The Guillotine

[mikeford]

Mottau.

Eckford or Corrente would be better served in the lineup getting experience than this 30+ year old dog.

[cubanjd305]

No. He wasn't a top pairing D man. That's why.

If he can't handle it, stop giving him top minutes. He keeps screwing up, yet he plays PK...absurd.

Who else is going to go out there on this roster? Recall Cory Murphy? Pick Jay Leach back up? Call Havelid back over?

Salvador, White, Fraser, Mottau, Greene and Salmela. One true top 3 D-man in the whole bunch. It's a defense by committee and having good coaching/instruction/system that has made that group what it is. We know Mottau is NOT a top 3 and borderline 4, but who on this team after Salavador, White and Greene can play a 4th pair "stay at home" mins and have a different outcome? If so, they would be there already.

For all Mottau's mistakes lately, he's still only a -3.

Clueless.

You have selective memory.

Point total=Irrelivant. He's a stay at home D-man.

Mottau wasn't responsible for that series loss.

Yeah, let me conform with Mottau getting minutes to screw up because who else huh?

You started the numbers, you continue with the numbers, so don't come with "irrelevant". It's not like +/- says everything.

Speaking of selective memory? The one who can't remember seeing #27 making mistakes all over the place?

Obviously he wasn't the only responsible, but you like numbers....and a season of +24 turned into a -3 postseason, that's all.

Edited February 9, 2010 by cubanjd305

[cubanjd305]

Also with the +/- deal.....Mottau and Pandolfo are the ONLY regulars in this team with a minus-something

[Marshall]

Rolston, no question.

[halfsharkalligatorhalfman]

Niedermayer is the easiest to replace so I picked him

The other two are key members of the team, for better or worse. Losing them makes the team clearly worse.

edit: With that said, if there were someway to get out of Rolston's contract I would do that in a heartbeat.

Edited February 9, 2010 by halfsharkalligatorhalfman

[RSC]

Rob Niedermayer for sure. Rolston and Mottau at least TRY to be hockey players. Special Nieds doesn't skate, he's lazy as sh!t, he doesn't use his stick, his passes are lazy, etc. He needs to fvcking go.

[DevilinLA]

Also with the +/- deal.....Mottau and Pandolfo are the ONLY regulars in this team with a minus-something

You've been on him since you came to the board, but thats Ok, because most here will aptly label me as his most outspoken defender.

Your logic of "Step up or step out if you can't handle it" is adsurd:

"If Rod Pelley or Zharkov isn't ready to be Zach Parise tommorrow then they've got no place on the team?" Foolish.

Secondly, any comparison to pre-2003 personnel is irrelevant. Mottau, Greene and CO. would look like Allstars on a team w/Neids & Scotty.

The ENTIRE defense is tired and burnt - every single one of them.

Its the small folk like Mottau that clear the cap room for the ability to sign Kovalchuck's, Parises's, and Martin's. As I've said before, with the right minutes he's fine.

Good back and watch the CAR series, and no NOT JUST GAME 7, and see how much he contributed. (I.e. Goal #1, setting up the Gio goal, etc.).

I won't argue that he's played poorly as of late, but if you expect guys like Pelley or Deano to fill Zach's shoes - you'll see what happens.

Some in this fanbase have been (rightly so) spoiled by the ALLSTAR D years, those days are over. Name me a team with that type of solidity on the back end today?

Some folk are also ready to throw up anyone from Lowell before their ready....what can it hurt? Any when you've waived MM and said prospect doesn't work out, AND you've botched their confidence in their development, what do you do then keyboard GM's? Start another temper-tantrum thread?

This recent/or not-so-recent slump is not the sole responsibility of just one player.

The issue w/Rolston is that his skill sets (or set) became immediately obsolete the minute Kovy and the chance of signing him came on board. That and his recent play or lack of effort hasn't given any reasons to the contrary to retain him.

Edited February 9, 2010 by DevilinLA

[thelastonealive]

My vote's on Rolston, only because of his contract. As much as Niedermayer infuriates lately, it's impossible to me to say he needs to go right now, because he's gone after the season anyway. Rolston's contract, on the other hand, is a giant roadblock to re-signing Kovalchuk or adding other pieces in the next two years (not that it can't be done, but it would be much easier without it).

[thefiestygoat]

I vote for Rol$ton because of that awful contract and there is no hope of him getting any better than he's been playing. I understand the upsetment towards Mottau but I don't have an issue with him. Honestly he's fine as a 3rd pairing defenseman, he's just been asked to do more than he should due to Martin being out and it's caught up to him.

