Mighty Grendel Posted June 21, 2004 Share Posted June 21, 2004 I'd love to see Kozlov under Burns for a year (if anyone can make him produce it Burnsy===provided he is healthy to coach). Kozlov could turn out to be a superstar. Exactly. I think it will be stupid to get rid of him before he has played enough games to get used to the team and our way of playing the game. There is no reason why the coaches can't get him to play a little tougher, and if they can I also think he'd be a superstar on our team. Oh and i'm not high either Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils731 Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 I'm not disagreeing with anyone, I think the Devs would be foolish to trade him for all the reasons that have been pointed out, but I'm telling you I know someone close to the organization (and Gomez) who tells me that Gomez won't be playing for the Devils for another full season. One of the reasons was Parise, and another reason is Burns. I think we all know that Gomer didn't start off too well with him, and I'm told that the relationship isn't very good. I don't want to start any more trade Gomez rumors because I don't want to see him go, but I'm just telling you what I'm hearing from a reliable source. I don't post on this board very often, just thought I would pass it along. Just for goofs, ask your source what the Devils expect to get for Gomez when you see him/her next. -Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squishyx Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 im with NJayDevil, if you cant name your "source" then you shoudlnt say anything at all, cuz it seems like a cheap way to make a prediction and not have to worry about backing it up if it doesnt come true. its one thing if your opinion is that gomez will be traded, its another to inderectly say it. its gonna be a frustating summer if people do that.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 There is no reason why the coaches can't get him to play a little tougher, and if they can I also think he'd be a superstar on our team. The coaches couldn't get Rupp to play a little tougher, for any sustained amount of time anyway- not so sure they can get Kozlov to either. You can't teach aggression, you either have it or you don't IMO. That being said, I would like to see more of what Kozlov can do on this team when healthy. I'd like to give him one more season, if he still plays like a puss bag then let him go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevilMinder Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 It's a tough call if the decision to let go Marshall or Stevenson is being played out in Lou's mind. Marshall does seem to have some offensive potential that Stevenson doesn't. Then there is the fact that without Stevenson nobody else on the team has really stood out in the physical category. The Devils really can't afford to lose more toughness now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockeye Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Let me just say that I'm not posting on this board to try and predict something and then bask in the glory of being right. I don't have any history of making predictions or trying to look like the guy with the scoop. There may be others that post just to stir the pot or make ludicrous predictions, but thats not the case here. I merely thought I would pass along that I know someone that is close to the inside of a certain situation and they tell me that Gomer will not remain a Devil, and I'll just leave it at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerrydevil Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Sockeye, I think the problem is many of us, including me, hate to hear that rumor! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils731 Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Sockeye, I think the problem is many of us, including me, hate to hear that rumor! I just hate open ended rumors. You can't tell whether or not to be happy about it. Like if its Gomez for Kovalchuk that'd be great but if its Gomez for O'neill that would suck. -Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockeye Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Isn't Gomer a RFA, and doesn't that mean other teams can make an offer that NJ must match or lose him? My understanding is that there are some teams out there may be interested in making a pretty big offer for him. He's is very gifted with the puck, has great vision, and would be a great playmaker for a scoring winger. Plus he has a ton of playoff experience, has gotten much better on faceoffs, and has learned to play a little defense. Let's face it, he's just not the prototypical Devs type of player, but for some other organizations might turn out to be a superstar. He could get a very big offer that the Devs just won't match, which means he may be gone for nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MantaRay Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 As far as Gomer I think he is a Devil for life. After losing to Patrick Roy in the finals, Gomer & Almo took the brunt of the blame from Lou. Almo was let go and Gomer had spent the season "on the trading block". Larry and Constantine kept putting pairing him with stone handed wings and his numbers went down. Burns got Gomez to elevate his game and demanding high standards of play from him and now he is the best set up man in the league...plus he is in Lou's price range. He's not going anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aylbert Posted June 22, 2004 Author Share Posted June 22, 2004 Isn't Gomer a RFA, and doesn't that mean other teams can make an offer that NJ must match or lose him? My understanding is that there are some teams out there may be interested in making a pretty big offer for him. He's is very gifted with the puck, has great vision, and would be a great playmaker for a scoring winger. Plus he has a ton of playoff experience, has gotten much better on faceoffs, and has learned to play a little defense. Let's face it, he's just not the prototypical Devs type of player, but for some other organizations might turn out to be a superstar. He could get a very big offer that the Devs just won't match, which means he may be gone for nothing. Are you aware what that nothing is? 5 first round picks... Ill take that for Gomer and hope Parise pans out, Kozlov toughens up. and that whoever signs him sucks, and gets high 1st rounders for the next 5 seasons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils731 Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Isn't Gomer a RFA, and doesn't that mean other teams can make an offer that NJ must match or lose him? My understanding is that there are some teams out there may be interested in making a pretty big offer for him. He's is very gifted with the puck, has great vision, and would be a great playmaker for a scoring winger. Plus he has a ton of playoff experience, has gotten much better on faceoffs, and has learned to play a little defense. Let's face it, he's just not the prototypical Devs type of player, but for some other organizations might turn out to be a superstar. He could get a very big offer that the Devs just won't match, which means he may be gone for nothing. Are you aware what that nothing is? 5 first round picks... Ill take that for Gomer and hope Parise pans out, Kozlov toughens up. and that whoever signs him sucks, and gets high 1st rounders for the next 5 seasons Maybe the Rangers can offer Gomez like 9 million a season and then the Devils will get a top 10 pick for the next 5 years on top of their own. woohoo! -Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aylbert Posted June 22, 2004 Author Share Posted June 22, 2004 Just because I dont like spitting out the 5 first rounders for signing an RFA because its not 100% accurate... the current CBA reads: 10.5. Draft Choice Compensation for Restricted Free Agents Any Club that is entitled to but does not exercise its Right of First Refusal pursuant to Section 10.3 shall be entitled to obtain Draft Choice Compensation from the New Club. The number and quality of draft choices due to the Prior Club shall be based on the average annual value of the Compensation contained in the Principal Terms (as defined in Section 10.3(e) hereof) of the New Club's Offer Sheet (determined by dividing such Compensation by the lesser of the number of years of the Offer Sheet or five), based on the following scale: NOTE: Updated for 2002-03 Season OFFER DRAFT CHOICE(S) $667,433 OR BELOW NONE Over $667,433 - $917,720 THIRD ROUND Over $917,720 - $1,084,579 SECOND ROUND Over $1,084,579 - $1,334,867 FIRST ROUND Over $1,334,867 - $1,668,582 FIRST AND THIRD ROUND Over $1,668,582 - $2,002,298 FIRST AND SECOND ROUND Over $2,002,298 - $2,336,015 TWO FIRST ROUNDS Over $2,336,015 - $2,836,589 TWO FIRST ROUNDS AND ONE SECOND ROUND Over $2,836,589 THREE FIRST ROUNDS EACH ADDITIONAL $1,668,582 ADDITIONAL FIRST ROUND, UP TO MAXIMUM OF FIVE FIRST ROUND PICKS The dollar amounts set forth in the scale outlined above shall be increased on an annual basis at the same percentage rate of increase as Average League Salary, with the 1997/98 League Year being the first year such increase shall take effect. By way of example, if the Average League Salary on June 30, 1998 has increased by 10% from the Average League Salary on June 30, 1997, then each of the dollar amounts stated in the table above shall be increased by 10% on June 30, 1998, and the basis for determining the number and quality of draft choices due to the Prior Club for the loss of a Restricted Free Agent signed after such date shall be adjusted accordingly. For each League Year thereafter, a similar comparison and adjustment shall be made. Clubs owing one draft pick must have it available in the next draft. Clubs owing two draft picks in the same round must have them available in the next three drafts. Clubs owing three draft picks must have them available in the next four drafts, and so forth. Clubs owing two draft picks in different rounds must have them available in the next draft. Clubs must use their own draft picks (being those awarded directly to the Club by the League for use by it in the Entry Draft, including any Compensatory Draft Selection pursuant to Section 8.3). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aylbert Posted June 23, 2004 Author Share Posted June 23, 2004 So it turns out Sockeye's source is Neverson!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockeye Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 That's okay, instead of continuing the parting shots, I'll just put a smile on my face and have the last laugh when its done. I'm sure there are lots of people on this board that "make predictions" based on some type of information. I'm not making any predictions, just passing along the information from someone I know that seems to think they know whats going to happen, so we'll see what happens and find out who looks the most foolish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MantaRay Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 OK, I am intrigued Sockeye. I am not going to ask who the source is, I just want too know the motivation behind Gomer being trading. I am not buying the Parise line, because that might not happen for another two years. The Devils have been very good to Gomer and Burns has him playing at a very high level, why would Lou trade such a blossoming player who is only a few years from being a Calder winner??? That doesn't make sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockeye Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 My understanding is for a variety of reasons. I would agree that Gomez has been treated fairly well in NJ, but I don't believe its as rosy of a relationship as some might think. I think its somewhat similiar to the Morrison situation. I believe Gomez feels he didn't get a fair contract 2 years ago. He produced pretty well at a young age, won the Calder, and a Stanley Cup. His contract was for $1M. Other young stars that came into the league at the same time he did are making much more. Gagne $2.6M, York $2M, Tanguay $1.5M. Tanguay has a few more points than him over those five years, but he's also been playing regularly with Sakic, Forsberg, Hejduk, and others in a more offensive system. I think the reason for this move is as much because of Gomer as it is the Devils. Gomer has had success (winning 2 cups), and I think now he may want something else, such as playing in a style more suitable to his skills and making more money. He knows the Devils history of contract negotiations, and my guess is that he's not going to get the money he thinks he deserves from Lou. Look at the Morrison situation and its very similiar to this one. Gomez comes in as a rookie, similiar to Morrison, who isn't happy about what Lou is offering, and Morrison is shipped out and Gomez fills his spot. Same thing is going to happen with Gomer and Parise. Gomez is due for salary arbitration, and you can bet that he is due for a