RSC Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4366335 Dude, you just made my day. Cue Kicksave Brodeur to come in here and defend Big Poopy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOTCB Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) So I guess Mr George Mitchell, this supposed 'unbiased' person who reported the names to $elig, could not keep his boys from getting exposed? Poor bastard. For me the icing on the cake would be if Schilling was ever exposed. Edited July 30, 2009 by LOTCB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaneykoIsGod Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 I love how the Mitchell Report, compiled by a guy on the Red Sox payroll, managed to somehow miss the two most important parts of Boston's two championship teams, yet still managed to name 23 Yankees (five more than any other team). Yeah, unbiased my @$$. What a joke. How long before we finally get to see the other 100 or so names on this 2003 "list"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghdi Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 It'd be comeuppance to the stupid Mitchell Report if Clemens was exonerated. Its not going to happen, but I'd love to see it happen. Its really ironic how Manny and Ortiz were not on it. My bet is that Mitchell took every painstaking step to eliminate Red Sox players, the way a cop/detective try to eliminate suspects, but added whatever Yankee he could find on whatever evidence he could get http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Major_League_Baseball_players_named_in_the_Mitchell_Report_by_team Not ONE damn Red Sox player whatsoever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaneykoIsGod Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 It'd be comeuppance to the stupid Mitchell Report if Clemens was exonerated. Its not going to happen, but I'd love to see it happen. Its really ironic how Manny and Ortiz were not on it. My bet is that Mitchell took every painstaking step to eliminate Red Sox players, the way a cop/detective try to eliminate suspects, but added whatever Yankee he could find on whatever evidence he could get http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Major_League_Baseball_players_named_in_the_Mitchell_Report_by_team Not ONE damn Red Sox player whatsoever. The only two Red Sox on the Report of any consequence are Roger Clemens and Mo Vaughn. Clemens being named is more damning to his time with the Yanks than the Sox, and Vaughn, well, he was Ortiz before Ortiz, minus the rings. I swear, this news has made my freakin day. Every couple minutes I think of another reason why it's so hilarious. Remember Big Poopy's eye tests earlier this season? Yeah, David, that's why you sucked. Not because you were a nobody in Minnesota before juicing and you'd go back to being a nobody after you stop juicing. I can't wait to see him forget how to speak English, a la Sammy Sosa, when reporters interview him about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devilsrule33 Posted July 30, 2009 Author Share Posted July 30, 2009 Have to say I enjoy the Sox and Yankees fans going back and forth at each other with each big name from their respective teams being added to the steroid list. The bottom line is both teams heavily cheated like most teams in baseball did. Now can we be done with this and get all 103 names. Having one player leaked every few months is getting very annoying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghdi Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) The only two Red Sox on the Report of any consequence are Roger Clemens and Mo Vaughn. Clemens being named is more damning to his time with the Yanks than the Sox, and Vaughn, well, he was Ortiz before Ortiz, minus the rings. Clemens supposedly didnt start until he was with the Jays, so I dont even consider him part of the Red Sox in regards to the report. As for Mo, big whoop. That's about as interesting as Glenallen Hill being on there. Ortiz and Manny are worse than A-Rod, or at the least AS bad. A-Rod's not won a championship. At least A-Rod owned up to it, in his own A-Rod way. "I think you clean up the game by the testing. I test you, you test positive, you're going to be out. Period." -David Ortiz Edited July 30, 2009 by ghdi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devilsrule33 Posted July 30, 2009 Author Share Posted July 30, 2009 Clemens supposedly didnt start until he was with the Jays, so I dont even consider him part of the Red Sox in regards to the report. As for Mo, big whoop. That's about as interesting as Glenallen Hill being on there. Ortiz and Manny are worse than A-Rod, or at the least AS bad. A-Rod's not won a championship. At least A-Rod owned up to it, in his own A-Rod way. "I think you clean up the game by the testing. I test you, you test positive, you're going to be out. Period." -David Ortiz You can't say it is worse. A-Rod was the guy that everyone thought would break all the records and be the greatest player of all-time. Now he is no better than Bonds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOTCB Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Have to say I enjoy the Sox and Yankees fans going back and forth at each other with each big name from their respective teams being added to the steroid list. The bottom line is both teams