?id=306895

[Amberite]

My $.02 is he should be criminally charged and open to a civil lawsuit.

This guy better clean it up when he gets back on the ice.

How many Devs will even want to play with him?

It'll just open up Parise and Zajac to vicious hits.

[PaDevsFan]

No, that one is an elbow. Please show me the second elbow at the WJC. Cormier isn't known as a fighter but he has fought his fair share of times. Usually a coach will tell his #1 center not to fight. I agree he deserves a suspension but to say he intended to elbow Tam the whole time, I just don't buy it.

Triumph, its a fast sport. I used to throw quite a few hits and to time it is a skill and I agree, if you go for that sort of hit make damn sure you connect with your shoulder and not your arm.

Im sorry that was was just ridiculous. And again let me say I am all for Devils having a toughness to them, but this crap is just not called for and there is no place for it. Yeah it is a fast sport, yeah you have to time your hits, and with the Tam hit you could almost argue he mis timed it although he was making a bee line for him, but with this one? Even though the damage wasnt nearly as severe, the intent was there to injure, he was skating slowly towards the bench and pops his elbow out to the guys chin, PUSS move and a cowardly move. I will say this, my son played tier 1 and was a very physical player, loved to throw the body around, but if there is one thing I always told him was to hit hard but clean, this kid just thinks he can get away with it. And for someone to think that it wont affect other Devils players?? Sorry but that is just the nature of the game, if this guy is taking cheap shots you can rest assured Parise or Elias or someone is going to get one and it would not be good. I really hope Lou can get through to this kid, and if not Lou maybe Scotty Stevens can, but he needs some sort serious maturing before he could ever wear a Devils Uniform!!

Edited January 20, 2010 by PaDevsFan

[ThreeCups]

Im sorry that was was just ridiculous. And again let me say I am all for Devils having a toughness to them, but this crap is just not called for and there is no place for it. Yeah it is a fast sport, yeah you have to time your hits, and with the Tam hit you could almost argue he mis timed it although he was making a bee line for him, but with this one? Even though the damage wasnt nearly as severe, the intent was there to injure, he was skating slowly towards the bench and pops his elbow out to the guys chin, PUSS move and a cowardly move. I will say this, my son played tier 1 and was a very physical player, loved to throw the body around, but if there is one thing I always told him was to hit hard but clean, this kid just thinks he can get away with it. And for someone to think that it wont affect other Devils players?? Sorry but that is just the nature of the game, if this guy is taking cheap shots you can rest assured Parise or Elias or someone is going to get one and it would not be good. I really hope Lou can get through to this kid, and if not Lou maybe Scotty Stevens can, but he needs some sort serious maturing before he could ever wear a Devils Uniform!!

I am sure some time on the ice with Scotty would set anyone straight.

[Revan]

The guy is a piece of sh!t for what he's done... sorry, for what he's been doing. Downplaying the whole thing and saying there is no problem and the guy will mature is just ridiculous. The thing is, this isn't the first time. He had dirty hits in the past and he doesn't stop. I can't see how you might think the guy is going to start playing fair just because of getting called up to the NHL. Just like someone else in this thread said: did Tie Domi or Chris Simon learn? Hell no. There were and still are lost of cheap-shot artists in the NHL, so at this point there is no reason to think Cormier will change to meet the higher standards.

Calm down. Was it a disgusting elbow? Yes. Should he get suspended? Yes and for a long time. Should we jump the gun and say Cormier is a dirty player who will play like this in the NHL? No. Scott Niedermayer clocked Peter Worrell in the head with his stick. Indefensible and a disgusting play. Would you say Niedermayer should have gotten traded right after? Of course not.

Come on, Nieds was almost 30 and it was his first incident, I believe. Plus, it was, like they say, "in the heat of the moment", he wasn't the one that started. It was awful, but it wasn't something that could in any way define Niedermayer.

Patrice is a different story. This isn't the first time and he clearly has issues. Plus, it's not like he got pissed and punished the guy in retaliation - it was completely brainless. He doesn't give a fvck about other players' health, or the rules. It will be extremely hard to set him straight and we can only hope the media kicking the sh!t out of him plus getting suspended for a long time provide a shock therapy for the guy. But then again, Chris Simon faced some serious suspensions, too...