very large increase, which Lou just isn't going to pay with Parise coming aboard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MantaRay Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 Very sound. It really makes sense, especially since I understand that Morrison and Gomer (along with Elias and Sykora) were pretty good friends. Lou is NOT kind in salary arbitration (Holik, Sykora, Nieds), but I am hoping he has learned from that and Gomer gets a bump in salary that he deserves, especially now since he is really the key to the Devils offense and the best passer in the NHL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MantaRay Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 Similiar to rewarding Elias good money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueNJ97 Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 My understanding is for a variety of reasons. I would agree that Gomez has been treated fairly well in NJ, but I don't believe its as rosy of a relationship as some might think. I think its somewhat similiar to the Morrison situation. I believe Gomez feels he didn't get a fair contract 2 years ago. He produced pretty well at a young age, won the Calder, and a Stanley Cup. His contract was for $1M. Other young stars that came into the league at the same time he did are making much more. Gagne $2.6M, York $2M, Tanguay $1.5M. Tanguay has a few more points than him over those five years, but he's also been playing regularly with Sakic, Forsberg, Hejduk, and others in a more offensive system. I think the reason for this move is as much because of Gomer as it is the Devils. Gomer has had success (winning 2 cups), and I think now he may want something else, such as playing in a style more suitable to his skills and making more money. He knows the Devils history of contract negotiations, and my guess is that he's not going to get the money he thinks he deserves from Lou. Look at the Morrison situation and its very similiar to this one. Gomez comes in as a rookie, similiar to Morrison, who isn't happy about what Lou is offering, and Morrison is shipped out and Gomez fills his spot. Same thing is going to happen with Gomer and Parise. Gomez is due for salary arbitration, and you can bet that he is due for a very large increase, which Lou just isn't going to pay with Parise coming aboard. Sockeye, you may be correct that Gomez may try for more $$$ because he feels that it was 'unfair' that Lou tried to keep his salary down. But how does this square with the rhetoric now coming out of folks like Guerin and Roenick, that the CBA should work as long as you use it correctly??? Lou used it correctly. Should he have not done it??? I guess I'm just sick of all the friggin' hypocracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MantaRay Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 I agree as well Sue. And look at what a burden Guerins contract has become for Dallas (they can't trade him--no one wants his salary and he won't take a pay cut to help the team--Hatcher situation last year). Roenick is a joke at his salary, but Philly doesn't care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerrydevil Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 Sockeye, your argument makes a lot of sense, and I believe that any hard feelings can subside if Gomez gets a fair contract. I'd like to NOT see this case go to arbitration (if there is arbitration in the next CBA), and for the Devils to pay Gomez a fair salary. What is that salary? Under the current cost structure, it's probably $3 million or $4 million. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockeye Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 I agree, that if Gomer got a "decent" contract, things could be different. I would consider decent in the $2.5M range. But I'm just don't think, from my own feelings and what I'm hearing, that is going to happen. Gomer has done well during the regular season, but hasn't produced quite as well during the post-season (although few put up better numbers), so I just don't think Lou is going to raise the anty that much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 That's okay, instead of continuing the parting shots, I'll just put a smile on my face and have the last laugh when its done. I'm sure there are lots of people on this board that "make predictions" based on some type of information. Yeah there are and that's part of the problem. People were willing to be more lenient towards HOI's inside sources that said Burns and Stevens were having problems, seperate posts a few weeks later that predicted Burns' firing, some other posts that insinuated Stevens' problems were worse than PCS. Maybe you're catching the brunt of it because none of these things ever happened or if they did there's no way to prove it now. Now, I don't have anything against rumor posting per se but at the same time you do it at your own (credibility) risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aylbert Posted June 23, 2004 Author Share Posted June 23, 2004 Lams should qualify Gomer upfront... Gomer will of course rejects, but NJ satisifies keeping his rights... Id then offer 2.5mil; that Id allow to be talked up to 3million. If he rejects, I would wait until the CBA is in place and offer him 2million; or trade him. Yes; I intended that to be a lesser amount than before the new CBA. The Morrison-Gomez-Parise link makes sense in that they replace players... however, if we trade Gomez it needs to be for far more promising than moving up in the draft a couple of spots... We traded Morrison and Pederson for AlMo. However, Morrison wasnt developed as a player yet (nor did he have linemates called Naslund/Bertuzzi)... So really they were swapping a good young center, for a more promising young center... Gomez has a lot more worth NOW than Morrison did when he was traded. Morrison wasnt our number 1 center, Gomez is. Gomez is an overall better player than Morrison... I cant see Lams trading Gomez for potential players (prospects, higher draft pick swap) unless its something crazy... Like our 1st pick and Gomez to Washington... Imagine playing Parise and Ovecken in the same year? That would be 2 potential Calder finalists on the same team... However, never going to happen. Unless NJ picks up a relatively inexpensive, long-term power forward at center (who can assume our #1 center roll), I dont see why NJ would bother trading Gomez... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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