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GDT: Devils @ Rangers


Joonas #6

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I mean they're being shut-out by fvcking Mike Smith. You don't deserve to make it if you sh!t the bed like this at home in a win and in scenario. fvck this sh!t, I'm gonna watch our boy Merril in the Frozen Four championship game.

If you want to watch good hockey, this is it. Minn-Duluth up by 1, but both teams playing with passion.

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Forget about the fans. Playing your closest rival and not going in from player 1-20 with the mindset of "we're going home, so are they" is unacceptable. It says alot about a team. It's hard to match the instensity of desparation of the Rangers, but that does not mean you show up for a period and then play out the game. Having your goaltender stop a few softies helps too.

Kovalchuk showed me alot today.

Let's be honest, there's a reason they're going to the playoffs and we're not. They're the grittier team to begin with. Not to mention healthier, hard to expect this team to be the machine it was for two months when it's missing its two best defensemenen, another good role player and decides to put Parise in mothballs. Especially when they were winning most of those games in two months by the skin of their teeth.

And yes Marty had a crap game, I hate seeing those overall numbers against the Rangers cause they remind me of what used to be. Marty was always as good against the Rangers as he was against Montreal until the lockout, since then not so much. Always seems to give up the crusher soft goals against them.

fvck this season already. I swear, if we rooted for the sky to be blue, it would turn green and purple.

Basically this sums it up nicely. This season can't end soon enough. This team could have gotten a standing ovation tomorrow with a big last two periods today, instead they'll probably get booed and rightly so. Ultimately they underachieved more than they came to play and deserve to go out with a losing record.

Edited by NJDevs4978
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And **** Carolina too, I don't want to ever hear again how they're the grittiest team in the game. To get manhandled at home against a team with zero to play for is just inexcusable. Why couldn't they have thrown up a clunker like that against us? :rant:

Oh well if there's one other team I'm glad would be crashing and burning like that in the clutch it's them. I'm just really worried about Rangers-Caps though, they own the Caps this year and should have beat them two years ago if Torts and Avery didn't go bat**** nuts.

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Let's be honest, there's a reason they're going to the playoffs and we're not. They're the grittier team to begin with. Not to mention healthier, hard to expect this team to be the machine it was for two months when it's missing its two best defensemenen, another good role player and decides to put Parise in mothballs. Especially when they were winning most of those games in two months by the skin of their teeth.

The shootout is one reason for sure they're going.

They're also a better fundamental team. It's funny, no one brings up how bad the Devils have been at fundamental hockey for a few seasons now. That seems to get lost. Clearing their own zone, bad passing as I don't think they can make two clean crisp passes in row. Line changes, which bit them today, are basic fundamentals and on the road especially.

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And **** Carolina too, I don't want to ever hear again how they're the grittiest team in the game. To get manhandled at home against a team with zero to play for is just inexcusable. Why couldn't they have thrown up a clunker like that against us? :rant:

Oh well if there's one other team I'm glad would be crashing and burning like that in the clutch it's them. I'm just really worried about Rangers-Caps though, they own the Caps this year and should have beat them two years ago if Torts and Avery didn't go bat**** nuts.

Yeah, no doubt- fvck them, although if there's a bright side to all this, its that Carolina sh!t the bed in a big spot. Its too bad its the Rangers that are the beneficiaries though, or else I'd really be enjoying this.

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The shootout is one reason for sure they're going.

They're also a better fundamental team. It's funny, no one brings up how bad the Devils have been at fundamental hockey for a few seasons now. That seems to get lost. Clearing their own zone, bad passing as I don't think they can make two clean crisp passes in row. Line changes, which bit them today, are basic fundamentals and on the road especially.

The Devils are a much better team than the Rangers - I'll exclude this year, for obvious reasons, but the Devils were better in 2010, and they will be better in 2011-12. The Rangers are not a very good team. I have no clue why you are obsessed with talking up the Rangers here, or what you see in them. They could go deep in the playoffs - any team can win - but they're an average NHL team.

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The Devils are a much better team than the Rangers - I'll exclude this year, for obvious reasons, but the Devils were better in 2010, and they will be better in 2011-12. The Rangers are not a very good team. I have no clue why you are obsessed with talking up the Rangers here, or what you see in them. They could go deep in the playoffs - any team can win - but they're an average NHL team.

Agreed. Ever since the lockout we have had way too many "woe is me, the Devils are awful, the Rangers are great" posts on here. The Rangers haven't accomplished bo diddly since the lockout, and we haven't won the Cup obviously but we have won the division two-thirds of the time. People need to get a grip and stop being so overdramatic.

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The Devils are a much better team than the Rangers - I'll exclude this year, for obvious reasons, but the Devils were better in 2010, and they will be better in 2011-12. The Rangers are not a very good team. I have no clue why you are obsessed with talking up the Rangers here, or what you see in them. They could go deep in the playoffs - any team can win - but they're an average NHL team.

Just like i have no idea how you see the Devils defense as "one of the best in the league" or "the best".