There's even no discussion about the hit. There are situations where you might be able to make an excuse for the villain, tell it wasn't intentional. Not in this case. I don't want this kind of sh!t in New Jersey. And you bet your ass he would get ripped into ferociously had he been a Rangers/Flyers prospect. The only post-lockout dirty Devils incident I recall was Janssen on Kaberle a few years ago, so we are fortunate and we don't get to see our players act like classless a$$holes. So it's easier for us to bash other teams' players for bad actions. This time it's one of our potential players being a dick and we should act like grown men and admit he is scum. We usually associate this kind of act with Philly and now when it comes to our team, I say don't be a bunch of hypocrites. Saying you are excited to see this guy coming to Jersey after seeing this hit means there is something seriously wrong with you.

Edited January 20, 2010 by Revan

[PaDevsFan]

The guy is a piece of sh!t for what he's done... sorry, for what he's been doing. Downplaying the whole thing and saying there is no problem and the guy will mature is just ridiculous. The thing is, this isn't the first time. He had dirty hits in the past and he doesn't stop. I can't see how you might think the guy is going to start playing fair just because of getting called up to the NHL. Just like someone else in this thread said: did Tie Domi or Chris Simon learn? Hell no. There were and still are lost of cheap-shot artists in the NHL, so at this point there is no reason to think Cormier will change to meet the higher standards.

Come on, Nieds was almost 30 and it was his first incident, I believe. Plus, it was, like they say, "in the heat of the moment", he wasn't the one that started. It was awful, but it wasn't something that could in any way define Niedermayer.

Patrice is a different story. This isn't the first time and he clearly has issues. Plus, it's not like he got pissed and punished the guy in retaliation - it was completely brainless. He doesn't give a fvck about other players' health, or the rules. It will be extremely hard to set him straight and we can only hope the media kicking the sh!t out of him plus getting suspended for a long time provide a shock therapy for the guy. But then again, Chris Simon faced some serious suspensions, too...

There's even no discussion about the hit. There are situations where you might be able to make an excuse for the villain, tell it wasn't intentional. Not in this case. I don't want this kind of sh!t in New Jersey. And you bet your ass he would get ripped into ferociously had he been a Rangers/Flyers prospect. The only post-lockout dirty Devils incident I recall was Janssen on Kaberle a few years ago, so we are fortunate and we don't get to see our players act like classless a$$holes. So it's easier for us to bash other teams' players for bad actions. This time it's one of our potential players being a dick and we should act like grown men and admit he is scum. We usually associate this kind of act with Philly and now when it comes to our team, I say don't be a bunch of hypocrites. Saying you are excited to see this guy coming to Jersey after seeing this hit means there is something seriously wrong with you.

And I said the exact same thing yesterday. Did those guys learn?? that was my poijnt, I hope someone can teach him, but seeing this as a pattern I certainly have my doubts. My main point here is, I want the Devils to continue to be a classy top notch organization, not one with a cheap shot artist that is certainly appearing to be trying to hurt somebody!

[devlman]

The guy is a piece of sh!t for what he's done... sorry, for what he's been doing. Downplaying the whole thing and saying there is no problem and the guy will mature is just ridiculous. The thing is, this isn't the first time. He had dirty hits in the past and he doesn't stop. I can't see how you might think the guy is going to start playing fair just because of getting called up to the NHL. Just like someone else in this thread said: did Tie Domi or Chris Simon learn? Hell no. There were and still are lost of cheap-shot artists in the NHL, so at this point there is no reason to think Cormier will change to meet the higher standards.

Come on, Nieds was almost 30 and it was his first incident, I believe. Plus, it was, like they say, "in the heat of the moment", he wasn't the one that started. It was awful, but it wasn't something that could in any way define Niedermayer.

Patrice is a different story. This isn't the first time and he clearly has issues. Plus, it's not like he got pissed and punished the guy in retaliation - it was completely brainless. He doesn't give a fvck about other players' health, or the rules. It will be extremely hard to set him straight and we can only hope the media kicking the sh!t out of him plus getting suspended for a long time provide a shock therapy for the guy. But then again, Chris Simon faced some serious suspensions, too...