heavily cheated like most teams in baseball did. Now can we be done with this and get all 103 names. Having one player leaked every few months is getting very annoying. That I agree with, and for me why I am happy is because of how some, and I say some Red Sox fans were..I read message boards everywhere...we were clean...we did it the right way blah blah blah..I know Yankee$ juiced, now Red $ox..join the club, that is what makes me happy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmigliore Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ti-halladayupdate073009&prov=yhoo&type=lgns Red Sox and Dodgers after Halladay.. mmm interesting, I have a tough time believing LA could pull it off without giving up a roster player (unless Toronto has brought down the price after Philly rejected them), but the LA farm system is not as strong as Boston's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaneykoIsGod Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 You can't say it is worse. A-Rod was the guy that everyone thought would break all the records and be the greatest player of all-time. Now he is no better than Bonds. A-Rod and Bonds can rightfully be accused of cheapening the record books with steroids use. Now the Red Sox can be rightfully be accused of cheapening the World Series by winning two on the juiced-up shoulders of these mongoloids. Records have always been in dispute ... whether it's because of the length of the season, the height of the mound, steroids, etc. But the World Series ... it's always been the World Series. Now there are two championships that should have asterisks next to them. And they weren't just any championships. These were the titles that silenced the Curse Of The Bambino. These marked the fall of the Evil Empire. These changed baseball and were the biggest news in sports. Now, they're a sham. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Dude, you just made my day. Cue Kicksave Brodeur to come in here and defend Big Poopy... meh.. a-fraud, gabroni, manny, ortiz... who cares? Obviously any Red Sox haters who have been waiting for this shoe to drop. Honestly anybody who believed that there was a team who was free of any players that took ped's probably thinks there is a tooth fairy too, lol. But it does make me smile to know that there are some out there who will be upset because somehow they think the two WS are now cheapened..heheh.. SUFFER!!! Seriously though, I do think anybody who tests positive should have an asterisk next to any records they have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghdi Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 The asterisk argument is stupid. This is the Steroids Era, and just as Maris' record was always said to be lessened because of the length of the season, they'll say the same thing. Records will not be asterisked. The problem is, PEDs aren't going anywhere, no matter how stringent the testing. There will always be idiots that try to get past it, and even more glaring - there will always be new drugs developed that undermine the system. They're used in every single sport. You can say "suffer" all you want, but this will taint the Championships in many peoples eyes, just as it will taint any player who sets records and is found to have been using. The core offense of those two teams were arguably (if not definitively) Manny and Ortiz, and they're both users, and who knows who else was using. That being said, Pete Rose for the HOF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njdevil26 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 As a Sox fan, I do not defend Ortiz one bit. He should be suspended and/or thrown out of the league. I have no watched one baseball game this season and this is part of the reason... The other is the money that these guys make. America's "past time" is ruined for me. Give me 15 mil. I've played baseball for 15 years. I can shoot myself up with some roids and perform with the best of them. Baseball has become a complete joke. Football and basketball are filled with millionaire criminals..... When does hockey season start? The lack of steroids in hockey almost seems too good to be true... but for now I'll take it. It's the only pure sport left with talented, responsible individuals... say for a few Averys... but man... hopefully this gets the sport more fans as people realize it is genuinely the best game around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Pride 26 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 A-Rod and Bonds can rightfully be accused of cheapening the record books with steroids use. Now the Red Sox can be rightfully be accused of cheapening the World Series by winning two on the juiced-up shoulders of these mongoloids. Records have always been in dispute ... whether it's because of the length of the season, the height of the mound, steroids, etc. But the World Series ... it's always been the World Series. Now there are two championships that should have asterisks next to them. And they weren't just any championships. These were the titles that silenced the Curse Of The Bambino. These marked the fall of the Evil Empire. These changed baseball and were the biggest news in sports. Now, they're a sham. I'm not going to defend the red sox but if it wasn't them in 04 it would have been the yanks with a-rod, sheff, and