Voros19 Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 Alex Suglobov doesn't look to have much potential to be a 30 goal scorer and the Devils aren't going to wait around for it to happen unless he can hang out on a 4th line for a while. Brian Gionta was on the 4th line - he moved to the 3rd line, then to the 2nd line, then to the first. Patrik Elias had a similar ascent. Suglobov probably won't. Your 30 goal scorers have to be able to do something else. What do you base that statement off of? And I don't buy people saying all Suggy can do is play O. As long he doesn't have a mental breakdown and skate around endlessly with the puck, I think he is fairly responsible. He has added a little physicality to his game since 04-05 and I don't think he is as bad on D as everyone says he is. He has been doing it pretty much all by himself in Albany and is exactly what this time needs on the second line: Someone with jump, who plays a firey game, and can put the puck in the net. Triumph, Gomez seems to have survived so far with the Devils. He's won two cups with them. His defense isn't anything to sneeze at. And I also have a problem with you comparing Suglobov and Afinogenov. It seems that just because they are each Russian, and were highly touted snipers, they are directly analogous and will suffer the same fate. That argument holds absolutely no weight, and is debunked by the numerous other Russian snipers who have went on to have allustrious NHL careers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted January 25, 2006 Share Posted January 25, 2006 Which Russian snipers, exactly? I think you'll find very quickly that most of them went directly to the NHL and have elite-level talent. Snipers that don't have elite-level talent are forgettable - players like Dagenais and Alexander Selivanov and Audette and Valeri Bure. There's only about 20 guys who can survive as pure scoring wingers - the rest barely hang on. Is Suglobov in that top 20 or 30? Probably not, judging by his AHL statistics. While he hasn't had the most support, his goals per game isn't phenomenal. The Devils certainly haven't treated him like a prospect they value, sending him down to the Albany camp well before other, younger players. He's 24 years old. He should be in the NHL by now. Lou signed Alex Mogilny instead. He won't be a Devil by mid-March. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils731 Posted January 25, 2006 Share Posted January 25, 2006 If the Devils plan on moving Suglobov they should try highlighting him with some PP time and 2nd line minutes against weaker teams to try and give him some exagerrated NHL numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted January 25, 2006 Share Posted January 25, 2006 (edited) If the Devils plan on moving Suglobov they should try highlighting him with some PP time and 2nd line minutes against weaker teams to try and give him some exagerrated NHL numbers. The cost of sacrificing valuable minutes from other players for the sake of increasing trade value is too great. Regardless, Suglobov's minor league numbers speak for themselves. I'd really like Sergei Fedorov here but I see he has 2 years left on his deal. Pity. I think he's exactly what the Devils need for the 2nd line, and I think Suglobov and a pick would spring him. Edited January 25, 2006 by Triumph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voros19 Posted January 26, 2006 Author Share Posted January 26, 2006 (edited) Which Russian snipers, exactly? I think you'll find very quickly that most of them went directly to the NHL and have elite-level talent. Snipers that don't have elite-level talent are forgettable - players like Dagenais and Alexander Selivanov and Audette and Valeri Bure.There's only about 20 guys who can survive as pure scoring wingers - the rest barely hang on. Is Suglobov in that top 20 or 30? Probably not, judging by his AHL statistics. While he hasn't had the most support, his goals per game isn't phenomenal. The Devils certainly haven't treated him like a prospect they value, sending him down to the Albany camp well before other, younger players. He's 24 years old. He should be in the NHL by now. Lou signed Alex Mogilny instead. He won't be a Devil by mid-March. What do you consider elite level talent? Suggy is certainly up there potential-wise. And still, you apply seemingly unrelated cases and automatically assume that the same thing will happen with Suggy. And again, he can do more than just score. He has refined his passing game quite a bit, has honed his defensive skills to a degree, and has developed a little physical game. He is making strides, and with work, he could improve even further. Jesus...AHL statistics, AHL statistics...Are you that daft? For one, his AHL statistics have improved every single season from 03-04 to present. So far this season, he is averaging .46 gpg, which, over an 80 game season, would pace him for 37 goals (and 71 points). Yeah, really disappointing on a team such as the Rats...He has little to no help, and still manages to put up decent numbers and improve year after year. If he were on a team such as the Portland Pirates, he would be averaging well over a point per game and would probably a top 20 or so scorer. There is little doubt in my mind. And since when should does a 24-year old have to be in the NHL? He just turned 24 several days ago, and has the talent and ability to be on an NHL roster right now. And didn't he make the Devils a couple years ago before getting a wrist injury? I'm not exactly sure there, but that's what I seem to remember... Edited January 26, 2006 by Voros19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDevil Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 (edited) Successful teams have one or less than one pure scorer. And they've got to be good. Let's list some guys from Cup winners:'95 Devils: Stephane Richer (average defensively, could penalty kill) '96 Avs: Valeri Kamensky (great scorer, great in the playoffs) Arguably the 97 and 98 Red Wings had no one '99 Stars: Brett Hull The 00 Devils arguably had two - Petr Sykora and Alex Mogilny, but Mogilny was in a 4th line role '01 Avs: Milan Hedjuk '02 Wings: Brett Hull No one on the 03 Devils '04 Lightning: Martin St. Louis Do you see the connection? The teams only have 1, and they've got to be outstanding. All of those guys are Hall of Famers or have near to Hall of Fame talent. Suglobov doesn't fit this description and I'm not sure he ever will. And the dropoff is significant - Geoff Sanderson, Donald Audette, and Mariusz Czerkawski have never been a significant part of a playoff run. OK. First of all is way too early to call Suglobov pure scorer. That would make him with no OTHER offensive capabilities and wiht no defense at all. I have no idea from where yoo pulled those . Please cip in some stats to prove your point. And the last "Puer Goal scorer" - which is according to your definition "score and nohting more" was Pavel Bure. I don't recall anyone on any Devils team that matches your definition. On the other side if we search for "Excellent GOAL SCORERS" or so called snipers on prior 10 SC Champs here we go : If Elias, Shanahan, Forsberg, Guerin, Modano aren't "Great(Excellent) Goal scorers" I don't know who is scorer at all Edited January 26, 2006 by MacDevil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'7' Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 Mark Recchi could probably be a decent 2nd line stopgap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 Mark Recchi could probably be a decent 2nd line stopgap. I thought of him too, but he's too small. We'd have a top 6 of midgets. I want him here but I just don't see a way how that would work unless we altered our lines significantly. I'll address the other points tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weekes Head Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 Speaking of Recchi, I love how TSN.ca lists him as "HOT" for having two points in his last two GP...I mean, really? I guess when it's the Pens, you gotta set the bar a little lower, eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'7' Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 I thought of him too, but he's too small. We'd have a top 6 of midgets. I want him here but I just don't see a way how that would work unless we altered our lines significantly.I'll address the other points tomorrow. fair enough I'm not a fan of any of them, but if the Panthers fall further out of it, Nieuwendyk, Roberts, and Hill will all be available. I think Lou wouldn't mind giving Nieuwy another shot, and you did mention in some other post the need for a stopgap 2nd line center until Parise matures.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weekes Head Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 fair enoughI'm not a fan of any of them, but if the Panthers fall further out of it, Nieuwendyk, Roberts, and Hill will all be available. I think Lou wouldn't mind giving Nieuwy another shot, and you did mention in some other post the need for a stopgap 2nd line center until Parise matures.... Yeah, but with Nieu comes Roberts -- it's a package deal. One goes, they both go me thinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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