You can't possibly believe that and no amount of Sabermetric mumbo-jumbo can put that D-corps in the top or near the top of the league. You'd get laughed out of any serious discussion outside of this board. As a matter of fact, i'd challenge you to do so. Lemaire "fixed" the defense by having the forwards take the burden off of them because he did not overrate them as Maclean did. They are also not a unit that's going to add a whole lot offensively, something that is often lost around here.

But to answer your question, i am not "obsessed", i hate them as much as the next person, but i am merely stating what i see when i watch them without consulting mathematical formulas. If that team doesn't scare you for a potential upset, especially since Washington has next to no grit, you really should put the calculator down. Losing Callahan might have saved Washington's ass in the end.

Which brings me to why you have this staunch approach that the Devils are going to be a night and day different team next season provided they dress pretty much the same roster and return Lemaire as coach. There's no FA coming this summer of any impact. While i think the flaws this team has is correctible without tearing it apart, i do not have the confidence this is more then a 7th-8th seed provided what happens to teams in the conference this off season. You seem to have fell victim to the "Streak" and are trying to project numbers from it into a full season. You keep putting DinLA down for his Lemaire commentary, but he's got good points and valid concerns about it.

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Just like i have no idea how you see the Devils defense as "one of the best in the league" or "the best".

You can't possibly believe that and no amount of Sabermetric mumbo-jumbo can put that D-corps in the top or near the top of the league. You'd get laughed out of any serious discussion outside of this board. As a matter of fact, i'd challenge you to do so. Lemaire "fixed" the defense by having the forwards take the burden off of them because he did not overrate them as Maclean did. They are also not a unit that's going to add a whole lot offensively, something that is often lost around here.

Boy, I'd hate to get laughed out of that 'serious discussion'. I bet there'd be a lot of talk about who the best puck moving defenseman is.

Anyway, like I explained in the same thread where I got called out, the Devils D personnel is not the best in the league. The Devils D personnel, when coupled with the forwards, is one of the best, if not the best total defense in the league. The Devils don't take penalties. They're again last in the league in minor penalties, and by a reasonably healthy margin. Furthermore, they allow the least number of shots both at even strength and on the penalty kill. Only injuries or poor goaltending will keep them from being a top 10 defense, and they should probably be in the top 5.

But to answer your question, i am not "obsessed", i hate them as much as the next person, but i am merely stating what i see when i watch them without consulting mathematical formulas. If that team doesn't scare you for a potential upset, especially since Washington has next to no grit, you really should put the calculator down. Losing Callahan might have saved Washington's ass in the end.

You make an inordinate number of posts defending the Rangers.

Washington has plenty of grit. The Rangers are what, 3 to 2 dogs, maybe? Yeah, so the Rangers can win this one - like I said, anyone can win - but Washington is an exceptionally skilled team, and the Rangers just don't have the kind of players that match up with that skill. They have Staal, and that, with Callahan down, is it.

Which brings me to why you have this staunch approach that the Devils are going to be a night and day different team next season provided they dress pretty much the same roster and return Lemaire as coach.

No one said they would be night and day. For one, they'll be dressing Parise, which already makes it not 'pretty much the same roster' - that's adding a top 20 forward in the game right on to the team. That's a bigger addition than probably anyone else in the Eastern Conference will make. Parise is probably worth 5 wins a year, he's that good. He draws a ton of penalties, moves the play in the right direction, and scores a lot of goals, and he's excellent in the shootout. All I said was that they will be a top defense, and they probably won't be worst in the league at offense. They could even be a dominant team at even strength - that depends on how much better Tedenby and Josefson get, as well as whether Elias (and to a lesser degree Rolston) can sustain what they've been doing.

There's no FA coming this summer of any impact. While i think the flaws this team has is correctible without tearing it apart, i do not have the confidence this is more then a 7th-8th seed provided what happens to teams in the conference this off season. You seem to have fell victim to the "Streak" and are trying to project numbers from it into a full season. You keep putting DinLA down for his Lemaire commentary, but he's got good points and valid concerns about it.

I have not fallen victim to the 'Streak'. The things I try to examine go beyond 'streaks' - streaks are what fool people. I'm looking at the numbers underlying the streak - were the Devils lucky during that streak, and how much of that streak is good fortune (or grit/determination/wanting it more/whatever you'd like to call it)? Those numbers tell me NJ's a damn fine team, even without Parise. NJ's full season numbers tell me NJ's a damn fine team, even without Parise.

Edited by Triumph
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Which brings me to why you have this staunch approach that the Devils are going to be a night and day different team next season provided they dress pretty much the same roster and return Lemaire as coach. There's no FA coming this summer of any impact. While i think the flaws this team has is correctible without tearing it apart, i do not have the confidence this is more then a 7th-8th seed provided what happens to teams in the conference this off season. You seem to have fell victim to the "Streak" and are trying to project numbers from it into a full season. You keep putting DinLA down for his Lemaire commentary, but he's got good points and valid concerns about it.

