undaimee Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 I just converted to islam...lettin u guys know... Why I converted? Heres a brief explaination: I was an athiest, and thought that there was no such thing as god, until i started questioning myself. Who made me??? Who made life??? They just cant pop out of nowhere. Science and history didnt help at all, and the ape-human theory was just retarted. If we really evolved from monkeys, then when are the monkeys today gonna evolve into humans? I started looking into various religions, none made sense to me. Then, I read the Quran, which I had promised myself that I would never do. Various things, specificly scientific evidence and future predictions, madfe me realise tha there was Allah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepperkorn Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Congratulations! Glad you found what you needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciyenne Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Cool. What did the conversion process involve? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
undaimee Posted August 19, 2004 Author Share Posted August 19, 2004 I had to say "La illaha ill allah, muhammud urrasulullah" (There is no God but Allah, and Muhammad is his messenger)...and I was basically done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRASHER Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 congratulations are in order... I personally don't follow a religous belief myself, but when someone has found their own path and calling in life its always a good thing since everyone needs to follow their own path in life to happiness and I respect that... good for you hope that didn't come off as me talking down religion it's not intended to be that way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammyk Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Good for you. Can I ask what the Pakistan connection is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueNJ97 Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Congratulations. I'm an athiest myself, but just as I have not found it necessary to include religion in my life, I am always happy for those who have found a way to include it in their lives. To each his/her own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Conversion is quite easy, as noted above. My friend, who is Muslim, once told me that many parents will not let their daughters marry non-Muslim men, so the young men go to the mosque, say the 6 words, and never return. Me thinks conversion for undaimee runs a little deeper. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- I am an athiest. I think I shall always be an athiest. We've all asked those questions before. You now have your answer, one that helps you and can guide you. I'm still searching for something that makes sense. I have a book at home called "How Can I Believe When I Live in a World Like This?". It is written by a pastor and it tries to deal with all the issues I have asked, such as "Why do bad things happen to good people and good things happen to bad people?". He suggests two possible scenarios: (1) God has left humanity to it's own devices and in his wisdom, which is beyond ours, has left us to make what we will of this world - and in this world we LET bad things happen to good people and we LET good things happen to bad people. (2) God uses the earth as a test to find worthiness to enter into his holy domain. If this be the case, he would want the good people to be tempted to do bad... the good people suffer while the bad people reap the rewards here on earth. The truely worthy would see past the earthly rewards and have their eyes solely on the reward that heaven offers. He points to the suffering that Lot went through as an example. I can't reconcile either. I have found no religion with a foundation in creation by an omnipotent being that has been able to answer that question to a satisfactory enough reason for me. Until somebody does, I'll remain a free agent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarDew Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 (edited) Best wishes in finding what gives you peace btw..are you that state you are atheist I must ask...are you athiest or agnostic...fine line I guess but just curious...dew you believe there is no God or just don't know one way or the other? Edited August 19, 2004 by StarDew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 First, as for what gives me peace, I'm already there. I can remain a free agent and get through life just fine. I'm just saying that whenever the Church of Latter Day Saints come by they can't give me a sound answer, so I'll go on living my life as I do. I can live without belief in a higher power. Second, I'm not sure. I think a university friend I had put it succinctly. I'm not 100% sure that there is not a God. But if there is, I'm 100% sure that He created one really screwed up world." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepperkorn Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Anyone watch the Nova on NJN last night (the 8:00 Nova -- 13 has the 9:00 Nova ) Anyhow -- it dealt with neurology and one of the issues was how seisures triggered a manic depressive spirituality response in this guys brain. So what if they do fine that spirituality corresponds to an area of the brain? Would you all then discount the validity of it? I dont' think I would... AHHHHHHHHHH! Does the brain not wig you guys out? One of my friends is a neurologist -- I can't figure on how she could choose in what area to focus. The mind is AMAZING! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