giambi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmigliore Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Dodgers acquire reliever George Sherrill to bolster their bullpen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaneykoIsGod Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 As a Sox fan, I do not defend Ortiz one bit. He should be suspended and/or thrown out of the league. And this is exactly how I, as a Yankees fan, feel about A-Rod and anyone else who tests positive. I really wish we could take a Black Sox-esque stand on this and just ban 'em all permanently. Not only will that clean up the game, but with the punishment being so severe and so black-and-white no one will be tempted to juice again. It'll never fly in the Player Union era though. Where is Kenesaw Mountain Landis when you need him? Oh yeah, dead. I'm not going to defend the red sox but if it wasn't them in 04 it would have been the yanks with a-rod, sheff, and giambi ... and if that were the case, that championship team would deserve an asterisk too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devilsrule33 Posted July 30, 2009 Author Share Posted July 30, 2009 A-Rod and Bonds can rightfully be accused of cheapening the record books with steroids use. Now the Red Sox can be rightfully be accused of cheapening the World Series by winning two on the juiced-up shoulders of these mongoloids. Records have always been in dispute ... whether it's because of the length of the season, the height of the mound, steroids, etc. But the World Series ... it's always been the World Series. Now there are two championships that should have asterisks next to them. And they weren't just any championships. These were the titles that silenced the Curse Of The Bambino. These marked the fall of the Evil Empire. These changed baseball and were the biggest news in sports. Now, they're a sham. That is your opinion as a Yankees fan. I can almost guarantee non Yankees fans would agree with me. A-Rod was going to go down as the greatest of all time. The fact that they silenced a curse shouldn't matter, nor the fact that this began the fall of the empire. Like someone said, if the Yanks won...it also be a black championship. There are probably 3 or 4 championship teams that were filled with steroid players. And the reality is...records in baseball seem to be more holy than any other sport, and much bigger than rings. No one seemed to care about Bonds never winning a ring. All they cared about is if he broke the home run record. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) Oh big deal, like we didn't know Manny was juicing already after his 'fertility drug' a few months back, and Ortiz was always a guy you figured was doing it anyway because of his career arc. It's not about who was doing it and who wasn't, everyone was doing it. There's no way the Red Sox championship was tainted, that's silly talk. Otherwise you might as well strike down the '99 and '00 Yankees at the very least for Clemens, etc. It's just a matter of who was dumb enough to get caught. And I know Yankee fans like to claim the Mitchell report was biased for obvious reasons, but the fact is he didn't have access to this list - which btw was supposed to be confidential. Whoever's leaking these names clearly has it in for baseball and wants to do it one and two at a time to keep the steroid thing in the news. First A-Rod, then Sosa shortly after his comments about waiting for the HOF and now Manny and Ortiz. I'm worried that as soon as Pujols wins the triple crown and gets anoited as the next great untainted star, boom it'll come out he's on the list too. And really the whole Mitchell report was based on the testimony of two people already under indictment because nobody else would talk on the record. If it was flawed it was flawed because one guy under indictment worked for Clemens and the Yankees and the other guy was also based in the NY area (Mets clubbie) along with the BALCO stuff which was already pretty much public record. Honestly at this point it would behoove baseball to just release the whole 2004 list and get it over with instead of having it leak out anyway over months and years. Already four people from it have been outed and I'm sure there are more big names on the list, just get it over with. Edited July 30, 2009 by Hasan4978 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insanity_gallops Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 +1 for Has Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmigliore Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 i really have little-to-no input on steroids... frankly - they should all have an asterisk near their names (HoF or not) and this steroid list should just be released already because releasing 1 name every few months is unfair, ridiculous, and annoying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) i really have little-to-no input on steroids... frankly - they should all have an asterisk near their names (HoF or not) and this steroid list should just be released already because releasing 1 name every few months is unfair, ridiculous, and annoying. Well it's impossible to put an asterisk by teams if everyone had the same issues but individual players are a different story because it isn't a level playing field in that respect. I could definitely see keeping a