You're wrong. We're going to get the best FA in the NHL this summer - Zach Parise. Everyone seems to have forgotten about how good he is. That addition alone makes a big difference. Add on the further development of Tedenby, Josefson, etc., and reasonable luck in the injury department, and this is easily a solid playoff team next year. The only way I see us struggling to make it in is if we run into serious injury problems.

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Boy, I'd hate to get laughed out of that 'serious discussion'. I bet there'd be a lot of talk about who the best puck moving defenseman is.

Ah, still think a PMD is not a commodity, huh?

Anyway, like I explained in the same thread where I got called out, the Devils D is not the best in the league. The Devils D, when coupled with the forwards, is one of the best, if not the best D in the league. The Devils don't take penalties. They're again last in the league in minor penalties, and by a reasonably healthy margin. Furthermore, they allow the least number of shots both at even strength and on the penalty kill. Only injuries or poor goaltending will keep them from being a top 10 defense, and they should probably be in the top 5.

That's the problem. It relies on the forwards which is why this team has the scoring problems it does and why they can not be rated as a top D corps. They are not well rounded enough to be one. Zajac might have been damn well a 3rd defenseman on the ice. Same with Elias. It's one thing to have forwards being defensively repsonsible, but it's another to see #19 and #26 in better position to defend and make plays then the actual defensemen.

Don't be fooled by statistics all the time. While stats can be influenced by smoke and mirror play such as with this corps, this is not a top seed/Stanley Cup contending group.

This team with the offensive players it has, needs the defense to support them. The game moves forward, not backwards and when your forwards are starting from their own zone all the time it's a disadvantage. If this continues next season as was this season, they'll have the same scoring problems and they'll be playing alot of 2-1 games which has been brought up as a concern about fatigue and burnout over a course of a full season.

You make an inordinate number of posts defending the Rangers.

Because i am not on here going "THE RANGERS SUCK AVERY'S GAY DICK LOLZ" or something of that extent. I call it as i see them play and i think there are a terrible amount of folks who think they pose no threat, much like the Flyers were deemed harmless last year because they were the Flyers and they automatically "suck".

Washington has plenty of grit. The Rangers are what, 3 to 2 dogs, maybe? Yeah, so the Rangers can win this one - like I said, anyone can win - but Washington is an exceptionally skilled team, and the Rangers just don't have the kind of players that match up with that skill. They have Staal, and that, with Callahan down, is it.

They do? Matt Bradley? Jason Chimera? I wouldn't exactly be looking over my shoulder going into the corner against that team. Whatever they have better come to play.

The Rangers scored more goals then Washington this season, but Semin and Green both missed various time so that's probably 25 goals missing easy.

Washington might be more skilled on paper, but it better show up.

No one said they would be night and day. For one, they'll be dressing Parise, which already makes it not 'pretty much the same roster' - that's adding a top 20 forward in the game right on to the team. That's a bigger addition than probably anyone else in the Eastern Conference will make. Parise is probably worth 5 wins a year, he's that good. He draws a ton of penalties, moves the play in the right direction, and scores a lot of goals, and he's excellent in the shootout. All I said was that they will be a top defense, and they probably won't be worst in the league at offense. They could even be a dominant team at even strength - that depends on how much better Tedenby and Josefson get, as well as whether Elias (and to a lesser degree Rolston) can sustain what they've been doing.

While i do not argue Parise's value to the team in terms of skill and what impact he has, he'd be even better if he had help from a D corps that can move the puck. So would Kovalchuk and any skilled forwards who can get a lead into the zone and support from the point. Even if Parise is worth 5 wins, they still miss this year. I'm not convinced this is going to be a team that undergoes a reversal of goal scoring problems until they fix some other issues which include passing, crashing the net and getting help from the D. Playing 3 periods often helps too.

I have not fallen victim to the 'Streak'. The things I try to examine go beyond 'streaks' - streaks are what fool people. I'm looking at the numbers underlying the streak - were the Devils lucky during that streak, and how much of that streak is good fortune (or grit/determination/wanting it more/whatever you'd like to call it)? Those numbers tell me NJ's a damn fine team, even without Parise. NJ's full season numbers tell me NJ's a damn fine team, even without Parise.

They are somewhere between the two Devils teams that showed up this season. Which one is open to debate.

Edited by SJP20
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You're wrong. We're going to get the best FA in the NHL this summer - Zach Parise. Everyone seems to have forgotten about how good he is. That addition alone makes a big difference. Add on the further development of Tedenby, Josefson, etc., and reasonable luck in the injury department, and this is easily a solid playoff team next year. The only way I see us struggling to make it in is if we run into serious injury problems.

There's alot of if's. Then again, that's every team.

The Devils didn't miss the Playoffs this year mainly due to the loss of Parise. They were the worst team in the league with him (he was playing injured though) and even if he counts for 5 extra wins, they still don't make it this year.

No team is injury free and the Devils have been extremely unlucky in recent years.

To count on those kids developing and not regressing in a full season and avoiding a sophmore jinx is always risky with any young players who aren't God-gifted superstar/can't miss talents. Tedenby concerns me more due to his size, not skill. Josefson is a smart player, a quick learner, i think he'll be ok, but i think he's another season after next from making an impact.

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