[Toaster13]

My vote's on Rolston, only because of his contract. As much as Niedermayer infuriates lately, it's impossible to me to say he needs to go right now, because he's gone after the season anyway. Rolston's contract, on the other hand, is a giant roadblock to re-signing Kovalchuk or adding other pieces in the next two years (not that it can't be done, but it would be much easier without it).

+1 That's why I voted Rolston as well.

[cubanjd305]

You've been on him since you came to the board, but thats Ok, because most here will aptly label me as his most outspoken defender.

Your logic of "Step up or step out if you can't handle it" is adsurd:

"If Rod Pelley or Zharkov isn't ready to be Zach Parise tommorrow then they've got no place on the team?" Foolish.

Secondly, any comparison to pre-2003 personnel is irrelevant. Mottau, Greene and CO. would look like Allstars on a team w/Neids & Scotty.

The ENTIRE defense is tired and burnt - every single one of them.

Its the small folk like Mottau that clear the cap room for the ability to sign Kovalchuck's, Parises's, and Martin's. As I've said before, with the right minutes he's fine.

Good back and watch the CAR series, and no NOT JUST GAME 7, and see how much he contributed. (I.e. Goal #1, setting up the Gio goal, etc.).

I won't argue that he's played poorly as of late, but if you expect guys like Pelley or Deano to fill Zach's shoes - you'll see what happens.

Some in this fanbase have been (rightly so) spoiled by the ALLSTAR D years, those days are over. Name me a team with that type of solidity on the back end today?

Some folk are also ready to throw up anyone from Lowell before their ready....what can it hurt? Any when you've waived MM and said prospect doesn't work out, AND you've botched their confidence in their development, what do you do then keyboard GM's? Start another temper-tantrum thread?

This recent/or not-so-recent slump is not the sole responsibility of just one player.

The issue w/Rolston is that his skill sets (or set) became immediately obsolete the minute Kovy and the chance of signing him came on board. That and his recent play or lack of effort hasn't given any reasons to the contrary to retain him.

I registered last year so....

I've been on his case lately...because he gives us reasons to!!

Again, if Mottau can't handle top D minutes and responsibilities, then don't give it to him, is that simple. Again, he is hurting the team, yet he gets PK minutes and PP minutes. At least that you should consider a "step up or step out" deal!.

Compare Pelley?? If Parise went down tomorrow (knock on wood he won't) guess what...Pelley won't be the guy JL, or any of us, will look at to fill in. At least do a realistic comparison. If a Parise gets injured, well, the guys we'll be looking at would be Elias, Zubrus, Rolston, Kovalchuk....and if they can't handle it...then same deal, f-off (Patty gets a free pass ).

It's the small guy that clears cap room indeed; but there are tons of small salaries out there that may or may not be doing a better job than Mottau right now.

Enough with the obvious. No team has a slump (if it can still be considered a slump after 20 games) because of one player alone.

....and Rolston is terrible. He's fourth in points in the team...but each his points are the most expensive of any one.

[DevilinLA]

I registered last year so....

I've been on his case lately...because he gives us reasons to!!

Again, if Mottau can't handle top D minutes and responsibilities, then don't give it to him, is that simple. Again, he is hurting the team, yet he gets PK minutes and PP minutes. At least that you should consider a "step up or step out" deal!.

Compare Pelley?? If Parise went down tomorrow (knock on wood he won't) guess what...Pelley won't be the guy JL, or any of us, will look at to fill in. At least do a realistic comparison. If a Parise gets injured, well, the guys we'll be looking at would be Elias, Zubrus, Rolston, Kovalchuk....and if they can't handle it...then same deal, f-off (Patty gets a free pass ).

It's the small guy that clears cap room indeed; but there are tons of small salaries out there that may or may not be doing a better job than Mottau right now.

Enough with the obvious. No team has a slump (if it can still be considered a slump after 20 games) because of one player alone.

....and Rolston is terrible. He's fourth in points in the team...but each his points are the most expensive of any one.

1.) Find me a D man making 760K that regularly plays 15 minutes, now asked to play 22:00 for this stretch of games that would do this better on any NHL club.

He's a solid steal if he's used correctly given the consistency.

2.) OK, if its "That simple", then who fills those minutes, especially with Andy and Sal already playing 20+. Do you play them for 30 minutes so they completely burn out? Next your going to recommend that some Lowell players (i.e. Eckford, Corrente) play 15-20 when they've barely seen 10 minutes of NHL ice time. Then, when they are overwhelmed, and you've exposed them to something they're not ready for - you send them back to Lowell with their confidence destroyed. Simple!