undaimee Posted August 19, 2004 Author Share Posted August 19, 2004 Good for you. Can I ask what the Pakistan connection is? i was born there, didnt live for a very long time, my parents were prolly athiests too. I am pretty sure that at least one of my ancestors were muslim or hindu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
undaimee Posted August 19, 2004 Author Share Posted August 19, 2004 Conversion is quite easy, as noted above. My friend, who is Muslim, once told me that many parents will not let their daughters marry non-Muslim men, so the young men go to the mosque, say the 6 words, and never return. Me thinks conversion for undaimee runs a little deeper. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- I am an athiest. I think I shall always be an athiest. We've all asked those questions before. You now have your answer, one that helps you and can guide you. I'm still searching for something that makes sense. I have a book at home called "How Can I Believe When I Live in a World Like This?". It is written by a pastor and it tries to deal with all the issues I have asked, such as "Why do bad things happen to good people and good things happen to bad people?". He suggests two possible scenarios: (1) God has left humanity to it's own devices and in his wisdom, which is beyond ours, has left us to make what we will of this world - and in this world we LET bad things happen to good people and we LET good things happen to bad people. (2) God uses the earth as a test to find worthiness to enter into his holy domain. If this be the case, he would want the good people to be tempted to do bad... the good people suffer while the bad people reap the rewards here on earth. The truely worthy would see past the earthly rewards and have their eyes solely on the reward that heaven offers. He points to the suffering that Lot went through as an example. I can't reconcile either. I have found no religion with a foundation in creation by an omnipotent being that has been able to answer that question to a satisfactory enough reason for me. Until somebody does, I'll remain a free agent. as i said, i just questioned myself a lot. I also have muslim friends who told me that they cant marry nonmuslim girls. Its rolly because their parents wanna avoid religious issues within the marriage. interesting book, i have to buy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 It's by Reginal Stackhouse. Quite a good book. The chapters are: 1 - Why are bad things happening to me? 2 - If you could be God for a day, how would you fix things? 3 - What kind of world is it when the innocent suffer and evil is rewarded? 4 - Is all suffering bad? 5 - Is the world a fair place? 6 - Suffering and death isn't all there is. 7 - How can a good person make it through a world like this? Interesting book... he convinced me of a few things. He just wasn't convincing enough on chapter three, which is the make it or break it for me. I just hear my friend at work tell me of how his family back in Somalia live. It's basically kill or be killed. The warlords have complete control - they hand-pick any woman they want, they kill anyone they want, they massacre whole families at a whim... torture happens every day. Meanwhile, good people are being killed, starve to death or sometimes worse, have to continue living under the thumb of the warlords. Anyone is going to have a hard time convincing me that truely good omnipotent being is putting these people through the hell that they are living as a "testing ground" for souls. What kind of monster would do that to someone? I have trouble buying that one. I also can't see a good omnipotent being just walking away from the world and leaving it to rot the way it has. A friend of mine who became a born-again Christian had a third theory: God created all the good things on the planet and Satan causes all the suffering. They are equally powerful, and it is up to man to decide who he backs. Malarky. I'm supposed to believe that somehow, someway there were two omnipotent beings - one all good and one all evil. What are the odds? Why not one lucky and the other unlucky? Why not 3 gods - one for each primary colour? The good vs evil seems to contrived an explaination. But that aside, he made some very excellent observations, drawing from Voltaire to Bob Dylan. Definitely a good read that gets your head spinning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
undaimee Posted August 20, 2004 Author Share Posted August 20, 2004 It's by Reginal Stackhouse. Quite a good book. The chapters are: 1 - Why are bad things happening to me? 2 - If you could be God for a day, how would you fix things? 3 - What kind of world is it when the innocent suffer and evil is rewarded? 4 - Is all suffering bad? 5 - Is the world a fair place? 