McGwire, Sosa, Clemens, Palmeiro and Manny out of the HoF because who knows if they were HOF'ers without roids? Bonds is trickier, he probably would have made it anyway based on when he supposedly started taking them, roids just turned him from an already great player to the modern-day Babe Ruth. I'm not sure any of these guys get in regardless, at least not on the first ballot. I'm still waiting for the day that it comes out a guy was juicing AFTER he gets inducted to see what happens then - whether he gets defrocked like OJ or not. Edited July 30, 2009 by Hasan4978 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmigliore Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) Well it's impossible to put an asterisk by teams if everyone had the same issues but individual players are a different story because it isn't a level playing field in that respect. I could definitely see keeping a McGwire, Sosa, Clemens, Palmeiro and Manny out of the HoF because who knows if they were HOF'ers without roids? i meant asterisk near the players' names, not the teams they were on (or the championship teams they were on). Edited July 30, 2009 by nmigliore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaneykoIsGod Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 That is your opinion as a Yankees fan. I can almost guarantee non Yankees fans would agree with me. A-Rod was going to go down as the greatest of all time. The fact that they silenced a curse shouldn't matter, nor the fact that this began the fall of the empire. Like someone said, if the Yanks won...it also be a black championship. There are probably 3 or 4 championship teams that were filled with steroid players. That was me who said that. I'm not trying to play down A-Rod or anyone else. If you read my posts, you'll see that I say that ALL PLAYERS WHO TEST POSITIVE SHOULD BE BANNED FOREVER. Please don't lump me in with anyone who puts the Yanks or their players on a pedestal over everyone else. The Yanks tried to win World Series with juiceheads and failed. The Sox succeeded. They got to brag for these years about they won and we didn't. Now it's our turn to brag about how they had to cheat to do it. It's all good natured rivalry ribbing. And if you say it shouldn't matter that some thought of the Sox titles as the fall of the Evil Empire or the end of the Curse Of The Bambino, then by the same token it also shouldn't matter that some thought A-Rod was gonna be baseball's Golden Boy. People's preconceived notions should either be considered or not considered. Double standard, my friend. Personally, I just think it's hilarious. The same Boston fans who chanted "STEROIDS" at A-Rod last time he was in Boston have also praised Ortiz as a hero this whole time. Manny too. They're all a bunch of hypocrites, and any time I get to accurately call Boston fans names is a good time for me. Oh, and speaking of hypocritical, this video makes me http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4366829&categoryid=2521705 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devilsrule33 Posted July 30, 2009 Author Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) That was me who said that. I'm not trying to play down A-Rod or anyone else. If you read my posts, you'll see that I say that ALL PLAYERS WHO TEST POSITIVE SHOULD BE BANNED FOREVER. Please don't lump me in with anyone who puts the Yanks or their players on a pedestal over everyone else. The Yanks tried to win World Series with juiceheads and failed. The Sox succeeded. They got to brag for these years about they won and we didn't. Now it's our turn to brag about how they had to cheat to do it. It's all good natured rivalry ribbing. And if you say it shouldn't matter that some thought of the Sox titles as the fall of the Evil Empire or the end of the Curse Of The Bambino, then by the same token it also shouldn't matter that some thought A-Rod was gonna be baseball's Golden Boy. People's preconceived notions should either be considered or not considered. Double standard, my friend. Personally, I just think it's hilarious. The same Boston fans who chanted "STEROIDS" at A-Rod last time he was in Boston have also praised Ortiz as a hero this whole time. Manny too. They're all a bunch of hypocrites, and any time I get to accurately call Boston fans names is a good time for me. Oh, and speaking of hypocritical, this video makes me http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4366829&categoryid=2521705 We can both agree Ortiz is an idiot. It should be interesting how he plays it from here. Some of these guys need to learn from Andy Pettite and Jason Giambi. Their names came up...they admitted it and apologized quickly. Now who even brings up Pettite when talking about steroid users of the past? I don't think Sox fans are hypocrites. At least the smart intellectual ones. From the posts I have read...they are ready for all the same crap they gave the Yankees fans and players...and are going to take it like men. They didn't know Ortiz was a steroid user or didn't want to believe it no matter how obvious it was. They weren't going to turn on Ortiz without proof. That would be unfair. Now here it is...and I think they are ashamed and disgusted. Edited July 30, 2009 by devilsrule33 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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