3.) And yes the comparison is fair. Most agree MM is a #6 D man (with given set of talent and skill of one) playing as a top 4. So that is the equivilant of your 4th line forward getting Parise ice time. The players you listed to "step up" in the hypothetical absence of Parise are all (or have been) top NHL players, some HOF's. They HAVE the skillsets to play that role for a bit. Mottau doesn't. As with much of this team, you are asking back pairing or 4th line players, with those skillsets, to play top 4 or top 6 roles. It may work for a few games, but in the end, the result is what you are seeing on the ice. They have "Stepped up", now they need some relief. This doesn't apply to Winky - he's never stepped up.

People want to blame someone, blame the "absence" of Paul Martin. Its not Paul's fault, but he's the only top pair guy on the whole team.

[Devil Fan]

Rolston because of his contract status as the other two become UFAs after this season.

[mouse]

Rolston -- his contract is huge and screws them up. More importantly, his role is to use his big shot to create goals, but he keeps missing the net. He doesn't create his own shot, and needs to be on the first/second line, but there are multiple guys who should be ahead of him for first/second line winger.

Nieds and Motts can be valuable if used in the right role. When Clarkie gets back and Elias gets healthier, Nieds hopefully becomes a 4th liner with a brain who can be valuable on the PK. When Martin gets back, Motts becomes a cheap and useful 6th/7th dman. I have no problem with trying Fraser out and benching Motts, but there is no way we should throw Motts, who's a hard worker, and a very consistent and predictable (in a good way) player.

[SS-SS]

Not even a question.

Rolston should be out,soft playing,no heart and can't keep the puck more than 5 seconds.

When he is on a PP we can't keep the puck in the offensive zone because he just find a way to lose it or let it cross the blue line every time he touch's it.

Sorry but Rolston is Garbage and his contract just makes me crazy.

With this money we could put anyone already on the Roster or a rookie at his place and shop for some decent blue line support for the PP or a second line center.

NO doubts Lou should find a way to throw him away and clear up some cap space.

Edited February 10, 2010 by SS-SS

[njmar]

Brian "shot wide" Rolston --makes me want to throw up every time. The contract and the NTC. I thought Lou hated those--what was he thinking?

[jim777]

Sean Avery, and for the hell of it (I mean, you have it out and sharpened right?) Mark McGwire

Edited February 10, 2010 by jim777

[Devilstail]

I'm going with Mottau his is definitely the best player. On the other team!

[cubanjd305]

Brian "shot wide" Rolston --makes me want to throw up every time. The contract and the NTC. I thought Lou hated those--what was he thinking?

Shoots wide 'cause of the permanently shutting eye

[DaneykoIsGod]

1.) Find me a D man making 760K that regularly plays 15 minutes, now asked to play 22:00 for this stretch of games that would do this better on any NHL club.

He's a solid steal if he's used correctly given the consistency.

2.) OK, if its "That simple", then who fills those minutes, especially with Andy and Sal already playing 20+. Do you play them for 30 minutes so they completely burn out? Next your going to recommend that some Lowell players (i.e. Eckford, Corrente) play 15-20 when they've barely seen 10 minutes of NHL ice time. Then, when they are overwhelmed, and you've exposed them to something they're not ready for - you send them back to Lowell with their confidence destroyed. Simple!

3.) And yes the comparison is fair. Most agree MM is a #6 D man (with given set of talent and skill of one) playing as a top 4. So that is the equivilant of your 4th line forward getting Parise ice time. The players you listed to "step up" in the hypothetical absence of Parise are all (or have been) top NHL players, some HOF's. They HAVE the skillsets to play that role for a bit. Mottau doesn't. As with much of this team, you are asking back pairing or 4th line players, with those skillsets, to play top 4 or top 6 roles. It may work for a few games, but in the end, the result is what you are seeing on the ice. They have "Stepped up", now they need some relief. This doesn't apply to Winky - he's never stepped up.

People want to blame someone, blame the "absence" of Paul Martin. Its not Paul's fault, but he's the only top pair guy on the whole team.

These are the questions that the Mottau haters can never answer.

Sure, he's looked bad in a larger role. But if you push him down to a lower pairing, who steps up for him? The best answer I've heard is Mark Fraser, cuz he's gonna get a shot sometime, right?