There's even no discussion about the hit. There are situations where you might be able to make an excuse for the villain, tell it wasn't intentional. Not in this case. I don't want this kind of sh!t in New Jersey. And you bet your ass he would get ripped into ferociously had he been a Rangers/Flyers prospect. The only post-lockout dirty Devils incident I recall was Janssen on Kaberle a few years ago, so we are fortunate and we don't get to see our players act like classless a$$holes. So it's easier for us to bash other teams' players for bad actions. This time it's one of our potential players being a dick and we should act like grown men and admit he is scum. We usually associate this kind of act with Philly and now when it comes to our team, I say don't be a bunch of hypocrites. Saying you are excited to see this guy coming to Jersey after seeing this hit means there is something seriously wrong with you.

+1

[pattyelias]

I wasn't making an excuse for Cormier. He's definitely earned his dirty rep. I'm just hoping he can clean his act up and become and effective NHLer for the Devils. If he continues to show that he's a gutless puke then au revoir.

[Jimmy Leeds]

Well thought out

[mouse]

I think we should judge the actions more than the player. Yes, he fvkced up royally, and not only do I hope he's suspended for the year in juniors, I'll be pissed at Lou (which I never am) if he plays for Lowell at the end of the year. That said, he's young and emotional. That doesn't justify his actions, but he MIGHT still mature. If he turns into another Simon or Domi when he gets to the NHL, with us or with someone else, then we can turn on him completely, but I think he deserves a chance to prove he's not a bad guy. I'm not saying he doesn't have a lot of work to do before I respect him, but let's not completely cut the kid loose either. There's no way that helps anyone.

[yankeesjetsfan]

Saw the video during the game tonight. You can plainly see Cormier zeroing in on his head. Very dirty. Also heard Roy wants criminal charges bought but, but Fischler thinks Roy is doing that for publicity.

[iamtheprodigy]

The guy is a piece of sh!t for what he's done... sorry, for what he's been doing. Downplaying the whole thing and saying there is no problem and the guy will mature is just ridiculous. The thing is, this isn't the first time. He had dirty hits in the past and he doesn't stop. I can't see how you might think the guy is going to start playing fair just because of getting called up to the NHL. Just like someone else in this thread said: did Tie Domi or Chris Simon learn? Hell no. There were and still are lost of cheap-shot artists in the NHL, so at this point there is no reason to think Cormier will change to meet the higher standards.

Cormier is like Simon or Domi? What a joke. Cormier isn't just some goon. He's a high draft pick with offensive talent and leadership skills. He's a guy that wants to finish all his checks and stuck out his arm in a natural human reaction to the guy jumping out of the way. It was stupid, and unfortunate, and he should be suspended, but it wasn't like he planned it. Why would he want to intentionally elbow this random guy for no reason? And don't just say "He's done it before, durr", because the WJC elbow was completely different - that was in a very chippy, dirty game with players taking shots back and forth on both sides. Cormier elbowed the guy to send a message that his team wasn't going to be cheapshotted without payback. That was dirty, but it wasn't for no reason. Plus, it wasn't vicious and at a high speed, it was more of a shot on the way to the bench. Anyway, unless there's some backstory between Cormier and Tam that nobody knows about, there's no reason for him to do this on purpose, and it's nothing at all like his elbow at the WJC, which was done to stand up for his team and send a message. People are just trying to stir up more controversy and turn Cormier into an evil villain when there's no real evidence to support that this was planned attack. The hit wasn't premeditated, it was reckless - he wanted to cream the guy and in reaction to him dodging at the last split second he threw an arm out.

Has he ever swung his stick at an opponent's face? Has he ever pulled a fan over the boards and tried to beat the crap out of them? No? Then he's NOTHING like Simon or Domi. Don't act like you know everything about this player and that he'll never mature. You don't know that, nobody does. All you know is what you've seen in Youtube clips of him, which show one or two bad hits he's made out of the hundreds or thousands he's made in his career. It's idiotic to take a couple of bad hits he's made out of context and turn him into some supervillain who needs to be banned from hockey.