6 - Suffering and death isn't all there is. 7 - How can a good person make it through a world like this? Interesting book... he convinced me of a few things. He just wasn't convincing enough on chapter three, which is the make it or break it for me. I just hear my friend at work tell me of how his family back in Somalia live. It's basically kill or be killed. The warlords have complete control - they hand-pick any woman they want, they kill anyone they want, they massacre whole families at a whim... torture happens every day. Meanwhile, good people are being killed, starve to death or sometimes worse, have to continue living under the thumb of the warlords. Anyone is going to have a hard time convincing me that truely good omnipotent being is putting these people through the hell that they are living as a "testing ground" for souls. What kind of monster would do that to someone? I have trouble buying that one. I also can't see a good omnipotent being just walking away from the world and leaving it to rot the way it has. A friend of mine who became a born-again Christian had a third theory: God created all the good things on the planet and Satan causes all the suffering. They are equally powerful, and it is up to man to decide who he backs. Malarky. I'm supposed to believe that somehow, someway there were two omnipotent beings - one all good and one all evil. What are the odds? Why not one lucky and the other unlucky? Why not 3 gods - one for each primary colour? The good vs evil seems to contrived an explaination. But that aside, he made some very excellent observations, drawing from Voltaire to Bob Dylan. Definitely a good read that gets your head spinning. thanks for the info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHEDEVIL30 Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 I myself have to believe in God. I may not know why He does what He does at times, but then again who am I to even question Him. He is God, and He is just. And I would rather take my chances on believing in Him than not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satans Hockey Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 I myself have to believe in God. I may not know why He does what He does at times, but then again who am I to even question Him. He is God, and He is just. And I would rather take my chances on believing in Him than not. I thought about that one too.... I think I'm a good person. I give 10% of my disposable income to charity (3 foster children in Africa, Amnesty International, United Way). I've volunteered with dozens of different groups including helping students with math tutoring, funding drives for the food bank, organized park clean-ups and the like. Every decision I make, it's based on not causing suffering - even to animals. I don't want to look back on my life and think that I caused hurt, pain or sorrow. Yet, I wouldn't be allowed entry into Heaven because I don't believe in God. On the other hand, someone that has tortured, raped, and then killed 30 people, someone that sexually molested a hundred children, those warlords that I spoke of earlier that wipe out entire familes or entire villages at a time... so long as the moment before they die they proclaim their belief in God, they're in. Sounds like a silly game to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciyenne Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Well they also have to truly repent. I think if there was a god, he'd know when someone was truly sorry and really wanted to embrace religion. I don't think he would be fooled by lip-service repenters or anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Well they also have to truly repent. I think if there was a god, he'd know when someone was truly sorry and really wanted to embrace religion. I don't think he would be fooled by lip-service repenters or anything. Even at that.... http://www.bible.ca/s-Dahmer.htm Doesn't seem right to me. Jeffrey Dahmer in. Don out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciyenne Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Well, console yourself Don...ask yourself 'would you like to reside in a place where the lord is so biased and unfair? For all eternity?' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammyk Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Yet, I wouldn't be allowed entry into Heaven because I don't believe in God. Isn't heaven a creation of religion? How do you expect to get to a place you don't believe in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Yet, I wouldn't be allowed entry into Heaven because I don't believe in God. Isn't heaven a creation of religion? How do you expect to get to a place you don't believe in? Sammy: I was referring to SHEDEVIL's "better safe than sorry" theory. So, no I don't believe in a heaven or a hell. But I have been wrong before. Let's say my buddy and I are going to Smalltown, USA. My buddy says there is a big casino there. I say no way. There is no way that Smalltown has enough people to support a casino. When we get there, I find my buddy is right - there *IS* a casino. I don't think the doorman is going to say "You - you there - you're not allowed in. Your buddy here says you didn't believe in this place". If they did do that, maybe I should have believed with all my heart that the casino did exist... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepperkorn Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 I think we can't comprehend what's going on. Relativity - perception - prevents us from making any sort of informed appraisal. It's all a product of our brains - our interpretation of stimuli. I have no problem reconciling this stimuli with "God" I can accept this stimuli is controlled. Now try to think of this stimuli as self-aware... possessing I don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepperkorn Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 (edited) Wow I sure know how to kill a thread huh? But don't you all want to venture outside of the realm of afterlife as myth and try to figure out something maybe possible - even if we can't actually perceive it's magnitude? I miss my dog Edited August 20, 2004 by Pepperkorn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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