[Swede]

Cormier is like Simon or Domi? What a joke. Cormier isn't just some goon. He's a high draft pick with offensive talent and leadership skills. He's a guy that wants to finish all his checks and stuck out his arm in a natural human reaction to the guy jumping out of the way. It was stupid, and unfortunate, and he should be suspended, but it wasn't like he planned it. Why would he want to intentionally elbow this random guy for no reason? And don't just say "He's done it before, durr", because the WJC elbow was completely different - that was in a very chippy, dirty game with players taking shots back and forth on both sides. Cormier elbowed the guy to send a message that his team wasn't going to be cheapshotted without payback. That was dirty, but it wasn't for no reason. Plus, it wasn't vicious and at a high speed, it was more of a shot on the way to the bench. Anyway, unless there's some backstory between Cormier and Tam that nobody knows about, there's no reason for him to do this on purpose, and it's nothing at all like his elbow at the WJC, which was done to stand up for his team and send a message. People are just trying to stir up more controversy and turn Cormier into an evil villain when there's no real evidence to support that this was planned attack. The hit wasn't premeditated, it was reckless - he wanted to cream the guy and in reaction to him dodging at the last split second he threw an arm out.

Has he ever swung his stick at an opponent's face? Has he ever pulled a fan over the boards and tried to beat the crap out of them? No? Then he's NOTHING like Simon or Domi. Don't act like you know everything about this player and that he'll never mature. You don't know that, nobody does. All you know is what you've seen in Youtube clips of him, which show one or two bad hits he's made out of the hundreds or thousands he's made in his career. It's idiotic to take a couple of bad hits he's made out of context and turn him into some supervillain who needs to be banned from hockey.

mrs cormier, is that you?

[titans04]

mrs cormier, is that you?

Could be or just a guy that fails to see any wrong about anything red and black. Maybe it's brother Kevin, since being given his two year deal in the off-season he's been MIA neither in Trenton or Lowell. Second year in a row he's on hiatus in the middle of the season. Coming in Kevin was supposed to be the undisciplined one or sometimes crossed the line. He's not half as talented as Patrice but apparently he's a hell of a lot smarter.

Maybe the best koolaid line yet - "He's a guy that wants to finish all his checks and stuck out his arm in a natural human reaction to the guy jumping out of the way"

Cormier isn't much of a fighter like Domi or Simon those guys had no problem answering the bell back in the day.

[Amberite]

It's really sickening how many of you are completely throwing this guy under the bus and writing him off as a hopeless goon for the rest of his life because of a few dirty plays when he's *19*. There is no doubt about it that this elbow was as dirty as it gets. But if Tam simply lost a few teeth and got back up instead of getting the injury he did, this would be a 1 page thread with a few comments of "he needs to calm down and clean up by the time he's here." What happened to Tam is absolutely terrible and I feel extremely bad for him and his family, but lets face it - it was a freak injury. 99 times out of 100 that elbow does not cause that to happen.

The guy needs to clean up, absolutely. But from some of the comments you see on this thread, you'd think Cormier tried to stab someone with a knife outside a bar while simultaneously belligerently beating his girlfriend to death. He's young, he plays dirty, he got involved in a very unfortunate situation because of a bad decision on his part, but it's not the end of the world.

[PaDevsFan]

Cormier is like Simon or Domi? What a joke. Cormier isn't just some goon. He's a high draft pick with offensive talent and leadership skills. He's a guy that wants to finish all his checks and stuck out his arm in a natural human reaction to the guy jumping out of the way. It was stupid, and unfortunate, and he should be suspended, but it wasn't like he planned it. Why would he want to intentionally elbow this random guy for no reason? And don't just say "He's done it before, durr", because the WJC elbow was completely different - that was in a very chippy, dirty game with players taking shots back and forth on both sides. Cormier elbowed the guy to send a message that his team wasn't going to be cheapshotted without payback. That was dirty, but it wasn't for no reason. Plus, it wasn't vicious and at a high speed, it was more of a shot on the way to the bench. Anyway, unless there's some backstory between Cormier and Tam that nobody knows about, there's no reason for him to do this on purpose, and it's nothing at all like his elbow at the WJC, which was done to stand up for his team and send a message. People are just trying to stir up more controversy and turn Cormier into an evil villain when there's no real evidence to support that this was planned attack. The hit wasn't premeditated, it was reckless - he wanted to cream the guy and in reaction to him dodging at the last split second he threw an arm out.

Has he ever swung his stick at an opponent's face? Has he ever pulled a fan over the boards and tried to beat the crap out of them? No? Then he's NOTHING like Simon or Domi. Don't act like you know everything about this player and that he'll never mature. You don't know that, nobody does. All you know is what you've seen in Youtube clips of him, which show one or two bad hits he's made out of the hundreds or thousands he's made in his career. It's idiotic to take a couple of bad hits he's made out of context and turn him into some supervillain who needs to be banned from hockey.

My original post said Bertuzzi HUnter Domi Simon, so yes he has skill unlike Simon or Domi but he could certainly be catagorized as another Bertuzzi or Hunter, unless he straightens out. PLease take off the blinders and see this kid for what he is. And please "stuck out is arm in a natural human reaction"?????? Is that what he did to the Swede player as he was going to the bench as well?????? Dude give it a rest and try to understand what you are watching before you make ridiculous comments.

Edited January 21, 2010 by PaDevsFan

[Devil Dan 56]

It's really sickening how many of you are completely throwing this guy under the bus and writing him off as a hopeless goon for the rest of his life because of a few dirty plays when he's *19*. There is no doubt about it that this elbow was as dirty as it gets. But if Tam simply lost a few teeth and got back up instead of getting the injury he did, this would be a 1 page thread with a few comments of "he needs to calm down and clean up by the time he's here." What happened to Tam is absolutely terrible and I feel extremely bad for him and his family, but lets face it - it was a freak injury. 99 times out of 100 that elbow does not cause that to happen.

The guy needs to clean up, absolutely. But from some of the comments you see on this thread, you'd think Cormier tried to stab someone with a knife outside a bar while simultaneously belligerently beating his girlfriend to death. He's young, he plays dirty, he got involved in a very unfortunate situation because of a bad decision on his part, but it's not the end of the world.

This. What he did was wrong and very dirty. He messed up big time. No question about it and he will get a lengthy suspension. But when he returns, (possibly in Lowell), he will be given a chance to prove he isn't just some dirty player. We saw him in the pre-season for a couple of games, and I don't recall him being like Chris Simon or Tie Domi in anyway.

[iamtheprodigy]

@Everyone who apparently thinks my opinion is a total joke, I was going to post a long response but it's not worth it, instead, I will post a comment by TG that basically sums up my opinion perfectly:

"Here, to me, is the crux of the matter:

Did Cormier go out there with the

[ZeroGravityFat]

sign him and unleash him on lundqvist, let's see how that feels on the flip side.

[Marshall]

You think Lou is going to comment? I saw this on NHL Live and yelped.. and they didn't even show the convulsions.

He already has.

[mrthemike]

That was a pathetic and cowardly play. Any of you defending these need to wake up. Throwing elbows and almost murdering people is not how hockey should be played.

[PaDevsFan]

@Everyone who apparently thinks my opinion is a total joke, I was going to post a long response but it's not worth it, instead, I will post a comment by TG that basically sums up my opinion perfectly:

"Here, to me, is the crux of the matter:

Did Cormier go out there with the the intent to injure and intent to elbow Tam in the head?

Or did Cormier go out there to hit Tam legally, Tam pulled up a little and dumped the puck in, and Cormier wrongly stuck out his elbow in reaction because he was going to mostly whiff on his hit?

I think the second is a closer to the truth than the first.

That doesnt mean he doesnt deserve a lengthy suspension. That doesnt mean what he did wasnt wrong.

But, it also doesnt mean the kid is the complete thug some are portraying him as."

This is what I was trying to say before. People seem to have misinterpreted me. My stance is that he did not go out to injure the guy but stuck out an elbow at the last second as a reaction. That's still bad, and he deserves punishment, but it's very different than going up to a guy nowhere near the play and elbowing him to the face, like Domi did. That was obvious intent to injure. This hit isn't.

I am curious in the Video against the Swede player was the Swede player anywhere near the play? And did Cormier stick his elbow out and elbow the kid in the face? The answers are pretty clear, no he wasnt near the play as Cormier was headed to the bench, and yes he stuck the elbow out and struck the kid in the face, so PLEASE EXPLAIN HOW IT IS DIFFERENT THAN DOMI??? If the Tam thing had been a 1 time incident I could see your point about well he didnt want to "whiff" on the hit, but he has done this more than 1 time. Like I have said I just hope that he does not bring "this type of play" to the Devils!!!

Edited January 22, 2010 by PaDevsFan

[devilsfan26]

That was a pathetic and cowardly play. Any of you defending these need to wake up. Throwing elbows and almost murdering people is not how hockey should be played.

Who is defending it?